On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 15:13:28 GMT, "Michael E. Carver" [email hidden] wrote:
>Also, before the warez was available of F1 2000 the majority of folks
>were saying that if they don't fix the small heads the product was dead
>in the water. Now that the product is out and it has more problems than
>small heads in the cockpits, it is a great game and has wonderful
>potential. What happened?
We drove it?
> Did cracking the CD's jewel case release some powerful mind altering gas?
No, but there is enough gas emanating in the newsgroup to compensate.
--
* rrev at mindspring dot com *
I got my copy yesterday and after day of hot lapping and offline racing I
would like to give my opinion of this game. This is written as info for
people considering to buy this game. It's my personal opinion of this
product. Don't want to offend anybody and certainly wont be offended if
anybody have different experience with this game.
I see 3 main problems:
1. Off line racing - AI cars.
Say at least, it's embarrassing that serious company can release that
unfinished product. AI is that bad that I couldn't believe the first time I
tried. They drive wrong lines, slow in corners - lightening speed on
straights, soon as they catch you they will crash into you, they brake
without any reason... You can have the fastest exist from turn and you will
never be able to overtake AI on straight, they are just 20% and more faster
than you on straight and 20% or less slower in turns. In racing with them
you cannot apply any racing knowledge or tactics. Until you hear that F1
2000 AI patch is available, you can assume that game doesn't have offline
racing.
2. 3D engine - FPS.
I assume that constant 30 FPS is a minimum for racing game. My Celeron @540
Voodoo3 3000 256mb RAM is hardly good enough to run this game with decent
FPS. To run Grand Prix race (with 21 AI cars) I need to lower resolution to
800x600 and to turn graphics to medium/minimum. In practice (just your car
on the track) at 1024x768 and medium graphics settings I usually have
instant slowdowns with FPS dropping below 20 FPS. Huge oscillation in FPS -
hard on eyes. Patch needed.
3. Graphics - visual appealing.
Because you have to lower resolution and graphics settings to medium/minimum
to get reasonable FPS, you wont like what you going to see. Nothing which
looks like pics you've seen posted on numerous sites or published in
magazines. At 800x600 with medium graphics settings this game look very bed.
Patch which solves FPS problem will allow people to increase graphics
settings and make this game looks nicer.
There is a lot of other less important things that has to be
changed/improved, but I just wanted to give my main concerns with this game.
I will not return this game, cause I see some potential and I believe that
developers off game will listen and soon start fixing things. With all fixes
this can be very promising game/sim. If I'm wrong, well, this is the last
time I bought EA Sport product.
Darko
PS
Some people are offended with comparation of F1 2000 with GPL. We should
compare two products which are trying to compete in same genre and try to
get approval of sim community. I cannot force myself to compare F1 2000 with
MGPRS2 or SCGT when personally I consider GPL the best sim, and one of the
best peace of software ever made. Doesn't meter modern or not, it's racing
sim. I cannot full myself that F1 2000 AI is small issue that shouldn't be
of big importance. How much work was needed to put GPL AI in place and ship
finished, tested product? Papyrus did it. ISI didn't - they choose to ship
unfinished product. Very bed. And we should tell that. There is no point in
prizing very promising, but unfinished product. What are we going to say
when/if they release killer sim, when we already used all words in prizing
unfinished one.
> 1. Off line racing - AI cars.
> Say at least, it's embarrassing that serious company can release that
> unfinished product. AI is that bad that I couldn't believe the first timeI
> tried. They drive wrong lines, slow in corners - lightening speed on
> straights, soon as they catch you they will crash into you, they brake
> without any reason... You can have the fastest exist from turn and youwill
> never be able to overtake AI on straight, they are just 20% and morefaster
> than you on straight and 20% or less slower in turns. In racing with them
> you cannot apply any racing knowledge or tactics.Eh, sorry to add this but that is exactly my whole comlaint with GPL! if you
could believe it, but not any will:-)
> 2. 3D engine - FPS.
> I assume that constant 30 FPS is a minimum for racing game. My Celeron@540
> Voodoo3 3000 256mb RAM is hardly good enough to run this game with decent
> FPS. To run Grand Prix race (with 21 AI cars) I need to lower resolutionto
> 800x600 and to turn graphics to medium/minimum. In practice (just your car
> on the track) at 1024x768 and medium graphics settings I usually have
> instant slowdowns with FPS dropping below 20 FPS. Huge oscillation in FPSI mentioned a bit down how I resolved FTP problems on my relativly low spec
PC. It runs fine PII 350, 64MB RAM and 16MB 3DFX. But any game thats heavy
on graphic has problems dealing witha hugh mass of cars on screen. Its only
for the start.
To butt it in again (yes, you'll all love it), GPL has terrible problems
with that, with full detail it runs smoother than any game I have when just
you are on screen, maybe the car ahead adn the guy he's chasing too but
thats the limit. F1 2000 isn't the first or last sim to have this problem.
> 3. Graphics - visual appealing.
> Because you have to lower resolution and graphics settings tomedium/minimum
> to get reasonable FPS, you wont like what you going to see. Nothing which
> looks like pics you've seen posted on numerous sites or published in
> magazines. At 800x600 with medium graphics settings this game look verybed.
> Patch which solves FPS problem will allow people to increase graphics
> settings and make this game looks nicer.Its a balance, "Good Graphics/Good Game Speed". You can't always have both.
On Sun, 26 Mar 2000 04:07:57 GMT Darko Juvan <[email hidden]> wrote:
One thing that also needs fixing that you didn't mention is the crashing
to desktop when ever you touch a wall with the sides of the front wheels
with Force Feedback.
% There is a lot of other less important things that has to be
% changed/improved, but I just wanted to give my main concerns with this game.
% I will not return this game, cause I see some potential and I believe that
% developers off game will listen and soon start fixing things. With all fixes
% this can be very promising game/sim. If I'm wrong, well, this is the last
% time I bought EA Sport product.
This is really strange.... I remember Motorsims getting dumped on
because they admitted up front that their product AMA Superbike was not
as "finished" as they liked when released, but promised to patch and
patch and fix and fix (which they have done and are still doing). Now
we have an Emperor parading about claiming to have on his finest new
regalia and folks are saying how beautiful and wonderful he looks.
Well maybe his new clothes only needs a tuck here and maybe a bit more
material here and then perhaps a slightly better color match, and
maybe...
Hardly anyone at all has the guts to say that the Emeror has no
clothes. If Motorsims' release was an F1 sim and not a bike sim would
people have been more generous and forgiving? It would seem so... Their
product was more complete and a 1000% better in quality and simulation
that F1 2000. What gives?
Also, before the warez was available of F1 2000 the majority of folks
were saying that if they don't fix the small heads the product was dead
in the water. Now that the product is out and it has more problems than
small heads in the cockpits, it is a great game and has wonderful
potential. What happened? Did cracking the CD's jewel case release
some powerful mind altering gas?
--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.
[email hidden] http://www.teleport.com/~mcarver
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
See other threads on this, but basically the straight line speed is down to
setups. Try Monza with the 'speed' setup, and you'll find you can match the
AI cars on the straights.
I haven't seen the silly behaviour that is talked about here like 'soon as
they catch you they will crash into you, they brake without any reason... '.
Iain
GraDee <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:8bkpqk$bb8$[email hidden]...
> > 1. Off line racing - AI cars.
> > Say at least, it's embarrassing that serious company can release that
> > unfinished product. AI is that bad that I couldn't believe the firsttime
them
> > you cannot apply any racing knowledge or tactics.
> Eh, sorry to add this but that is exactly my whole comlaint with GPL! ifyou
decent
> > FPS. To run Grand Prix race (with 21 AI cars) I need to lower resolution
> to
> > 800x600 and to turn graphics to medium/minimum. In practice (just yourcar
> > on the track) at 1024x768 and medium graphics settings I usually have
> > instant slowdowns with FPS dropping below 20 FPS. Huge oscillation inFPS
> I mentioned a bit down how I resolved FTP problems on my relativly lowspec
> PC. It runs fine PII 350, 64MB RAM and 16MB 3DFX. But any game thats heavy
> on graphic has problems dealing witha hugh mass of cars on screen. Itsonly
> for the start.
> To butt it in again (yes, you'll all love it), GPL has terrible problems
> with that, with full detail it runs smoother than any game I have whenjust
which
> > looks like pics you've seen posted on numerous sites or published in
> > magazines. At 800x600 with medium graphics settings this game look very
> bed.
> > Patch which solves FPS problem will allow people to increase graphics
> > settings and make this game looks nicer.
> Its a balance, "Good Graphics/Good Game Speed". You can't always haveboth.
>
>
>
Quoted text (8 lines)
> I > > tried. They drive wrong lines, slow in corners - lightening speed on > > straights, soon as they catch you they will crash into you, they brake > > without any reason... You can have the fastest exist from turn and you > will > > never be able to overtake AI on straight, they are just 20% and more > faster > > than you on straight and 20% or less slower in turns. In racing withQuoted text (7 lines)
> could believe it, but not any will:-) > > > > 2. 3D engine - FPS. > > I assume that constant 30 FPS is a minimum for racing game. My Celeron > @540 > > Voodoo3 3000 256mb RAM is hardly good enough to run this game withQuoted text (8 lines)
> you are on screen, maybe the car ahead adn the guy he's chasing too but > thats the limit. F1 2000 isn't the first or last sim to have this problem. > > > > 3. Graphics - visual appealing. > > Because you have to lower resolution and graphics settings to > medium/minimum > > to get reasonable FPS, you wont like what you going to see. NothingI also haven't noticed any particularly bad AI behaviour in the races I
have took part in. Is this something that maybe only shows up with the AI
at 100%?? So far I have only been driving with the AI at reduced
competitiveness so maybe that's why I have yet to see this silly behaviour
that others have reported.
Peter Hooper
Iain Mackenzie <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:uEqD4.3678$[email hidden]...
> See other threads on this, but basically the straight line speed is downto
> setups. Try Monza with the 'speed' setup, and you'll find you can matchthe
> AI cars on the straights.
> I haven't seen the silly behaviour that is talked about here like 'soon as
> they catch you they will crash into you, they brake without any reason...'.
> Iain
>
Can't agree with you there....
Apart from the framerate drop at starts I have always found GPL to be very
smooth... even when in close proximity to a pack of other cars. I even
found this when running it on my old P233MMX with Voodoo Banshee card.
Peter Hooper
GraDee <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:8bkpqk$bb8$[email hidden]...
> To butt it in again (yes, you'll all love it), GPL has terrible problems
> with that, with full detail it runs smoother than any game I have whenjust
which
> > looks like pics you've seen posted on numerous sites or published in
> > magazines. At 800x600 with medium graphics settings this game look very
> bed.
> > Patch which solves FPS problem will allow people to increase graphics
> > settings and make this game looks nicer.
> Its a balance, "Good Graphics/Good Game Speed". You can't always haveboth.
>
>
>
Quoted text (8 lines)
> you are on screen, maybe the car ahead adn the guy he's chasing too but > thats the limit. F1 2000 isn't the first or last sim to have this problem. > > > > 3. Graphics - visual appealing. > > Because you have to lower resolution and graphics settings to > medium/minimum > > to get reasonable FPS, you wont like what you going to see. NothingI certainly don't have this crash to desktop problem and haven't read of
too many others that have suffered with it. The Motorsims comparison
doesn't really work for me, I can't really see how you claim it was more
complete than F1 2000... maybe in your opinion it was but definately not in
mine.
As far as I am concerned F1 2000 was initially a disappointment but after
persevering with it I have found it to be an extremely enjoyable sim. Yes,
there are some problems with it and we all have our own opinions on what
they are but I can enjoy it as it stands and look forward to some of the
clever bods out there producing the goods to improve it as they have with
SCGT.
Regards
Peter Hooper
Michael E. Carver <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:sOpD4.1065$[email hidden]...
game.
> % I will not return this game, cause I see some potential and I believethat
> % developers off game will listen and soon start fixing things. With allfixes
> % this can be very promising game/sim. If I'm wrong, well, this is thelast
