This is why the PS2/Xbox will be the better beast.

Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people like us that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see some movies of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. Folks, this is what I'm saying. We have top of the line equipment, some of us with 1ghz systems, and these folks still havent seen perfect gameplay. The PS2 title of NASCAR is undescribable...... Sparks,smoke detail FAR surpassing HEAT in every aspect. No joke here. And guess what. It looks like the title is running WAY over 60fps....... I know comparing a computer to a PS2 is like comparing a pine cone to a turd. They just aren't the same. But were sitting here with $2,000 - $3,000 systems while the PS2 will be going for $299.00 or $399.00 (can't recall) and beleive me when you see the movies of NASCAR for the PS2 you'll be saying like me," What the HELL"! And multi-player will crush over what were doing now. With broadband in the PS2 (add-on) and XBox, can you imagine what the on-line gameplay will be like? I can't wait........ Beeing 29 and a simmer for years, I've NEVER seen a console come close to a 'puter, but guess what. The time is here with PS2 and X. And even more mind boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concrete thing. And the specs are gut-wrenching...... I have been admiditly very biased (like you may be ;) over a computer for simms, but its time for me to step down and realize that the next 2 consoles (PS2 / XBox) WILL be surpasing us in gameplay. Period. Off to work I go........ -- ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ Tony Gaylord / WA State, USA - [email hidden] http://www.CART.com http://www.SeventhGear.com http://www.PaulTracy.com (Who's the man!!) In Memory of : #99 Greg Moore - You will be missed Visit the Greg Moore Foundation - http://www.GregMoore.com

Consoles=Games PCs=Sims You make compromises on a console when it comes to background calculations and processing, read "physics". The console has all sorts of onboard graphics hardware taking care of the pretty pictures, but their CPUs are incapable of processing physics on the level of GPL at full frames. BTW, what kind of system are you running? NHeat at 40fps on: P3 800@920MHz 256MB SDRAM GeForce2 GTS 64MB clocked to 210/400MHz SBLive! Value Full Install I run with ALL detail at the highest resolution and have yet to see a frame stutter. I'm not a big NASCAR fan, so I haven't played it much, but I was fairly impressed with the overall performance. The above rig cost me much less than $2000 including NIC and IBM 30GB ATA/100 HDD. In article <wxTr5.44111$[email hidden]>, "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with peoplelike us > that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. > > Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see somemovies > of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. > Folks, this is what I'm saying. We have top of the line equipment,some of > us with 1ghz systems, and these folks still havent seen perfectgameplay. > > The PS2 title of NASCAR is undescribable...... Sparks,smoke detail FAR > surpassing HEAT in every aspect. No joke here. And guess what. Itlooks like > the title is running WAY over 60fps....... > I know comparing a computer to a PS2 is like comparing a pine cone toa > turd. They just aren't the same. But were sitting here with $2,000 -$3,000 > systems while the PS2 will be going for $299.00 or $399.00 (can'trecall) > and beleive me when you see the movies of NASCAR for the PS2 you'll be > saying like me," What the HELL"! > > And multi-player will crush over what were doing now. With broadbandin the > PS2 (add-on) and XBox, can you imagine what the on-line gameplay willbe > like? I can't wait........ > > Beeing 29 and a simmer for years, I've NEVER seen a console comeclose to a > 'puter, but guess what. The time is here with PS2 and X. And evenmore mind > boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concretething. And > the specs are gut-wrenching...... > > I have been admiditly very biased (like you may be ;) over a computerfor > simms, but its time for me to step down and realize that the next 2consoles

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> (PS2 / XBox) WILL be surpasing us in gameplay. Period. > > Off to work I go........ > > -- > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > Tony Gaylord / WA State, USA - [email hidden] > http://www.CART.com > http://www.SeventhGear.com > http://www.PaulTracy.com (Who's the man!!) > > In Memory of : #99 Greg Moore - You will be missed > Visit the Greg Moore Foundation - http://www.GregMoore.com > >

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Tony Gaylord wrote: > > Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people like us > that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. > > Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see some movies > of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. <Snipped, spit on & tossed in the toilet> What a load of sh!t this is! -- Chuck Kandler A man is no less a Slave just because he is allowed to choose a new Master every four years. Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

Your the same putz looking for warez shit, piss off asshole. -- Joe Marques Please remove "NO SPAM" to e-mail me. "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:wxTr5.44111$[email hidden]... > > Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people like us > that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. > > Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see some movies > of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. > Folks, this is what I'm saying. We have top of the line equipment, some of > us with 1ghz systems, and these folks still havent seen perfect gameplay. > > The PS2 title of NASCAR is undescribable...... Sparks,smoke detail FAR > surpassing HEAT in every aspect. No joke here. And guess what. It looks like > the title is running WAY over 60fps....... > I know comparing a computer to a PS2 is like comparing a pine cone to a > turd. They just aren't the same. But were sitting here with $2,000 - $3,000 > systems while the PS2 will be going for $299.00 or $399.00 (can't recall) > and beleive me when you see the movies of NASCAR for the PS2 you'll be > saying like me," What the HELL"! > > And multi-player will crush over what were doing now. With broadband in the > PS2 (add-on) and XBox, can you imagine what the on-line gameplay will be > like? I can't wait........ > > Beeing 29 and a simmer for years, I've NEVER seen a console come close to a > 'puter, but guess what. The time is here with PS2 and X. And even more mind > boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concrete thing. And > the specs are gut-wrenching...... > > I have been admiditly very biased (like you may be ;) over a computer for > simms, but its time for me to step down and realize that the next 2 consoles > (PS2 / XBox) WILL be surpasing us in gameplay. Period. > > Off to work I go........ > > > -- > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > Tony Gaylord / WA State, USA - [email hidden] > http://www.CART.com > http://www.SeventhGear.com > http://www.PaulTracy.com (Who's the man!!) > > In Memory of : #99 Greg Moore - You will be missed > Visit the Greg Moore Foundation - http://www.GregMoore.com > > >

hes right...also.. DTR sprints for the PS2 is gonna blow the computer version away............period. get ready to pull your foot out of your ass. "Joe Marques" <Joe"NO_SPAM"[email hidden]> wrote in message news:W1Zr5.36619$[email hidden]...

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> Your the same putz looking for warez shit, piss off asshole. > > -- > Joe Marques > > Please remove "NO SPAM" to e-mail me. > "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:wxTr5.44111$[email hidden]... > > > > Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people

like

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> us > > that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. > > > > Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see some > movies > > of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. > > Folks, this is what I'm saying. We have top of the line equipment, some

of > > us with 1ghz systems, and these folks still havent seen perfectgameplay.

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> > > > The PS2 title of NASCAR is undescribable...... Sparks,smoke detail FAR > > surpassing HEAT in every aspect. No joke here. And guess what. It looks > like > > the title is running WAY over 60fps....... > > I know comparing a computer to a PS2 is like comparing a pine cone to a > > turd. They just aren't the same. But were sitting here with $2,000 - > $3,000 > > systems while the PS2 will be going for $299.00 or $399.00 (can't

recall)

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> > and beleive me when you see the movies of NASCAR for the PS2 you'll be > > saying like me," What the HELL"! > > > > And multi-player will crush over what were doing now. With broadband in > the > > PS2 (add-on) and XBox, can you imagine what the on-line gameplay will be > > like? I can't wait........ > > > > Beeing 29 and a simmer for years, I've NEVER seen a console come close

to > a > > 'puter, but guess what. The time is here with PS2 and X. And even more > mind > > boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concrete thing.And > > the specs are gut-wrenching...... > > > > I have been admiditly very biased (like you may be ;) over a computerfor

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> > simms, but its time for me to step down and realize that the next 2 > consoles > > (PS2 / XBox) WILL be surpasing us in gameplay. Period. > > > > Off to work I go........ > > > > > > -- > > > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > > Tony Gaylord / WA State, USA - [email hidden] > > http://www.CART.com > > http://www.SeventhGear.com > > http://www.PaulTracy.com (Who's the man!!) > > > > In Memory of : #99 Greg Moore - You will be missed > > Visit the Greg Moore Foundation - http://www.GregMoore.com > > > > > > > >

Are you forgetting that the PS2 and the X-Box don't use a resolution higher than 640x480? The consoles support higher resolutions, but unfortunately TV's don't. If someone released a game that ran at only 640x480 on the PC, people would freak. Just look at all the Voodoo 3 owners complaining that they couldn't run the Nascar Heat demo in 1024x768!! The other aspect to consider are the physics or lack thereof. If eye candy is all that matters, F1WGP has some of the prettiest graphics I've ever seen on an arcade racer. Just remember to run it at 640x480 and preferably interlaced to get that console-style feel! Michael M "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:wxTr5.44111$[email hidden]... > > Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people likeus > that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. > > Speaking of, I hate to break this to everyone, but I got to see somemovies > of the NASCAR sim for the PS2, and I'm still drooooolin. > Folks, this is what I'm saying. We have top of the line equipment, some of > us with 1ghz systems, and these folks still havent seen perfect gameplay. > > The PS2 title of NASCAR is undescribable...... Sparks,smoke detail FAR > surpassing HEAT in every aspect. No joke here. And guess what. It lookslike > the title is running WAY over 60fps....... > I know comparing a computer to a PS2 is like comparing a pine cone to a > turd. They just aren't the same. But were sitting here with $2,000 -$3,000 > systems while the PS2 will be going for $299.00 or $399.00 (can't recall) > and beleive me when you see the movies of NASCAR for the PS2 you'll be > saying like me," What the HELL"! > > And multi-player will crush over what were doing now. With broadband inthe > PS2 (add-on) and XBox, can you imagine what the on-line gameplay will be > like? I can't wait........ > > Beeing 29 and a simmer for years, I've NEVER seen a console come close toa > 'puter, but guess what. The time is here with PS2 and X. And even moremind > boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concrete thing. And > the specs are gut-wrenching...... > > I have been admiditly very biased (like you may be ;) over a computer for > simms, but its time for me to step down and realize that the next 2consoles

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> (PS2 / XBox) WILL be surpasing us in gameplay. Period. > > Off to work I go........ > > > -- > > ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ > Tony Gaylord / WA State, USA - [email hidden] > http://www.CART.com > http://www.SeventhGear.com > http://www.PaulTracy.com (Who's the man!!) > > In Memory of : #99 Greg Moore - You will be missed > Visit the Greg Moore Foundation - http://www.GregMoore.com > > >

On Fri, 01 Sep 2000 19:34:52 GMT, "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >And even more mind >boggling is that the XBOX is NOT just Vaporware, its a concrete thing. And >the specs are gut-wrenching...... Gut wrenching specs? My computer already surpasses those specs. -- J.H.

I already have my preorder in for a PS2, and as soon as the Xbox is available I fully intend to buy one. It's not like you have to choose sides and either buy a PC or buy a console. At least for the next year or so consoles will have equal or better graphics than even high end PC's. Also, even a lowly Sega dreamcast's main cpu is more powerful than the fastest pentiums that were available when GPL came out, and consequently there is no hardware limitations preventing even that console from creating a version of GPL that would be superior to the current PC version. Arcade racers will dominate the console market simply due to marketing considerations, not because the hardware is not fast enough. There will be racing sims on all of these next generation consoles , you can be sure. Now if you define sims as only games as faithful as GPL, then you may be waiting for awhile,just as we are waiting for GPL2 on the PC. But, if your definition of a sim is something along the lines of Nascar Heat, GP3, F12000, etc. , then there are already sims coming out which will be in their league with respect to physics models, and even superior with respect to graphics. SegaGT, Ferrari F355, Gran tourismo 2000, are just the beginning. The main CPU in the Dreamcast is capable of far more than just eye candy, a 200 MHZ RISC in a stable dedicated console system is easily superior to what I have seen from my 600 MHZ pentium 3, in part because the programmers can utilize the system to its fullest since they dont have to compromise for the variety of hardware that you find in the PC world. Check out NBA2k or NFL2K for the dreamcast, they easily vanquish last years madden in most respects, and a sim racer is definitely not beyond the bounds of what this hardware could produce, it's just a matter of time and a sufficiently large audience for that kind of game on a given console. Then consider that the Xbox will essentially be a PC with a state of the art Nvidea 3d accelerator and(750MHZ Pentium 3), why would it not be able to reproduce a GPL level sim ? If you can afford it, buy a next generation console as well as your PC, and enjoy the great games that will be out on the various platforms. Why be partisan and limit all of the great fun games that you could be playing. These are not Atari 2600's , they are equal to the finest PC's available today, and superior in many ways. They just need enough sim racing lovers to buy them , and the GPL level or better Sims will follow. If Papyrus believes that there is sufficient demand for true racing sims on these new consoles, they will follow the money trail, along with other companies. Force feedback wheels and other state of the art PC peripherals are well within the hardware capabilities of a PS2, nintendo gamecube, or an Xbox.

Rod Smelser wrote: > > hes right...also.. DTR sprints for the PS2 is gonna blow the computer > version away............period. > get ready to pull your foot out of your ass. Let's just hit a couple highlights here. Unaccelerated 640x480 graphics, dumbed down physics engines, no ability to tweak or modify your game. Just on the last one alone, they can forget it. I want to tweak games to be *my way*, not how some suit decides it'll get released. There's no competition to be had. And the Xbox is so far behind the technology curve, it's already obsolete & it's not even released yet! [shrug] Whatever. Have yourselves a real blast... -- Chuck Kandler Windows--computing for the Unwashed Masses Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

On Sat, 02 Sep 2000 13:56:08 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>Let's just hit a couple highlights here. Unaccelerated 640x480 >graphics, dumbed down physics engines, no ability to tweak or modify >your game. Just on the last one alone, they can forget it. I want to >tweak games to be *my way*, not how some suit decides it'll get >released. There's no competition to be had. And the Xbox is so far >behind the technology curve, it's already obsolete & it's not even >released yet! > >[shrug] > >Whatever. Have yourselves a real blast...

I agree with what you say, except the unaccelerated graphics bit. Todays console systems use accelerated graphics chips too. -- J.H.

Loosay2 wrote: > Force feedback wheels and other state of the art PC peripherals are > well within the hardware capabilities of a PS2, nintendo gamecube, or an Xbox. Excellent and thoughtful post. I have a 1stGen PSX and I have to agree, having seen the specs for PS2/Xbox, that there's no reason the consoles, with ALL their power and systems dedicated to ONE standardized application format, won't be better in almost every way than PC-based gaming systems, with their many concessions to compatibility and other processing tasks. I think the TV-Raster limitation is also a moot point, for many reasons, technical and aesthetic, but that's a very subjective area that people will have to decide for themselves (I'm half-blind even with glasses on, so I'm a lousy judge of that stuff). I DO think LED wraparound goggles are the way to go, not only for the immersive experience, but also because it takes so little graphics power to generate a really high-res image on such a small "screen". As for Force-Feedback -- wasn't that pioneered by PSX, and available on consoles long before PC games and peripherals incorporated it? Or am I wrong again? BB

On Fri, 01 Sep 2000 19:34:52 GMT, "Tony Gaylord" <[email hidden]> wrote: > >Not bashing Hasbro,(HEAT) but it is a -ucking shame that with people like us >that have hig-end systems, STILL can't get absolute Nirvana gameplay. PS2, Dreamcast, N64 et al are all about gaming and pretty graphics. PC Games are more about sims and realism (graphics taking a back seat for really good sims). It will probably be another 2-3 years before we get a sim as good as GPL :(((( And you'll probably never see a sim as good as GPL for a console system. ----------- http://surf.to/speedyfast26

"Barton Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I DO think LED wraparound goggles > are the way to go, not only for the immersive experience, but also > because it takes so little graphics power to generate a really high-res > image on such a small "screen". I agree with that 110%. I've been saying that for a long time now and have no idea why that technology hasn't been taken advantage of for racing sims. -- Take care, Dave Boothe ***************************************************** Edward Jones Investments #37 Ford Taurus Proud member of Ground Zero Motorsports The Pro Series http://www.theproseries.com OSCAR http://www.awtech.net/oscar/