Re: WHY no new VIPER RACING tracks ?

Hey Alex, Is that guy on your mailing list a Socialist-Communist? If he is, you are onto something! ;) LOL -- Scott B. Husted PA-Scott PowerSims.com ICQ# 4395450

On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 20:13:09 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (8 lines)

>On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:51:02 -0400, "Peter O'Connor" ><[email hidden]> wrote: > >>I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade >>game, > >I forgot, was is PLOINK or PLONK? Rrevved? >

hehe it is PLONK. It means Please Leave Our Newsgroup. Killfiled. :)

On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 14:05:52 GMT, [email hidden] (Nos) wrote:

Quoted text (9 lines)

>On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:47:46 -0500, rrevved ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >>Horseshit. >> > >Hey rrevved, >Why don't you post in the flight-sim group anymore?

Hey! Well, I have kind of slowed down on flight sims. My FLCS went on the fritz and I just switched over to Dreamcast.. :) I also still do some sim racing. Good to 'talk' to you.

Actually, Brian, I think the guy is dead-wrong -- look at how many cars and tracks have been developed for NFS3 and NFS:HS, and they are both DEFINITELY arcade games. The problem with Viper Racing is a lack of tools from involved parties (i.e., the developer and/or testers who were involved with development). Papy and EA both have people who were involved in the development and testing proving follow-on support for 3rd-party development for ICR2, N2/3, GPL, SCGT, and the NFS games; MGI hasn't done anything to make Viper Racing more open, or to help people crack the existing files so that they can develop 3rd-party add-ons (no knock against MGI intended -- I know some of those guys). So, at any rate, it's not an arcade versus sim deal, it's an open architecture versus closed architecture issue, and Viper Racing is a closed book to all the smart guys out there right now. Hopefully that will change, but I'm not holding my breath. -- JB In article <WzO15.1510$[email hidden]>, "Mocker" <[email hidden]> wrote: > Don't flame the guy. He tried to answer the question as best hecould. With > no real information, which he states, he offered his opinion. Without > hearing from the "track guru's" his answer seems as likely as anyother. > There is a real feeling of "GPL is a sim, everything else is a game"in this > newgroup. So perhaps his comments aren't that far off, regardless ofhow > other people feel about Viper Racing. All that counts is that thepeople who > have the skill to make new tracks for this game, haven't, and don'tsppear > to be doing so in the near future. Maybe one of them will explain whythey > have ignored this fine game. Not that they should feel that they haveto,

Quoted text (7 lines)

> just as a way of answering a pretty good question. > Later, > Brian > > "Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Viper Racing is an ARCADE game?????? I hope you are not referring

to the > > physics, damage model, etc as Viper was probably number 2 to GPL interms > > of accurate physics modeling. > > > > Yeah, they weren't real tracks, all cars were Vipers, etc etc.. BUTViper

Quoted text (10 lines)

> > Racing was NOT arcade. > > > > Scott > > PA-Scott > > PowerSims.com > > > > [email hidden] (Peter O'Connor) wrote in > > <8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]>: > > > > >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically

an > > >arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to andsupplement > > >existing games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL). > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:51:02 -0400, "Peter O'Connor" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade >game, Horseshit.

That doesn't explain the many tracks for all the NFS games... Stephen Peter O'Connor <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]... > I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically anarcade > game, and the people who generally contribute to and supplement existing > games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL). I really don'twant > to get into an argument here over which type of game is better (arcade or > simulation, they meet different requirements). I'm simply trying to offera

Quoted text (8 lines)

> suggestion (which may or may not be a correct observation) as to why there > are no new tracks offered for Viper Racing. > > Loosay2 <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > IS it that much more difficult to figure out how the tracks in viper > racing are > > made, than for GPL or NFS or SCGT. The tracks in that game are

excellent. > > Has any of you smart programming wizards out there tried to crack thecode > ? > > > >

IS it that much more difficult to figure out how the tracks in viper racing are made, than for GPL or NFS or SCGT. The tracks in that game are excellent. Has any of you smart programming wizards out there tried to crack the code ?

Quoted text (7 lines)

>On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:51:02 -0400, "Peter O'Connor" >>I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade >>game, >I forgot, was is PLOINK or PLONK? Rrevved?

hehe it is PLONK. It means Please Leave Our Newsgroup. Killfiled. :)

I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to and supplement existing games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL). I really don't want to get into an argument here over which type of game is better (arcade or simulation, they meet different requirements). I'm simply trying to offer a suggestion (which may or may not be a correct observation) as to why there are no new tracks offered for Viper Racing. Loosay2 <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > IS it that much more difficult to figure out how the tracks in viperracing are > made, than for GPL or NFS or SCGT. The tracks in that game are excellent. > Has any of you smart programming wizards out there tried to crack the code? >

Peter O'Connor wrote:

Quoted text (9 lines)

> > I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade > game, and the people who generally contribute to and supplement existing > games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL). I really don't want > to get into an argument here over which type of game is better (arcade or > simulation, they meet different requirements). I'm simply trying to offer a > suggestion (which may or may not be a correct observation) as to why there > are no new tracks offered for Viper Racing. >

Did you actually see Viper Racing? If you did you'd know its every bit as good as a vehicle sim as GPL (it was developed by some ex-Papy employees), it's only the concept that is arcadish a bit. -Gregor

Viper Racing is an ARCADE game?????? I hope you are not referring to the physics, damage model, etc as Viper was probably number 2 to GPL in terms of accurate physics modeling. Yeah, they weren't real tracks, all cars were Vipers, etc etc.. BUT Viper Racing was NOT arcade. Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com [email hidden] (Peter O'Connor) wrote in <8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]>: >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an >arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to and supplement >existing games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL).

On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:47:46 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Horseshit. > Hey rrevved, Why don't you post in the flight-sim group anymore? -- Nos

Don't flame the guy. He tried to answer the question as best he could. With no real information, which he states, he offered his opinion. Without hearing from the "track guru's" his answer seems as likely as any other. There is a real feeling of "GPL is a sim, everything else is a game" in this newgroup. So perhaps his comments aren't that far off, regardless of how other people feel about Viper Racing. All that counts is that the people who have the skill to make new tracks for this game, haven't, and don't sppear to be doing so in the near future. Maybe one of them will explain why they have ignored this fine game. Not that they should feel that they have to, just as a way of answering a pretty good question. Later, Brian "Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (17 lines)

> Viper Racing is an ARCADE game?????? I hope you are not referring to the > physics, damage model, etc as Viper was probably number 2 to GPL in terms > of accurate physics modeling. > > Yeah, they weren't real tracks, all cars were Vipers, etc etc.. BUT Viper > Racing was NOT arcade. > > Scott > PA-Scott > PowerSims.com > > [email hidden] (Peter O'Connor) wrote in > <8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]>: > > >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an > >arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to and supplement > >existing games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL).

Peter O'Connor <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]... > I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically anarcade > game...(snipped) Could you describe why you think so? I'm interested in how someone would consider it "arcadish" (if there were such a word). To each his own, or course, but imo VR has a very good driving model and the force feedback effects were very useful for car control.

I'm guessing the fact that Viper doesn't have real world tracks, it doesn't grab the "racing" guys. Add to that, only a very few folks have figured out this track editing thing for the Papy family of tracks. Most of them have concentrated on GPL or the N series.(with a good dose of ICR2 backgroud replacements) dave henrie Loosay2 wrote: > > IS it that much more difficult to figure out how the tracks in viper racing are > made, than for GPL or NFS or SCGT. The tracks in that game are excellent. > Has any of you smart programming wizards out there tried to crack the code ?

Maybe you can point me in the direction to where I flamed him ??? I questioned his opinion and stated mine. Maybe your definition of flaming is different than mine. Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com [email hidden] (Mocker) wrote in <WzO15.1510$[email hidden]>:

Quoted text (26 lines)

>Don't flame the guy. >"Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> Viper Racing is an ARCADE game?????? I hope you are not referring to >> the physics, damage model, etc as Viper was probably number 2 to GPL >> in terms of accurate physics modeling. >> >> Yeah, they weren't real tracks, all cars were Vipers, etc etc.. BUT >> Viper Racing was NOT arcade. >> >> Scott >> PA-Scott >> PowerSims.com >> >> [email hidden] (Peter O'Connor) wrote in >> <8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]>: >> >> >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an >> >arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to and >> >supplement existing games are more interested in simulations (such as >> >GPL). > > >

Scott wrote: > > Maybe you can point me in the direction to where I flamed him ??? > > I questioned his opinion and stated mine. Maybe your definition of flaming > is different than mine. Probably, most people's are....:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

Listen you @#$@#$$! ;) ROFLMAO Shouldn't you be out buying those Ayn Rand books I recommended you read?!? ;) Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com [email hidden] (Goy Larsen) wrote in <[email hidden]>:

Quoted text (19 lines)

>Scott wrote: >> >> Maybe you can point me in the direction to where I flamed him ??? >> >> I questioned his opinion and stated mine. Maybe your definition of >> flaming is different than mine. > >Probably, most people's are....:-) > > >Beers and cheers >(uncle) Goy > >"Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ >"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ > >* Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * >"Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com >

Scott wrote: > > Listen you @#$@#$$! ;) ROFLMAO > > Shouldn't you be out buying those Ayn Rand books I recommended you read?!? Why, I already know everything ? Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

I know, I know. You know everything, you just can't remember it all at once <VBG> Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com

"Loosay2" <[email hidden]> wrote > IS it that much more difficult to figure out how the tracks in viperracing are > made, than for GPL or NFS or SCGT. The tracks in that game are excellent. > Has any of you smart programming wizards out there tried to crack the code? Viper Racing had a very closed file system architecture. Some developers chose to not open their game engine to any third-party utility enhancement. MGI did that with VR. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

I wasn't commenting on the validity of his claims. I was trying to stem the tide of inane "Are you F'in joking????" posts.... Which I guess I caused... so.... nevermind... Later, Brian <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8i8pol$ep0$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (74 lines)

> Actually, Brian, I think the guy is dead-wrong -- look at how many cars > and tracks have been developed for NFS3 and NFS:HS, and they are both > DEFINITELY arcade games. > > The problem with Viper Racing is a lack of tools from involved parties > (i.e., the developer and/or testers who were involved with development). > > Papy and EA both have people who were involved in the development and > testing proving follow-on support for 3rd-party development for ICR2, > N2/3, GPL, SCGT, and the NFS games; MGI hasn't done anything to make > Viper Racing more open, or to help people crack the existing files so > that they can develop 3rd-party add-ons (no knock against MGI intended > -- I know some of those guys). > > So, at any rate, it's not an arcade versus sim deal, it's an open > architecture versus closed architecture issue, and Viper Racing is a > closed book to all the smart guys out there right now. Hopefully that > will change, but I'm not holding my breath. > > -- JB > > In article <WzO15.1510$[email hidden]>, > "Mocker" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > Don't flame the guy. He tried to answer the question as best he > could. With > > no real information, which he states, he offered his opinion. Without > > hearing from the "track guru's" his answer seems as likely as any > other. > > There is a real feeling of "GPL is a sim, everything else is a game" > in this > > newgroup. So perhaps his comments aren't that far off, regardless of > how > > other people feel about Viper Racing. All that counts is that the > people who > > have the skill to make new tracks for this game, haven't, and don't > sppear > > to be doing so in the near future. Maybe one of them will explain why > they > > have ignored this fine game. Not that they should feel that they have > to, > > just as a way of answering a pretty good question. > > Later, > > Brian > > > > "Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > Viper Racing is an ARCADE game?????? I hope you are not referring > to the > > > physics, damage model, etc as Viper was probably number 2 to GPL in > terms > > > of accurate physics modeling. > > > > > > Yeah, they weren't real tracks, all cars were Vipers, etc etc.. BUT > Viper > > > Racing was NOT arcade. > > > > > > Scott > > > PA-Scott > > > PowerSims.com > > > > > > [email hidden] (Peter O'Connor) wrote in > > > <8i7v3v$fko$[email hidden]>: > > > > > > >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically > an > > > >arcade game, and the people who generally contribute to and > supplement > > > >existing games are more interested in simulations (such as GPL). > > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy.

Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American Rally mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seems to have a similar personality :) Thanks, Alex Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (7 lines)

> I know, I know. You know everything, you just can't remember it all at > once <VBG> > > Scott > PA-Scott > PowerSims.com >

After reading your post, I'm afraid it's you... Remco "Alex Kihurani" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American Rally >mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of >trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seems to >have a similar personality :)

On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 08:51:02 -0400, "Peter O'Connor" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I think that the possible reason is that Viper Racing is basically an arcade >game, I forgot, was is PLOINK or PLONK? Rrevved? Andre <snip the rest, not worth reading after a statement like this one>

In article <[email hidden]>, Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (7 lines)

>Scott wrote: >> >> I know, I know. You know everything, you just can't remember it all at >> once <VBG> > >Exactly :-) >

Everyone has a photographic memory. Some just don't have film... :) Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. 2:12.80 minutes-GPLRank:329 and falling.. Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Scott wrote: > > I know, I know. You know everything, you just can't remember it all at > once <VBG> Exactly :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

"Scott B. Husted" wrote: > > Hey Alex, > > Is that guy on your mailing list a Socialist-Communist? If he is, you are > onto something! ;) LOL More likely that he's ON something if you ask me :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

Alex Kihurani wrote: > > Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American Rally > mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of > trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seems to > have a similar personality :) I'm a smartass, not a dumbass Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

ROFL Goy ;) Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com

ROFL Goy ;) Scott PA-Scott PowerSims.com [email hidden] (Goy Larsen) wrote in <[email hidden]>:

Quoted text (11 lines)

>More likely that he's ON something if you ask me :-) > > >Beers and cheers >(uncle) Goy > >"Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ >"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ > >* Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * >"Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

Remco Moedt wrote: > > After reading your post, I'm afraid it's you... The kid is 13 years old :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

Lol. I just use dumbass because I told this other rally driver (Kendall Russel) about how Jens did a big slide (he's ultra conservative, afraid to go past 75 on the straights, finishes last, most of the people on the mailing list are mad at him because he says he beats all the top competitors when they crash like Choiniere, Buffum, Lawler, Comas, etc.) She said, "yeah, probably wet his pants doing it too" Then her co-driver asks her, "Who's Jens Larsen" Kendall: "Probably one of the biggest rally dumbasses you'll ever meet" So, you were potraying behavior like our Dutch friend Jens, and your last name was Larsen, so I just had to say dumbass :) Check out my rally video clips from STPR at http://drive.to/rallyclips/ and see maybe your distant relative slide :) BTW, Click on STPR 2000 Thanks, Alex Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > > Alex Kihurani wrote: > > > > Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this AmericanRally > > mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of > > trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seemsto

Quoted text (13 lines)

> > have a similar personality :) > > I'm a smartass, not a dumbass > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > > "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ > "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ > > * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * > "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

hehe.....Geez, can't u take a joke :) Remco Moedt <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (9 lines)

> > After reading your post, I'm afraid it's you... > > Remco > > > "Alex Kihurani" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American

Rally > >mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of > >trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seemsto > >have a similar personality :) >

Alex Kihurani wrote:

Quoted text (13 lines)

> > Lol. I just use dumbass because I told this other rally driver (Kendall > Russel) about how Jens did a big slide (he's ultra conservative, afraid to > go past 75 on the straights, finishes last, most of the people on the > mailing list are mad at him because he says he beats all the top competitors > when they crash like Choiniere, Buffum, Lawler, Comas, etc.) She said, > "yeah, probably wet his pants doing it too" Then her co-driver asks her, > "Who's Jens Larsen" > Kendall: "Probably one of the biggest rally dumbasses you'll ever meet" > > So, you were potraying behavior like our Dutch friend Jens, and your last > name was Larsen, so I just had to say dumbass :) Check out my rally video > clips from STPR at http://drive.to/rallyclips/ and see maybe your distant

Relax Alex, I didn't get offended by what you wrote, I usually don't get offended by 13 year olds calling me names :-), although I must admit that I didn't quite spot the joke, guess it was more funny to those who know this other guy, but going to a forum like this and calling people you don't know a "dumbass" is not the best way of making new friends, if you do, you better make sure that there's an obvious joke in there, preferably a funny one :-) But having said that, being compared to this guy you're talking about don't seem very nice, so maybe I should be offended now that you have explained it :-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

hehe.....Geez, can't u take a joke :)

Quoted text (8 lines)

> After reading your post, I'm afraid it's you... > Remco > >Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American

Rally > >mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of > >trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seems to > >have a similar personality :)

Hey, it was late! I didn't recognize it as a joke, though. I admit, I'm a bit sensitive when people are generalizing... Remco "Alex Kihurani" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (17 lines)

>hehe.....Geez, can't u take a joke :) >Remco Moedt <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> >> After reading your post, I'm afraid it's you... >> >> Remco >> >> >> "Alex Kihurani" <[email hidden]> wrote: >> >> >Is it just me, or are most Larsen's online dumbasses? On this American >Rally >> >mailing list I'm on, their's a guy named Jens Larsen who talks a lot of >> >trash, but is quiet in real life. (met him at a rally) Funny, Goy seems >to >> >have a similar personality :)

Graeme Nash <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > >I didn't recognize it as a joke, though. I admit, I'm a bit > >sensitive when people are generalizing... > > Yeah, you're too sensitive, just like every other Remco in the World :-) does anyone else in here always thinnk of a childs' toy manufacturer when they hear the name "Remco"? ~daxe -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----

>I didn't recognize it as a joke, though. I admit, I'm a bit >sensitive when people are generalizing... Yeah, you're too sensitive, just like every other Remco in the World :-) -- Cheers! Graeme Nash