Re: Watkins Glen: new and old?

isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of different parts of the track? "Barton Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> MichaelJP wrote: > > > > Has anyone got a link to some Watkins Glen maps showing old and new > > configurations? I know there have been various ones over the years. > > Haven't got any links, but I have track maps I can scan if you're > interested ... from the 'round the houses version used first in 1948, > through the first 2.35 mi. purpose-built circuit, through all that > circuit's various changes until the end of its GP life in 1980. > > Speaking of which -- has any sim ever modeled the "Anvil" at the Glen -- > the extension off the old "Loop" that the NASCAR guys don't use (way too > tight fer them bombs -- though the TransAm cars never seemed to have a > problem with it)? > > BB

lito <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Very curious, I was doing exactly the same search and even > compared the track of GPL with an actual map. With the > information in www.forix.com you could see both previous > configs, but one question surges from the 71-80 series > about that chicane on the esses? I just couldn�t imagine it > > lito

The chicane in the esses was ain reaction to the death of Francois Cevert and ditched soon after the France family purchased the Glen. Track map and history: http://www.silhouet.com/motorsport/tracks/watkins.html -- don New Programmes for the Converted GPL Tracks http://www.ianparker1.plus.com/gpl/bapom/

Has anyone got a link to some Watkins Glen maps showing old and new configurations? I know there have been various ones over the years. Thanks, - Michael

MichaelJP wrote: > > Has anyone got a link to some Watkins Glen maps showing old and new > configurations? I know there have been various ones over the years. Haven't got any links, but I have track maps I can scan if you're interested ... from the 'round the houses version used first in 1948, through the first 2.35 mi. purpose-built circuit, through all that circuit's various changes until the end of its GP life in 1980. Speaking of which -- has any sim ever modeled the "Anvil" at the Glen -- the extension off the old "Loop" that the NASCAR guys don't use (way too tight fer them bombs -- though the TransAm cars never seemed to have a problem with it)? BB

Very curious, I was doing exactly the same search and even compared the track of GPL with an actual map. With the information in www.forix.com you could see both previous configs, but one question surges from the 71-80 series about that chicane on the esses? I just couldn�t imagine it lito * Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping. Smart is Beautiful

www.forix.com shows two maps (1961-70, 1971-1980) of the GP circuit. http://www.theglen.com has a history page but no maps that I could find. Tony Whitley MichaelJP <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > Has anyone got a link to some Watkins Glen maps showing old and new > configurations? I know there have been various ones over the years. > > Thanks, > > - Michael

lito wrote: > about that chicane on the esses? I just couldn�t imagine it I've got some of my own pix of it somewhere, if I can ever find them... BB

here is the link at the map on forix with the track with a chicane in the middle of the esses http://www.forix.com/asp/ci.asp?z=0&k=0&l=0&r=7111&c=0 lito * Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping. Smart is Beautiful

Mark Stahl wrote: > > isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of different parts of > the track? Same part -- for some reason, in the early days, right after it was added (1971), it was generally referred to as the anvil. Since NASCAR bought the joint, it's been called the boot. Since I am very old, I call it the anvil. Having been privileged to have gotten a highly-illegal ride at speed around the thing in a full-comp 1964 Porsche Super C roadster, I have to say that from the old loop through the uphill from the anvil to where it rejoins the original track is my favorite part of the Glen -- now THERE'S a rush! BB

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > Haven't got any links, but I have track maps I can scan if you're > interested ... from the 'round the houses version used first in 1948, > through the first 2.35 mi. purpose-built circuit, through all that > circuit's various changes until the end of its GP life in 1980. Thanks for the offer - the other links had maps on though. I didn't realise there was a round the houses version. - Michael

I went by the track last week -- we were coming across NY on the turnpike and took a side trip down Seneca Lake. We couldn't get into the track, but we were able to see parts of it from high points on the north side and from a side road that goes down the west side. From the latter we could see Formula Fords come down the hill to turn into the anvil, and then see them again when they reappeared going north. Until then I hadn't been sure the anvil section was still in use. There were a whole line of transporters going into the track for a sportscar 6-hour race the following weekend (that would have been last weekend). Unfortunately our vacation plans made it impossible to stay there until the weekend. Maybe another year. But, it was great to see the track still alive. I went to the last GP there in 1980, and at that time the track's future looked very grim. We knew at the time that we were seeing the last F1 race there. Dave Wilson In article <[email hidden]>, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: > Mark Stahl wrote: > > > > isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of differentparts of

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> > the track? > > Same part -- for some reason, in the early days, right after it was > added (1971), it was generally referred to as the anvil. Since NASCAR > bought the joint, it's been called the boot. > > Since I am very old, I call it the anvil. Having been privileged to

have > gotten a highly-illegal ride at speed around the thing in a full-comp > 1964 Porsche Super C roadster, I have to say that from the old loop > through the uphill from the anvil to where it rejoins the originaltrack > is my favorite part of the Glen -- now THERE'S a rush! > > BB > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

> Mark Stahl wrote: > > > > isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of different partsof > > the track? >Barton Brown responded... > Same part -- for some reason, in the early days, right after it was > added (1971), it was generally referred to as the anvil. Since NASCAR > bought the joint, it's been called the boot. > It was called "The Boot" when we were there for a 6-hour endurance race and the CanAm races in '71 or '72. We watched most of the CanAm from the hill overlooking the Boot. It was actually a pretty cool spot back then, you could see the very end of the backstretch, catch them coming out of Turn 5 down the hill and watch them all the way to the beginning of the frontstretch. Even if they used it now, tree growth has obscured a good portion of what you could see then. BTW, that area of the hill is now unreserved camping for the Winston Cup race weekend, and during that weekend they actually do use the Boot --- that's where the helicopter lands ;-)

Damn WardsBro, you are everywhere!!! 7E "Don Jennings" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8prd15$dpdab$[email hidden]... > > Mark Stahl wrote: > > > > > > isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of differentparts

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> of > > > the track? > > > Barton Brown responded... > > Same part -- for some reason, in the early days, right after it was > > added (1971), it was generally referred to as the anvil. Since NASCAR > > bought the joint, it's been called the boot. > > > > It was called "The Boot" when we were there for a 6-hour endurance race

and

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> the CanAm races in '71 or '72. We watched most of the CanAm from the hill > overlooking the Boot. It was actually a pretty cool spot back then, you > could see the very end of the backstretch, catch them coming out of Turn 5 > down the hill and watch them all the way to the beginning of the > frontstretch. Even if they used it now, tree growth has obscured a good > portion of what you could see then. BTW, that area of the hill is now > unreserved camping for the Winston Cup race weekend, and during that

weekend > they actually do use the Boot --- that's where the helicopter lands ;-) > >

I had to ask my dad who has been going to the Glen for 52 years (racing and flagging)... The Boot has never been called "the Anvil"!! Speaking of NASCAR, I went to the 96(?) nascar race there. Those cars sound more like loud chainsaws then they do race cars. The shear volumm will blow your ear drums but that's it. The "Big Boy's" (what we used to call the vetts, mustangs, ect.. just before they were classified as GT1,2,3,ect... were not only as loud but each compression coming out of the exhaust would push you over if you were standing 100 feet or more off the track. any time a car back fired sounded like one hell of a thunder boom echoing through out the track. NASCAR race cars may have more power then the old cars but they don't sound powerful. Don Jennings wrote in message <8prd15$dpdab$[email hidden]>... >> Mark Stahl wrote: >> > >> > isn't that part called "the boot"? or are we thinking of differentparts

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>of >> > the track? >> >Barton Brown responded... >> Same part -- for some reason, in the early days, right after it was >> added (1971), it was generally referred to as the anvil. Since NASCAR >> bought the joint, it's been called the boot. >> > >It was called "The Boot" when we were there for a 6-hour endurance race and >the CanAm races in '71 or '72. We watched most of the CanAm from the hill >overlooking the Boot. It was actually a pretty cool spot back then, you >could see the very end of the backstretch, catch them coming out of Turn 5 >down the hill and watch them all the way to the beginning of the >frontstretch. Even if they used it now, tree growth has obscured a good >portion of what you could see then. BTW, that area of the hill is now >unreserved camping for the Winston Cup race weekend, and during that

weekend >they actually do use the Boot --- that's where the helicopter lands ;-) > >

The "Anvil" or "Boot" is still used for sports car racing... BB

Well, they say father knows best, but even the Glen itself, in their promotional material, has referred to "the extension" (as it was officially named in 1971) as the anvil. I don't have 52 years of Glen participation, only a mere 40, but I was certainly there when the extension was built. Many vintage racers still refer to it as "The Anvil" (see Team.net "Vintage Racing" newsgroup). As for that NASCAR sound -- I don't know... Before they fenced it off and made it unavailable, I used to sit on the big cement drainpipe on the infield side of the track, just a few dozen yards up the Esses (roughly across from where the Scheckter Chicane used to be), and when the USRRC 427 Cobras used to power up the hill, the drainpipe would vibrate and make your willy tingle -- they certainly were wonderfully loud. Having had the good fortune to snag some manufacturers' passes for the '97 Brickyard 400, I was able to stand cheek by jowl with several Cup cars while they were being fired up, and spent the first 40 laps of the race in Robby Gordon's pit -- them babies up close are *very* loud! Different sort of sound from the big-inch Cobras and Corvettes, but damned loud, nonetheless. For sheer ear-splitting racket, though, there's absolutely NOTHING like a top fueler or funny car -- the greatest noise on earth, IMHO. BB Mike Barlow wrote: > > I had to ask my dad who has been going to the Glen for 52 years (racing > and flagging)... The Boot has never been called "the Anvil"!!�