In the "future" (WHOOOO)

I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I reckon it's not bad anyway. I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will have laps fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents laps perhaps, so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they are losing or gaining time. Just what I reckon. And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racing series where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which are actually out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras which are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one will be in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track, each with their own cockpits and computers. This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People will always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more people would be able to race "from a distance".

Incubus wrote:

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> > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will have laps > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents laps perhaps, > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they are losing > or gaining time. > > Just what I reckon.

Lotus tried that HUD thing in F1 a few years ago. I remember seeing a feature on an F1 programme about it. Johnny Herbert had a little projector in his helmet that put the revs and gear onto a screen (or the visor) in front of his right eye. Obviously didn't work too well...... Kev

Is this not just the same as todays RC model cars except that the driver uses a visual system instead. I think this will become the future as you say. Safety will not be a problem so everything could really be pushed to the limit. Rocket propelled cars, supersonic speeds. Every imaginable aid , currently banned for safety reasons, could be added leading to immense cornering speeds and requiring the ultimate in quick reactions from the driver. Should be great.

"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will havelaps > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents lapsperhaps, > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they arelosing > or gaining time. > > Just what I reckon. > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racingseries > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which areactually > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras which > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one will be > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track,each > with their own cockpits and computers. > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. Peoplewill > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more > people would be able to race "from a distance". Every once in awhile you hear a story about how in the future fighter planes will be 'piloted' by a remotely located 'pilot' who is actually sitting at a terminal many, many miles away, and completely safe. This system has many advantages for the military in both cost and performance of equipment, and of course saving the very heavily invested in life of the 'pilot.' Well guess what? The technology to implement this has existed for many years already, why hasn't it been implimented? In Japan there is a small group of people who race R/C model cars exactly as you describe, but it isn't really catching on beyond the developer crowd, why not? Well I'll tell you why not, because people * want to fly and drive!* That's why not. Here, let me test this theory directly with a little thought experiment. I'm going to loan you for the next hour a copy of SCGT running on a 1.1g Athalon system and a TSW wheel,. . . AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run of Spa all to yourself. You only have one hour to use these items as you will. Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour? Case closed, Q.E.D.

I'd take the 917, but I don't think I'd last the full hour! Still, at least I'd die happy. - Michael In article <fCDL5.114578$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run of > Spa all to yourself. > > You only have one hour to use these items as you will. > > Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour?

Kev <[email hidden]> wrote: > Lotus tried that HUD thing in F1 a few years ago. I remember seeing a > feature on an F1 programme about it. Johnny Herbert had a little > projector in his helmet that put the revs and gear onto a screen (or the > visor) in front of his right eye. Obviously didn't work too well...... i a prog. a few weeks ago they put a camera on toby schekter's[1] helmet looking at his eye while he drove 40 laps in his f3000 (or is it f3?) car so some professor or other could see if The Racing Driver looks/focuses at the same parts of the road as The Normal Road User. (turns out he does, more or less). but the interesting fact (for me) was that in the 6 laps of film that were usable, schekter looked at his cockpit instruments just once! in gpl my eyes are almost glued to the rev counter. perhaps i need a change of style. martin. -- [1] apologees for possible misspelling, and not being too certain of his first name.

I'd like to try both actually. Kevin Gavitt <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fCDL5.114578$[email hidden]...

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> > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will have > laps > > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents laps > perhaps, > > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they are > losing > > or gaining time. > > > > Just what I reckon. > > > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racing > series > > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree > > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which are > actually > > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras

which > > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one willbe

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> > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track, > each > > with their own cockpits and computers. > > > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > will > > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and

more > > people would be able to race "from a distance". > > > Every once in awhile you hear a story about how in the future fighterplanes > will be 'piloted' by a remotely located 'pilot' who is actually sitting ata > terminal many, many miles away, and completely safe. > > This system has many advantages for the military in both cost and > performance of equipment, and of course saving the very heavily investedin > life of the 'pilot.' > > Well guess what? The technology to implement this has existed for manyyears > already, why hasn't it been implimented? > > In Japan there is a small group of people who race R/C model cars exactlyas > you describe, but it isn't really catching on beyond the developer crowd, > why not? > > Well I'll tell you why not, because people * want to fly and drive!*That's > why not. > > Here, let me test this theory directly with a little thought experiment.I'm > going to loan you for the next hour a copy of SCGT running on a 1.1gAthalon

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> system and a TSW wheel,. . . AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run of > Spa all to yourself. > > You only have one hour to use these items as you will. > > Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour? > > Case closed, Q.E.D. > >

I can't get to Spa, can I have the computer? -- -- Daniel Francis, Webmaster, Shrews Fans (http://www.shrews-fans.co.uk) aka TMLS One Luke Rodgers! Sponsored by the Shrews Fans and Blue and Amber websites "MichaelJP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I'd take the 917, but I don't think I'd last the full hour! > > Still, at least I'd die happy. > > - Michael > > In article <fCDL5.114578$[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] says... > > AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run of > > Spa all to yourself. > > > > You only have one hour to use these items as you will. > > > > Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour?

probelm with HUD for driving is that your not always focusing beyond 200m (or infinity for the eye), which means the thing will be out of focus alot of the time...... pilots are always focusing beyond 200m...... pez Incubus <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will havelaps > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents lapsperhaps, > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they arelosing > or gaining time. > > Just what I reckon. > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racingseries > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which areactually > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras which > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one will be > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track,each > with their own cockpits and computers. > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. Peoplewill > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more > people would be able to race "from a distance". > > > >

They won't go to remote controls because there is NO feel with a remote control and thus there is no way to sense the edge. I am not sure how they would do a ghost car...It could work but I can't see them putting a computer image of a car in front of the driver. Maybe just realtime notification of how far ahead or behind the driver is from the "ideal" lap at any given time. Just like they still have pilots flying airplanes. They could go to completely automated or remote control, but when something goes wrong, a human in the cockpit will have the advantage...especially in a dog fight. JB "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will havelaps > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents lapsperhaps, > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they arelosing > or gaining time. > > Just what I reckon. > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racingseries > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which areactually > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras which > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one will be > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track,each > with their own cockpits and computers. > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. Peoplewill > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more > people would be able to race "from a distance". > > > >

Kevin explains it the best. People race for that FEELING. If you had a choice between a game and real life, what do you go for? You want to feel those Gs...you dont want to watch it on a screen. JB "Kevin Gavitt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fCDL5.114578$[email hidden]...

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> > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will have > laps > > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they are > > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car. This > > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents laps > perhaps, > > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they are > losing > > or gaining time. > > > > Just what I reckon. > > > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racing > series > > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180 degree > > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which are > actually > > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras

which > > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no one willbe

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> > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track, > each > > with their own cockpits and computers. > > > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > will > > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and

more > > people would be able to race "from a distance". > > > Every once in awhile you hear a story about how in the future fighterplanes > will be 'piloted' by a remotely located 'pilot' who is actually sitting ata > terminal many, many miles away, and completely safe. > > This system has many advantages for the military in both cost and > performance of equipment, and of course saving the very heavily investedin > life of the 'pilot.' > > Well guess what? The technology to implement this has existed for manyyears > already, why hasn't it been implimented? > > In Japan there is a small group of people who race R/C model cars exactlyas > you describe, but it isn't really catching on beyond the developer crowd, > why not? > > Well I'll tell you why not, because people * want to fly and drive!*That's > why not. > > Here, let me test this theory directly with a little thought experiment.I'm > going to loan you for the next hour a copy of SCGT running on a 1.1gAthalon

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> system and a TSW wheel,. . . AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run of > Spa all to yourself. > > You only have one hour to use these items as you will. > > Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour? > > Case closed, Q.E.D. > >

HAHAHA wow, interesting answer. You are a cheap person to please. JB "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ZzEL5.12091$[email hidden]...

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> I'd like to try both actually. > > Kevin Gavitt <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:fCDL5.114578$[email hidden]... > > > > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:3XCL5.12085$[email hidden]... > > > I posted this in another thread, but I've put it in a new thread coz I > > > reckon it's not bad anyway. > > > > > > I reckon in the "future" (insert spooky sound here), drivers will have > > laps > > > fed to their helmet visors, as in a HUD on a flight sim, while they

are > > > doing a practice or qualifying session, in the form of a ghost car.This

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> > > will be either be a ghost car of their own laps, or opponents laps > > perhaps, > > > so that they'll be able to see in which sectors of the track they are > > losing > > > or gaining time. > > > > > > Just what I reckon. > > > > > > And I also think that at some point, they'll be able to have a racing > > series > > > where, drivers are sitting infront of huge screens with maybe 180

degree > > > vision, and thru remote control, they'll be driving cars which are > > actually > > > out on the track. They'll be watching an "in car" view thru cameras > which > > > are on the car. Spectators will be there in the stands, but no onewill > be > > > in the cars. The drivers will maybe be in seperate rooms at the track, > > each > > > with their own cockpits and computers. > > > > > > This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition.People

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> > will > > > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and > more > > > people would be able to race "from a distance". > > > > > > Every once in awhile you hear a story about how in the future fighter > planes > > will be 'piloted' by a remotely located 'pilot' who is actually sitting

at

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> a > > terminal many, many miles away, and completely safe. > > > > This system has many advantages for the military in both cost and > > performance of equipment, and of course saving the very heavily invested > in > > life of the 'pilot.' > > > > Well guess what? The technology to implement this has existed for many > years > > already, why hasn't it been implimented? > > > > In Japan there is a small group of people who race R/C model cars

exactly > as > > you describe, but it isn't really catching on beyond the developercrowd,

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> > why not? > > > > Well I'll tell you why not, because people * want to fly and drive!* > That's > > why not. > > > > Here, let me test this theory directly with a little thought experiment. > I'm > > going to loan you for the next hour a copy of SCGT running on a 1.1g > Athalon > > system and a TSW wheel,. . . AND a Porsche 917/K with the complete run

of

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> > Spa all to yourself. > > > > You only have one hour to use these items as you will. > > > > Tell me, what are YOU going to do with your hour? > > > > Case closed, Q.E.D. > > > > > >

"Daniel Francis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8tn4qm$1hf$[email hidden]... > I can't get to Spa, can I have the computer? The computer is sitting next to the Porsche, in the pits at Spa.

"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ZzEL5.12091$[email hidden]... > I'd like to try both actually. Actually, my thought experiment allows that. However, why don't you just step into the Porsche FIRST, and try the computer when you tire of the Porsche. :)

"Wosco" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zwJL5.3230$[email hidden]... > Kevin explains it the best. People race for that FEELING. If you had a > choice between a game and real life, what do you go for? You want to feel > those Gs...you dont want to watch it on a screen. > > JB Bear in mind that I am a radical supporter of the position that sim racing IS real racing. While sims are computer games they are NOT *just* games. It is real, honest to god sport. Huttu is every much a motorsports superstar to me as Schumacher, he just dosn't get payed as well. That being said, racing actual cars * as if * they were a sim is just plain silly.

I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that the remote control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People will always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more people would be able to race "from a distance"." Kevin Gavitt <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:quNL5.115415$[email hidden]...

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> > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ZzEL5.12091$[email hidden]... > > I'd like to try both actually. > > Actually, my thought experiment allows that. However, why don't you just > step into the Porsche FIRST, and try the computer when you tire of the > Porsche. :) > >

Well, I guess the remote control would open the door to otherwise hazardous technology / speeds, since no one would actually be risking his/her life. I think the absence of a human body would make huge changes to car shape and size possible. Drivers would be more game to try risky overtaking manoevures, etc., which might be fun . . . "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:IeOL5.12356$[email hidden]...

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> I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that the remote > control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. > > "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > will > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more > people would be able to race "from a distance"."

Martin Portman wrote:

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> > Kev <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > Lotus tried that HUD thing in F1 a few years ago. I remember seeing a > > feature on an F1 programme about it. Johnny Herbert had a little > > projector in his helmet that put the revs and gear onto a screen (or the > > visor) in front of his right eye. Obviously didn't work too well...... > > i a prog. a few weeks ago they put a camera on toby schekter's[1] > helmet looking at his eye while he drove 40 laps in his f3000 (or is > it f3?) car so some professor or other could see if The Racing Driver > looks/focuses at the same parts of the road as The Normal Road User. > (turns out he does, more or less). > > but the interesting fact (for me) was that in the 6 laps of film that > were usable, schekter looked at his cockpit instruments just once! in > gpl my eyes are almost glued to the rev counter. perhaps i need a > change of style.

I saw that too. Don't forget though that he was driving round Mallory Park. I've driven there and there isn't much too it. It's practically an oval track but with an extra loop to make a hairpin. http://www.silhouet.com/motorsport/tracks/mallory.html So it's not that surprising he didn't check his instruments. I was amazed at how surprised the professor was that he drove better and faster as he learnt the circuit. Well...er...duh. yep.

It'd be a cool thing to watch.....not sure about how close I'd want to be to the cars, in the grandstand, if I was at such a race, but I guess it's kind of like a documentary I saw about fighter jets. They were saying that the weakest link to the performance limit of the jets is actually the pilot. They can make planes to withstand much greater forces than they are currently exposed to, but the human body can't actually take it. I think they were also talking about pilotless drones for this very reason. Ryan Mitchley <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8toqso$781$[email hidden]... > Well, I guess the remote control would open the door to otherwisehazardous > technology / speeds, since no one would actually be risking his/her life.I

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> think the absence of a human body would make huge changes to car shape and > size possible. Drivers would be more game to try risky overtaking > manoevures, etc., which might be fun . . . > > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:IeOL5.12356$[email hidden]... > > I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that the

remote > > control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. > > > > "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > > will > > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more andmore > > people would be able to race "from a distance"." > > >

"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:IeOL5.12356$[email hidden]...

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> I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that the remote > control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. > > "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > will > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more > people would be able to race "from a distance"." >

And as I pointed out in my original post they're already doing it Japan, just with 1/8 scale cars. Driver participation remains low, spectatorship is zilch. Tell me, when was the last time YOU went, purely as a spectator, to an R/C car race? Spectatorship at the national and world level is near zero for these. Spectatorship at a local Kart race is at least 4 times greater. Even spectators want the driver to be in the car. So you're right, it will happen, and is already happening, but it's a novelty act. Noone much really cares.

I've read several of these posts and *think* I know what you are after(?) "Some kind of a spectator mode for Sim Racing?" If so, *My opinion* is that it would be a great feature to be able to watch some of the league events in real time! I also think that the only ones that would be interested would be the non-members but are also online drivers. I will say that first "You never know"!! Not to long ago the idea of owning a computer was considered science fiction. Now many of us have several computers in the house. It's a long shot, but you never know. I will also say that with the pro R/C and go-kart tracks around here, the spectators are passer by's that are just curious and don't come back again once their curiosity is filled. The only advertising there is is a small sign at the track enterance. If there were TV comercials boasting the competition and trying to make a name for the drivers, there would probably be (relitivly speaking) quite a showing of spectaters. With Sim racing, if marketed right, we would probably have even less then the current crop of R/C and Kart racing spectators but it would be nice to know that the possibility of even one curious non sim driver could be there watching. Now it's just a mater of praying that the ability is implimented in a up coming sim. on a side note: when a TV isn't accesible some of us listen to the radio for live coverage of sporting events. As a test session it would great to have league events covered in a voice chat application. I.E.... Someone logs in to a GPL race with one computer and watches and reports the events to his FireTalk application on the other computer that's set up as a moderated room with a one way transmision. I can't remember what they call it but it can be set up so only one person can talk and everyone else has no choice but to listen. With the right person braudcasting the event I sure would be there listening in. The bad thing is that I think GPL will only let 5 cars show at any time. So maybe if a server replay was braudcast instead of a live racing event(?) Kevin Gavitt wrote in message ... > >"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:IeOL5.12356$[email hidden]... >> I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that theremote

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>> control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. >> >> "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People >> will >> always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more and more >> people would be able to race "from a distance"." >> > >And as I pointed out in my original post they're already doing it Japan, >just with 1/8 scale cars. > >Driver participation remains low, spectatorship is zilch. > >Tell me, when was the last time YOU went, purely as a spectator, to an R/C >car race? > >Spectatorship at the national and world level is near zero for these. >Spectatorship at a local Kart race is at least 4 times greater. > >Even spectators want the driver to be in the car. > >So you're right, it will happen, and is already happening, but it's a >novelty act. Noone much really cares. > >

In article <XUZL5.119510$[email hidden]>, "Kevin Gavitt" <[email hidden]> writes: >Tell me, when was the last time YOU went, purely as a spectator, to an R/C >car race? Never, but I've watched guys racing on my GPL servers before. It was pretty exciting when you get a good race going... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL hcp. +49.67 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

But I mean with the full size, real, actual cars....with some type of virtual reality cockpit for the driver, off in a room somewhere, and the cars racing on a full size track, so that as someone else here pointed out in this thread, the cars could be made with more power and even better aerodynamics as driver safety wouldn't be an issue anymore. I'd rather go to one of these events than a 1/8 scale rc event. Just because spectatorship is low with 1/8 scale cars, doesn't mean that it will therefore also be low with full size cars. I don't think you can make that connection. I'd have no interest in scaled down cars.....if however they were the real thing, I'm there. I think that the reason the 1/8 RC cars dont attract people is not because of the "RC" aspect, but because of the "1/8" aspect. Kevin Gavitt <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:XUZL5.119510$[email hidden]... > > "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:IeOL5.12356$[email hidden]... > > I know what you're saying, but in my original post, I said that theremote > > control idea is not a substitute, but an addition. I've pasted it below. > > > > "This wont replace "humans in cars", but it could be an addition. People > > will > > always want to actually be in the car, but with technology, more andmore

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> > people would be able to race "from a distance"." > > > > And as I pointed out in my original post they're already doing it Japan, > just with 1/8 scale cars. > > Driver participation remains low, spectatorship is zilch. > > Tell me, when was the last time YOU went, purely as a spectator, to an R/C > car race? > > Spectatorship at the national and world level is near zero for these. > Spectatorship at a local Kart race is at least 4 times greater. > > Even spectators want the driver to be in the car. > > So you're right, it will happen, and is already happening, but it's a > novelty act. Noone much really cares. > >

Yup, thats exactly what I mean, for the exact reasons you said. I didn't even think of rocket propelled....that'd be something.....this just gets better and better. Cars doing 500 or 1000 mph....movable wing surfaces on the cars....I'm getting goosebumps. attaya <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Is this not just the same as todays RC model cars except that the driver > uses a visual system instead. > I think this will become the future as you say. Safety will not be aproblem

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> so everything could really be pushed to the limit. > Rocket propelled cars, supersonic speeds. Every imaginable aid , currently > banned for safety reasons, could be added leading to immense cornering > speeds and requiring the ultimate in quick reactions from the driver. > Should be great. > > > >

On Thu, 2 Nov 2000 22:08:14 +1100, "Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote: > I think that the reason the 1/8 RC cars dont >attract people is not because of the "RC" aspect, but because of the "1/8" >aspect. Do you happen to know of any websites that feature this particular subset of RC racing? ~daxe

On Wed, 1 Nov 2000, Mike Barlow wrote: > I've read several of these posts and *think* I know what you are > after(?) "Some kind of a spectator mode for Sim Racing?" If so, *My > opinion* is that it would be a great feature to be able to watch some of the > league events in real time! I also think that the only ones that would be > interested would be the non-members but are also online drivers. <rest snipped> I think this is getting off topic, but couldn't resist when I read your comments above... About a year ago, I happened to be in Charlotte and attended the annual championships at NASCAR Silicon Motor Speedway -- as a spectator. All the competitors were extremely good (they were picked by local eliminations and then flown in from the different SMS sites around the USA). To give you some idea of the experience level, I think that one guy had raced something over 1000 laps on the simulated "Charlotte" track. It was really entertaining and interesting to walk around the room and stand behind the different drivers, and see the same big projected display that they were looking at. At the same time, I could watch the body motion of the simulators (the cars are on hydraulics-- they pitch, roll, bounce and move sideways) and see just how smooth these drivers were. The effect was kind of like in-car tv coverage, but by walking around the room (or just looking in different directions) I got to choose who to ride along with. Afterwords, I talked to some of the managers out at SMS headquarters (disclaimer--I do a little consulting for them), and made a big fuss about the fact that they hadn't done any PR or invited the public to come and see a great race. Now that I've been to one of these events, I would pay $$ to get in and watch, it was that good -- for me it was similar (fun factor) to watching the real racing at a local short track. -- Doug Douglas Milliken <[email hidden]> Milliken Research Associates Inc. Plug = <http://www.smsonline.com>

"Doug Milliken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I think this is getting off topic, but couldn't resist when I read your > comments above... > > About a year ago, I happened to be in Charlotte and attended the annual > championships at NASCAR Silicon Motor Speedway -- as a spectator. All the > competitors were extremely good (they were picked by local eliminationsand > then flown in from the different SMS sites around the USA). To give you > some idea of the experience level, I think that one guy had racedsomething > over 1000 laps on the simulated "Charlotte" track. > > It was really entertaining and interesting to walk around the room and > stand behind the different drivers, and see the same big projected display > that they were looking at. At the same time, I could watch the bodymotion > of the simulators (the cars are on hydraulics-- they pitch, roll, bounce > and move sideways) and see just how smooth these drivers were. The effect > was kind of like in-car tv coverage, but by walking around the room (orjust > looking in different directions) I got to choose who to ride along with. > > Afterwords, I talked to some of the managers out at SMS headquarters > (disclaimer--I do a little consulting for them), and made a big fuss about > the fact that they hadn't done any PR or invited the public to come andsee > a great race. Now that I've been to one of these events, I would pay $$to > get in and watch, it was that good -- for me it was similar (fun factor)to

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> watching the real racing at a local short track. > > -- Doug > Douglas Milliken <[email hidden]> > Milliken Research Associates Inc. > > Plug = <http://www.smsonline.com> >

Offtopic in a usenet dicussion? Never! :) Call it "topic drift." I imagine a day when a packed virutal grandstand shows up to watch GPL league races and cheer on their personal favorites. The technology is there already, it's just that nobody has implimented it. Networking isn't my coding bag. Anyone out there with the skills that thinks this is a cool idea? I also believe, however, that if sim racing has a real future as a sport, and I believe it does, it will be in the form of LAN events, not the internet. You went to the event. It was an EVENT. You saw the drivers. You saw the other spectators. I find sim racing to be far more realistic since GPL then R/C racing. But when I go to an R/C race I'm there WITH the other drivers and spectators. We talk to each other. We get to know each other on a personal level. We bench race before, during, and at Denny's after, each meeting. It's a community, and even spectators like that. I'll even set it up. Now all I need is the money. :) Kevin F. Gavitt

"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:dXbM5.13416$[email hidden]...

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> But I mean with the full size, real, actual cars....with some type of > virtual reality cockpit for the driver, off in a room somewhere, and the > cars racing on a full size track, so that as someone else here pointed out > in this thread, the cars could be made with more power and even better > aerodynamics as driver safety wouldn't be an issue anymore. > > I'd rather go to one of these events than a 1/8 scale rc event. Just

because > spectatorship is low with 1/8 scale cars, doesn't mean that it will > therefore also be low with full size cars. I don't think you can make that > connection. I'd have no interest in scaled down cars.....if however they > were the real thing, I'm there. I think that the reason the 1/8 RC carsdont > attract people is not because of the "RC" aspect, but because of the "1/8" > aspect. Sure. I know what you mean. Obviously we disagree. :)

"Incubus" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:dXbM5.13416$[email hidden]... > But I mean with the full size, real, actual cars....with some type of > virtual reality cockpit for the driver, off in a room somewhere, and the > cars racing on a full size track, so that as someone else here pointed out > in this thread, the cars could be made with more power and even better > aerodynamics as driver safety wouldn't be an issue anymore. Surely the "scale" of a real car is determined to a large extent by the need to accommodate a human being. If there was no human passenger, I wonder what would be the ideal size for an F1-type car? Something smaller than the current designs might be faster... although perhaps not eighth scale.