Re: Nascar heat: NO SAVE RACE..ALL READ

Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as real can be, right down to the rules. If you cant finish the race DONT start it. "Chas39cop" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious > "option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation suchas > Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has thisfeature. > A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interiorheater is > to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request"this in > a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers (some of > who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally releasedWITHOUT > this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expresseddispleasure > with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples > priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayerinternet > options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such aCRITICAL > fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the cardealer > telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too > "complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...buthey!...we > got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUSTbe > in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every otheraspect of > the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascarsims > to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat"and > "race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racingseason > ( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that whatthis > game is supposed to be about anyway?

Yep, no save really isn't good. And Hasbro is already on the record as saying that no patch will be made to change it. Also, there's no autochat or ability to make a replay clip for online league racing, assuming of course, that the game REALLY can be done online, not trusting the spin/carrot on a stick, being put out by Hasbro on this lately(that, and the "tracks are modeled down to the .25 inch".....sure they are:) If it can be done online in a league format, should be easier for admins; no replays to look at but their own, etc. :) Chances are though, somebody will come up with a hack for this. -John Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Yep, no save really isn't good. And Hasbro is already on the record as saying that no patch will be made to change it. Also, there's no autochat or ability to make a replay clip for online league racing, assuming of course, that the game REALLY can be done online, not trusting the spin/carrot on a stick, being put out by Hasbro on this lately(that, and the "tracks are modeled down to the .25 inch".....sure they are:) If it can be done online in a league format, should be easier for admins; no replays to look at but their own, etc. :) Chances are though, somebody will come up with a hack for this. -John Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

> Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if > you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to > try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is > imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > > Andre While I agree that no save option doesn't make it an arcade game, the thought that it's ok not to have one because they don't in real life is also invalid. In real life, they're not working a different job, nor have other commitments while on track, nor have a family to think about.....on and on. They also aren't driving while looking at a monitor :) In terms of realism, this is one area where playability needs to be king, plain and simple. There is really NO excuse for not having an in-race save option, including in GPL. -John > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Well, I may agree that a Save Game feature is needed, but I also understand the "logic" behind the post. What he is saying is that if you have more important things to do than play your game, turn it off and start over next time you sit down. My 10 year old has a game or two that will not allow him to save until he reaches a certain point (Lego Rock Raiders is one that I can think of). I either have to let him take over my computer until he gets to where he's going or leave it on. If I need to log in to the office however, he will concede (heh) and I will "turn the game off" and do what I have to do... --David Cook <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:00:22 GMT, Red 86 Vet > <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn > >the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying > >about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to > >have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start > >over, so what... > > What kind of fucking stupid logic is that? You're post makes no sense > at all. > -- > Nos

Um... You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought it was a sim, it's just another arcade game...... -- Tim, [email hidden]|[email hidden] http://legends.sports-gaming.com/forums.shtml FREE forums for your league... http://legends.sports-gaming.com Sim racing website loosely based on gpl... Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 23:17:04 +1000, Leaky_Valve > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Without the ability to save, this sim has been relegated to an arcade in the sense > >that the strategic element associated with full-length races has been lost > >entirely. That strategic element includes the effects of tyre wear and fuel > >consumption. > > Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if > you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to > try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is > imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > > Andre > > > > > > >No....this news has dulled what was a bright spot in the world of racing sims. I > >sincerely hope that the developers follow the lead set by Papyrus when N2 was > >patched with a save function. > > > >rrevved wrote: > > > >> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > >> > >> >I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be > >> >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of > >> >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims > >> >to just another "eye candy" arcade game. > >> > >> Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. > >> > >> While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that > >> the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are > >> a dumb ass.. > >> > >> In my opinion, of course. >

In article <8nqphj$n42$[email hidden]>, "Chris Wright" <[email hidden]> writes: >I'll stop ranting with putting this scenario forward. You're three quarters >of the way through a full NH race when you are called away from the house >for several hours - are you seriously going to leave everything on pause - I >think not. I've done it before. As I posted in another message, I've taken three DAYS to finish a race. I'd rather be able to save it, though... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <39a0f22c$[email hidden]>, "Stephen Ferguson" <[email hidden]> writes: >A save game is the *only* way for some of us to run full races. My evenings >don't have enough hours for full races, but I don't want to miss out on the >strategy of a full race. A simple save game makes GP3 tops for me. I don't >use it as a crutch in case I crash out, but it lets me run for an hour >without being stuck with only "quickraces". > I've run full races before, and just hit pause(overnight, etc). I've even taken 3 days to finish a race because I just didn't have time. However, I have the luxury(?!) of not having a wife or kids around who'd need the computer. If *I* need to use it while the game is paused, then I need to make a choice. Yes, it would be nice to be able to save the game in progress... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

A save game is the *only* way for some of us to run full races. My evenings don't have enough hours for full races, but I don't want to miss out on the strategy of a full race. A simple save game makes GP3 tops for me. I don't use it as a crutch in case I crash out, but it lets me run for an hour without being stuck with only "quickraces". Stephen Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > This is most disappointing. Most disappointing. > I am now in two minds about buying the game. Although I'm not an avid fanof > NASCAR sims, I would definitely have bought this based on my pleasure withthe > demo. > Now, I don't think I'll worry about it, preferring instead to wait and seewhat N4

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> might offer. > > Chas39cop wrote: > > > I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious > > "option" etc. >

rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > > >I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be > >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every otheraspect of > >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascarsims

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> >to just another "eye candy" arcade game. > > Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. > > While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that > the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are > a dumb ass.. > > In my opinion, of course. >

He seems a bit hyperbolic, doesn't he? However, I could also say that it is reduced to an "arcade" game only in the sense that, without a save game feature, there are a number of people (myself included) who will rarely have the time for a full race weekend, therefore the only option is to run it as a "quick sprint to the flag" short-race game. We get the nice physics, of course, so it remains a "sim" in that sense, but we can't access the race strategy part of the sim, so it become a little less "real". Yes, saving a game is not "real", but it is a necessary evil for me, as I have nowhere near the amount of free evening time that a lot of the enthusiasts here seem to have. Stephen

I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious "option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation such as Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has this feature. A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interior heater is to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request" this in a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers ( some of who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally released WITHOUT this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expressed displeasure with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayer internet options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such a CRITICAL fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the car dealer telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too "complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...but hey!...we got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat" and "race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racing season ( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that what this game is supposed to be about anyway?

You're right 100% But I think ( although I have not seen the game nor the demo) the no save ads to the realism like in GPL! But this is why I only have done 2 Full GP races in GPL and didn't play N2 until the patch came out that fixed the saving game issue! But I also can understand the go toward realism ( I don't think that they didn't have time to include it in the game) but as you said spending 3+ hours it's absurd without saving! Ok so why not being able to save game when you come into the pits or something? That's when I was saving in N2 N3? Maybe this is just a Demo thing huh? Oliver BEOROCKET Racing: www.beorocket.co.yu "Chas39cop" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious > "option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation suchas > Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has thisfeature. > A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interiorheater is > to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request"this in > a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers some of > who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally releasedWITHOUT > this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expresseddispleasure > with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples > priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayerinternet > options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such aCRITICAL > fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the cardealer > telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too > "complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...buthey!...we > got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUSTbe > in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every otheraspect of > the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascarsims > to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat"and > "race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racingseason > ( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that whatthis > game is supposed to be about anyway?

It is an option we can live without. Plain and simple, I will buy the game with or without the savegame... -<+>-I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious -<+>-"option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation such as -<+>-Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has this feature. -<+>-A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interior heater is -<+>-to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request" this in -<+>-a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers ( some of -<+>-who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally released WITHOUT -<+>-this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expressed displeasure -<+>-with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples -<+>-priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayer internet -<+>-options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such a CRITICAL -<+>-fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the car dealer -<+>-telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too -<+>-"complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...but hey!...we -<+>-got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be -<+>-in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of -<+>-the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims -<+>-to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat" and -<+>-"race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racing season -<+>-( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that what this -<+>-game is supposed to be about anyway? Thanks, Mike Alexander ([email hidden]) Torch Red 1986 C4 "ITIS4FN" Pictures available at http://alexander.dyndns.org My 2nd Baby!!! (Note:remove the no_tickets. to send email)

On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) thus spoke:

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>I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious >"option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation such as >Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has this feature. >A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interior heater is >to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request" this in >a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers ( some of >who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally released WITHOUT >this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expressed displeasure >with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples >priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayer internet >options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such a CRITICAL >fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the car dealer >telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too >"complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...but hey!...we >got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims >to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat" and >"race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racing season >( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that what this >game is supposed to be about anyway?

Have to agree with you. I'll probably still buy NH, but I was really pissed that F12K didn't have a save race feature and now I'm pissed to find out NH won't either. -- Nos

This is an UNBELIEVABLE omission. MGI have clearly done their homework with the race sim community on NH and there's no doubt it's the best looking race sim ever in any category, with excellent physics. But the lack of a save game is a HUGE disappointment, What's more, Ed Martin has said that there are no plans to introduce one - first big mistake Ed, I'm afraid. Virtually no-one can sit down and race 100% length at one sitting. Indeed I think it really adds something to a game when you can save it at any point and think about how you'll tackle the rest of the race when you're in a traffic jam the following morning etc. Someone from BHMotorsports commented on the NH forum that he didn't see why one was necessary because "they don't take a break in the real races" or words to that effect. Well the reason for that is because those guys are at work - I bet they have less time for sim racing when they're at home too! In a week when the NH hype machine has been gathering pace, Papy can at least gain some comfort from the fact that even N3 contains this vital feature. It would be a major shock if N4 didn't do the same. It is often said that putting in a save game feature is no easy feat - so here's a challenge for all the tweakers - I would gladly pay the price of the game again to buy a patch for saving any NH race position. The guy that posted this AWFUL news on r.a.s is dead right when he says this shouldn't be an optional feature in this day and age. Hell, even with one lap replay saves, even GP3 allows you this "luxury". I'll stop ranting with putting this scenario forward. You're three quarters of the way through a full NH race when you are called away from the house for several hours - are you seriously going to leave everything on pause - I think not. MGI just scored their first own goal Chas39cop <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious > "option" that they can afford to not include in a REALTIME simulation suchas > Nascar Heat. Virtually every type of game on the market today has thisfeature. > A save feature is as FUNDEMENTAL to this type of game as an interiorheater is > to an automobile. It boggles the mind to think we must still "request"this in > a newly developed game when it should be EXPECTED.Did the developers some of > who WORKED for Papyrus in 1996 when Nascar2 was originally releasedWITHOUT > this feature) FORGET about the thousands of gamers who expresseddispleasure > with it and pressured Papy to make a patch to fix it? Where are peoples > priorities when they spend dozens of hours on things like multiplayerinternet > options and meticuliously detailed animated pit crews yet omit such aCRITICAL > fundemental issue as an in race save feature. Can you imagine the cardealer > telling you that your new Cadillac didnt have a radio because it was too > "complicated" an item or they "didnt have time to implement it"...buthey!...we > got a snazzy cupholder! LOL.. I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUSTbe > in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every otheraspect of > the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascarsims > to just another "eye candy" arcade game.You guys can go "beat the heat"and > "race the pro"...I'm going to run a full, 100% Winston Cup Nascar Racingseason > ( at MY conveience of time)...in Nascar 4! Is it me? Or isnt that whatthis > game is supposed to be about anyway? >

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 06:46:37 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >It is an option we can live without. No, it's not an option we can live without. If it's left out then it's not an option at all. I don't want to have to sit at the wheel for 3+hrs to run a full race. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 04:06:00 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > >>I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be >>in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of >>the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims >>to just another "eye candy" arcade game. > >Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. > >While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that >the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are >a dumb ass.. > >In my opinion, of course.

I'm not agreeing with "Chas39cop", but my opinion of him is that he is certainly not a "dumb ass". However, after lurking in this group for some time and having read many of your posts, "revved", it is my opinion that you are indeed a "smart ass". Seems you can't disagree with someone without resorting to name calling. Guess I'm guilty of it too, now, though in my case I suspect the usage is entirely correct. <plonk> <plonK> <ploNK> <plONK> <pLONK> <PLONK> Ben "Jesus saves...Gretzky gets the rebound, he shoots, HE SCORES!!"

Jesus!...If you dont like it..dont buy it!...plain and simple...all the pissing and moaning aint gonna change it!

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 23:17:04 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> wrote: >Without the ability to save, this sim has been relegated to an arcade in the sense >that the strategic element associated with full-length races has been lost >entirely. That strategic element includes the effects of tyre wear and fuel >consumption. Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. Andre

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> >No....this news has dulled what was a bright spot in the world of racing sims. I >sincerely hope that the developers follow the lead set by Papyrus when N2 was >patched with a save function. > >rrevved wrote: > >> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: >> >> >I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be >> >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of >> >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims >> >to just another "eye candy" arcade game. >> >> Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. >> >> While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that >> the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are >> a dumb ass.. >> >> In my opinion, of course.

The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start over, so what... On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 10:59:38 GMT, [email hidden] wrote:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 06:46:37 GMT, Red 86 Vet ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>It is an option we can live without. > >No, it's not an option we can live without. If it's left out then it's >not an option at all. I don't want to have to sit at the wheel for >3+hrs to run a full race.

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:51:47 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if >you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to >try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is >imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > >Andre He explained perfectly clear why. If you enjoy sitting at the wheel for 3+hrs then bully for you. Some of us would like the *option* to do otherwise. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 18:18:25 GMT, [email hidden] thus spoke: > Chances are though, somebody will come up with >a hack for this. I doubt that. Somehting like that is hard coded and would take quite an effort to incorporate. Otherwise it would have been done by now for GPL and F12K. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 18:09:51 GMT, "Mike" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Jesus!...If you dont like it..dont buy it!...plain and simple...all the >pissing and moaning aint gonna change it! > > It can change things. Alien v Predator was released without an in game save and so many people bitched about it that finally the developer conceded and released a patcht that gave you an in game save. Not that I play that game. I just know what transpired. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:00:22 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn >the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying >about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to >have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start >over, so what... What kind of fucking stupid logic is that? You're post makes no sense at all. -- Nos

On 21 Aug 2000 17:04:22 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >I've done it before. As I posted in another message, I've taken three DAYS to >finish a race. I'd rather be able to save it, though... That means you can't do anything else on your computer for three days. That is not an option to me and I am seriously considering not buying NH now because of this oversight. N3 will suffice until N4 comes out. -- Nos

Since it is a game then put the save game option! Stefano Serni "Red 86 Vet" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio news:[email hidden]... > The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn > the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying > about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to > have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start > over, so what...

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:54:30 -0400, "David L. Cook" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Well, I may agree that a Save Game feature is needed, but I also understand >the "logic" behind the post. What he is saying is that if you have more >important things to do than play your game, turn it off and start over next >time you sit down. Well, that's what's so stupid about it. Why would I start a full length race and then halway through decide I have something more important to do and then think nothing of quiting the game and starting another 3+hr. race over again tomorrow? That would completeley negate the 1.5hr.s I spent on the first race. What a f***g waste of time that would be. No? -- Nos

I am not going to get into a pissing contest with you about a feature in a game which neither of us can control. I will add, I would love for the game to have a save game feature, but it will not change my mind to buy, or not buy, the game. Like most others (wild guess) I will buy the game and use it for its intended purpose, entertainment. If life gets in the way, I will turn it off and take care of life. I can say I would be irritated if 2 hours into a full length race if the phone rang or something. Yikes. It has happened before. I would hope the game has a pause (that is perfect for what I need.) I am sorry if you find my logic stupid, but it really is the way I see the game. Just that, only a game. My wife and child does come first. On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:36:12 GMT, [email hidden] wrote:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:54:30 -0400, "David L. Cook" ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>Well, I may agree that a Save Game feature is needed, but I also understand >>the "logic" behind the post. What he is saying is that if you have more >>important things to do than play your game, turn it off and start over next >>time you sit down. > >Well, that's what's so stupid about it. Why would I start a full >length race and then halway through decide I have something more >important to do and then think nothing of quiting the game and >starting another 3+hr. race over again tomorrow? That would >completeley negate the 1.5hr.s I spent on the first race. What a f***g >waste of time that would be. No?

<BFG> Now that is some stinky bait... hehehehe On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 22:39:11 -0500, "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Um... > >You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought it was >a sim, it's just another arcade game......

This is most disappointing. Most disappointing. I am now in two minds about buying the game. Although I'm not an avid fan of NASCAR sims, I would definitely have bought this based on my pleasure with the demo. Now, I don't think I'll worry about it, preferring instead to wait and see what N4 might offer. Chas39cop wrote: > I can't believe they still think the save game feature is some luxurious > "option" etc.

I think that it's necessary for developers to understand that not everyone plays on-line and that not everyome treats these games as if they are real-life. There's an awful lot of us out here who simply view these things as entertainment; a means of winding down and losing oneself in an imaginary world. A save-game function simply allows us to finish what we started, when we feel like it and have the time to do so. Red 86 Vet wrote: > It is an option we can live without. Plain and simple, I will buy the game with or without the > savegame... >

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 06:46:37 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> wrote: >It is an option we can live without. Please, speak for yourself.

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:26:45 GMT, [email hidden] wrote:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:51:47 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> >thus spoke: > > >>Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if >>you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to >>try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is >>imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. >> >>Andre > >He explained perfectly clear why. If you enjoy sitting at the wheel >for 3+hrs then bully for you. Some of us would like the *option* to do >otherwise.

Perhaps you should read my question again. I asked why he thinks that NH is an arcade game when it hasn't got a save option. A save game feature has nothing to do with a game being arcade or a simulation. Ofcourse I understand why you would like a save game feature, I just don't understand why people are even considering not buying the game when it doesn't have a save game feature. Andre

Just hit pause and then ALT-Tab Geee problem solved!!!!!!! <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On 22 Aug 2000 20:29:55 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus > spoke: > > >If it *does* involve the computer, then you > >have a decision to make. Just like everything else in life... > > That's right. And I have decided to try and put a little pressure on > Hasbro to make a patch to add a savegame feature. Ding! Ding! Ding! > > -- > Nos

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>On 21 Aug 2000 17:04:22 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus >spoke: > > >>I've done it before. As I posted in another message, I've taken three DAYS >to >>finish a race. I'd rather be able to save it, though... > >That means you can't do anything else on your computer for three days. >That is not an option to me and I am seriously considering not buying >NH now because of this oversight. N3 will suffice until N4 comes out.

Stephen Ferguson(I believe) said the same thing, which I understand. But, don't you also have GPL? The lack of a save game doesn't stop you from enjoying it, right? Just curious. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <39a21923$[email hidden]>, "Stephen Ferguson" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> I've run full races before, and just hit pause(overnight, etc). I've even >> taken 3 days to finish a race because I just didn't have time. However, I >have >> the luxury(?!) of not having a wife or kids around who'd need the >computer. If >> *I* need to use it while the game is paused, then I need to make a choice. >> Yes, it would be nice to be able to save the game in progress... >> > >My home computer is my work computer is my commuting computer. I don't have >that luxury. > >Stephen

Well, *that* sucks. I'm not fortunate enough to work at home, so that's not an issue for me. Would the lack of a save game feature actually keep you from buying the game, even though you might like everything else? Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 22:39:11 -0500, "Tim Wheatley" ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>Um... >> >>You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought it was >>a sim, it's just another arcade game...... > >So how many times have you ran a full race in GPL? Another great game >that was lessened by the lack of a save feature.

I can't speak for Tim, but *I've* run at least 20 full races... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, daxe <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> I >>can say I would be irritated if 2 hours into a full length race if the >>phone rang or something. Yikes. It has happened before. I would >>hope the game has a pause (that is perfect for what I need.) > >Why don't you just not answer the phone? My phone is there for my >convenience, not the convenience of everyone else in the world. If >it's important, they'll call back. Chances are it's some cretin >giving me a "courtesy call" to try and sell me something.

Don't people have answering machines...? Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <39a1e57d$0$60927$[email hidden]>, "Laings" <[email hidden]> writes: >Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if >they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as >real can be, right down to the rules. If you cant finish the race DONT start >it. Well, that's a bit harsh... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:54:30 -0400, "David L. Cook" ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>Well, I may agree that a Save Game feature is needed, but I also understand >>the "logic" behind the post. What he is saying is that if you have more >>important things to do than play your game, turn it off and start over next >>time you sit down. > >Well, that's what's so stupid about it. Why would I start a full >length race and then halway through decide I have something more >important to do and then think nothing of quiting the game and >starting another 3+hr. race over again tomorrow? That would >completeley negate the 1.5hr.s I spent on the first race. What a f***g >waste of time that would be. No?

If the 'something more important' doesn't require the computer, then hit PAUSE, turn off the monitor and go do it. If it *does* involve the computer, then you have a decision to make. Just like everything else in life... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> writes:

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>I will not be buying it....but that's my choice and isn't stated in order to >influence anyone else. I said prior to this post that I am not a rabid NASCAR >fan >and, without a save-game function, the balance has been tipped away from my >buying >the game. > >I will say that there are probably many, many others like myself (simulation >enjoyers...but not raging enthusiasts) who, once they discover that there is >no >save-game, will either not buy the pack or will return it for exchange or >refund. >These are people who don't (necessarily) visit RAS, therefore they will >receive no >prior warning about this particular shortcoming. > >C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved.

But GPL doesn't have a save game, either...<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <2yko5.179$[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: >I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel >useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature they probably >knew they would not be able to implement? Can you save in SCGT? I don't remember, but I know that you can set the 2x and 3x for fuel and tire wear... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> writes: >Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if >you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to >try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is >imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > >Andre I'd like to see a save game feature, but it not being there isn't a 'deal-breaker', IMO. I think a lot of people are getting worked up over something that isn't really *that* important in the grand scheme of things... How's THAT for philosophical...?<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

So it does have tire wear, great! Racing a full distance race for the strategy is great, but racing 50% races at 2x wear is easier for the average person to do and you get all the strategy. Jason. Don Burnette wrote:

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> I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel > useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature they probably > knew they would not be able to implement? > > -- > Don Burnette > Dburn in N3 and Legends > ICQ# 74084566 >

-- Jason Monds http://www.proracingclub.com - Pro Racing Club! (N3, GPL) http://members.home.net/stuff.mondsj/csp - Car Sim Project (Please remove 'no extra spork' when replying)

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 17:51:47 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 23:17:04 +1000, Leaky_Valve ><[email hidden]> wrote: > >>Without the ability to save, this sim has been relegated to an arcade in the sense >>that the strategic element associated with full-length races has been lost >>entirely. That strategic element includes the effects of tyre wear and fuel >>consumption. > >Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if >you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to >try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is >imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > >Andre >

Maybe it's not so much the ability to start over if something bad happens as the ability to not have to sit there playing the game for three hours, but still get a feel for some of the strategy involved in a full length race. You talk about real life, but in real life, a race car driver is being PAID to sit there for three hours....it's his or her job (and a sweet one at that!). Also, a race car driver is staring out into the real world for those three hours.....not at a teeny, tiny computer monitor.

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> >> >>No....this news has dulled what was a bright spot in the world of racing sims. I >>sincerely hope that the developers follow the lead set by Papyrus when N2 was >>patched with a save function. >> >>rrevved wrote: >> >>> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: >>> >>> >I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be >>> >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of >>> >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims >>> >to just another "eye candy" arcade game. >>> >>> Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. >>> >>> While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that >>> the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are >>> a dumb ass.. >>> >>> In my opinion, of course.

rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > > While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that > the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are > a dumb ass.. > > In my opinion, of course. >

But not your HUMBLE opinion, right Ed? Dumbass. -- Randy "If you have a home that is mobile and 12 cars that aren't, you might be a redneck."

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 06:46:37 GMT, Red 86 Vet > <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >It is an option we can live without. > > No, it's not an option we can live without. If it's left out then it's > not an option at all. I don't want to have to sit at the wheel for > 3+hrs to run a full race. > -- > Nos

I've done it a couple of times, once offline and once online, with N2. It was fun, but boy was my butt a hurtin :) -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566

I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature they probably knew they would not be able to implement? -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566 "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <39a0f22c$[email hidden]>, "Stephen Ferguson" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >A save game is the *only* way for some of us to run full races. My evenings > >don't have enough hours for full races, but I don't want to miss out on the > >strategy of a full race. A simple save game makes GP3 tops for me. I don't > >use it as a crutch in case I crash out, but it lets me run for an hour > >without being stuck with only "quickraces". > > > > I've run full races before, and just hit pause(overnight, etc). I've even > taken 3 days to finish a race because I just didn't have time. However, I have > the luxury(?!) of not having a wife or kids around who'd need the computer. If > *I* need to use it while the game is paused, then I need to make a choice. > Yes, it would be nice to be able to save the game in progress... > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +51.31 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

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>Subject: Re: Nascar heat: NO SAVE RACE..ALL READ >From: Red 86 Vet [email hidden] >Date: 08/21/2000 4:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time >Message-id: <[email hidden]> > >The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn >the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying >about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to >have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start >over, so what... >

......Sounds to me like the game ought to sell for around $7.99....if so then I agree with the "so what" mentality. If it sells for the typical $40 - $50 then Hasbro should change their name to Hasballs... <g> (Don't gimme NOCRAP in E-mail)

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> >>I've done it before. As I posted in another message, I've taken three DAYS >to >>finish a race. I'd rather be able to save it, though... > >That means you can't do anything else on your computer for three days. >That is not an option to me and I am seriously considering not buying >NH now because of this oversight. N3 will suffice until N4 comes out. >-- >Nos

Ditto (Don't gimme NOCRAP in E-mail)

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:56:17 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> wrote: > I >can say I would be irritated if 2 hours into a full length race if the >phone rang or something. Yikes. It has happened before. I would >hope the game has a pause (that is perfect for what I need.) Why don't you just not answer the phone? My phone is there for my convenience, not the convenience of everyone else in the world. If it's important, they'll call back. Chances are it's some cretin giving me a "courtesy call" to try and sell me something. I can't believe people make such an issue about spending 40$ for *anything*, let alone something (imperfect or not) that gives you hundreds or thousands of hours of pleasure. Other than TV and radio, which are essentially free, there are few greater entertainment bargains than a decent sim/game. ~daxe (whose wife and children also come first)

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:26:00 -0500, "Laings" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if >they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as >real can be, right down to the rules. You mean like being able to make a pit stop for left side tires only? Sorry, I don't mean to slam a sim that hasn't even been officially released yet. I'll be picking up my copy on Wed like most all of us. But I still see some things that are missing that should have been incorporated, particularly if this game is headed online.

Your right..running 40 lap sprint races for the thousands of us who cant or dont want to sit thru a 100% race is really a TRUE simulation! LMAO..might as well take out the garage, all its settings, and pit stops because the race will END BEFORE I NEED to make a pit stop! What an awesome SIM! LMAO ..and BTW..GPL is ALREADY in the budget racks..while N3 still goes for anywhere between 40-50 bucks!

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:56:17 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I am sorry if you find my logic stupid, but it really is the way I see >the game. Just that, only a game. My wife and child does come first. Hey, real racing is just a game too. Yes, it's only a game, but that doesn't mean I should just accept stupid design features and keep my mouth shut. -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 03:50:45 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >~daxe (whose wife and children also come first) > What does this have to do with the issue? Wife+kids=important to you. To me they mean dick all. I just want to run a *complete* race without having to sit at the computer for 3+ hours straight. Is that so hard to understand? -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:59:56 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Perhaps you should read my question again. I asked why he thinks that >NH is an arcade game when it hasn't got a save option. >A save game feature has nothing to do with a game being arcade or a >simulation. No, I don't need to read it again. He told you why it made it an arcade game. Racing at 25% of a full race makes it an arcade game. That's his point. At 100% so many things can happen during the race that it is just a lot more interesting. But, some of us would like to do that 100% in 1/2-1hr sessions and not all at once. >Ofcourse I understand why you would like a save game feature, I just >don't understand why people are even considering not buying the game >when it doesn't have a save game feature. I think my above reason tells you why. -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 01:18:54 GMT, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel >useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature they probably >knew they would not be able to implement? F12K has that option too. Don't care for it myself. F12K is another sim without a save feature. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:26:00 -0500, "Laings" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if >they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as >real can be, right down to the rules. If you cant finish the race DONT start >it. Bollocks. If it was made optional then you can play it either way. It would be a users choice. Wow! What a concept. -- Nos

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 22:39:11 -0500, "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Um... > >You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought it was >a sim, it's just another arcade game...... So how many times have you ran a full race in GPL? Another great game that was lessened by the lack of a save feature. -- Nos

Without the ability to save, this sim has been relegated to an arcade in the sense that the strategic element associated with full-length races has been lost entirely. That strategic element includes the effects of tyre wear and fuel consumption. No....this news has dulled what was a bright spot in the world of racing sims. I sincerely hope that the developers follow the lead set by Papyrus when N2 was patched with a save function. rrevved wrote:

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> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > > >I can write VOLUMES on WHY this feature MUST be > >in a game such as this. Its absence undermines virtually every other aspect of > >the game. It relegates what could have been the reigning champ of Nascar sims > >to just another "eye candy" arcade game. > > Uhh.. [email hidden] , try to get a grip. > > While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that > the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are > a dumb ass.. > > In my opinion, of course.

Maybe not, but you could just go play N3.... noone is forcing you to go buy Nascar Heat. -<+>-On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:56:17 GMT, Red 86 Vet -<+>-<[email hidden]> thus spoke: -<+>- -<+>- -<+>->I am sorry if you find my logic stupid, but it really is the way I see -<+>->the game. Just that, only a game. My wife and child does come first. -<+>- -<+>-Hey, real racing is just a game too. Yes, it's only a game, but that -<+>-doesn't mean I should just accept stupid design features and keep my -<+>-mouth shut. Thanks, Mike Alexander ([email hidden]) Torch Red 1986 C4 "ITIS4FN" Pictures available at http://alexander.dyndns.org My 2nd Baby!!! (Note:remove the no_tickets. to send email)

EldredP <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <39a0f22c$[email hidden]>, "Stephen Ferguson" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >A save game is the *only* way for some of us to run full races. Myevenings > >don't have enough hours for full races, but I don't want to miss out onthe > >strategy of a full race. A simple save game makes GP3 tops for me. Idon't > >use it as a crutch in case I crash out, but it lets me run for an hour > >without being stuck with only "quickraces". > > > > I've run full races before, and just hit pause(overnight, etc). I've even > taken 3 days to finish a race because I just didn't have time. However, Ihave > the luxury(?!) of not having a wife or kids around who'd need thecomputer. If > *I* need to use it while the game is paused, then I need to make a choice. > Yes, it would be nice to be able to save the game in progress... > My home computer is my work computer is my commuting computer. I don't have that luxury. Stephen

Most days I don't even bother to qualify. I see that I have maybe an hour at most to drive, and I ask myself whether or not I want to drive q-laps, or just say "bugger it" and start at the back of the field and get more racing experience. The latter usually wins out. At least I can save a previous qualifying session and start from there, but it still bothers me that I am stuck running short races. Stephen <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 22:39:11 -0500, "Tim Wheatley" > <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >Um... > > > >You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought itwas > >a sim, it's just another arcade game...... > > So how many times have you ran a full race in GPL? Another great game > that was lessened by the lack of a save feature. > -- > Nos

rrevved <[email hidden]> writes: > Hmm.. I know that Sgt. Stadanko <[email hidden]> > won't read this since he has me killfiled, but I thought the > group would like to know that the above post is The Sarge's > one and only post to Usenet. LOL. One has to be the first, doesn't it ? -- Olav K. Malmin remove spam when replying

[email hidden] (Chas39cop) writes: > ..and BTW..GPL is ALREADY in the budget racks..while N3 still goes >for anywhere between 40-50 bucks! What kind of an argument is that ? -- Olav K. Malmin remove spam when replying

rrevved <[email hidden]> writes:

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> On 22 Aug 2000 09:21:44 +0200, [email hidden] (Olav K. Malmin) wrote: > > >rrevved <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > >> Hmm.. I know that Sgt. Stadanko <[email hidden]> > >> won't read this since he has me killfiled, but I thought the > >> group would like to know that the above post is The Sarge's > >> one and only post to Usenet. LOL. > > > >One has to be the first, doesn't it ? > > Yep, and his was a little silly, IMO.

Well, I guess yours wasn't that great either ? :D (no flame intention) -- Olav K. Malmin remove spam when replying

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 04:42:15 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Maybe not, but you could just go play N3.... I do play N3. N2 got a save game feature by people like me complaining about the lack of one. You won't get what you want if you don't ask. Comprehende? >noone is forcing you to go buy Nascar Heat. No one is forcing you to read my posts and reply either. But, you do anyway. -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 02:25:45 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >So, are you gonna buy it and whine or leave it on the shelf (and whine)? > What do you think? -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 02:48:08 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >He has already stated that any racing sim without a savegame, >such as F1-2000/NH,GPL, etc., is an "arcade game". You are misconstuing what he means by that comment and you know it. Answer this. How many times have you run full races in F12K and GPL? My guess is not many due to the lack of a save game feature. If you can't run a full race due to lack of time then, yes, it becomes an arcade game. Many people use GPL for nothing more than hot laps. That sounds pretty arcadish to me. Online they run 10-20% races. Again, arcade racing at it's finest. -- Nos

But then, when you DO use a save game option, you don't actually drive a 100% distance race. I mean, when you split the race in half, you don't have to be concentrated for the full 100%. It's a bit like doing the marathon in parts of 100meter dashes, adding the times, and then claiming you did the marathon under 2 hours. Not quite the same. That said, althought I personally never would use a save game option, I can understand the demand. After all, you don't have to use it... Remco [email hidden] wrote:

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>On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 02:48:08 -0500, rrevved ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>He has already stated that any racing sim without a savegame, >>such as F1-2000/NH,GPL, etc., is an "arcade game". > >You are misconstuing what he means by that comment and you know it. >Answer this. How many times have you run full races in F12K and GPL? >My guess is not many due to the lack of a save game feature. If you >can't run a full race due to lack of time then, yes, it becomes an >arcade game. Many people use GPL for nothing more than hot laps. That >sounds pretty arcadish to me. Online they run 10-20% races. Again, >arcade racing at it's finest.

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 11:17:21 GMT, [email hidden] (Remco Moedt) thus spoke:

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> > >But then, when you DO use a save game option, you don't actually >drive a 100% distance race. I mean, when you split the race in half, >you don't have to be concentrated for the full 100%. It's a bit like >doing the marathon in parts of 100meter dashes, adding the times, and >then claiming you did the marathon under 2 hours. Not quite the same.

It's not about how long I sit at the computer in one session. It's about the strategies and pitfalls that can happen during a 100% race that just doesn't happen in a 10-20% race. That's the realism I'm looking for. Not getting a sore ass and pissing my pants during a 100% race. Save that for the *real* men. -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:12:19 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved. I'm with you on this lack of save thing, but why did you say the above. GPL has no save feature either. -- Nos

rrevved wrote:

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> > On 22 Aug 2000 09:54:23 +0200, [email hidden] (Olav K. Malmin) wrote: > > >rrevved <[email hidden]> writes: > > > >> On 22 Aug 2000 09:21:44 +0200, [email hidden] (Olav K. Malmin) wrote: > >> > >> >rrevved <[email hidden]> writes: > >> > > >> > > >> >> Hmm.. I know that Sgt. Stadanko <[email hidden]> > >> >> won't read this since he has me killfiled, but I thought the > >> >> group would like to know that the above post is The Sarge's > >> >> one and only post to Usenet. LOL. > >> > > >> >One has to be the first, doesn't it ? > >> > >> Yep, and his was a little silly, IMO. > > > >Well, I guess yours wasn't that great either ? :D (no flame intention) > > He plonked me for mine. I didn't plonk him for his.

He's really off to a good start. LOL -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

rrevved wrote:

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> > On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 00:36:39 GMT, "Randy Wilson" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > > >rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >news:[email hidden]... > >> On 21 Aug 2000 04:42:10 GMT, [email hidden] (Chas39cop) wrote: > >> > >> While I can understand your desire for this feature, if you think that > >> the lack of it relegates NH to an 'arcade game' status, then you are > >> a dumb ass.. > >> > >> In my opinion, of course. > >> > >But not your HUMBLE opinion, right Ed? Dumbass. > > Why be humble when you're right? > > *plonk*

Ouch! ;-) -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 20:00:22 GMT, Red 86 Vet <[email hidden]> wrote: >The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn >the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying >about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to >have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start >over, so what... For all the flak that GP3 got for its missing features, most of which were completely chrome (like other car sounds, animated pit crew, warmup lap) I find it repulsing that once a game has a good physics model, like NH or GPL, it can get away with bloody stupidity like not having a save-game feature.

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 04:16:21 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >>~daxe (whose wife and children also come first) >> > >What does this have to do with the issue? I was concurring with something someone said earlier in the thread. It doesn't have to directly relate to the issue. ~daxe (who doesn't care if there's a save game or not)

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 14:37:34 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I was concurring with something someone said earlier in the thread. >It doesn't have to directly relate to the issue. Well, I don't care if your wife and kids are more important to you. I care about the lack of a save game feature. That's the discussion so stick to the subject please. -- Nos

No tyre wear, no refuelling = no pit stops = no strategy. I can run a "full-length" race irrespective of whether it's 5 laps or 50 laps. [email hidden] wrote:

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> On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:12:19 +1000, Leaky_Valve > <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved. > > I'm with you on this lack of save thing, but why did you say the > above. GPL has no save feature either. > -- > Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 20:38:27 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >>I was concurring with something someone said earlier in the thread. >>It doesn't have to directly relate to the issue. > >Well, I don't care if your wife and kids are more important to you. And I don't care what you think either. >I >care about the lack of a save game feature. That's the discussion so >stick to the subject please. Who put you in charge of what I can and can't say? If you don't like it, then don't read my posts. I'm not going to do or not do anything based on your opinion of it. This is a public forum, in case you hadn't noticed. ~daxe

"rrevved" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 21:52:22 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]>wrote: > > >Without the ability to enjoy full-length racing AT MY LEISURE I wouldfeel > >short-changed if I bought this package. > > So, you're not going to buy Nascar Heat? Is buying Nascar Heat a requirement or something? -- [email hidden]

On 22 Aug 2000 20:29:52 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >Stephen Ferguson(I believe) said the same thing, which I understand. But, >don't you also have GPL? The lack of a save game doesn't stop you from >enjoying it, right? >Just curious. Yes it does degrade my enjoyment of GPL. I'm not into hotlapping and I would like to run full races, but the lack of a save game feature makes it difficult to do. Mind you I rarely make it around the track without crashing anyway so it doesn't really matter. -- Nos

On 22 Aug 2000 20:29:55 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >If it *does* involve the computer, then you >have a decision to make. Just like everything else in life... That's right. And I have decided to try and put a little pressure on Hasbro to make a patch to add a savegame feature. Ding! Ding! Ding! -- Nos

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:00:21 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > Who put you in charge of what I can and can't say? If you don't like >it, then don't read my posts. I'm not going to do or not do anything >based on your opinion of it. This is a public forum, in case you >hadn't noticed. > >~daxe And I have every right to tell you that your point is irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I'm not telling you what you can or can't talk about.I'm telling you and the other guy talking about how important your home life is has no bearing on wether I should buy a game or not due to the lack of a missing feature. -- Nos

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 07:36:18 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >No tyre wear, no refuelling = no pit stops = no strategy. >I can run a "full-length" race irrespective of whether it's 5 laps or 50 >laps. True. -- Nos

I just ran a race with maximum wear setting 6X and if you want pitting and strategy you got it. Every 15 laps or so at Atlanta I had to pit for gas and right side tires! Pete "Leaky_Valve" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > No tyre wear, no refuelling = no pit stops = no strategy. > I can run a "full-length" race irrespective of whether it's 5 laps or 50 > laps. >

In article <9pHo5.1660$[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: >Hate to admit it, I never purchased SCGT, so I do not know the answer to >that. > Ok, fair enough. I'll have to re-install it and check... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>On 22 Aug 2000 20:29:55 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus >spoke: > >>If it *does* involve the computer, then you >>have a decision to make. Just like everything else in life... > >That's right. And I have decided to try and put a little pressure on >Hasbro to make a patch to add a savegame feature. Ding! Ding! Ding!

I'm not arguing your right to want that feature, or even to state your case to Hasbro about it. I'll stand behind you. But, when your posts are whining, yelling rants, people tend to be put off by that... Just a suggestion to change your tone/methods... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:32:09 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >And I have every right to tell you that your point is irrelevant to >the discussion at hand. I'm not telling you what you can or can't talk >about. You asked me to *stop posting* irrelevant stuff. Ask, tell, whatever, it's you trying to control what I say and that's not OK with me. I'll express myself the way I want and you can express yourself the way you want. Your 'response' to me was for no purpose other than picking on what I chose to say in my signature. If it wasn't relevant to your point, then you really had no purpose in addressing it other than to be antagonistic. You have good points to make and plenty of relevant stuff to say, why sink down to picking on people with differing opinions? >I'm telling you and the other guy talking about how important >your home life is has no bearing on wether I should buy a game or not >due to the lack of a missing feature. And your problems with the lack of a save game feature have no bearing on anything we do, either. We don't care if you buy the game or not. You and your opinions and problems aren't important to anyone but you, but everyone assembles here to talk about this stuff, so we are all free to talk about what matters to us, hopefully without some insecure person feeling the need to tell us we aren't relevant or important. Everyone in this newsgroup has gotten your point, Nos. I understood your point from the first time you stated it. People who argue your points or that state other points aren't wrong or stupid or irrelevant, they just feel differently than you and that doesn't make them wrong. Saying what you mean a hundred times isn't going to change their minds, either. I don't care about a save game feature. Lots of other people don't care about it. Some do, some don't. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. To me, the save game thing is total non-issue. I don't care if you or others label the game 'arcade' because the issue is having fun and from the demo I can see tons of fun readily available to me in NH. Personally, if I have to think about whether or not to buy a game longer than it takes me to earn the money to buy it I have lost out one way or another. If you can't see any fun in it or simply can't deal with the lack of a save game feature, then just don't buy the friggin' game! Simple! Bitching endlessly about it in here isn't going to accomplish anything except to annoy people who don't agree with you and make people who do agree with you nod their heads in agreement. If you want it changed, then write to the game developers and make the suggestion. Ed Martin graciously subjects himself to this forum and I am sure he has gotten your point, too. If you just keep railing about it forever, you end up sounding more like a lunatic than a thoughtful person with a good point and the validity of the point you are making starts to become secondary to your expression of the point. You seem like a bright, thoughtful guy. Why not use all that energy to its best advantage in a place where it will do the most good? In reality, if the several dozen people in r.a.s. who are complaining about this end up not buying NH, it won't even make a statistical blip on Hasbro's radar screens. They don't need to care about the opinion of a tiny minority of people (i.e. those who care about a save game feature) because that doesn't represent enough sales to matter one way or the other to them. ~daxe

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 00:28:30 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >hopefully without some insecure >person feeling the need to tell us we aren't relevant or important. Insecure? Hehe...very funny stuff indeed. I got as far as the above part of your post and could stomach no more. The rest of your post was wasted because I didn't even bother to read it. Don't know what you are talking about attacking your sig either. Don't you feel guilty wasting time here on usenet talking to a nobody when you could be spending quality time with the wife and kids? -- Nos

By that argument you are agreeing that, as a game and not real life, we should be able to save it if that is our choice, is that correct? Red 86 Vet wrote:

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> The point being, it is a game... When something else comes up, turn > the game off and go do it. I do understand what everyone is saying > about needing a savegame "feature" Yes, it would be a nice thing to > have, but get real, it is a game. If you have to turn it of and start > over, so what... > > On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 10:59:38 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: > > >On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 06:46:37 GMT, Red 86 Vet > ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > > >>It is an option we can live without. > > > >No, it's not an option we can live without. If it's left out then it's > >not an option at all. I don't want to have to sit at the wheel for > >3+hrs to run a full race.

If its intended purpose is, as you say, "entertainment", all the more reason why it should incorporate a save function. Whilst real life certainly comes first (no argument with that at all) simply because this program is intended for leisure, that's the very reason why it SHOULD have the capability for some sort of save, so that we can come back to it at OUR leisure. Understand now? Red 86 Vet wrote:

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> I am not going to get into a pissing contest with you about a feature > in a game which neither of us can control. I will add, I would love > for the game to have a save game feature, but it will not change my > mind to buy, or not buy, the game. Like most others (wild guess) I > will buy the game and use it for its intended purpose, entertainment. > If life gets in the way, I will turn it off and take care of life. I > can say I would be irritated if 2 hours into a full length race if the > phone rang or something. Yikes. It has happened before. I would > hope the game has a pause (that is perfect for what I need.) > > I am sorry if you find my logic stupid, but it really is the way I see > the game. Just that, only a game. My wife and child does come first. > > On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 21:36:12 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: > > >On Mon, 21 Aug 2000 16:54:30 -0400, "David L. Cook" > ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > > >>Well, I may agree that a Save Game feature is needed, but I also understand > >>the "logic" behind the post. What he is saying is that if you have more > >>important things to do than play your game, turn it off and start over next > >>time you sit down. > > > >Well, that's what's so stupid about it. Why would I start a full > >length race and then halway through decide I have something more > >important to do and then think nothing of quiting the game and > >starting another 3+hr. race over again tomorrow? That would > >completeley negate the 1.5hr.s I spent on the first race. What a f***g > >waste of time that would be. No?

I DID explain, Andre. Because the elements of tyre wear, fuel consumption (and any other degradable or consumable features that the game might include) will be missing from short races. Without the ability to enjoy full-length racing AT MY LEISURE I would feel short-changed if I bought this package. I don't have the time nor the inclination to involve myself in leagues, either on-line or off-line. I want to simply sit down in front of a computer and lose myself in a world of imagination for an hour or so. But I want to do it when with a certain degree of flexibility and that, my friend, is being denied me if I cannot race a full-length event WHEN I WANT TO. By reducing NH to a series of Race The Pro, Beat The HEAT and Short Race events, the package becomes little more than a sophisticated arcade....no matter how pretty the graphics nor how squirmy the physics. Get my drift? Andre Warringa wrote:

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> > Could you explain why you think that NH degrades to an arcade game if > you can't save a race? I mean, in real life you can't save a race to > try again and again? Allthough frustrating sometimes, no save game is > imho more realistic, and a save option would be arcade. > > Andre >

Because it IS a GAME! That's my whole point, Andre....IT'S A GAME. That's the irony of the situation......it's a piece of packaged entertainment, something that the developers and publishers should be viewing it as. I haven't the slightest intention of trying to cram in a 500 mile race in one sitting simply because the developer has taken it upon himself to say "That's not reality". IT IS A GAME! So at least allow those of us who CAN tell the difference between reality and make-believe to save a game in progress when reality has to be returned to. Andre Warringa wrote:

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> Perhaps you should read my question again. I asked why he thinks that > NH is an arcade game when it hasn't got a save option. > A save game feature has nothing to do with a game being arcade or a > simulation. > Ofcourse I understand why you would like a save game feature, I just > don't understand why people are even considering not buying the game > when it doesn't have a save game feature. > > Andre

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 02:00:17 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >>hopefully without some insecure >>person feeling the need to tell us we aren't relevant or important. > >Insecure? Hehe...very funny stuff indeed. I got as far as the above >part of your post and could stomach no more. Insecure..as in needing to constantly spout one's opinions to other people in order to help validate them in ones mind. Interesting how you can't stomach sensible counter-arguments. I noticed you ducked someone else's well-reasoned thoughts elsewhere. All you do is spout your opinion over and over and then squirm away when you are confronted. Insecure. And fairly unctuous, beside. > The rest of your post was >wasted because I didn't even bother to read it. Has it ever occured to you that you aren't the only person reading this group? You seem to have an unusually self-centered view of things. I guess if YOU don't read it, then it's a waste, right? > Don't know what you >are talking about attacking your sig either. Something wrong with your short term memory? On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 20:38:27 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >Well, I don't care if your wife and kids are more important to you. Honestly, who asked you? Your first post directed at me was complaining about the content of my signature and had no further substance aside from repeating your opinion. Is everyone supposed to judge whether or not *you* care about something before they post it? > Don't you feel guilty >wasting time here on usenet talking to a nobody when you could be >spending quality time with the wife and kids? I am on Usenet for a lot more reasons than just fielding your witty banter. Believe it or not, everyone doesn't come here exclusively to read your opinions and talk with you. And my wife and kids are asleep. ~daxe

You aren't REALLY a cretin are you?. If you cannot tell the difference between reality and pretend then perhaps you should return to the institution; obviously your treatment hasn't taken. Laings wrote: > Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if > they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as > real can be, right down to the rules. If you cant finish the race DONT start > it. >

I will not be buying it....but that's my choice and isn't stated in order to influence anyone else. I said prior to this post that I am not a rabid NASCAR fan and, without a save-game function, the balance has been tipped away from my buying the game. I will say that there are probably many, many others like myself (simulation enjoyers...but not raging enthusiasts) who, once they discover that there is no save-game, will either not buy the pack or will return it for exchange or refund. These are people who don't (necessarily) visit RAS, therefore they will receive no prior warning about this particular shortcoming. C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved. rrevved wrote: > So, are you gonna buy it and whine or leave it on the shelf (and whine)?

Hate to admit it, I never purchased SCGT, so I do not know the answer to that. -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566 "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <2yko5.179$[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel > >useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature they probably > >knew they would not be able to implement? > > Can you save in SCGT? I don't remember, but I know that you can set the 2x and > 3x for fuel and tire wear... > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +51.31 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 03:09:07 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Insecure..as in needing to constantly spout one's opinions to other >people in order to help validate them in ones mind. Interesting how >you can't stomach sensible counter-arguments. I noticed you ducked >someone else's well-reasoned thoughts elsewhere. All you do is spout >your opinion over and over and then squirm away when you are >confronted. Insecure. And fairly unctuous, beside. Oh poo poo on you. You really make too much of things. I'm sitting here laughing my ass off reading the reponses to my shit and you are waxing and waning over the wrong I have done you and making up crap about my inner mind that you have no inkling of. Pretty funny stuff indeed. -- Nos

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 05:51:47 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >Oh poo poo on you. You really make too much of things. I haven't posted dozens of times on the same minor topic in the last two days, have I? Who is it that makes too much of things? >I'm sitting >here laughing my ass off reading the reponses to my shit and you are >waxing and waning over the wrong I have done you and making up crap >about my inner mind that you have no inkling of. Pretty funny stuff >indeed. Since you are just sitting there laughing at how people respond to what you write, then the accusation that you are posting just to be antagonistic seems spot on. Glad I could entertain you. ~daxe

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 06:49:51 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I haven't posted dozens of times on the same minor topic in the last >two days, have I? Who is it that makes too much of things? I made a few posts on the subject and the rest has been defending my position from flamers and comments like, "it's just a game, my wife and kids are more important". <sigh> >Since you are just sitting there laughing at how people respond to >what you write, then the accusation that you are posting just to be >antagonistic seems spot on. It didn't start that way, but seeing as some people wanted to make an issue out of my (and other peoples) opinion then I was up for the good fight and reeled out my line. It's cheap entertainment and beats watching TV. But, that's about as far as it goes. Apologies if I offended you. -- Nos

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 10:58:43 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >I made a few posts on the subject and the rest has been defending my >position from flamers and comments like, "it's just a game, my wife >and kids are more important". <sigh> Well, you don't really need to defend yourself against that since it isn't an attack on you or your views, but I understand the sport of a good argument. >It didn't start that way, but seeing as some people wanted to make an >issue out of my (and other peoples) opinion then I was up for the good >fight and reeled out my line. It's cheap entertainment and beats >watching TV. But, that's about as far as it goes. Apologies if I >offended you. Thanks. Enough of this silliness. Let's get racing. ~daxe

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 09:47:48 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote: >>sounds pretty arcadish to me. Online they run 10-20% races. Again, >>arcade racing at it's finest. >I guess you and I have a different definition of the words >'arcade game'. Logic failure there rrevved. He said 'arcade racing' not 'arcade game'. Even though GPL or NH for that matter qualify as 'hardcore simulators', running 10% races in any simulator is, arcade _racing_.

See above (or below, depending on how you have your NG browser set up). rrevved wrote:

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> On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:05:39 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >You aren't REALLY a cretin are you?. > >If you cannot tell the difference between reality and pretend then perhaps you > >should return to the institution; obviously your treatment hasn't taken. > > > > Leaky Valve, since you are a GPL fan, how can you stand not being > able to savegame in GPL? I don't think I have ever seen you make > any posts, here, denouncing GPL (the arcade game) for it's pathetic > lack of this highly important feature. > > What's the scoop? > > >Laings wrote: > > > >> Lets write Nascar and tell them the drivers should get to save their race if > >> they dont feel like racing that day. NOT!!!!! Its a sim and is as real as > >> real can be, right down to the rules. If you cant finish the race DONT start > >> it. > >>

I've given my response to this scintillating observation elsewhere. EldredP wrote:

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> In article <[email hidden]>, Leaky_Valve > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >I will not be buying it....but that's my choice and isn't stated in order to > >influence anyone else. I said prior to this post that I am not a rabid NASCAR > >fan > >and, without a save-game function, the balance has been tipped away from my > >buying > >the game. > > > >I will say that there are probably many, many others like myself (simulation > >enjoyers...but not raging enthusiasts) who, once they discover that there is > >no > >save-game, will either not buy the pack or will return it for exchange or > >refund. > >These are people who don't (necessarily) visit RAS, therefore they will > >receive no > >prior warning about this particular shortcoming. > > > >C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved. > > But GPL doesn't have a save game, either...<g> > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +51.31 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

So you've already bought the retail version of Nascar HEAT, have you? Pete wrote:

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> I just ran a race with maximum wear setting 6X and > if you want pitting and strategy you got it. Every 15 laps > or so at Atlanta I had to pit for gas and right side tires! > > Pete > > "Leaky_Valve" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > No tyre wear, no refuelling = no pit stops = no strategy. > > I can run a "full-length" race irrespective of whether it's 5 laps or 50 > > laps. > >

No....I'd have to try and get it on-line or through someone in the 'States anyway. I would've gone to the trouble to do that if it had offered a save function. As it doesn't then, as I said, the balance has tipped to the side labelled "Decline". rrevved wrote: > On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 21:52:22 +1000, Leaky_Valve <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Without the ability to enjoy full-length racing AT MY LEISURE I would feel > >short-changed if I bought this package. > > So, you're not going to buy Nascar Heat?

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>On 23 Aug 2000 14:42:30 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus >spoke: > > >>I'm not arguing your right to want that feature, or even to state your case >to >>Hasbro about it. I'll stand behind you. But, when your posts are whining, >>yelling rants, people tend to be put off by that... Just a suggestion to >>change your tone/methods... > >Where have I yelled, ranted or whined? Any time someone makes an issue >out of something there are always people accusing them of whining. >Give it a rest.

Whatever... I'm sure the listening audience sees it differently. Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> Eldred votes yes... -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes: >>C'est la vie..............I simply return to GPL and money is saved. > >I'm with you on this lack of save thing, but why did you say the >above. GPL has no save feature either. Don't be silly. In 1967 no video games had a save game feature Don McCorkle

On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 22:09:40 -0500, "Laings" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Just hit pause and then ALT-Tab Geee problem solved!!!!!!! Don't make me have to enter the fray again. But, just one last comment. No, the problem is not solved. Maybe I won't want to continue the race for a week or so. Maybe I'll want to boot to dos for some reason. Your band-aid suggestion is weak at best. -- Nos

On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 11:52:20 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Do GPL hot-lappers like to be known as 'arcade racers'? > >How about VROC races? Are those 'arcade races'? > >Naw, that dog won't hunt.. > They might not like to hear it, but yes they are. :-) They are not managing fuel or tire wear etc. so they are running an arcade level race. That is not meant to offend btw, it's just the way it is. -- Nos

On 23 Aug 2000 14:42:30 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >I'm not arguing your right to want that feature, or even to state your case to >Hasbro about it. I'll stand behind you. But, when your posts are whining, >yelling rants, people tend to be put off by that... Just a suggestion to >change your tone/methods... Where have I yelled, ranted or whined? Any time someone makes an issue out of something there are always people accusing them of whining. Give it a rest. -- Nos

On Thu, 24 Aug 2000 01:44:57 GMT, [email hidden] wrote:

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>On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 11:52:20 -0500, rrevved ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >>Do GPL hot-lappers like to be known as 'arcade racers'? >> >>How about VROC races? Are those 'arcade races'? >> >>Naw, that dog won't hunt.. >> > >They might not like to hear it, but yes they are. :-) >They are not managing fuel or tire wear etc. so they are running an

Perhaps because back then cars were filled with fuel for the whole race and tires lasted the whole race? Andre >arcade level race. That is not meant to offend btw, it's just the way >it is.

Yes, I have! Pete "Leaky_Valve" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > So you've already bought the retail version of Nascar HEAT, have you? >

Actually I'd say he was just plain wrong. You have to select a fuel level that will last the race length at a certain speed, if you push harder you can run out before the end of the race, if you put too much in you are at a slight disadvantage. Tyre wear isn't an issue, but tyre heat most certainly is, ie. if you push the car very hard for a few laps the handling will suffer due to the excessive heat build up. I was recently in a race at Watkins Glen using my trusty old Ferrari, imagine my horror when 3 Lotii turned up and set pole in the low 4's <G> Anyway in the race I was pushing very hard from the start, staying within sight of the Lotii for a few laps but then the car became unstable because of the tyre heat, understeer into and oversteer out of corners, had to back off for a lap or two to get it drivable again. I was then running in 3rd place with 4 laps to go (pro long race) and the fuel gauge was dropping rapidly, eventually ran out with 2 laps to go :( This setup if driven as I normally do will last a whole race without excessive tyre heat. -- Ian P <email invalid due to spam> Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Thu, 24 Aug 2000 01:44:57 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: > > >On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 11:52:20 -0500, rrevved > ><[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > > > > >>Do GPL hot-lappers like to be known as 'arcade racers'? > >> > >>How about VROC races? Are those 'arcade races'? > >> > >>Naw, that dog won't hunt.. > >> > > > >They might not like to hear it, but yes they are. :-) > >They are not managing fuel or tire wear etc. so they are running an > > Perhaps because back then cars were filled with fuel for the whole > race and tires lasted the whole race? > > Andre > > > >arcade level race. That is not meant to offend btw, it's just the way > >it is. >

On 24 Aug 2000 19:11:16 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> No. -- Nos

Bendito wrote:

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> > Pierre Legrand wrote in message <39a61b78.5344469@news>... > > >You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife > >calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next > >timezone. > > No offense intended, but why do cats feature prominently in game playing > interruption stories? I've never had a cat so maybe that's why I need to ask > the question. :)

You never had a cat jump on your lap while going full throttle through Eau Rouge? I panicked and almost killed the poor, attention seeking thing... ;) -- l8er ronny Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change to take effect. Reboot now? |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

In article <39a61fc4.6444814@news>, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand) writes:

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>Enjoy it while you can....I used to practice flying Flanker for about >5 hours a day....then the little one was born and the wifey got out of >graduate school...then my entire world was turned upside down. > >I rarely have more than 1 hour stretches...and those are usually very >late at night. This is a reality that the gaming industry better come >to terms with... > >PAPA DOC > >> >>I can't speak for Tim, but *I've* run at least 20 full races... >> >>Eldred

Hehe... I dunno, I'd rather have a wife or girlfriend than to have time on weekends for games... :) Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <9Blp5.3753$[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: >No, just stating an opinion on a feature he is passionate about. Nothing >wrong there. > I never said there was anything wrong with stating it. I even *agreed* with him. I'm ONLY referring to his methods, that's all. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

>No savegame is stupidity incarnate.... >>It's just like your favorite sim, GPL. Why are you so adamant about other sims having a savegame when GPL doesn't? >>Just wondering. But Nascar 4 WILL....LOL..and boy is it going to be godsmacking..just talked to Dave Kaemmer.....

rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:30:24 GMT, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand)wrote:

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> > >Hell Im gonna buy it then use the fact that I spent my money on it as > >a right to bitch to high heaven about a feature thats so obvious I > >cannot believe its been left out. > > Why don't you bitch about GPL? >

Because he sees GPL as a hot-lapping sim, where the satisfaction comes as much from bettering lap times as from winning races (judging by the number of GPLRank posts vs online racing posts lately, it seems a lot of GPL people are happy to hot lap, myself included). On the other hand, he sees NH as a racing sim (as I see GP3) and there a savegame feature would be welcome. I can see exactly where he is coming from, because it is also exactly the way I use GPL and GP3. GPL is a driving simulator (for me) and GP3 is a racing simulator. Stephen

rrevved <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:13:13 GMT, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand)wrote:

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> > >What kind of drugs are you on.....? Kinda long post coming from a > >person who doesnt take this stuff seriously. > > > >The lack of a savegame feature is exactly contrary to a happy family > >life and a fun gaming life...scenario. > > > >You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife > >calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next > >timezone. You do... > >a. Calmly piss away nearly 3 hours of race time...to answer you wifes > >calls for help. > >b. Call out that you only have two laps left...whereby your ass does > >get kicked.... > >c. Press the save game key.... > > > >Ooops thats right we dont get a savegame key....ooopsy. So you do a > >and vow to never get into that game again cause that kind of stupidity > >doesnt deserve to be rewarded. Some people in the games industry have > >nothing but time cause they have no family....to them the lack of a > >savegame adds a bit of drama to the game and a bit of fun. I can > >assure you that if any one of the primary designers had a kid then > >that save game key would be prominent. > > > >PAPA DOC > > > > PD, your favorite sim, GPL, doesn't have a save game. > I thought I'd mention that.

Three times... :-) That's a bit more than a "by the way". Stephen

Pierre Legrand wrote in message <39a61b78.5344469@news>... >You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife >calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next >timezone. No offense intended, but why do cats feature prominently in game playing interruption stories? I've never had a cat so maybe that's why I need to ask the question. :) Bendito;

EldredP wrote: > Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> > > Eldred votes yes... The silence in here is deafening. <g> Think most everyone is giving a "no comment"! Rather than join you three, I think I'll keep my silence as well. ;-) -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

No, just stating an opinion on a feature he is passionate about. Nothing wrong there. -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566 <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On 24 Aug 2000 19:11:16 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus > spoke: > > > >Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> > > No. > -- > Nos

What kind of drugs are you on.....? Kinda long post coming from a person who doesnt take this stuff seriously. The lack of a savegame feature is exactly contrary to a happy family life and a fun gaming life...scenario. You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next timezone. You do... a. Calmly piss away nearly 3 hours of race time...to answer you wifes calls for help. b. Call out that you only have two laps left...whereby your ass does get kicked.... c. Press the save game key.... Ooops thats right we dont get a savegame key....ooopsy. So you do a and vow to never get into that game again cause that kind of stupidity doesnt deserve to be rewarded. Some people in the games industry have nothing but time cause they have no family....to them the lack of a savegame adds a bit of drama to the game and a bit of fun. I can assure you that if any one of the primary designers had a kid then that save game key would be prominent. PAPA DOC

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>In reality, if the several dozen people in r.a.s. who are complaining >about this end up not buying NH, it won't even make a statistical blip >on Hasbro's radar screens. They don't need to care about the opinion >of a tiny minority of people (i.e. those who care about a save game >feature) because that doesn't represent enough sales to matter one way >or the other to them. > >~daxe >

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Oh good because I wanted to be 3....I have always wanted to be 3 but have always been two...finally I get to be 3....me three..me three... hehehe. No savegame is stupidity incarnate.... PAPA DOC

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>EldredP wrote: > >> Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> >> >> Eldred votes yes... > > >The silence in here is deafening. <g> Think most everyone is giving a >"no comment"! >Rather than join you three, I think I'll keep my silence as well. ;-) > >-- >Chuck Kandler > >Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses > >Registered Linux User #180746 >http://counter.li.org

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Yes so now lets have a pol of how many people have run the entire season full length races....ooops. No certainly GPL is not an arcade game but then again you cannot really say its useful as a simulator of a Grand Prix race of the people who purchase it cannot race an entire race because of the pressures of the Family. I dont believe that not having a savegame makes Nascar Heat an arcade game but I do believe that the lack of said savegame feature has seriously crippled it. In GPL its entirely possible to hot lap to ones hearts content due to the awesome nature of the tracks. But with Nascar the fun is entirely in the full length races....if you cannot do the full length race then ooops.... Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand

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>Um... > >You can't save mid-race in gpl either... and all this time I thought it was >a sim, it's just another arcade game...... > >-- >Tim,

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Enjoy it while you can....I used to practice flying Flanker for about 5 hours a day....then the little one was born and the wifey got out of graduate school...then my entire world was turned upside down. I rarely have more than 1 hour stretches...and those are usually very late at night. This is a reality that the gaming industry better come to terms with... PAPA DOC

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> >I can't speak for Tim, but *I've* run at least 20 full races... > >Eldred >-- >Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 >Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett >GPL hcp. +51.31 > >Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you >with experience... >Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Hell Im gonna buy it then use the fact that I spent my money on it as a right to bitch to high heaven about a feature thats so obvious I cannot believe its been left out. The only reason its not there is someone got the bright idea that leaving it out would be good for gameplay....and in todays world with families and such thats just plain dumb PAPA DOC > >So, are you gonna buy it and whine or leave it on the shelf (and whine)? > Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Thats a very simple answer the nature of both these type of racing is different. Racing around the Ring....or Monoco is challenging in an of itself...a Major challenge...while getting around an Oval while still difficult wont rate to be nearly as much fun solo. To put it in simple easy to digest terms. Driving around the Ring...challenging. Driving around Daytona .....less so....but then again add a bunch of other cars and the strategy of pitstops and saving the car and driving around Daytona becomes challenging. Ed you really shouldnt be such an apologist for every game developer in existence...they do get it wrong from time to time. PAPA DOC

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>Leaky Valve, since you are a GPL fan, how can you stand not being >able to savegame in GPL? I don't think I have ever seen you make >any posts, here, denouncing GPL (the arcade game) for it's pathetic >lack of this highly important feature. > >What's the scoop? >

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:13:13 GMT, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand) thus spoke: >What kind of drugs are you on.....? Kinda long post coming from a >person who doesnt take this stuff seriously. Uh oh...I sense trouble. :-) -- Nos

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:13:13 GMT, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand) wrote: >What kind of drugs are you on.....? Kinda long post coming from a >person who doesnt take this stuff seriously. I try to state my thoughts clearly. Sometimes it takes a few extra paragraphs, though sometimes people are so stuck in their mindsets that all the explaining in the world can't get them to see outside their little boxes. >The lack of a savegame feature is exactly contrary to a happy family >life and a fun gaming life...scenario. I have never saved a race in my life and I honestly don't even know which sims have it or not because I don't need it or care about it. I either run races within the parameters of time I have available, or if I am interrupted by something important, I just pause it or shut it off. What is so incongruous about that? I have loads of fun with my race sims and I have a very happy family life. I have *priorities* to help me balance the two. >You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife >calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next >timezone. You do... >a. Calmly piss away nearly 3 hours of race time...to answer you wifes >calls for help. Wife would come into my office and ask when race was going to be over. I would tell her and she would leave. If I have 100 laps to go and what she wants is kind of urgent, I would probably hit pause or just stop the game. If I have 100 laps to go and it isn't urgent, I'd come find her when I was done. Plus, if there was a cat here, I would have kicked it into the next time zone, personally. I hate cats. My dogs don't like them, either. >b. Call out that you only have two laps left...whereby your ass does >get kicked.... Nope. My wife doesn't run my life and knows better than to attack me for having a good time. I pay the bills, live up to my responsibilities, and treat her very well. She's got nothing to bitch about. >c. Press the save game key.... I would not try to return to such an emotionally wound-up, adrenalized moment and expect to enjoy it or be able to deal with it after a big interruption. Part of the thrill of racing is the intensity and concentration without distractions and interruptions. A save game key doesn't eliminate these things. Savegames strike me like coitus interruptus. >Ooops thats right we dont get a savegame key....ooopsy. So you do a >and vow to never get into that game again cause that kind of stupidity >doesnt deserve to be rewarded. I guess I am smart enough to know how much time I have to do something and not to schedule something longer than the time I have. I don't start a 3 hour race unless my wife has left with the kids for 5 hours. If it's 2 hours before she is going to return, I just don't start a 3 hour race, or I run a 1 hour race, instead. I race a lot after everyone goes to bed. I have all the time I want. If my daughter falls out of bed and fractures her skull, I will stop the game and not regret it, because that's more important than sim racing. >Some people in the games industry have >nothing but time cause they have no family....to them the lack of a >savegame adds a bit of drama to the game and a bit of fun. I can >assure you that if any one of the primary designers had a kid then >that save game key would be prominent. Well, I have two kids and I don't care if it's there or not. I have no use for it. I didn't care about it when I didn't have any kids, either. For anyone who wants a savegame feature, I wish it was there. I am not arguing that it shouldn't be there. I am arguing against people who are making blanket statements and generalizations regarding the lack of this feature in NH, saying it makes the game 'arcade' (and therefore intolerable) or that they can't possibly find any use for the game without it (I guess stopping it is more important than playing it..) I was just making my thoughts known on the matter. ~daxe

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 08:38:18 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I try to state my thoughts clearly. Sometimes it takes a few extra >paragraphs, though sometimes people are so stuck in their mindsets >that all the explaining in the world can't get them to see outside >their little boxes. I hope that wasn't directed at me or I'm going to have to start with the aggro again. -- Nos

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 05:51:38 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Nice post. My sentiments, exactly. > Bollocks. I'm trying to stay out of this, but it's kind of hard when this situation is being misrepresented. No one made blanket statements. The way the person meant arcade was in a different way from what you call arcade. I see you lot as the transgressors here. Some people expressed their displeasure at the lack of a save game and gave good reasons why and then they were attacked as whiners and troublemakers for it. Well, I have one last thing to say to you all. Fuck you! Ah, that feels better. :-) -- Nos

Bendito wrote:

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> > Pierre Legrand wrote in message <39a61b78.5344469@news>... > > >You are running in the lead with two laps to go of a 500 miler...wife > >calls for help cause the kid just drop kicked the cat into the next > >timezone. > > No offense intended, but why do cats feature prominently in game playing > interruption stories? I've never had a cat so maybe that's why I need to ask > the question. :)

Easy, cats are like kids, they want attention, and the more you ignore them, the more they insist on getting it, trust me, I know, I've learned to live with it though, they're worth the occasional crash......:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "Team Mirage" http://www.teammirage.com/ "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

rrevved wrote:

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> > On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:15:22 GMT, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand) wrote: > > >No savegame is stupidity incarnate.... > > It's just like your favorite sim, GPL. Why are you so adamant > about other sims having a savegame when GPL doesn't? > Just wondering.

No, that's a weak argument there Ed. Just because we love GPL doesn't mean it has no flaws in it. This is just one of the *few* flaws it does have. I'm not as adamant about the save game feature as some are, but I also don't put sims I like on such a high pedestal that I can't see any fault in them. -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

Absolutely and it suffers because of it...I have never had the time to actually race a complete race...absurd that a simple thing like a savegame key isnt in there. The saving grace for GPL is that the tracks are interesting enough to hot lap into infinity. I doubt I will say the same thing about ovals. PAPA DOC >PD, your favorite sim, GPL, doesn't have a save game. >I thought I'd mention that. > > Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Rrevved, Did you take a stupid pill or something...or just trying to be condencending for the sheer joy of pissing into the wind...? PAPA DOC >It's just like your favorite sim, GPL. Why are you so adamant >about other sims having a savegame when GPL doesn't? >Just wondering. > Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Forgive Rrevved I believe he has fallend down and hit his head....I can see no other reason to be so condencending and to so joyously piss into the wind. PAPA DOC PS Thats exactly the difference between the two.....I wish it were different for GPL but its not.

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> >Because he sees GPL as a hot-lapping sim, where the satisfaction comes as >much from bettering lap times as from winning races (judging by the number >of GPLRank posts vs online racing posts lately, it seems a lot of GPL people >are happy to hot lap, myself included). On the other hand, he sees NH as a >racing sim (as I see GP3) and there a savegame feature would be welcome. I >can see exactly where he is coming from, because it is also exactly the way >I use GPL and GP3. GPL is a driving simulator (for me) and GP3 is a racing >simulator. > >Stephen > > >

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

In article <[email hidden]>, EldredP <[email hidden]> writes

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>In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] >writes: > >>On 23 Aug 2000 14:42:30 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) >thus >>spoke: >> >> >>>I'm not arguing your right to want that feature, or even to state your case >>to >>>Hasbro about it. I'll stand behind you. But, when your posts are whining, >>>yelling rants, people tend to be put off by that... Just a suggestion to >>>change your tone/methods... >> >>Where have I yelled, ranted or whined? Any time someone makes an issue >>out of something there are always people accusing them of whining. >>Give it a rest. > >Whatever... I'm sure the listening audience sees it differently. >Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> > >Eldred votes yes...

I would happily vote on your question Eldred, but at the moment some other, more important, life related issues have come up so I'll pass at the moment and maybe answer this next time around. You do understand of course. <g> -- Peter Ives - (AKA Ivington) Remove ALL_STRESS before replying No person's opinions can be said to be more correct than another's, because each is the sole judge of his or her own experience.

Peter Ives wrote: > I would happily vote on your question Eldred, but at the moment some > other, more important, life related issues have come up so I'll pass at > the moment and maybe answer this next time around. You do understand of > course. <g> Gee, your newsreader has a save-thread feature? <VBG> -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

rrevved wrote:

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> > I agree, Chuck. I feel the same way. > > What is hard for me to agree with are those who hammer Hasbro > for something they never mention as lacking in their favorite sim. > I, personally, have never seen a 50-100 post thread in this ng > bitching at Papy for no savegame in GPL. If you have, maybe > you could find me a Deja News link. > > [shrug]

Hmmm, got me curious now. I thought I remembered a bitch-a-thon at the time GPL was released in regards to this lack of a feature. But it's been a while, I may be mistaken. Maybe I'm recalling the N2 release instead. :-/ Not really *that* important, but i'm really wondering now... -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes

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>Peter Ives wrote: >> I would happily vote on your question Eldred, but at the moment some >> other, more important, life related issues have come up so I'll pass at >> the moment and maybe answer this next time around. You do understand >of >> course. <g> > > >Gee, your newsreader has a save-thread feature? <VBG> >

Well... once it was patched. :) -- Peter Ives - (AKA Ivington) Remove ALL_STRESS before replying No person's opinions can be said to be more correct than another's, because each is the sole judge of his or her own experience.

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 07:00:12 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Are you going to buy it? If so, why? > Yes, because I like the driving model, graphics etc. That doesn't mean I can't post my displeasure at the lack of a feature I would *really* like. -- Nos

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 11:22:44 -0500, rrevved <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>I agree, Chuck. I feel the same way. > >What is hard for me to agree with are those who hammer Hasbro >for something they never mention as lacking in their favorite sim. >I, personally, have never seen a 50-100 post thread in this ng >bitching at Papy for no savegame in GPL. If you have, maybe >you could find me a Deja News link. > >[shrug] >

I've commented about it a long time ago. I also lambasted EA for not having one in F12K. But, I'm a whiner so it is expected of me. -- Nos

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 09:08:03 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: >I hope that wasn't directed at me or I'm going to have to start with >the aggro again. Go ahead. Maybe it was directed at you, maybe not. Since you are doing nothing but being aggravating for your own entertainment (by your earlier admission) , I place an appropriate amount of stock in your comments and will ignore what you say as essentially verbal masturbation. ~daxe

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 11:56:02 GMT, [email hidden] wrote: > Well, I have one last thing to say to you all. >Fuck you! Ah, that feels better. :-) like I said..saying things just to make yourself feel good...verbal masturbation. ~daxe

On 25 Aug 2000 22:20:05 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >I never said there was anything wrong with stating it. I even *agreed* with >him. I'm ONLY referring to his methods, that's all. YOU DON'T LIKE MY METHODS??? YOU GOT A PROBLEM WITH MY MEHTODS?? WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH MY METHODS?? YOU'RE JUST ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE PUSSIES FROM R.A.S. I DON'T GIVE A RATS ASS WHAT YOU OR ANY OTHER PUSSY IN HERE THINKS. I WAN'T A SAVE GAME FEATURE AND I WANT IT NOW!!! :-) -- Nos

[email hidden] wrote:

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> > On 25 Aug 2000 22:20:05 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus > spoke: > > >I never said there was anything wrong with stating it. I even *agreed* with > >him. I'm ONLY referring to his methods, that's all. > > YOU DON'T LIKE MY METHODS??? YOU GOT A PROBLEM WITH MY MEHTODS?? WHAT > THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH MY METHODS?? YOU'RE JUST ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE > PUSSIES FROM R.A.S. I DON'T GIVE A RATS ASS WHAT YOU OR ANY OTHER > PUSSY IN HERE THINKS. I WAN'T A SAVE GAME FEATURE AND I WANT IT NOW!!! > :-)

Sounds like a dropout from the Greg Cisko School of Charm to me. ;-) -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 23:42:45 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Sounds like a dropout from the Greg Cisko School of Charm to me. ;-) Who the hell are you? -- Nos

In article <uMLp5.18714$[email hidden]>, <[email hidden]> writes:

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>* d. You use the Pause Key. Beat the kid. Pet the cat. Get back to the >race. > > >Surely I'm not the first person to think about the possibility of >pausing the game, completing other business, and continuing afterwards. >

No, I've mentioned that before. For some, it's not a choice they want to make... Since I have no problem with pausing a game(overnight if need be), sometimes I think differently about it than others... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes: >>Yeah, what's your point???<g> > >I think he is saying that if you did have a wife/girlfriend you would >be wishing you didn't because they cut into your game/computer time >drastically. My girlfriend absolutely hated my computer. Needless to >say she is no longer my girlfriend. :-) You're kidding - you lost your girlfriend over COMPUTERS??? Let's just say I wouldn't have made the same choice...<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <39a80b26.80760055@news>, [email hidden] (Pierre Legrand) writes:

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>hehe...I am lucky cause while I was flying 5 hours a day my then >girlfriend now wifey and mom to my most wonderful daughter was in Grad >school studying hard. So for about 2 years I had it all...with the >birth of the daughter I have less time for gaming but am smiling even >more... > >The point being I have significant amounts of disposable income...and >catering to the likes of me is a wise thing since I fairly >representative of the people buying Sims. >

Must be nice(re: disposable income)...<g> >I like savegames....life has alot more reasons to call my name for >immediate attention then it did 3.5 years ago. And those calls are >sometimes important enough that I cannot get back to the sim for days. > >Besides all that the most pitiful thing is that the lack of a savegame >is some limp dicks version of enhancing gameplay....You already SAID that... :) Besides, do any of us know how hard that is to PUT in a game? I mean, it can't be easy saving all that info on all the cars...? >>Hehe... I dunno, I'd rather have a wife or girlfriend than to have time on >>weekends for games... :) > -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On 25 Aug 2000 22:20:05 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) wrote: >Hehe... I dunno, I'd rather have a wife or girlfriend than to have time on >weekends for games... :) Only single guys can say something like that :) Andre >Eldred

In article <[email hidden]>, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> writes: >>Hehe... I dunno, I'd rather have a wife or girlfriend than to have time on >>weekends for games... :) > >Only single guys can say something like that :) > >Andre Yeah, what's your point???<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes:

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>>I never said there was anything wrong with stating it. I even *agreed* with >>him. I'm ONLY referring to his methods, that's all. > >YOU DON'T LIKE MY METHODS??? YOU GOT A PROBLEM WITH MY MEHTODS?? WHAT >THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH MY METHODS?? YOU'RE JUST ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE >PUSSIES FROM R.A.S. I DON'T GIVE A RATS ASS WHAT YOU OR ANY OTHER >PUSSY IN HERE THINKS. I WAN'T A SAVE GAME FEATURE AND I WANT IT NOW!!! >:-)

Dude, de-caf...<g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes: >I've commented about it a long time ago. I also lambasted EA for not >having one in F12K. But, I'm a whiner so it is expected of me. >-- >Nos > Well, at least you're consistent... <g> F1 2K doesn't have a savegame either? I didn't realize that. Good to know. So what racing games DO have a save game?(besides N2/N3) Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes:

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>rrevved wrote: >> >> I agree, Chuck. I feel the same way. >> >> What is hard for me to agree with are those who hammer Hasbro >> for something they never mention as lacking in their favorite sim. >> I, personally, have never seen a 50-100 post thread in this ng >> bitching at Papy for no savegame in GPL. If you have, maybe >> you could find me a Deja News link. >> >> [shrug] > > >Hmmm, got me curious now. I thought I remembered a bitch-a-thon at the >time GPL was released in regards to this lack of a feature. But it's >been a while, I may be mistaken. Maybe I'm recalling the N2 release >instead. :-/ Not really *that* important, but i'm really wondering >now...

Sure, it was discussed - even bitched about. But it was nowhere NEAR the fallout like this... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Peter Ives <[email hidden]> writes:

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>>Whatever... I'm sure the listening audience sees it differently. >>Quick poll - was Nos whining(yes/no)? <g> >> >>Eldred votes yes... > >I would happily vote on your question Eldred, but at the moment some >other, more important, life related issues have come up so I'll pass at >the moment and maybe answer this next time around. You do understand of >course. <g>

All right, all right...very FUNNY... <g> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +51.31 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

[email hidden] wrote:

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> > On Fri, 25 Aug 2000 23:42:45 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> > thus spoke: > > >Sounds like a dropout from the Greg Cisko School of Charm to me. ;-) > > Who the hell are you? > -- > Nos

I rest my case. :-)) -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

On 26 Aug 2000 03:35:49 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >Well, at least you're consistent... <g> >F1 2K doesn't have a savegame either? I didn't realize that. Good to know. >So what racing games DO have a save game?(besides N2/N3) Not many. GP2/3 and the Ubisoft F1 sims. And I think ICR2, but haven't played that in a looong time so can't say for sure. -- Nos

On 26 Aug 2000 03:35:49 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >Yeah, what's your point???<g> I think he is saying that if you did have a wife/girlfriend you would be wishing you didn't because they cut into your game/computer time drastically. My girlfriend absolutely hated my computer. Needless to say she is no longer my girlfriend. :-) -- Nos

On Sat, 26 Aug 2000 05:17:33 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I rest my case. :-)) Only thing is that it's Greg who is my underling and not the other way around. I trained him over in the flight-sim group a long time ago. :-) -- Nos

No you can't save a race in SCGT. "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <2yko5.179$[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >I wonder if that's why they included the 2x and 4x tire wear and fuel > >useage, to try and make up somewhat for the save game feature theyprobably > >knew they would not be able to implement? > > Can you save in SCGT? I don't remember, but I know that you can set the2x and

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> 3x for fuel and tire wear... > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +51.31 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On 26 Aug 2000 03:35:49 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus > spoke: > > > >Well, at least you're consistent... <g> > >F1 2K doesn't have a savegame either? I didn't realize that. Good toknow. > >So what racing games DO have a save game?(besides N2/N3) > > Not many. GP2/3 and the Ubisoft F1 sims. And I think ICR2, but haven't > played that in a looong time so can't say for sure. > -- > Nos Lol, I dusted off and installed ICR2 last night , it was amazing how bad the graphics looked, I remember vividly at the time it came out the graphics seemed awesome in 640x480. And yes, it had a save game feature. Both ICR2 and N1 did a great job with the save game feature, imho it was better in both of those than in N2, perhaps because it was added later in N2 as a patch. -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566

Not sure if I would say it isnt for me....I would say that the simple addition of a savegame then allows me to take advantage of the very thing that makes Nascar so compelling in RLtm, full race strategy. Without that I am left with the option of running abreviated races...and all of that is because some limp dick thought the gameplay would be enhanced by the ommission of a savegame....aaaarrrrgggghhhh....I guess they havent been around for my CHOICES speeches on the Flight sim group. PAPA DOC >Watkins Glen and Sears Point are very cool in NH, but if you >don't like ovals being the majority of the tracks in a sim, >then NH isn't the sim for you. > Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

hehe...I am lucky cause while I was flying 5 hours a day my then girlfriend now wifey and mom to my most wonderful daughter was in Grad school studying hard. So for about 2 years I had it all...with the birth of the daughter I have less time for gaming but am smiling even more... The point being I have significant amounts of disposable income...and catering to the likes of me is a wise thing since I fairly representative of the people buying Sims. I like savegames....life has alot more reasons to call my name for immediate attention then it did 3.5 years ago. And those calls are sometimes important enough that I cannot get back to the sim for days. Besides all that the most pitiful thing is that the lack of a savegame is some limp dicks version of enhancing gameplay.... PAPA DOC

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>Hehe... I dunno, I'd rather have a wife or girlfriend than to have time on >weekends for games... :) > >Eldred >-- >Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 >Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett >GPL hcp. +51.31 > >Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you >with experience... >Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand Voodoo 5 vs Geforce Shootout http://www.papadoc.net/Voodoo_vs_Geforce2.htm Flanker Target Grand Prix Legends Crash Test Dummy Aim-120 Propellent Addict Infamous Pink Flamingo Pilot...<VBG> Rants, Bullshit and Help Guides availible at www.papadoc.net

Do like I did, get the wife/girlfriend involved in computers, have 2 side by side, and introduce her to websites such as Ebay. Now I have all the puter time I want :) Warning: Introducing said wife/girlfriend to Ebay could be quite dangerous, I only used it above as an example :) -- Don Burnette Dburn in N3 and Legends ICQ# 74084566 "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] writes: > > >>Yeah, what's your point???<g> > > > >I think he is saying that if you did have a wife/girlfriend you would > >be wishing you didn't because they cut into your game/computer time > >drastically. My girlfriend absolutely hated my computer. Needless to > >say she is no longer my girlfriend. :-) > > You're kidding - you lost your girlfriend over COMPUTERS??? Let's just say I > wouldn't have made the same choice...<g> > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +51.31 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On 26 Aug 2000 18:46:32 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >You're kidding - you lost your girlfriend over COMPUTERS??? Let's just say I >wouldn't have made the same choice...<g> Sort of. I ws being neglectful because I spent to much time on the computer so she strayed. Sex is highly over rated anyway. :-) -- Nos

On Sat, 26 Aug 2000 19:11:23 GMT, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >Do like I did, get the wife/girlfriend involved in computers, have 2 side by >side, and introduce her to websites such as Ebay. Now I have all the puter >time I want :) > >Warning: Introducing said wife/girlfriend to Ebay could be quite dangerous, >I only used it above as an example :) Maybe a copy of this game I saw called Wallstreet Tycoon would be better. What's interesting about this game is that it connects to the internet and gets all the stockmarket data and enters it into the game. So in essence you are investing in real stocks, but not using real money. Now if she does well and starts winning the game then start investing real money in the stocks you are winning on and see if she can make some money at it. I see a lot of rip offs on Ebay. Things selling for more than you can buy them new for. -- Nos

On 26 Aug 2000 22:45:10 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) thus spoke: >Besides, do any of us know how hard that is to PUT in a game? I mean, it can't >be easy saving all that info on all the cars...? Yes, it must be quite difficult, but it can be done, therefore; it should be done. But, at least NH has 2x/4x wear etc. so even on a 50 lap race you will still need to refuel and maybe change the tires. -- Nos