Re: PDPI L4 Card...

http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm Cheers, Schumi "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game cards? I > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seem tobe > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > Dave C. > >

You can read my review on the L4, and a detailed technical breakdown on how it works (and why the standard gameport doesn't). It easily outperforms all current USB implementations and is more stable. Check it out at: www.gplonline.com review is in the Review Section..... and the technical papers are in Tech Talk (under standard gameport). There are no win2k drivers (NT kernel base) so it will not work on an NT system. Follow installation instructions STEP-BY-STEP and you'll be driving more accurately than before 2X. Cheers, Schumi BTW... I run a TSW F99 and the L4 combined. I have had the opportunity to try almost every wheel on the market, and I still keep coming back to the TSW/L4 combo everytime. Although.... the TSW needs the L4 to really shine. "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jVED5.1284$[email hidden]... > Thanks Schumi...Are you currently using one? I just picked up a TSW and I > hear these cards are excellent. I also heard there can be someinstallation > problems and also compatibility issues. Are you aware of anything likethat?

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> > Thanks again, > > Dave C. > Jason "Schumi" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm > > > > Cheers, > > > > Schumi > > > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > > > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game

cards? > I > > > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seemto

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> > be > > > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > > > > > Dave C. > > > > > > > > > > > >

Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game cards? I know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seem to be listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. Dave C.

http://bovineracing.com/zgnews.htm Check their Clasifieds section! David Ciemny wrote in message ...

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>Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game cards? I >know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seem to be >listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > >Dave C. > >

Thanks Schumi...Are you currently using one? I just picked up a TSW and I hear these cards are excellent. I also heard there can be some installation problems and also compatibility issues. Are you aware of anything like that? Thanks again, Dave C. Jason "Schumi" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm > > Cheers, > > Schumi > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game cards?

I

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> > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seem to > be > > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > > > Dave C. > > > > > >

The cards are excellent. The card made a noticeable improvement in response smoothness. You need to read the instructions for installation *before* you begin tearing apart and putting things in. Basically, you have to remove your sound card, install the L4 and then reinstall the sound card. You will need to do a custom setup in the Windows game controller section of control panel. It will take a little longer than the average plug and play. Also, you must have an ISA slot for the card. Have fun! Wayne Templin "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jVED5.1284$[email hidden]... > Thanks Schumi...Are you currently using one? I just picked up a TSW and I > hear these cards are excellent. I also heard there can be someinstallation > problems and also compatibility issues. Are you aware of anything likethat?

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> > Thanks again, > > Dave C. > Jason "Schumi" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm > > > > Cheers, > > > > Schumi > > > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > > > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game

cards? > I > > > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seemto

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> > be > > > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > > > > > Dave C. > > > > > > > > > > > >

Always lookin out for me aren't ya Mike... 8-) I've fallen into bad company with guys that mostly just turn left and have gotten addicted to bangin doors 3 wide in those big heaps.. Its taken me away from my beloved GPL for a while (again).. Thanks! G Patricks

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>On Sat, 07 Oct 2000 12:09:40 GMT, "Mike Barlow" <[email hidden]> wrote: > http://bovineracing.com/zgnews.htm Check their Clasifieds section! > > >David Ciemny wrote in message ... >>Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game cards? I >>know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not seem to be >>listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. >> >>Dave C. >> >> >

Maybe when N4 comes out I'll join you. It's quite hard to do any of the NASCAR stuff when I don't have the feel of the car like GPL gives us. I used to do the roundy rounds (95-98) online so maybe I'll see you on track sometime next season :-) In the mean time, the ZGN does have a PDPI card listed in their clasified section. G Patricks wrote in message ...

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>Always lookin out for me aren't ya Mike... 8-) >I've fallen into bad company with guys that mostly just turn left and >have gotten addicted to bangin doors 3 wide in those big heaps.. Its >taken me away from my beloved GPL for a while (again).. > >Thanks! >G Patricks

Was there ever a PCI version of the L4? I've got the ISA version and it works great but I'm considering upgrading my motherboard to either an ASUS CUBX or CUSL2 neither of which have an ISA slot. Or is there such a thing as an ISA to PCI adapter?? Thanks, Wayne Hutchison "Jason "Schumi" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > You can read my review on the L4, and a detailed technical breakdown onhow

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> it works (and why the standard gameport doesn't). > > It easily outperforms all current USB implementations and is more stable. > > Check it out at: www.gplonline.com > > review is in the Review Section..... and the technical papers are in Tech > Talk (under standard gameport). > > There are no win2k drivers (NT kernel base) so it will not work on an NT > system. Follow installation instructions STEP-BY-STEP and you'll be

driving

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> more accurately than before 2X. > > Cheers, > > Schumi > > BTW... I run a TSW F99 and the L4 combined. I have had the opportunity to > try almost every wheel on the market, and I still keep coming back to the > TSW/L4 combo everytime. Although.... the TSW needs the L4 to really shine. > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:jVED5.1284$[email hidden]... > > Thanks Schumi...Are you currently using one? I just picked up a TSW and

I

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> > hear these cards are excellent. I also heard there can be some > installation > > problems and also compatibility issues. Are you aware of anything like > that? > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Dave C. > > Jason "Schumi" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > Schumi > > > > > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > > > > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game > cards? > > I > > > > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not

seem

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> to > > > be > > > > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > > > > > > > Dave C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

We're going to have a real problem in the medium to high end controller market real soon. Many of us already do. Most high end controller makers agree that USB, in it's present version, stinks. This is why many of us (myself included) use a TSW/ECCI/Hyperstim with an L4. Well guess what folks. The good old ISA slot's days are drawing to an end. Most Intel-based MoBo's only come with six PCI slots now. The same thing may happen when VIA introduces the next generation chipset for AMD-based systems. What are we going to do then? There's only three choices: 1) Don't upgrade your PC so you can continue to use your high end controller on your L4. 2) Start using a "lesser" controller and leave your ECCI/TSW/etc... sitting in the basement? 3) Pray that high end controller manufacturers will retrofit their wheels with electronics for some "new" peripheral technology like USB 2.0/Firewire/etc... Sorry for the thesis, but I'm certain that there's many people like me who paid good money for their controllers that are going to be forced into one of the above scenarios within the next year. Anyone have any good gossip on what the future may hold? -Bill In article <[email hidden]>, Jason \"Schumi\" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>You can read my review on the L4, and a detailed technical breakdown on how >it works (and why the standard gameport doesn't). > >It easily outperforms all current USB implementations and is more stable. > >Check it out at: www.gplonline.com > >review is in the Review Section..... and the technical papers are in Tech >Talk (under standard gameport). > >There are no win2k drivers (NT kernel base) so it will not work on an NT >system. Follow installation instructions STEP-BY-STEP and you'll be driving >more accurately than before 2X. > >Cheers, > >Schumi > >BTW... I run a TSW F99 and the L4 combined. I have had the opportunity to >try almost every wheel on the market, and I still keep coming back to the >TSW/L4 combo everytime. Although.... the TSW needs the L4 to really

shine. -- | "Instead of letting the moon be the Bill Mette | gateway to our future, we have let Enteract, Chicago | it become a brief chapter in our [email hidden] | history." - Andrew Chaikin

In article <8s2o5b$2267$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Bill Mette) writes:

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> Well guess what folks. The good old ISA slot's days are drawing to an >end. Most Intel-based MoBo's only come with six PCI slots >now. The same thing may happen when VIA introduces the next generation >chipset for AMD-based systems. What are we going to do then? There's >only three choices: > >1) Don't upgrade your PC so you can continue to use your high end >controller on your L4. > >2) Start using a "lesser" controller and leave your >ECCI/TSW/etc... sitting in the basement? > >3) Pray that high end controller manufacturers will retrofit their wheels >with electronics for some "new" peripheral technology like USB >2.0/Firewire/etc... >

4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game ports as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. Don McCorkle

Unfortunately, it is only available in an ISA slot configuration. It could be converted to a PCI slot... but I am unsure of where the company is financially to manufacture it. They were the victims of a VERY nasty play by Act Labs in my opinion (I was an insider on the whole schocking thing and shook my head in disgust the whole way through). Hence why I and all of my current/future productions are/will boycott Act Labs. They put on a pleasant facade to you guys... but stick your head under the covers.... and imagine the worst smelling fart you've laid. Regards, Schumi "Wayne Hutchison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:NCqE5.1169$e%[email hidden]... > Was there ever a PCI version of the L4? I've got the ISA version and it > works great but I'm considering upgrading my motherboard to either an ASUS > CUBX or CUSL2 neither of which have an ISA slot. Or is there such a thingas

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> an ISA to PCI adapter?? > > Thanks, > > Wayne Hutchison > > "Jason "Schumi" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > You can read my review on the L4, and a detailed technical breakdown on > how > > it works (and why the standard gameport doesn't). > > > > It easily outperforms all current USB implementations and is more

stable. > > > > Check it out at: www.gplonline.com > > > > review is in the Review Section..... and the technical papers are inTech

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> > Talk (under standard gameport). > > > > There are no win2k drivers (NT kernel base) so it will not work on an NT > > system. Follow installation instructions STEP-BY-STEP and you'll be > driving > > more accurately than before 2X. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Schumi > > > > BTW... I run a TSW F99 and the L4 combined. I have had the opportunity

to > > try almost every wheel on the market, and I still keep coming back tothe > > TSW/L4 combo everytime. Although.... the TSW needs the L4 to reallyshine. > > > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:jVED5.1284$[email hidden]... > > > Thanks Schumi...Are you currently using one? I just picked up a TSWand

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> I > > > hear these cards are excellent. I also heard there can be some > > installation > > > problems and also compatibility issues. Are you aware of anything like > > that? > > > > > > Thanks again, > > > > > > Dave C. > > > Jason "Schumi" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > http://www.act-labs.com/PDPI_L4.htm > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > > > > Schumi > > > > > > > > "David Ciemny" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:eMtD5.1241$[email hidden]... > > > > > Anyone have the url or know where I can locate one of these game > > cards? > > > I > > > > > know Act Labs took it over for a while last year but it does not > seem > > to > > > > be > > > > > listed at their site? Any help would be appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > Dave C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Actually Bill, PDPI developed a USB chip that removed all electronic/mechanical jittering that plagues the current USB implementations today (basically what PDPI did for the gameport when the L4 first came out). The technology to remove all of the inherit problems associate with USB is already here... the manufacturers just don't want to spend the extra $1.50/controller to implement it (which actually works out to be a savings when you take into account the R&D time/cost it takes them to develop their own implementation, based on their current chip costs). Go figure! In fact... PDPI achieved 16K positioning resolution, and could have reached the spectrum cap of 65K if they used a higher bit USB chip (which ended up being too expensive). So they opted for a 4096 TRUE positioning resolution to lower the cost of the chip as a whole making it more accessible to you guys and the manufacturers at an acceptable price/performance. They even developed a method to use a lower bit chip and still reach the 4096 TRUE resolutions. Firewire... USB2.0... and other interfaces will not solve the problems inherit with current USB. They just offer a bigger pipe to push data through... which is not the issue here (Current USB 1.0 is MORE than enough pipe to push game controller info through). It's what you do with the data from the positioning mechanisms that is plagued with interference/jitter. Which is directly the responsibility of the chipset/algorithm they use to send it to the computer through the interface of choice. Basically... until they change algorithms and methods on their chipsets... the problem will remain. I say it with deep dismay as a Sim Racer too ;( Cheers, Schumi "Bill Mette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8s2o5b$2267$[email hidden]...

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> We're going to have a real problem in the medium to high end controller > market real soon. Many of us already do. Most high end controller makers > agree that USB, in it's present version, stinks. This is why many of us > (myself included) use a TSW/ECCI/Hyperstim with an L4. > Well guess what folks. The good old ISA slot's days are drawing to an > end. Most Intel-based MoBo's only come with six PCI slots > now. The same thing may happen when VIA introduces the next generation > chipset for AMD-based systems. What are we going to do then? There's > only three choices: > > 1) Don't upgrade your PC so you can continue to use your high end > controller on your L4. > > 2) Start using a "lesser" controller and leave your > ECCI/TSW/etc... sitting in the basement? > > 3) Pray that high end controller manufacturers will retrofit their wheels > with electronics for some "new" peripheral technology like USB > 2.0/Firewire/etc... > > Sorry for the thesis, but I'm certain that there's many people like me who > paid good money for their controllers that are going to be forced into one > of the above scenarios within the next year. Anyone have any good gossip > on what the future may hold? > > -Bill > > > In article <[email hidden]>, > Jason \"Schumi\" Murray <[email hidden]> wrote: > >You can read my review on the L4, and a detailed technical breakdown on

how

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> >it works (and why the standard gameport doesn't). > > > >It easily outperforms all current USB implementations and is more stable. > > > >Check it out at: www.gplonline.com > > > >review is in the Review Section..... and the technical papers are in Tech > >Talk (under standard gameport). > > > >There are no win2k drivers (NT kernel base) so it will not work on an NT > >system. Follow installation instructions STEP-BY-STEP and you'll be

driving

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> >more accurately than before 2X. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Schumi > > > >BTW... I run a TSW F99 and the L4 combined. I have had the opportunity to > >try almost every wheel on the market, and I still keep coming back to the > >TSW/L4 combo everytime. Although.... the TSW needs the L4 to really > shine. > -- > | "Instead of letting the moon be the > Bill Mette | gateway to our future, we have let > Enteract, Chicago | it become a brief chapter in our > [email hidden] | history." - Andrew Chaikin

I could do that but with my PDPI, I can plug in 4 controllers at the same time and even combine them as needed. Wayne "Woodie 83" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <8s2o5b$2267$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (Bill Mette) writes: > > > Well guess what folks. The good old ISA slot's days are drawing to an > >end. Most Intel-based MoBo's only come with six PCI slots > >now. The same thing may happen when VIA introduces the next generation > >chipset for AMD-based systems. What are we going to do then? There's > >only three choices: > > > >1) Don't upgrade your PC so you can continue to use your high end > >controller on your L4. > > > >2) Start using a "lesser" controller and leave your > >ECCI/TSW/etc... sitting in the basement? > > > >3) Pray that high end controller manufacturers will retrofit their wheels > >with electronics for some "new" peripheral technology like USB > >2.0/Firewire/etc... > > > > 4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game

ports

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> as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > > > Don McCorkle > > > >

>4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game >ports >as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. I have a Monster Sound MX300 and would have to disagree. That's why I bought a PDPI L4! :) God bless, Loren

In article <[email hidden]>, UnserFan1 <[email hidden]> wrote: >>4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game >>ports >>as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > >I have a Monster Sound MX300 and would have to disagree. That's why I bought a >PDPI L4! :) Exactly. I went from a Live! to the L4 and the difference was night & day. No way I'm going back to the live if I can avoid it. Not to mention the 4 controller flexibility that the L4 gives you. -- | "Instead of letting the moon be the Bill Mette | gateway to our future, we have let Enteract, Chicago | it become a brief chapter in our [email hidden] | history." - Andrew Chaikin

Go here.... and you'll have your answer :) It is a technical brief on how Gameports work... and how the L4 outperforms them all hands down. It is in Layman's terms.... so that all can have a good general knowledge of the issues. Cheers, Schumi http://www.gplonline.com/tech-talk/hardware-tech.htm read the GamePort section. I think you'll find the answers you are looking for. "Woodie 83" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <[email hidden]>,[email hidden]

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> (UnserFan1) writes: > > >>4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game > >>ports > >>as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > > > >I have a Monster Sound MX300 and would have to disagree. That's why I

bought > >a PDPI L4! :) > > > I can't imagine how it could be any better, but you're not the only onewho has > said this, so I guess I'm wrong again. The four controller thing is agiven. > I have no use for it, but if you need multiple controllers, PDPI is amust. > (Wanders off muttering: "How the hell could it be any more stable oraccurate > or.........?") > > > Don McCorkle >

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (UnserFan1) writes:

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>>4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game >>ports >>as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > >I have a Monster Sound MX300 and would have to disagree. That's why I bought >a PDPI L4! :) >

I can't imagine how it could be any better, but you're not the only one who has said this, so I guess I'm wrong again. The four controller thing is a given. I have no use for it, but if you need multiple controllers, PDPI is a must. (Wanders off muttering: "How the hell could it be any more stable or accurate or.........?") Don McCorkle

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> > 4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both > > have game ports as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since > > the PDPI was invented. > > > > Really? Maybe I shouldn't be so worried about upgrading to an > ISA-less mobo....I have an SBLive.

FWIW, my TSW with it's split axis cabling and the 50 kOhm pots works MUCH better through the PDPI than it ever did through the SB Live! game port. I used to get lots of signal jitter through the SB and that is totally gone through the PDPI. -Chris- **Jesus saves sinners and redeems them for valuable cash prizes** Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Woodie 83) writes: >4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game >ports >as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > Really? Maybe I shouldn't be so worried about upgrading to an ISA-less mobo....I have an SBLive. Eldred - considering that upgrade... -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +49.67 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

[email hidden] (EldredP) wrote in <20001017122121.21304.00001438@nso- cg.aol.com>:

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>In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] >(Woodie 83) writes: > >>4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game >>ports >>as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. >> > >Really? Maybe I shouldn't be so worried about upgrading to an ISA-less >mobo....I have an SBLive. > >Eldred - considering that upgrade...

I'm using the game port of my SBLive with my ECCI and I have no complaints. I sometimes see jitter when calibrating but I don't think it has any negative effect when driving. -- Don Scurlock Vancouver,B.C. GPLRank -5.09 Come see how you rank, at the GPLRank site http://gplrank.ringlord.com/

In article <[email hidden]>, "Jason \"Schumi\" Murray" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>Go here.... and you'll have your answer :) > >It is a technical brief on how Gameports work... and how the L4 outperforms >them all hands down. > >It is in Layman's terms.... so that all can have a good general knowledge of >the issues. > >Cheers, > >Schumi

Well, that sucks. I want to upgrade my rig, but they don't make a PCI version of the PDPI... I *already* have enough problems with disco's... :( Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +49.67 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

When I first got my SB live, I was hoping to be able to get rid of the PDPI L4. But after about 5 minutes of using the SB Live gameport I said forget this and went back to the L4. There is a BIG difference. -Tony- EldredP wrote:

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> > In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] > (Woodie 83) writes: > > >4) Plug your joystick into an SB Live or Monster MX300. Both have game > >ports > >as good as a PDPI. Things have changed since the PDPI was invented. > > > > Really? Maybe I shouldn't be so worried about upgrading to an ISA-less > mobo....I have an SBLive. > > Eldred - considering that upgrade... > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +49.67 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

You could try a USB to gameport adapter to see if that's any better than using the SBLive port. Let me know what you find as I'm in the same situation... Wayne Hutchison "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <[email hidden]>, "Jason \"Schumi\" Murray" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >Go here.... and you'll have your answer :) > > > >It is a technical brief on how Gameports work... and how the L4outperforms > >them all hands down. > > > >It is in Layman's terms.... so that all can have a good general knowledgeof

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> >the issues. > > > >Cheers, > > > >Schumi > > Well, that sucks. I want to upgrade my rig, but they don't make a PCI

version

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> of the PDPI... I *already* have enough problems with disco's... :( > > Eldred > -- > Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPL hcp. +49.67 > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <3yLH5.1177$[email hidden]>, "Wayne Hutchison" <[email hidden]> writes: >You could try a USB to gameport adapter to see if that's any better than >using the SBLive port. Let me know what you find as I'm in the same >situation... > >Wayne Hutchison I can't do USB yet. Win95 doesn't handle it well... :( Yes, I'm still running 95...<hides> Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +49.67 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

my sblive 1024 gameport does not exactly rock neither but unfortunately there is no ISA slot in my MB :(