GPL D3D PATCH - WOW!!!

This is a complete revelation. Runs more fantastic than words can describe. What fabulous customer service for a game that is almost two years old. Will we ever stop playing it? - Not now. Best wishes to all at Papy, Chris Wright

I agree, it has totally transformed the game. It looks very good and plays excellently on my GF2. It's a new game! They should release an updated version and have it reviewed again. I am sure it would sell very well and even more so if online support was good. Nice one Papy! "Chris Wright" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8j0rlu$m06$[email hidden]... > This is a complete revelation. Runs more fantastic than words candescribe. > > What fabulous customer service for a game that is almost two yearsold.

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> > Will we ever stop playing it? - Not now. > > Best wishes to all at Papy, > > Chris Wright > >

In article <VU755.1326$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Some Call Me Tim) wrote:

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> the new d3d patch is just fab. Look at those lovely high res mirrors! > It > runs at 36pfs at 1600x1200 with FSAA on ! (not that you need it at > 1600x1200) on my PIII 600 GeForce DDR. It even runs in a window so I > raced > at Spa this afternoon whilst watching the footy on a window for my TV > card > at the same time, it was just heaven. I didn't even have to turn the > AGP > size down from 128 to 4 as I had too with OpenGL. > > GP3 is going to have to be damm good to drag me away from GPL > > Some Call Me Tim

How do u get GPL to run in a window? 8-) *Peter* - http://www.cix.co.uk/~peterpc/home.html

"Trevor" <[email hidden]> wrote > ... They should release an > updated version ...I am sure it would sell > very well ... LOL!! You still don't get it. GPL didn't bomb because it played poorly or looked bad. Two years ago on my Voodoo 2 cards this was the best looking racing game on the planet. But it's still 1967 GP racing, so it still won't sell to the mass market that has no clue who the "Legends" in this game are - and no appreciation for driving 30 year old cars. Even the NASCAR Legends sim bombed, and NASCAR is incredibly popular right now in the U.S. The teenagers that make up the bulk of software sales just don't have any sense of nostalgia for the past. This is the "what have you done for me lately" era, Richard Petty is now Richard who? Oh, Kyle's dad... yeah.

I second that WOW! I have a TNT2 ultra and two Voodoo2's SLI'd. I alwaysran GPL through the Voodoos, now I can use the TNT2. Vibrant colors, no more purple smoke, and the best is I can use GPLSF's hi-rez 512x256 dashes, goodbye 256x256. p.s. anyone want to buy two VOODOO 2's On Sat, 24 Jun 2000 00:24:45 +0100, "Chris Wright" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>This is a complete revelation. Runs more fantastic than words can describe. > >What fabulous customer service for a game that is almost two years old. > >Will we ever stop playing it? - Not now. > >Best wishes to all at Papy, > >Chris Wright >

To email me remove the "u"s

the new d3d patch is just fab. Look at those lovely high res mirrors! It runs at 36pfs at 1600x1200 with FSAA on ! (not that you need it at 1600x1200) on my PIII 600 GeForce DDR. It even runs in a window so I raced at Spa this afternoon whilst watching the footy on a window for my TV card at the same time, it was just heaven. I didn't even have to turn the AGP size down from 128 to 4 as I had too with OpenGL. GP3 is going to have to be damm good to drag me away from GPL Some Call Me Tim

Oops! I own it too!! "Ian P" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8j4l8k$jk4$[email hidden]...

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> TOCA2 is not a Rally game, it's Touring cars ;) > > -- > Ian P > <email address invalid due to spam > > > Trevor <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:8j4581$joj$[email hidden]... > > > > > People who would buy driving sims are plenty and not just

teenagers. I > > saw Mobil 1 Rally Championship obtain huge sales and it's aBritish > > rally game - on paper it sounds very boring. TOCA2 is another'boring' > > British rally game. Colin McRae Rally another one - look at them > > anticipating CMR2 on the PC. > >

"Tracey A Miller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:39560ad3$0$49233$[email hidden]... > Trevor wrote > > Who says, apart from you, that it is teenagers who account for the > > "bulk of software sales"? That's nonsense. BTW, it is not justkids > > who buy *games*. Many 'older' people also buy and enjoy them. > > The demographics have changed quite a bit just in the two yearssince > GPL, with many more people - older people - owning home PC's. >My guess is that older people have always owned more home PCs than teenagers - they're too expensive simply to give to kids as toys (I am sure some do though). Affordable consoles are the teenagers' thing - parents' bane. The Net has opened up the usage of PCs to many more people. Many more kids have access to them at school because of its econmic power. But that's no the same thing. I think in most cases the kid gets to use his dad's PC. The general idea of some confused parent not knowing how to use a PC is a fallacy. > Adults do buy a lot of games now, in some ways they are driving the > market these days. Games like Deerhunter and Who Wants to be a > Millionaire would never see there way to the top of the charts if it > were up to teenagers. >I agree that adults with their greater incomes are driving the PC, Net and games markets. I see kids hanging around games shops but it's adults who are buying. The Net makes the buying of games, books, music so much easier - using credit cards.

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> So in some ways you're probably right, a realistic racing simulator > would have a better chance of selling today than it did in 1998. Now > there are a lot more people that have steering wheels connected to > their PC's, many with FF support, so that alone would improve the > games chances. I can't help but wonder how many people that returned > GPL had tried to drive it with a keyboard. >

Good point. You are likely correct. However, I enjoyed Revs very much on the 8-bit BBC Micro using the keyboard! I played TOCA2 with a game pad. But certainly a good steering wheel is quite a revelation and a joy to use. > If they really wanted to re-release GPL, they could take theconverted > N3 tracks, make some slight modifications to the cars and physics, > slap on some IRL logos and maybe a pic of Juan Montoya winningIndy - > bam, instant best seller. >Yes, I think some sort of arcade like mode with the harder game there for those who want to progress to it would be a good idea. Good online racing fun would be a good selling point too. Broadband access will help greatly with games like this. Quake3 and UT online are a bit too samey. Some good fast racing games would go down well. :-)

Trevor wrote > Who says, apart from you, that it is teenagers who account for the > "bulk of software sales"? That's nonsense. BTW, it is not just kids > who buy *games*. Many 'older' people also buy and enjoy them. The demographics have changed quite a bit just in the two years since GPL, with many more people - older people - owning home PC's. Adults do buy a lot of games now, in some ways they are driving the market these days. Games like Deerhunter and Who Wants to be a Millionaire would never see there way to the top of the charts if it were up to teenagers. So in some ways you're probably right, a realistic racing simulator would have a better chance of selling today than it did in 1998. Now there are a lot more people that have steering wheels connected to their PC's, many with FF support, so that alone would improve the games chances. I can't help but wonder how many people that returned GPL had tried to drive it with a keyboard. If they really wanted to re-release GPL, they could take the converted N3 tracks, make some slight modifications to the cars and physics, slap on some IRL logos and maybe a pic of Juan Montoya winning Indy - bam, instant best seller.

In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Schneider <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> Maybe if it were modern F1 or CART, people would have been more >> willing to suffer through he steep learning curve, but spending hours >> practicing so they could complete one lap - forget about even compete >> in, much less win, a race - against a bunch of old blokes they had >> never heard of... I don't blame the teens for not buying it. > >Therein lies the problem. GPL is hard, it takes work and dedication. >There's no instant gratification, you won't be winning races in an hour, >it's not Need for Speed.

Hehe...you won't be winning races in 6 *months*, aliens excepted...<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +77.11 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <39559daa$0$49239$[email hidden]>, "Tracey A Miller" <[email hidden]> writes: > >"Kai Fuller" wrote >> you can't have much nostalgia about something you didn't experience. > >True. Maybe not nostalgia, but you can still have INTEREST. I love stories, movies, and games about WWII. I was born in 1963...<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +77.11 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

LOL? Have we spoken before? I have played enough games (right back to 8-bit BBC Micros) to know it is not about understanding an era it is about it being a good playable game with good marketing. For instance, look at war games and the like: how many kids (or adults today) have been to war or fought? There are so many cases where marketing has won the day - MacOS and Win98... People who would buy driving sims are plenty and not just teenagers. I saw Mobil 1 Rally Championship obtain huge sales and it's a British rally game - on paper it sounds very boring. TOCA2 is another 'boring' British rally game. Colin McRae Rally another one - look at them anticipating CMR2 on the PC. Each of those games sold and still sells. Europe, believe it or not, is a huge place and is a market in its own right. Tell people what it is, how exciting it is and how much fun it is. Have it reviewed so they see that the 'experts' like it. Basically, it is how you present it. Who says, apart from you, that it is teenagers who account for the "bulk of software sales"? That's nonsense. BTW, it is not just kids who buy *games*. Many 'older' people also buy and enjoy them. "Tracey A Miller" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:39553d1d$0$56831$[email hidden]...

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> > "Trevor" <[email hidden]> wrote > > ... They should release an > > updated version ...I am sure it would sell > > very well ... > > LOL!! > > You still don't get it. GPL didn't bomb because it played poorly or > looked bad. Two years ago on my Voodoo 2 cards this was the best > looking racing game on the planet. > > But it's still 1967 GP racing, so it still won't sell to the mass > market that has no clue who the "Legends" in this game are - and no > appreciation for driving 30 year old cars. > > Even the NASCAR Legends sim bombed, and NASCAR is incredibly popular > right now in the U.S. The teenagers that make up the bulk of

software > sales just don't have any sense of nostalgia for the past. This isthe > "what have you done for me lately" era, Richard Petty is now Richard > who? Oh, Kyle's dad... yeah. > >

"Kai Fuller" wrote > you can't have much nostalgia about something you didn't experience. True. > it's pretty unfair to say teens should have nostalgia about it ... I never said "should have", I just said don't have. I grew up with my dad telling me about the "glory days" of racing, so I'm a bit more nostalgic than most I guess, and I still think GPL was a misguided conception. > ...Is it really the what > have you done lately era when the rolling stones are still sellingout > concerts with old music and teen fans? Have you been to one of those concerts? Teen fans? The crowd looks closer to retirement age. > ... Lets face it, sierra > did not market either of these titles, that where they failed. Whereare the > commercials? very very boring adverts in magazines if at all. It'san era of > advertising, that's what it is. They probably spent more money promoting GPL than they did all their NASCAR titles combined. They pushed it real hard, but those magazine ads were pathetic. I remember one said something about how deadly racing was back then, making mention of the flames et al. I think they were trying to cater to the Quake crowd - blood and guts. I laugh thinking about it now , imagining teens buying GPL thinking it was Carmagedden or something, LOL! The situation wasn't that GPL wasn't exposed well though, initial shipments flew off the shelves. But instead of the buyers telling friends how cool it was and building momentum, they were on their way back to the mall to get an refund. Maybe if it were modern F1 or CART, people would have been more willing to suffer through he steep learning curve, but spending hours practicing so they could complete one lap - forget about even compete in, much less win, a race - against a bunch of old blokes they had never heard of... I don't blame the teens for not buying it.

On Sat, 24 Jun 2000 21:40:04 +0100, "Trevor" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I agree, it has totally transformed the game. It looks very good and >plays excellently on my GF2. It's a new game! They should release an >updated version and have it reviewed again. I don't think anyone reviewed GPL on a TNT back in 1998 ... Daniel -- ICQ UIN: 30333508 http://www.topofgames.de || http://danielshome.cjb.net

you can't have much nostalgia about something you didn't experience. I think it's pretty unfair to say teens should have nostalgia about it when you can't see the races, even if you wanted to. I think everyone knows who Richard petty was... How many people here that was born in the 1900's would be really that interested in 1910's racing? You might say well they only go 5 mph, but if you asked a guy now who might still be alive and remember it would tell us it was more exciting than today's races. Is it really the what have you done lately era when the rolling stones are still selling out concerts with old music and teen fans? Or have we all become so cynical that we just kind buy into these stereotypes of age groups? Lets face it, sierra did not market either of these titles, that where they failed. Where are the commercials? very very boring adverts in magazines if at all. It's an era of advertising, that's what it is. Tracey A Miller <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:39553d1d$0$56831$[email hidden]...

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> > "Trevor" <[email hidden]> wrote > > ... They should release an > > updated version ...I am sure it would sell > > very well ... > > LOL!! > > You still don't get it. GPL didn't bomb because it played poorly or > looked bad. Two years ago on my Voodoo 2 cards this was the best > looking racing game on the planet. > > But it's still 1967 GP racing, so it still won't sell to the mass > market that has no clue who the "Legends" in this game are - and no > appreciation for driving 30 year old cars. > > Even the NASCAR Legends sim bombed, and NASCAR is incredibly popular > right now in the U.S. The teenagers that make up the bulk of software > sales just don't have any sense of nostalgia for the past. This is the > "what have you done for me lately" era, Richard Petty is now Richard > who? Oh, Kyle's dad... yeah. > >

Tracey A Miller wrote: <snip> > Maybe if it were modern F1 or CART, people would have been more > willing to suffer through he steep learning curve, but spending hours > practicing so they could complete one lap - forget about even compete > in, much less win, a race - against a bunch of old blokes they had > never heard of... I don't blame the teens for not buying it. Therein lies the problem. GPL is hard, it takes work and dedication. There's no instant gratification, you won't be winning races in an hour, it's not Need for Speed. I flashed it up for my nephew and his buddy and within minutes they were doing backwards laps against the field trying to outdo each other in terms of "best crash". That got old real quick and they were back to Half-Life. I showed them a replay of one of my friends laps, and said this is what a good lap looks like. I was rewarded with blank stares and "What do you mean, 'good lap'?" questions. Nascar2 could justifiably be called a simulator rather than an arcade game, it was easier than this, anyone could do laps and keep it on the track after an hour or so, and it sold. GPL is a masterpiece, there's no question in my mind about that, but it is definitely a niche market game, and it found its market. It's just too bad that market is so small. Personally, given the degree of difficulty and the learning curve involved, I doubt it would have done any better if it had been released as a modern day F1 or CART sim. Only a very narrow segment of the buying public is willing to put in the time necessary to become competent at a sim of this difficulty. Using a current, popular venue would not alleviate this fact. Many people today, especially teenagers (in my experience), seem to want a game where they can be up to speed in five minutes, let alone 30 or 40 hours. I confess I almost abandoned GPL myself, after doing what seemed like endless laps without being able to keep it on the track. Simple sells, Deer Hunter is proof. I only hope that companies like Papyrus continue to produce titles of this quality to satisfy the mere 40,000 or so of us that really, really appreciate them. Doug

well the fact that you separated out US teens not having a sense of nostalgia just seemed to indicate that to me, my mistake. as for the rolling stones, maybe they just got lucky with the audience, or the part I saw wasn't indicative of the audience as a whole. Anyhow I thought the PC gaming market was in their 20's and 30's (unlike consoles) therefore all the old guys must not be that nostalgic about it either. Maybe we all really secretly wanted to drive the 6 wheel car and were disappointed, so we brought it back?

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> > you can't have much nostalgia about something you didn't experience. > > True. > > > it's pretty unfair to say teens should have nostalgia about it ... > > I never said "should have", I just said don't have. I grew up with my > dad telling me about the "glory days" of racing, so I'm a bit more > nostalgic than most I guess, and I still think GPL was a misguided > conception. > > > ...Is it really the what > > have you done lately era when the rolling stones are still selling > out > > concerts with old music and teen fans? > > Have you been to one of those concerts? Teen fans? The crowd looks > closer to retirement age. > > > ... Lets face it, sierra > > did not market either of these titles, that where they failed. Where > are the > > commercials? very very boring adverts in magazines if at all. It's > an era of > > advertising, that's what it is. > > They probably spent more money promoting GPL than they did all their > NASCAR titles combined. They pushed it real hard, but those magazine > ads were pathetic. I remember one said something about how deadly > racing was back then, making mention of the flames et al. > > I think they were trying to cater to the Quake crowd - blood and guts. > I laugh thinking about it now , imagining teens buying GPL thinking it > was Carmagedden or something, LOL! > > The situation wasn't that GPL wasn't exposed well though, initial > shipments flew off the shelves. But instead of the buyers telling > friends how cool it was and building momentum, they were on their way > back to the mall to get an refund. > > Maybe if it were modern F1 or CART, people would have been more > willing to suffer through he steep learning curve, but spending hours > practicing so they could complete one lap - forget about even compete > in, much less win, a race - against a bunch of old blokes they had > never heard of... I don't blame the teens for not buying it. > > > > >

TOCA2 is not a Rally game, it's Touring cars ;) -- Ian P <email address invalid due to spam Trevor <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8j4581$joj$[email hidden]... > > People who would buy driving sims are plenty and not just teenagers. I > saw Mobil 1 Rally Championship obtain huge sales and it's a British > rally game - on paper it sounds very boring. TOCA2 is another 'boring' > British rally game. Colin McRae Rally another one - look at them > anticipating CMR2 on the PC.

"Kai Fuller" wrote True. I never said "should have", I just said don't have. I grew up with my dad telling me about the "glory days" of racing, so I'm a bit more nostalgic than most I guess, and I still think GPL was a misguided conception. Have you been to one of those concerts? *** fans? The crowd looks closer to retirement age. They probably spent more money promoting GPL than they did all their NASCAR titles combined. They pushed it real hard, but those magazine ads were pathetic. I remember one said something about how deadly racing was back then, making mention of the flames et al. I think they were trying to cater to the Quake crowd - *** and guts. I laugh thinking about it now , imagining ***s buying GPL thinking it was Carmagedden or something, LOL! The situation wasn't that GPL wasn't exposed well though, initial shipments flew off the shelves. But instead of the buyers telling friends how cool it was and building momentum, they were on their way back to the mall to get an refund. Maybe if it were modern F1 or CART, people would have been more willing to suffer through he steep learning curve, but spending hours practicing so they could complete one lap - forget about even compete in, much less win, a race - against a bunch of old blokes they had never heard of... I don't blame the ***s for not buying it.

I figured it was just an oversight <G> -- Ian P <email address invalid due to spam Trevor <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8j5i96$6us$[email hidden]... > Oops! I own it too!! > > > "Ian P" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:8j4l8k$jk4$[email hidden]... > > TOCA2 is not a Rally game, it's Touring cars ;) > > > > -- > > Ian P > > <email address invalid due to spam > > > > > > Trevor <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:8j4581$joj$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > People who would buy driving sims are plenty and not just > teenagers. I > > > saw Mobil 1 Rally Championship obtain huge sales and it's a > British > > > rally game - on paper it sounds very boring. TOCA2 is another > 'boring' > > > British rally game. Colin McRae Rally another one - look at them > > > anticipating CMR2 on the PC. > > > > > >