Re: Geoff Crammond, a perfectionnist ?

Hands and arms on the steering wheel is unnecessary IMHO. You have your own in front of you why do you need a set on screen? It was the first thing I turned off in GPL. Geoff has the philosophy of doing one thing and doing it right. That does not include gimmicks such as animated guys running around your car and pace cars. He has concentrated on making the game engine as realistic as possible. It took 4 years because of the limited resources available to him. Just like every small software company, he has to make compromises between never finishing a game and making a few ommisions to get it released. To add what you suggest would probably have added months onto the release schedule. Remember, he is under pressure from his publisher (Hasbro) too. IMO he has made exactly the right choices. I don't care if I have no pit radio and if all the cars look the same. What I care about is whether the game feels like I am driving a modern F1 car. He has concentrated on the GAME ENGINE as he has said many times before and he was absolutely right to do so. Cheers, ...Colin

Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is driving the car. SKurj <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > Erwan wrote: > > > Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: > > Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all > > the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: > > - no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing sim

which > > include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a veryimportant > > stuff > > for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive in cockpitview the > > most of the time. > > I have a set of arms in front of me and a wheel... why do i need to seeanother set > on screen. When you hop in your family sedan or whatever to go to thestore, do u > look out the windshield and see another set of arms and another steeringwheel.. > > I don't buy this driver arms = realistic arguement, its a waste ofresources, and a > distraction if u ask me, and turnem off whenever i can, and the steeringwheel if at > all possible. > > Martyn_D >

And you know I'd be the first one to switch the "don't screw up" feature on. Stephen (Mr. Inconsistency, Mr. Red-Mist, Mr. Brain Fade) asgeir nes�en <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Now, THAT would take time to implement! ;-) > > Hehe... > > ---Asgeir--- > > Stephen Ferguson wrote: > > > Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting

away > > like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralfsulking, > > and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. > > > > Lots of chatter. > > > > Paul Tracy's team manager is constantly on the radio, repeating almost > > mantra-like that Tracy should concentrate and not do anything stupid.It

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> > seems to work. > > > > Stephen > > > > Allan Harrison <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:8kkbnh$253$[email hidden]... > > > > > > Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > >- no radio with the pits. > > > > > > > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > > > > > > Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. > > > > > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > > > JoH > > > > > > > > > >

HAHA yeah Geoff does get it right. I love canned spins, or isn't that part of the GAME ENGINE. Allan Harrison - [email hidden] Colin <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8kj8ra$s21$[email hidden]... > Hands and arms on the steering wheel is unnecessary IMHO. You have yourown > in front of you why do you need a set on screen? It was the first thing I > turned off in GPL. > > Geoff has the philosophy of doing one thing and doing it right. That does > not include gimmicks such as animated guys running around your car andpace > cars. He has concentrated on making the game engine as realistic as > possible. It took 4 years because of the limited resources available to > him. Just like every small software company, he has to make compromises > between never finishing a game and making a few ommisions to get it > released. To add what you suggest would probably have added months ontothe > release schedule. Remember, he is under pressure from his publisher > (Hasbro) too. IMO he has made exactly the right choices. I don't care ifI > have no pit radio and if all the cars look the same. What I care about is > whether the game feels like I am driving a modern F1 car. He has > concentrated on the GAME ENGINE as he has said many times before and hewas > absolutely right to do so. > > Cheers, > ...Colin > >

Simon Brown <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:BC7b5.2350$[email hidden]... > He may have had 4 years but there is only one of him. Papyrus had 3 main > programmers and a team of about 15 other programmers working on GPL, andit > took 2 years and (or so i've heard) over a million dollars. GC just hasthe > one pair of arms. And that's why they aren't in the cockpit, because Geoff still needs them... :-) Stephen

Yes correct Berno 90 % of the spins in Gp2 you can't catch. Due to it being CANNED. Lets just hope in Gp3 that Geoff fixes this up, however I doubt it. That would require Geoff to actually change his "Perfect Code". A classic example of how canned Geoff's code is, is when you attempt a J Turn. Well umm it won't work and I doubt it will work in Gp2.5 / Gp3. Iam not against Gp3 just because its not GPL however because it is not a step forward. It really does appear to be nothing more Gp2 with a new season and weather. Look at the screenshots. They are hardly sensational and look very much like Gp2 with more polygons. Dispute this it doesn't mean that I won't be buying Gp3, infact I have mine ordered already, this is because dispute some major flaws it still will be the best MODERN racing simulation. This isn't an indication of how good Geoff's code is but how little sim development there has been in recent years. Nothing has surpassed it apart from GPL and thats where the problem arrives. Until GPL everyone believed Gp2 felt spot on. Then GPL came out and showed us just how perfect racing sim could be. The reason why many people are negative about Gp3 is because its not taking sim racing further. Its no more advanced than games that came out 2 years ago. Allan Harrison - [email hidden] Berno <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lgcb5.10736$[email hidden]...

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> > Oh get it a "canned spin" is one you cant catch? > > "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:8kjhnu$o9v$[email hidden]... > > HAHA > > > > yeah Geoff does get it right. I love canned spins, or isn't that part of > the > > GAME ENGINE. > > > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > > > >

Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Apart from the fact that it is *incredibly* early to comment this > aspect of GP3 (now that I think of it, it's utter BULLSHIT to comment > on it), "forward" is very relative. A sim uses different lanes. GP3 > will definitely go forward in the graphics, AI, and weather > departments at least. That's already 3 "forwards". Is it really that "incredibly early" to comment on this aspect of Gp3. Haven't you seen working code of Gp3 running. You may also note that I was not bagging out the AI, Weather. The only things I was disapoined with was the Graphics (which do look very poor) and the driving model. > Disagree. It looks *fabulous*. You mean that the reflections in the > puddles don't look "sensational"???? JFYI: Chris West (yes, from WSC!) > posted a message here stating how *impressive* the dynamical weather > effects were implemented in GP3. Yes i do recall Chris West Posting about the weather. The weather effects do look quite good. However for me that is not 2 years of work > But of course, what does HE know about programming sims! <G> Umm well Have you ever played Gpl. Haven't you ever been annoyed by canned spins in Gp2 or is it that you are so good at it that you can catch spinns everytime Mr Schumacher! > >The reason why many people > >are negative about Gp3 is because its not taking sim racing further. Itsno > >more advanced than games that came out 2 years ago. > > Again: isn't it a LITTLE bit early to slag it off? How much time have > you spent with GP3??? :-) No i don't believe it is too early. I have been following the progress of Gp3 since it was first seen in E3 a few years ago. I also hoped that it would be a sensational seqcale to Gp2 however I don't think it will be. I have seen Gp3 running first hand and was not that impressive. Especailly when I saw the infamous black flag when a person cut a corner. Well we will see in a few weeks time. Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > JoH > >

Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > >- no radio with the pits. > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > JoH

Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting away like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralf sulking, and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. Lots of chatter. Paul Tracy's team manager is constantly on the radio, repeating almost mantra-like that Tracy should concentrate and not do anything stupid. It seems to work. Stephen Allan Harrison <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8kkbnh$253$[email hidden]...

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> > Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > >- no radio with the pits. > > > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > > Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > JoH > > >

LOL! In fact, this affliction is not rare at all. And it only occurs in RAS! ---Asgeir--- Simon Brown wrote: > ROFL! - typo of the decade!!! > > Incomplete-Feature-List-Allergy-Syndrome - it's a new but very rare > affliction...

Now, THAT would take time to implement! ;-) Hehe... ---Asgeir--- Stephen Ferguson wrote:

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> Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting away > like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralf sulking, > and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. > > Lots of chatter. > > Paul Tracy's team manager is constantly on the radio, repeating almost > mantra-like that Tracy should concentrate and not do anything stupid. It > seems to work. > > Stephen > > Allan Harrison <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:8kkbnh$253$[email hidden]... > > > > Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > >- no radio with the pits. > > > > > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > > > > Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. > > > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > > JoH > > > > > >

Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: - no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing sim which include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a very important stuff for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive in cockpit view the most of the time. - all the 3D body car shapes are the same for the 11 teams. Very weird. - no pace car, commissionners, etc........ - no radio with the pits. - and i forget a lot (i'm tired 2night) but we will see all the total missig features when the game will be released. As a "perfectionnist", GC should includes all this details in a game.. Don't tell me he don't have the skills or the time........He had 4 YEARS !!!!!!!!!!!! Like EA Sports, i think he did the minimum in order to make us buy the "add-on" GP4 (of course at a high price) and all the futurs GP5, GP6, etc.... EA Sports did the same behaviour with all their games. They add only a few stuffs every year in order to buy a tons of games. I'm still waiting for the ultimate racing sim with all the features i would like to be included.........but unfortunately, it will not be for the next months.

He may have had 4 years but there is only one of him. Papyrus had 3 main programmers and a team of about 15 other programmers working on GPL, and it took 2 years and (or so i've heard) over a million dollars. GC just has the one pair of arms. Geoff's company Simergy is still only the same four people it was for GP2 and the extra people from Microprose don't have anything to do with the core simulation. So of course, it's gonna take a long time. Any extra features would have, by simple logic, pushed back the release date even further.

Erwan wrote:

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> Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: > Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all > the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: > - no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing sim which > include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a very important > stuff > for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive in cockpit view the > most of the time.

I have a set of arms in front of me and a wheel... why do i need to see another set on screen. When you hop in your family sedan or whatever to go to the store, do u look out the windshield and see another set of arms and another steering wheel.. I don't buy this driver arms = realistic arguement, its a waste of resources, and a distraction if u ask me, and turnem off whenever i can, and the steering wheel if at all possible. Martyn_D

Erwan wrote: > > but when i see all > the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: You've gone septic??? Quick, somebody call doctor! :-)

ROFL! - typo of the decade!!! Incomplete-Feature-List-Allergy-Syndrome - it's a new but very rare affliction...

LOL "Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own > steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the > screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is driving the > car. > > SKurj <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > Erwan wrote: > > > > > Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: > > > Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all > > > the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: > > > - no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing

sim > which > > > include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a very > important > > > stuff > > > for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive incockpit

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> view the > > > most of the time. > > > > I have a set of arms in front of me and a wheel... why do i need to see > another set > > on screen. When you hop in your family sedan or whatever to go to the > store, do u > > look out the windshield and see another set of arms and another steering > wheel.. > > > > I don't buy this driver arms = realistic arguement, its a waste of > resources, and a > > distraction if u ask me, and turnem off whenever i can, and the steering > wheel if at > > all possible. > > > > Martyn_D > > > >

On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 12:00:46 +0200, "Erwan" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: >Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all >the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: >- no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing sim which >include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a very important >stuff for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive in cockpit view the >most of the time.

Totally unimportant. (I know, just an *opinion*, but as relevant or irrelevant as yours) Plus it obscures the LCD screen. Plus they would look bad and slow things down. >- all the 3D body car shapes are the same for the 11 teams. Very weird. Saves resources, and importance while racing is absolutely minimal. Hell, there are even people who *think* the shapes are different just because the textures mislead them. >- no pace car, commissionners, etc........ Simple if you're satisfied with a mess, takes time to get *right*. >- no radio with the pits. They hardly exchange a few words in reality. >- and i forget a lot (i'm tired 2night) but we will see all the total missig >features when the game will >be released. Oh, it's easy to mention another 642897512 "features" that could be in. >As a "perfectionnist", GC should includes all this details in a game.. >Don't tell me he don't have the skills or the time........He had 4 YEARS >!!!!!!!!!!!! "Perfectionist" is not the same as mixing-up as much half-ass features as possible. It's not about trying to fill the box with the longest possible feature list. "Perfectionist" is about making sure that WHAT you put in actually WORKS without problems. >Like EA Sports, i think he did the minimum in order to make us buy the "add-on" >GP4 (of course at a high price) and all the futurs GP5, GP6, etc.... EA Sports >did the same behaviour with all their >games. They add only a few stuffs every year in order to buy a tons of games. That's the negative approach. There's also a positive approach. By changing from his usual "1 sim every 5 years" strategy, GC has the chance now to first put out a version that may have less-than-all desirable features, but fills them in adequately (rain, AI, overall playability.. you can think of more). That's why GP3 arrives on schedule: they didn't have to RUSH things (examples around? :-) ) So now GC actually has time to implement additional features DECENTLY. Because, maybe it surprises you, this takes TIME. >I'm still waiting for the ultimate racing sim with all the features i would like >to be included.........but unfortunately, it will not >be for the next months. Give up. It will never arrive (since each time you'll want more features, and since there are 435217 people out there who prefer still other features) JoH

POLE POSITION RULED!!!!! HOW DARE YOU KNOCK POLE POSITION! Vintook "Jo Helsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:25:13 +1000, "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >Yes correct Berno 90 % of the spins in Gp2 you can't catch. Due to itbeing > >CANNED. Lets just hope in Gp3 that Geoff fixes this up, however I doubtit.

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> >That would require Geoff to actually change his "Perfect Code". > > > >A classic example of how canned Geoff's code is, is when you attempt a J > >Turn. Well umm it won't work and I doubt it will work in Gp2.5 / Gp3. Iam > >not against Gp3 just because its not GPL however because it is not a step > >forward. > > Apart from the fact that it is *incredibly* early to comment this > aspect of GP3 (now that I think of it, it's utter BULLSHIT to comment > on it), "forward" is very relative. A sim uses different lanes. GP3 > will definitely go forward in the graphics, AI, and weather > departments at least. That's already 3 "forwards". > > >It really does appear to be nothing more Gp2 with a new season and > >weather. Look at the screenshots. They are hardly sensational and look

very

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> >much like Gp2 with more polygons. > > Disagree. It looks *fabulous*. You mean that the reflections in the > puddles don't look "sensational"???? JFYI: Chris West (yes, from WSC!) > posted a message here stating how *impressive* the dynamical weather > effects were implemented in GP3. > > But of course, what does HE know about programming sims! <G> > > >Dispute this it doesn't mean that I won't be buying Gp3, infact I have

mine > >ordered already, this is because dispute some major flaws it still willbe > >the best MODERN racing simulation. This isn't an indication of how good > >Geoff's code is but how little sim development there has been in recent > >years. Nothing has surpassed it apart from GPL and thats where theproblem > >arrives. Until GPL everyone believed Gp2 felt spot on. Then GPL came outand

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> >showed us just how perfect racing sim could be. > > 2.5 years later on 2.5 times better HW. Yep, "Pole Position" sucked, > too. > > >The reason why many people > >are negative about Gp3 is because its not taking sim racing further. Its

no

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> >more advanced than games that came out 2 years ago. > > Again: isn't it a LITTLE bit early to slag it off? How much time have > you spent with GP3??? :-) > > JoH > >

On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:25:13 +1000, "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Yes correct Berno 90 % of the spins in Gp2 you can't catch. Due to it being >CANNED. Lets just hope in Gp3 that Geoff fixes this up, however I doubt it. >That would require Geoff to actually change his "Perfect Code". > >A classic example of how canned Geoff's code is, is when you attempt a J >Turn. Well umm it won't work and I doubt it will work in Gp2.5 / Gp3. Iam >not against Gp3 just because its not GPL however because it is not a step >forward.

Apart from the fact that it is *incredibly* early to comment this aspect of GP3 (now that I think of it, it's utter BULLSHIT to comment on it), "forward" is very relative. A sim uses different lanes. GP3 will definitely go forward in the graphics, AI, and weather departments at least. That's already 3 "forwards". >It really does appear to be nothing more Gp2 with a new season and >weather. Look at the screenshots. They are hardly sensational and look very >much like Gp2 with more polygons. Disagree. It looks *fabulous*. You mean that the reflections in the puddles don't look "sensational"???? JFYI: Chris West (yes, from WSC!) posted a message here stating how *impressive* the dynamical weather effects were implemented in GP3. But of course, what does HE know about programming sims! <G>

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>Dispute this it doesn't mean that I won't be buying Gp3, infact I have mine >ordered already, this is because dispute some major flaws it still will be >the best MODERN racing simulation. This isn't an indication of how good >Geoff's code is but how little sim development there has been in recent >years. Nothing has surpassed it apart from GPL and thats where the problem >arrives. Until GPL everyone believed Gp2 felt spot on. Then GPL came out and >showed us just how perfect racing sim could be.

2.5 years later on 2.5 times better HW. Yep, "Pole Position" sucked, too. >The reason why many people >are negative about Gp3 is because its not taking sim racing further. Its no >more advanced than games that came out 2 years ago. Again: isn't it a LITTLE bit early to slag it off? How much time have you spent with GP3??? :-) JoH

And that's why they aren't in the***pit, because Geoff still needs them... :-) Stephen

Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting away like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralf sulking, and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. Lots of chatter. Paul Tracy's team manager is constantly on the radio, repeating almost mantra-like that Tracy should concentrate and not do anything stupid. It seems to work. Stephen

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> > >- no radio with the pits. > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. > > JoH

"Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own > steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the > screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is driving the > car. I agree. It definitely makes any game look arcadish. I always look for a way to turn this off. -- [email hidden]

"Erwan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:z66b5.16048$[email hidden]... > Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: > Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all > the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: > - no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing simwhich > include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a veryimportant > stuff > for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive in cockpitview the > most of the time. Correct. But as others have said I already have a pair of arms and wheel in my field of vision. You see, being hardcore I have a steering wheel for my racing sims. Is this truely a issue for you?? > - all the 3D body car shapes are the same for the 11 teams. Very weird. > - no pace car, commissionners, etc........ > - no radio with the pits. No radio??? Are you joking with this??? This "feature" was somewhat lame with F1RS. But after Nascar 2 & 3, the radio is essential for immersion (for me anyway). It is one of the features I really like in F1 2000. If this is true about no radio in GP3, I will most likely pass... Huh. -- [email hidden]

"Colin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8kj8ra$s21$[email hidden]... > Geoff has the philosophy of doing one thing and doing it right. That does > not include gimmicks such as animated guys running around your car andpace > cars. He has concentrated on making the game engine as realistic as > possible. It took 4 years because of the limited resources available to > him. Just like every small software company, he has to make compromises > between never finishing a game and making a few ommisions to get it > released. To add what you suggest would probably have added months ontothe > release schedule. Remember, he is under pressure from his publisher Well speaking for myself, I am not really concened with what his problems are. I look at the finial product. And I must say, F1 2000 is looking better and better. -- [email hidden] > (Hasbro) too. IMO he has made exactly the right choices. I don't care if I > have no pit radio and if all the cars look the same. What I care about is > whether the game feels like I am driving a modern F1 car. He has > concentrated on the GAME ENGINE as he has said many times before and he was > absolutely right to do so. > > Cheers, > ...Colin > >

"Berno" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lgcb5.10736$[email hidden]... > > Oh get it a "canned spin" is one you cant catch? Yep, physics is thrown out the window. You might as well get up and get a drink or something, as nothing you do in the cockpit will catch it. Of course I hope most people realize (maybe they don't) that under some circumstances some spins are simply not catchable. After watching the F1 races this year and years past, I pay special attention to how squirley the cars are for the drivers to drive. Schumacher is constantly throwing the car all over the place. Fish tailing and everything. There were some pretty huge discussions (flamewars actually) where people would argue in favour of canned spins. The arguement was that modern F1 cars are on the edge such that getting them out of sorts (just a little) will result in a spin, i.e like a canned spin modeled in GP2. Further, they claimed that modern F1 cars *DO NOT* fish tail. Obviously the people making these claims did not watch any F1 races or they refused to register the way the real cars behaved. Hey, maybe this will open up that old arguement again. Maybe John Wallace want to have another "go" with me on that one :-) I seem to remember that he was arguing against fishtailing... My apologies if I remembered wrong about John... -- [email hidden] > "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:8kjhnu$o9v$[email hidden]... > > HAHA > > > > yeah Geoff does get it right. I love canned spins, or isn't that part of > the > > GAME ENGINE. > > > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > > > >

"Jo Helsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > By changing from his usual "1 sim every 5 years" strategy, GC has the > chance now to first put out a version that may have less-than-all > desirable features, but fills them in adequately (rain, AI, overall > playability.. you can think of more). That's why GP3 arrives on While this may indeed prove out to be true, what proof do you have that the rain, AI and overall playability are good in GP3??? -- [email hidden] > schedule: they didn't have to RUSH things (examples around? :-) )

And all the extra sounds to bog that CPU down further...... Martyn_D asgeir nes�en wrote:

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> Now, THAT would take time to implement! ;-) > > Hehe... > > ---Asgeir--- > > Stephen Ferguson wrote: > > > Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting away > > like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralf sulking, > > and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. > > > > Lots of chatter. > > > > Paul Tracy's team manager is constantly on the radio, repeating almost > > mantra-like that Tracy should concentrate and not do anything stupid. It > > seems to work. > > > > Stephen > > > > Allan Harrison <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:8kkbnh$253$[email hidden]... > > > > > > Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > >- no radio with the pits. > > > > > > > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > > > > > > Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. > > > > > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] > > > > JoH > > > > > > > > >

On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 22:14:33 +1000, "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> >Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... > >> >- no radio with the pits. >> >> They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > >Yeah well then it would be easy for Geoff to implement it then. >

It would be a waste of time as long as you have more important things to do. Invisible things. Like making sure that the AI strategy doesn't end up as a farce in a variable-weather GP. JoH

"Jo Helsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 09:44:02 -0500, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >"Jo Helsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >news:[email hidden]... > >> By changing from his usual "1 sim every 5 years" strategy, GC has the > >> chance now to first put out a version that may have less-than-all > >> desirable features, but fills them in adequately (rain, AI, overall > >> playability.. you can think of more). That's why GP3 arrives on > > > >While this may indeed prove out to be true, what proof do you have > >that the rain, AI and overall playability are good in GP3??? > > I used "..has the chance now..", "..that may have...". No indication > that I have proof of anything. Just confidence. :-)

I guess that is the point I am trying to make :-) I will wait and see what the actual product is like. -- [email hidden]

On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 14:54:51 +0200, "Stephen Ferguson" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Find the MP3 file of Damon Hill's win at Spa, 1998. They were chatting away >like mad, Damon trying to convince Ralf not to chase him down, Ralf sulking, >and Eddie Jordan trying to act as intermediary. > >Lots of chatter. That's why they made an MP3 of it. It is something unusual. Not much other MP3s going around, not? :-) JoH

On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 09:44:02 -0500, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>"Jo Helsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> By changing from his usual "1 sim every 5 years" strategy, GC has the >> chance now to first put out a version that may have less-than-all >> desirable features, but fills them in adequately (rain, AI, overall >> playability.. you can think of more). That's why GP3 arrives on > >While this may indeed prove out to be true, what proof do you have >that the rain, AI and overall playability are good in GP3???

I used "..has the chance now..", "..that may have...". No indication that I have proof of anything. Just confidence. :-) JoH

I have to disagree, if the view shows a wheel, it looks wrong without arms, if the view shows no wheel than no arms is ok. GP3 shows the wheel, at least if you want the info available on the wheel, and it just plain looks bad having the wheel out there moving with no hands on it. On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 22:45:27 -0700, "Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own >steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the >screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is driving the >car. > >SKurj <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> I have a set of arms in front of me and a wheel... why do i need to see >another set

I drive without the arms in GPL but watching replays looks a bit silly with a poltergeist driving the car. MS "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Vgkb5.28101$[email hidden]... > "Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own > > steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the > > screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is drivingthe

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> > car. > > I agree. It definitely makes any game look arcadish. I always look > for a way to turn this off. > > > -- > > [email hidden] > > > > >

Oh get it a "canned spin" is one you cant catch? "Allan Harrison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8kjhnu$o9v$[email hidden]... > HAHA > > yeah Geoff does get it right. I love canned spins, or isn't that part ofthe > GAME ENGINE. > > Allan Harrison - [email hidden] >

>If this is true about no >radio >in GP3, I will most likely pass... So you're saying that the most important feature in a sim for you is whether or not it has simulated radio? To each his own I guess :-) -- Cheers! Graeme Nash

I like the hands and arms in a sim. I find it helps me get more immersed into the sim. It gives me the "feeling" of being in the car rather then controlling it from the outside. I don't see or notice my real hands so I go by the hands and arms in the game. I try to picture myself in the car and with out a virtual wheel and hands I feel lost. m.seery wrote:

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> > I drive without the arms in GPL but watching replays looks a bit silly with > a poltergeist driving the car. > > MS > "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Vgkb5.28101$[email hidden]... > > "Mike" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > Boy, do I agree. I think it's dumb to look over my own arms and my own > > > steering wheel, just to see another set of arms and another wheel on the > > > screen. Realistic ? I don't think so... unless an octopus is driving > the > > > car. > > > > I agree. It definitely makes any game look arcadish. I always look > > for a way to turn this off. > > > > > > -- > > > > [email hidden] > > > > > > > > > >

I like the arms during replays. Todd Wasson

I like the arms during replays. Todd Wasson

"Graeme Nash" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > >If this is true about no > >radio > >in GP3, I will most likely pass... > > So you're saying that the most important feature in a sim for you is > whether or not it has simulated radio? To each his own I guess :-)

I am saying that I am not willing to go backwards in features. This also means I would be buying many jet F16 based flight- simulators any time soon. There really is nothing wrong with F1 2000, so GP3 had better knock my socks off. I am certainly not going to buy it simply because it is called GP3 and written by Geoff Crammond. -- [email hidden]

If it doesn't have a simulated 10 CD changer, I'll pass it too. Oh, and it HAS to be a Pioneer. :-) --- Joeri J. Cox J_Cox on N3 - ICQ# 60159253 Co-founder of 502 Racing European Racing League - http://drive.to/erl "Graeme Nash" <[email hidden]> schreef in bericht news:[email hidden]...

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> > >If this is true about no > >radio > >in GP3, I will most likely pass... > > So you're saying that the most important feature in a sim for you is > whether or not it has simulated radio? To each his own I guess :-) > > -- > Cheers! > Graeme Nash

It's gonna have to be a Nakamichi for me to be interested ;) -- Ian Parker "Ambition is a poor excuse for not having sense enough to be lazy." <email invalid due to spam> Joeri Cox <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:0l0c5.2207$[email hidden]... > If it doesn't have a simulated 10 CD changer, I'll pass it too. Oh, and it > HAS to be a Pioneer. :-) > --- > Joeri J. Cox > J_Cox on N3 - ICQ# 60159253 > Co-founder of 502 Racing

Jo, I very much agree with your realistic approach. (Almost) no-one has played the final version of GP3 or will play it before July 28th. Just way and see what Crammond gives us. Han Monsees Jo Helsen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Wed, 12 Jul 2000 12:00:46 +0200, "Erwan" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Like all of you, i hardly wait GP3 on 28th july but: > >Everybody say this man is a really perfectionnist but when i see all > >the missing features or stuffs for GP3, i'm septic: > >- no hands in steering wheels in opposite of a tons of others racing sim

which > >include them. Is it very difficult to do today ? It's however a veryimportant > >stuff for realism, because most of us (hardcore sim players) drive incockpit view the

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> >most of the time. > > Totally unimportant. (I know, just an *opinion*, but as relevant or > irrelevant as yours) Plus it obscures the LCD screen. Plus they would > look bad and slow things down. > > >- all the 3D body car shapes are the same for the 11 teams. Very weird. > > Saves resources, and importance while racing is absolutely minimal. > Hell, there are even people who *think* the shapes are different just > because the textures mislead them. > > >- no pace car, commissionners, etc........ > > Simple if you're satisfied with a mess, takes time to get *right*. > > >- no radio with the pits. > > They hardly exchange a few words in reality. > > >- and i forget a lot (i'm tired 2night) but we will see all the total

missig

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> >features when the game will > >be released. > > Oh, it's easy to mention another 642897512 "features" that could be > in. > > >As a "perfectionnist", GC should includes all this details in a game.. > >Don't tell me he don't have the skills or the time........He had 4 YEARS > >!!!!!!!!!!!! > > "Perfectionist" is not the same as mixing-up as much half-ass features > as possible. It's not about trying to fill the box with the longest > possible feature list. "Perfectionist" is about making sure that WHAT > you put in actually WORKS without problems. > > >Like EA Sports, i think he did the minimum in order to make us buy the

"add-on" > >GP4 (of course at a high price) and all the futurs GP5, GP6, etc.... EASports > >did the same behaviour with all their > >games. They add only a few stuffs every year in order to buy a tons ofgames.

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> > That's the negative approach. There's also a positive approach. > > By changing from his usual "1 sim every 5 years" strategy, GC has the > chance now to first put out a version that may have less-than-all > desirable features, but fills them in adequately (rain, AI, overall > playability.. you can think of more). That's why GP3 arrives on > schedule: they didn't have to RUSH things (examples around? :-) ) > > So now GC actually has time to implement additional features DECENTLY. > Because, maybe it surprises you, this takes TIME. > > >I'm still waiting for the ultimate racing sim with all the features i

would like

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> >to be included.........but unfortunately, it will not > >be for the next months. > > Give up. It will never arrive (since each time you'll want more > features, and since there are 435217 people out there who prefer still > other features) > > JoH >