F1 2000 Force Feedback: Any way to make it stronger?

There is a patch for MGPR2 that strengthens the force feedback in the game, by modifying the Direct Input file in the game. Does anyone know if that could be done in F12K? It seems rather weak to me.

I think MGPR2 uses i-Force, so you should be able to tweak it with i-force Studio and change just about everything. -- Slot www.slottweak.com Tweaks & Reviews "nixx" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:39368c18.21394218@news-server... > There is a patch for MGPR2 that strengthens the force feedback in the > game, by modifying the Direct Input file in the game. Does anyone > know if that could be done in F12K? It seems rather weak to me.

Turn the speed sensitivity down to 0. I thought that the FFF was really lame but gradually I've been turning down the speed sensitivity from 30% as I get more used to it. When I got down the 0 the FF suddenly starts to work properly when before you only felt the curbs. Now you can feel the wheel weighting up and unweighting through the turns . It's now so much better although it's still nowhere near as good as GPL as Viper Racing. Because it gets a more twitchy you have to turn down your steering lock from 25% to something more like 12%. Some Call Me Tim

Does F12K use i-force as well? The changes on the MGPR2 patch made the FF much stronger and (I suppose) more realistic. Can a regular guy like me make those changes? Could you import the MGPR2 patch over? On Thu, 1 Jun 2000 19:32:45 -0400, "GTX_SlotCar" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I think MGPR2 uses i-Force, so you should be able to tweak it with i-force >Studio and change just about everything.

I don't know if F1 2000 uses i-Force studio. I tend to doubt it. I don't know what the patch is for MGPR2. With i-Force studio, you can configure FF the way you want it. If you're using a wheel, the i-force filename you want to modify is whl.ifr. If you're using a joystick, it's joy.ifr. Not all wheels use i-Force or include i-Force Studio. -- Slot www.slottweak.com Tweaks & Reviews "nixx" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3938f7e4.24495167@news-server... > Does F12K use i-force as well? The changes on the MGPR2 patch made > the FF much stronger and (I suppose) more realistic. Can a regular > guy like me make those changes? Could you import the MGPR2 patch > over? > > On Thu, 1 Jun 2000 19:32:45 -0400, "GTX_SlotCar" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >I think MGPR2 uses i-Force, so you should be able to tweak it with i-force > >Studio and change just about everything. >

Some Call Me Tim wrote;

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>Turn the speed sensitivity down to 0. I thought that the FFF was really lame >but gradually I've been turning down the speed sensitivity from 30% as I get >more used to it. When I got down the 0 the FF suddenly starts to work >properly when before you only felt the curbs. Now you can feel the wheel >weighting up and unweighting through the turns . It's now so much better >although it's still nowhere near as good as GPL as Viper Racing. Because it >gets a more twitchy you have to turn down your steering lock from 25% to >something more like 12%. >

Another problem is the double edged sword of the full force physics model. It's so realistic that it can handle variables and inputs beyond what an F1 driver would experience. For instance if you hack your cars *.svm file to get a higher wing angle than the garage menu allows (such as 20 degrees), the car reacts just the way it should, and you get more lateral g's, and you feel more forces on the steering wheel. You can make the tires wider or even change the friction (grip) in the *.veh files and the physics model is so good that just changing one number changes everything, handling, spins, top speed, fuel milage, just the way it would in the real world. If you double the grip of the tires it's actually hard to drive, at first, but then you get the hang of it, and the sensation of lateral g's is awesome from the rollbar view. So the total range of force your steering wheel is capable of has to be set to handle a very wide range of conditions. Problem is, a realistic setup that can get good speed on the straights and not have to change tires every 3 laps need only sample a small slice of that range. So if your wheel generates a max force of 10. And the max force triggered by F1 2000 is with, oh, let's say wings at 30 degrees and tires with twice the grip. Then when you race with realistic setups your max force feedback experience is going to be small, like 5 or less. Only half what your wheel hardware is capable of. So what the gamer needs is a way to manually alter the range that the physics model will output, and where on the lateral g (and other forces) scale it will match the max force possible from the force feedback hardware. Something like, "Set the lateral forces the car can stick to the road with wings at 10 degrees and soft tires as causing the max force feedback my hardware can make, and everything above that will just have to feel the same." I'm hoping there is a way to do this in the files, but so far I can't find it. GPL has something like that in it's core.ini file: [ Joy ] allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it force_feedback_damping = 40.000000 ; force feedback damping coefficient force_feedback_latency = 0.085000 ; force feedback latency (secs) max_steering_torque = 225.000000 ; steering torque in N*in giving max device force

Er, they do have a narrow lock, of course--but 10-12 degrees?! --DK "Richard S Beckett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message Erm...Real F1 cars have a max lock of around 10-12 degrees. They'd be a bit twitchy with 25 degrees of lock, too. They don't even use that much lock for Monaco. R.

Well, what you're saying makes a lot of sense. However, playing even the lame Official Formula 1 with my son, I noticed the FF was really quite good. We know it's good with GPL, and it's awesome in MGPRS, as well as DTR and Powerslide. The same physics you cite apply there. Other games I have played that are meant for FF sticks can rip the wheel out of your hand (Battlezone 2). So, why can't they come up with something decent for this game? Shouldn't good FF be mandatory for any new racing game? BTW, I am not knocking the game as such. I like it better every time I play it. It's just kinda disappointing that you can seemingly adjust everything else except FF response. On 08 Jun 2000 02:53:49 GMT, [email hidden] (TToommLL) wrote:

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>Another problem is the double edged sword of the full force physics >model. It's so realistic that it can handle variables and inputs beyond >what an F1 driver would experience. For instance if you hack your >cars *.svm file to get a higher wing angle than the garage menu >allows (such as 20 degrees), the car reacts just the way it should, >and you get more lateral g's, and you feel more forces on the steering >wheel. You can make the tires wider or even change the friction (grip) >in the *.veh files and the physics model is so good that just changing >one number changes everything, handling, spins, top speed, fuel milage, >just the way it would in the real world. If you double the grip of the tires >it's actually hard to drive, at first, but then you get the hang of it, and >the sensation of lateral g's is awesome from the rollbar view. So the >total range of force your steering wheel is capable of has to be set >to handle a very wide range of conditions. Problem is, a realistic >setup that can get good speed on the straights and not have to change >tires every 3 laps need only sample a small slice of that range. So if >your wheel generates a max force of 10. And the max force triggered by >F1 2000 is with, oh, let's say wings at 30 degrees and tires with twice >the grip. Then when you race with realistic setups your max force >feedback experience is going to be small, like 5 or less. Only half what >your wheel hardware is capable of. So what the gamer needs is a way >to manually alter the range that the physics model will output, and >where on the lateral g (and other forces) scale it will match the max >force possible from the force feedback hardware. Something like, "Set >the lateral forces the car can stick to the road with wings at 10 degrees >and soft tires as causing the max force feedback my hardware can make, >and everything above that will just have to feel the same." I'm hoping there >is a way to do this in the files, but so far I can't find it. > >GPL has something like that in it's core.ini file: > >[ Joy ] >allow_force_feedback = 1 ; Use FF if device has it >force_feedback_damping = 40.000000 ; force feedback damping >coefficient >force_feedback_latency = 0.085000 ; force feedback latency (secs) >max_steering_torque = 225.000000 ; steering torque in N*in >giving max device force > > >