Would it not be possible for a software developer to create an "open" racing
sim. Okay the word "open" might be a bit ambiguos so let me try and define
what I mean by the term.
The developer of the initial sim would create the basic physics engine.
This would have to be at least on par with the GPL physics engine aswell as
including some additions which I will get to later.
The sim could be released with a set of cars and a set of tracks and of
course a menu system.
The rights to the core physics engine would be kept by the developers but
they would share the knowledge with the rest of the world on how to create
cars, tracks, graphics etc. They would not need to release an editor as
there would be no lack of programmers out there ready to have a crack at it
and with enough information it shouldn't be a problem for them.
The format would allow any sort (within reason) of 4 (or more) wheel vehicle
to be created and given a set of values which would affect it's performance.
Values that could be entered could be the drive wheels, tyre dimensions,
power, weight and virtually anything else that would affect performance.
Types of possibble tracks could include the regular road/oval/street aswell
as possibly off-road and point to point such as Rally or Hill-Climbs. It
could maybe be possible to create a virtual world where you can drive
anywhere within it. This would allow a type of Midtown Madness scenario or
even a cross country race. Hey! Cannonball Run On-line!!
For those of you familiar with Flight Sims would realise that what I am
describing is more or less the Auto equivelant of the Microsoft Flight
Simulator series. For those not familiar with this product just go to
www.flightsim.com and look at all the additional
aircraft/airports/scenery/sounds/guages/navigation systems etc. etc. that
are free for downloading. Microsoft actually encourage third party
developers by releasing instructions for making these additions.
Microsoft releases a new flight sim every couple of years (actually it has
been just about every year for the last few years if you include Combat
Flight Simulator) and each one sells by the truckload, most of the third
party stuff from the previous sims is usually compatible with the new sim.
A racing sim developer could go the same sort of route, people would buy a
new version every couple of years which would include enhanced graphics and
the possibility of a more complex physics engine which would be possible
because computers would be more powerful. The old cars, tracks would still
work with each new release though.
The closest we have got to this format so far would be SCGT for it's ease of
creating cars and GP2 which seems to have had everything about it edited.
I know Paul Hoad is trying to create and open sim and I know there have been
a couple of more attempts. I wish Paul good luck but in reality this type
of thing needs a big name to get behind it and distribute/market it.
Well I just wanted to put my ideas on the subject in one place. I'm sure
it could be a popular and profitable format as the Flight Sim community has
proven.
Chris
Go see what is being done with SCGT. www.gtinsider.com Then take a
look at all the activity with N3 and GPL and the gazillions of tracks
for GP2. Some of what you ask for is already being done.
dave henrie
Chris Bloom wrote:
Quoted text (60 lines)
> > Would it not be possible for a software developer to create an "open" racing > sim. Okay the word "open" might be a bit ambiguos so let me try and define > what I mean by the term. > > The developer of the initial sim would create the basic physics engine. > This would have to be at least on par with the GPL physics engine aswell as > including some additions which I will get to later. > > The sim could be released with a set of cars and a set of tracks and of > course a menu system. > > The rights to the core physics engine would be kept by the developers but > they would share the knowledge with the rest of the world on how to create > cars, tracks, graphics etc. They would not need to release an editor as > there would be no lack of programmers out there ready to have a crack at it > and with enough information it shouldn't be a problem for them. > > The format would allow any sort (within reason) of 4 (or more) wheel vehicle > to be created and given a set of values which would affect it's performance. > Values that could be entered could be the drive wheels, tyre dimensions, > power, weight and virtually anything else that would affect performance. > > Types of possibble tracks could include the regular road/oval/street aswell > as possibly off-road and point to point such as Rally or Hill-Climbs. It > could maybe be possible to create a virtual world where you can drive > anywhere within it. This would allow a type of Midtown Madness scenario or > even a cross country race. Hey! Cannonball Run On-line!! > > For those of you familiar with Flight Sims would realise that what I am > describing is more or less the Auto equivelant of the Microsoft Flight > Simulator series. For those not familiar with this product just go to > www.flightsim.com and look at all the additional > aircraft/airports/scenery/sounds/guages/navigation systems etc. etc. that > are free for downloading. Microsoft actually encourage third party > developers by releasing instructions for making these additions. > > Microsoft releases a new flight sim every couple of years (actually it has > been just about every year for the last few years if you include Combat > Flight Simulator) and each one sells by the truckload, most of the third > party stuff from the previous sims is usually compatible with the new sim. > > A racing sim developer could go the same sort of route, people would buy a > new version every couple of years which would include enhanced graphics and > the possibility of a more complex physics engine which would be possible > because computers would be more powerful. The old cars, tracks would still > work with each new release though. > > The closest we have got to this format so far would be SCGT for it's ease of > creating cars and GP2 which seems to have had everything about it edited. > > I know Paul Hoad is trying to create and open sim and I know there have been > a couple of more attempts. I wish Paul good luck but in reality this type > of thing needs a big name to get behind it and distribute/market it. > > Well I just wanted to put my ideas on the subject in one place. I'm sure > it could be a popular and profitable format as the Flight Sim community has > proven. > > ChrisIn article <[email hidden]>, Dave Henrie
<[email hidden]> wrote:
> Go see what is being done with SCGT. www.gtinsider.com Thentake a
>look at all the activity with N3 and GPL and the gazillions oftracks
>for GP2. Some of what you ask for is already being done.
>dave henrie
>
Yes, I am aware of all that and I appreciate the efforts of
those who put their free time into making these enhancements for
our sims. None of these are endorsed by the game manufacturers
though and if there is a sequel to any of those sims it is
unlikely to be backwards compatible with any components from
these ones. My wish would be for a basic sim which would be a
basis for enthusiasts to personalise in almost any way they like.
Chris
* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
Maybe it is time for RAS to seriously consider sponsoring a project.
There seems to be an awful lot of talent in the group. If resources are not
available within the group then the project could be funded to make it
available.
On many occasions posters have said how they would be prepared to pay $100
for the next GPL with the understanding it will be a low volume product.
How many would actually be prepared to pay up front to fund a RAS Sim
project - run by one of the sim project volunteer groups known to us in RAS.
Maybe even a quarterly subscription - entitling the subscriber to beta
copies and all output from the project.
What do you think?
Tony
"Dave Henrie" wrote
racing
> > sim. Okay the word "open" might be a bit ambiguos so let me try anddefine
> > what I mean by the term.
> >
> > The developer of the initial sim would create the basic physics engine.
> > This would have to be at least on par with the GPL physics engine aswellas
> > including some additions which I will get to later.
> >
> > The sim could be released with a set of cars and a set of tracks and of
> > course a menu system.
> >
> > The rights to the core physics engine would be kept by the developersbut
> > they would share the knowledge with the rest of the world on how tocreate
> > cars, tracks, graphics etc. They would not need to release an editor as
> > there would be no lack of programmers out there ready to have a crack atit
> > and with enough information it shouldn't be a problem for them.
> >
> > The format would allow any sort (within reason) of 4 (or more) wheelvehicle
> > to be created and given a set of values which would affect it'sperformance.
> > Values that could be entered could be the drive wheels, tyre dimensions,
> > power, weight and virtually anything else that would affect performance.
> >
> > Types of possibble tracks could include the regular road/oval/streetaswell
> > as possibly off-road and point to point such as Rally or Hill-Climbs.It
> > could maybe be possible to create a virtual world where you can drive
> > anywhere within it. This would allow a type of Midtown Madness scenarioor
that
> > are free for downloading. Microsoft actually encourage third party
> > developers by releasing instructions for making these additions.
> >
> > Microsoft releases a new flight sim every couple of years (actually ithas
> > been just about every year for the last few years if you include Combat
> > Flight Simulator) and each one sells by the truckload, most of thethird
> > party stuff from the previous sims is usually compatible with the newsim.
> >
> > A racing sim developer could go the same sort of route, people would buya
> > new version every couple of years which would include enhanced graphicsand
> > the possibility of a more complex physics engine which would be possible
> > because computers would be more powerful. The old cars, tracks wouldstill
> > work with each new release though.
> >
> > The closest we have got to this format so far would be SCGT for it'sease of
> > creating cars and GP2 which seems to have had everything about itedited.
> >
> > I know Paul Hoad is trying to create and open sim and I know there havebeen
> > a couple of more attempts. I wish Paul good luck but in reality thistype
> > of thing needs a big name to get behind it and distribute/market it.
> >
> > Well I just wanted to put my ideas on the subject in one place. I'msure
> > it could be a popular and profitable format as the Flight Sim communityhas
> > proven.
> >
> > Chris
Quoted text (8 lines)
> Go see what is being done with SCGT. www.gtinsider.com Then take a > look at all the activity with N3 and GPL and the gazillions of tracks > for GP2. Some of what you ask for is already being done. > dave henrie > > Chris Bloom wrote: > > > > Would it not be possible for a software developer to create an "open"Quoted text (7 lines)
> > even a cross country race. Hey! Cannonball Run On-line!! > > > > For those of you familiar with Flight Sims would realise that what I am > > describing is more or less the Auto equivelant of the Microsoft Flight > > Simulator series. For those not familiar with this product just go to > > www.flightsim.com and look at all the additional > > aircraft/airports/scenery/sounds/guages/navigation systems etc. etc.Spare me. The kind of "openness" seen in the first person shooter genre of
games is almost completely foreign in the racing sim community. Only a select
few with a few thousand dollars to spend on 3D Studio Max are able to create
new cars and tracks. Clear documentation describing how to crack the file
formats is very hard to come by for most racing sims. In
Quake/Q2/Q3/Half-Life/etc. anyone can download any one of several free and
robust map editors and witin an hour start creating high quality maps. Or you
can download various SDKs being made readily available by the original
developers and begin programming your own mods. Check out some of the
newsgroups and major sites dedicated to FPSes and you'll be amazed at how open
it all is. Our genre doesn't even come close. Now I'm not saying it's
completely closed or anything, just that it isn't nearly as innovative or open
as some other popular genres of computer gaming.
I agree with Chris and if I had the programming skills I would love to get to
work on something like that. It's been my dream for some time. I may just have
to act on it one day. ;)
--
-----------------------------------
Morgan Vincent Wooten
mailto:[email hidden]
http://members.tripod.com/~morganv/
-----------------------------------
Dave Henrie <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Go see what is being done with SCGT. www.gtinsider.com Then take a
> look at all the activity with N3 and GPL and the gazillions of tracks
> for GP2. Some of what you ask for is already being done.
[]
of thing needs a big name to get behind it and distribute/market it.
> >
> > Well I just wanted to put my ideas on the subject in one place. I'm sure
> > it could be a popular and profitable format as the Flight Sim community has
> > proven.
> >
> > Chris
http://www.hoad.org/
It's slow because it maps to a Xoom account. Xoom has been really slow lately so
trying in the evening helps.
Jason.
hgffjnm wrote:
> Whats the site address for Paul Hoads Project?
>
--
Jason Monds
http://www.proracingclub.com - Pro Racing Club! (N3, GPL)
http://members.home.net/stuff.mondsj/csp - Car Sim Project
(Please remove 'no extra spork' when replying)
Paul Hoads project just might fill the request. The problems and
shortcommings
of previous projects were/are trying to decode the source that was written
by someone who does not want you to decode it!
By starting from scratch as thus knowing ALL the code, Mr. Hoad should
be able to eliminate the main problems. Having access to all the code makes
track and car editing a lot easier.
buzard
"Chris Bloom" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Would it not be possible for a software developer to create an "open"racing
> sim. Okay the word "open" might be a bit ambiguos so let me try anddefine
> what I mean by the term.
>
> The developer of the initial sim would create the basic physics engine.
> This would have to be at least on par with the GPL physics engine aswellas
it
> and with enough information it shouldn't be a problem for them.
>
> The format would allow any sort (within reason) of 4 (or more) wheelvehicle
> to be created and given a set of values which would affect it'sperformance.
> Values that could be entered could be the drive wheels, tyre dimensions,
> power, weight and virtually anything else that would affect performance.
>
> Types of possibble tracks could include the regular road/oval/streetaswell
> as possibly off-road and point to point such as Rally or Hill-Climbs. It
> could maybe be possible to create a virtual world where you can drive
> anywhere within it. This would allow a type of Midtown Madness scenarioor
and
> the possibility of a more complex physics engine which would be possible
> because computers would be more powerful. The old cars, tracks wouldstill
> work with each new release though.
>
> The closest we have got to this format so far would be SCGT for it's easeof
> creating cars and GP2 which seems to have had everything about it edited.
>
> I know Paul Hoad is trying to create and open sim and I know there havebeen
> a couple of more attempts. I wish Paul good luck but in reality this type
> of thing needs a big name to get behind it and distribute/market it.
>
> Well I just wanted to put my ideas on the subject in one place. I'm sure
> it could be a popular and profitable format as the Flight Sim communityhas
> proven.
>
> Chris
>
>
Quoted text (9 lines)
> including some additions which I will get to later. > > The sim could be released with a set of cars and a set of tracks and of > course a menu system. > > The rights to the core physics engine would be kept by the developers but > they would share the knowledge with the rest of the world on how to create > cars, tracks, graphics etc. They would not need to release an editor as > there would be no lack of programmers out there ready to have a crack atQuoted text (17 lines)
> even a cross country race. Hey! Cannonball Run On-line!! > > For those of you familiar with Flight Sims would realise that what I am > describing is more or less the Auto equivelant of the Microsoft Flight > Simulator series. For those not familiar with this product just go to > www.flightsim.com and look at all the additional > aircraft/airports/scenery/sounds/guages/navigation systems etc. etc. that > are free for downloading. Microsoft actually encourage third party > developers by releasing instructions for making these additions. > > Microsoft releases a new flight sim every couple of years (actually it has > been just about every year for the last few years if you include Combat > Flight Simulator) and each one sells by the truckload, most of the third > party stuff from the previous sims is usually compatible with the new sim. > > A racing sim developer could go the same sort of route, people would buy a > new version every couple of years which would include enhanced graphicsWhats the site address for Paul Hoads Project?
On Fri, 07 Apr 2000 07:17:50 GMT, "Bob Thurman" <[email hidden]>
wrote:
