New Logitech FF Wheel

I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? -- [email hidden]

Hello, Indeed, the newer wheel uses gears rather than cables (less costly for them to produce gears). Raymond ACT LABS www.act-labs.com On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:21:03 +1000, "Andrew Williams" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Someone also claimed that the LWFFGP uses gears for FF instead of cables >like the original LWFF. A big minus in my book. > >

On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 08:47:52 +1100, "Andrew Williams" <[email hidden]> scribbled:

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>> The original LWFF connected to the serial port, but also came with an >> adapter that allowed you to use the USB port instead. Apparently this >> serial port to USB port adapter is not included. > >That's a real shame, because on my system the USB connection provies a much >smoother response from the wheel. The serial connection was only really >ever intended for compatibility with old (non-USB) machines.

Does anyone know if it'd be possible to get this adapter seperately somewhere? -Slash -- -- -- -- "The people on the internet know more about what I am doing than I do. Like, they will say that I am going to be in this mall on this day and sure enough I am there." - Tori Amos, Dew Drop Inn Tour, 17-June-1996

I just ordered the old LWFF from justdeals because the price is hard to resist. I have been using the LWFFGP. I have the following questions about the old LWFF: 1. What does it mean, "*Please Note this DOES NOT INCLUDE The USB connector!* Does it mean I just buy a USB connector cable from BestBuys and all is well, or does it mean I have to use my game port? 2. I have the LWFFGP; will it serve as a good parts wheel? Are the pots the same? 3. How do the pedals compare? I fixed the problem of the clamps coming loose on the LWFFGP. Like someone else says, it might be the finish on my desk. Here is my fix: http://personal.rdu.bellsouth.net/~appleyar/lwffgp/ Thanks -- Doug Appleyard "Got us a Dirt Track Date, demolition derby figure 8" -- Southern Culture On The Skids Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

GTX_SlotCar <[email hidden]> wrote... <snip>On the other hand, I think the Ferrari wheel for $98 is still a better deal, higher quality, better feel.<snip> To chime in with another possibility, I see AVB's selling their Magturbo wheel through their online store for $69.95 plus shipping (US-only). This is obviously another version of the Ferrari wheel with differences in the pedals, button layout, and shift paddles. Anyone have hands-on experience with it? There's a review and links to others at http://www.joy-stick.net . The AVB link is: http://www.avbtech.com/avbtech/gc_fbw7.htm . Steve B.

On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 17:55:12 -0600, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it >quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one >and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one >at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my >original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with >MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the >wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel?

I have the original, but in all reviews about the LWGP wheel I read that it is worse in every way.. no paddles, buttons are clumsy to reach, wheel is partly from plastic instead of rubber, and yesterday I read a message here on RAS that the new GP wheel come loose from the desk, which does not happen with the LWFF. I think your friend should search for the LWFF instead of the LWGP.. Andre

Someone also claimed that the LWFFGP uses gears for FF instead of cables like the original LWFF. A big minus in my book.

On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 00:37:27 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>I have the original, but in all reviews about the LWGP wheel I read >that it is worse in every way.. no paddles, buttons are clumsy to >reach, wheel is partly from plastic instead of rubber, and yesterday I >read a message here on RAS that the new GP wheel come loose from the >desk, which does not happen with the LWFF. >I think your friend should search for the LWFF instead of the LWGP.. > >Andre

I had the GP FF wheel and returned it. Not because of the paddles and buttons (they are fine IMO), but because it does come loose after a short period and you have to re-tighten it during races. Absolutely crappy clamping system. Apart from that I didn't find FF that compelling and have gone back to non-FF.

You can get the old version of LWFF for 46.00 at www.justdeals.com. Andre Warringa wrote:

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> > On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 17:55:12 -0600, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > >quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > >and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > >at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > >original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > >MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > >wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > > I have the original, but in all reviews about the LWGP wheel I read > that it is worse in every way.. no paddles, buttons are clumsy to > reach, wheel is partly from plastic instead of rubber, and yesterday I > read a message here on RAS that the new GP wheel come loose from the > desk, which does not happen with the LWFF. > I think your friend should search for the LWFF instead of the LWGP.. > > Andre

On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 17:55:12 -0600, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it >quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one >and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one >at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my >original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with >MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the >wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel?

In a hurry here, but I can reflect on this for you. I have a gameport version of the MSFF and I like it a lot. It still works great and I have no real problems with the positioning of anything on the wheel. I can reach the paddle buttons just fine unless the wheel is turned very far to one side or the other. Last week I spotted the new Logitech FF wheel for 99$ and bought it on impulse. I wasn't aware of the new vs. old thing with the Logitech wheels and wanted to try it out to see the difference. It is also USB and I wanted to free up my gameport for a MIDI connection. I don't like it as much as the MSFF mostly because it feels really cheap and small in comparison. The clamping system for the desk is kind of clunky and does come off easily. It is way outclassed by the MSFF clamp. The buttons are small and oddly placed and hard to find accurately. The shift paddle buttons are similar to the MSFF, but seem smaller and harder to reach. It may be that I have large hands so the ergonomics just aren't right for me. In the last week, reading in here about the old Logitech FF wheel with the cable-actuated FF, I wanted that one instead. I found them for $47.95 at this URL: http://store.yahoo.com/justdeals/logindev.html I ordered one right away and will be getting it next week. Why I need three wheels is not clear to me, but then again I have 4 decent PCs here, so why not (I smell LAN parties....) So I will be able to give you my opinion about all three wheels next week if anyone is interested in my opinion. ~daxe

Does anyone know of any serious competitors to the original LWFF in the same price bracket? From what I've seen, nothing else comes close to it.

I've had one for about a month now. It replaced my old T2, so I have no way to compare the GP to other FF wheels. I can't disagree about all the 'features' of the GP wheel which have been posted here but I'm happy with it. I haven't had any trouble with it coming loose, but my old T2 has had differing luck with different desks so I think it really depends on what your desk is made of and how it is finished. I'm using a pretty ordinary wooden desk with no trouble. I htink the issue of button placement is largely subjective. We all have a preferred way of holding the wheel and you'd probably get used to it anyway. I guess that depends on which games you play and how often you use the buttons? It is undoubtedly inferior to the original LWFF but it's quite a bit cheaper, at least here in Australia. Mine also came with SCGT so I was pretty happy with my AUD130 deal. Here it is much cheaper than it's competitors. All in all, I'd say it is good value for money, although not the best wheel on the market. -Nick Greg Cisko <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > -- > [email hidden]

Thanks everyone. You guys confirmed my suspicions. -- [email hidden] <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8udcp2$1ko$[email hidden]... > > I've had one for about a month now. It replaced my old T2, > so I have no way to compare the GP to other FF wheels. > > I can't disagree about all the 'features' of the GP wheel which > have been posted here but I'm happy with it. > > I haven't had any trouble with it coming loose, but my old T2 > has had differing luck with different desks so I think it > really depends on what your desk is made of and how it > is finished. I'm using a pretty ordinary wooden desk with > no trouble. > > I htink the issue of button placement is largely subjective. > We all have a preferred way of holding the wheel and you'd > probably get used to it anyway. I guess that depends on which > games you play and how often you use the buttons? > > It is undoubtedly inferior to the original LWFF but it's quite > a bit cheaper, at least here in Australia. Mine also came with > SCGT so I was pretty happy with my AUD130 deal. Here it is > much cheaper than it's competitors. > > All in all, I'd say it is good value for money, although not > the best wheel on the market. > > -Nick > > > > Greg Cisko <[email hidden]> wrote: > > I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > > quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > > and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > > at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > > original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > > MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > > wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > > > -- > > > [email hidden] > > > >

you should be very pleased with it daxe <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 17:55:12 -0600, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > >quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > >and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > >at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > >original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > >MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > >wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > > In a hurry here, but I can reflect on this for you. > > I have a gameport version of the MSFF and I like it a lot. It still > works great and I have no real problems with the positioning of > anything on the wheel. I can reach the paddle buttons just fine > unless the wheel is turned very far to one side or the other. > > Last week I spotted the new Logitech FF wheel for 99$ and bought it on > impulse. I wasn't aware of the new vs. old thing with the Logitech > wheels and wanted to try it out to see the difference. It is also USB > and I wanted to free up my gameport for a MIDI connection. > > I don't like it as much as the MSFF mostly because it feels really > cheap and small in comparison. The clamping system for the desk is > kind of clunky and does come off easily. It is way outclassed by the > MSFF clamp. The buttons are small and oddly placed and hard to find > accurately. The shift paddle buttons are similar to the MSFF, but > seem smaller and harder to reach. It may be that I have large hands > so the ergonomics just aren't right for me. > > In the last week, reading in here about the old Logitech FF wheel with > the cable-actuated FF, I wanted that one instead. I found them for > $47.95 at this URL: > > http://store.yahoo.com/justdeals/logindev.html > > I ordered one right away and will be getting it next week. Why I need > three wheels is not clear to me, but then again I have 4 decent PCs > here, so why not (I smell LAN parties....) > > So I will be able to give you my opinion about all three wheels next > week if anyone is interested in my opinion. > > ~daxe >

I had a chance to use one for a couple hours at my sister's house (brother-in-law is getting into racing). I only raced on a few games. The unit is quite light. When turning the unpowered wheel, you can feel some roughness that's not present in the old wheel, but when driving it wasn't that noticeable. The clamping system can come loose if you have to use the extenders. Overall though, the wheel wasn't that bad. It did feel more accurate (precise) than the older one, which puts it more equal to the RS and Ferrari, and the pedals had a better feel. The wheel rim is quite comfortable, though it feels light with all the plastic. So, I guess it's got good points and bad points. As everyone has been saying, it does have kind of a cheap feel to it, but they've taken care of some of the problems of the old wheel like the precision, no cables to break, better feel to the pedals and a change in the paddle shifters that will make them less likely to need adjustments to keep working (the old ones sometimes needed to be re-torqued) although they don't feel as good. You wouldn't need to replace the pedals to race GPL and the steering is more precise, so I suppose those are positive points if you're on a budget. On the other hand, I think the Ferrari wheel for $98 is still a better deal, higher quality, better feel. And if you're not on a budget, the RS wheel is a lot more rugged and the RS Shifter is fun and can now run in GPL other older games with the 3rd party shifter utility. Nutshell: If it was the only wheel you had, could you be happy with it? Yes. -- Slot Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:BFlO5.46$[email hidden]... > I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > > -- > > [email hidden] > > > >

Doug Appleyard wrote:

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> > I just ordered the old LWFF from justdeals because the > price is hard to resist. I have been using the LWFFGP. > I have the following questions about the old LWFF: > > 1. What does it mean, "*Please Note this DOES NOT INCLUDE The > USB connector!* Does it mean I just buy a USB connector > cable from BestBuys and all is well, or does it mean I have > to use my game port?

The original LWFF connected to the serial port, but also came with an adapter that allowed you to use the USB port instead. Apparently this serial port to USB port adapter is not included. -- Chuck Kandler A man is no less a Slave just because he is allowed to choose a new Master every four years. Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

that looks very nice, i like it. Steve Blankenship <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > GTX_SlotCar <[email hidden]> wrote... > > <snip>On the other hand, I think the Ferrari wheel for $98 is still abetter

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> deal, higher quality, better feel.<snip> > > To chime in with another possibility, I see AVB's selling their Magturbo > wheel through their online store for $69.95 plus shipping (US-only). This > is obviously another version of the Ferrari wheel with differences in the > pedals, button layout, and shift paddles. Anyone have hands-on experience > with it? > > There's a review and links to others at http://www.joy-stick.net . > > The AVB link is: http://www.avbtech.com/avbtech/gc_fbw7.htm . > > > Steve B. > > >

On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 11:10:58 -0500, "Steve Blankenship" <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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> >GTX_SlotCar <[email hidden]> wrote... > ><snip>On the other hand, I think the Ferrari wheel for $98 is still a better >deal, higher quality, better feel.<snip> > >To chime in with another possibility, I see AVB's selling their Magturbo >wheel through their online store for $69.95 plus shipping (US-only). This >is obviously another version of the Ferrari wheel with differences in the >pedals, button layout, and shift paddles. Anyone have hands-on experience >with it?

Don't have it, but after reading the CNET review I am not too enthused due to the wheel causing F12K to crash, a possible frame rate drop problem in some games and a poor clamping system. http://www.gamecenter.com/Hardware/Controllers/Magturbo/

> The original LWFF connected to the serial port, but also came with an > adapter that allowed you to use the USB port instead. Apparently this > serial port to USB port adapter is not included. That's a real shame, because on my system the USB connection provies a much smoother response from the wheel. The serial connection was only really ever intended for compatibility with old (non-USB) machines.

The Guillemot Ferrari FF wheel is absulutely fantastic. Uses the same I-Force cable system as the LWFF, has paddles AND a gear shift lever, and is usually cheaper. I have had no problems with it after 4 months of use and wouldn't be without it. Krunch

In article <[email hidden]>, Slash <[email hidden]> wrote: > On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 08:47:52 +1100, "Andrew Williams" > <[email hidden]> scribbled: > > >> The original LWFF connected to the serial port, but also came withan > >> adapter that allowed you to use the USB port instead. Apparentlythis > >> serial port to USB port adapter is not included. > > > >That's a real shame, because on my system the USB connection proviesa much > >smoother response from the wheel. The serial connection was onlyreally > >ever intended for compatibility with old (non-USB) machines. > > Does anyone know if it'd be possible to get this adapter seperately > somewhere? > I have Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D joystick. Its cord has a serial jack. But it came with a short female-serial-to-male-USB adapter cord which I use to plug the stick into one of my computer's USB slots. I wonder if I can use this with the old LWFF wheel I just ordered from justdeals? -- Doug Appleyard "Got us a Dirt Track Date, demolition derby figure 8" -- Southern Culture On The Skids Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Doug Appleyard wrote:

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> > I have Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D joystick. > Its cord has a serial jack. But it came with > a short female-serial-to-male-USB adapter cord which > I use to plug the stick into one of my computer's USB > slots. I wonder if I can use this with the old LWFF > wheel I just ordered from justdeals?

Sounds like the very same thing to me. Go for it. -- Chuck Kandler A man is no less a Slave just because he is allowed to choose a new Master every four years. Registered Linux User #180746 http://counter.li.org

On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 02:15:51 GMT, Doug Appleyard <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I have Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D joystick. >Its cord has a serial jack. But it came with >a short female-serial-to-male-USB adapter cord which >I use to plug the stick into one of my computer's USB >slots. I wonder if I can use this with the old LWFF >wheel I just ordered from justdeals? If it doesn't then contact Logitech and say you lost your serial>usb adapter and would like to buy one off them. Maybe they keep this part in stock. I'm considering ordering the old LWFF wheel from Justdeals too, but they just emailed me and said shipping to Canada is $29.95 USD. Gulp!

its worth it! i paid a total of 70 dollars for mine and still feel like i got a great deal. Amp <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 02:15:51 GMT, Doug Appleyard > <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > > >I have Logitech Wingman Extreme Digital 3D joystick. > >Its cord has a serial jack. But it came with > >a short female-serial-to-male-USB adapter cord which > >I use to plug the stick into one of my computer's USB > >slots. I wonder if I can use this with the old LWFF > >wheel I just ordered from justdeals? > > If it doesn't then contact Logitech and say you lost your serial>usb > adapter and would like to buy one off them. Maybe they keep this part > in stock. I'm considering ordering the old LWFF wheel from Justdeals > too, but they just emailed me and said shipping to Canada is $29.95 > USD. Gulp!

On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 16:22:22 -0900, Slash <[email hidden]> wrote: >Does anyone know if it'd be possible to get this adapter seperately >somewhere? Sounds like a pretty standard computer store item to me. ~daxe

It's made by the same company that makes the Ferrari wheel. They also market it under their own name. The AVB wheel has some cheaper parts and is a little stripped down compared to the Ferrari. The basic case casting is about the same as is the wheel rim and, I assume, the electronics. The shifter paddles look a little cheaper, it doesn't have column mounted gas and brakes, and has no stick shifter. I wonder how well it would hold up. BTW, the Ferrari wheel will be replaced by the Modena in a while. The wheel will look similar to this: http://www.automotriz.net/images/modena/02.jpg Sorry about linking directly to the pic without going through the site. -- Slot www.slottweak.com Tweaks & Reviews Steve Blankenship <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > GTX_SlotCar <[email hidden]> wrote... > > <snip>On the other hand, I think the Ferrari wheel for $98 is still a better > deal, higher quality, better feel.<snip> > > To chime in with another possibility, I see AVB's selling their Magturbo > wheel through their online store for $69.95 plus shipping (US-only). This > is obviously another version of the Ferrari wheel with differences in the > pedals, button layout, and shift paddles. Anyone have hands-on experience > with it? > > There's a review and links to others at http://www.joy-stick.net . > > The AVB link is: http://www.avbtech.com/avbtech/gc_fbw7.htm . > > > Steve B. > > >

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 17:06:10 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> scribbled:

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>On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:20:00 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) wrote: > >>Daxe, >>bring back the new Logi GP, > >I'm more likely to give it to someone as a gift. I'm not a >"returner."

<subliminal mode on> Boy, one of these days I've gotta get myself a wheel. Playing with a gamepad just isn't fun any more. :( <subliminal mode off> ;)

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>>and try to mount the MSFF-clamp under the LWFF ;-) >>the MS clamps are excellent from what I heard > >The MS clamp really holds well and engages and disengages in a second. >However, removing it from the MSFF would mean I couldn't use that >wheel which is so far still my favorite. > >Thanks for your suggestions, though! > >~daxe

-Slash -- -- -- -- "The people on the internet know more about what I am doing than I do. Like, they will say that I am going to be in this mall on this day and sure enough I am there." - Tori Amos, Dew Drop Inn Tour, 17-June-1996

Hehe, pouring fuel? ;-) JensSchumi BTW: You are right. One more thing: According to my observations the cable drive was too difficult to assemble for their (most likely) underpaid stuff in China. But, as we all know (from a reply by Logitech-support), we all are even more stupid and untalented to dis- and assemble this wheel. <sarcasm off> On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 19:26:41 GMT, [email hidden] (Raymond, ACT LABS) wrote:

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>Hello, > >Indeed, the newer wheel uses gears rather than cables (less costly for >them to produce gears). > >Raymond >ACT LABS >www.act-labs.com >

--------------------------------------------- LWFF Ball Bearing conversion at: http://members.nbci.com/JensSchu/ GPLRank: -2.61

Andrew, there are a number of wheels out there, which are highly praised by their owners. IMO in the moment the LWFF cannot be beaten (price/value), since it's for sale for less than 50 bucks. JensSchumi On Thu, 9 Nov 2000 16:08:02 +1100, "Andrew Williams" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Does anyone know of any serious competitors to the original LWFF in the same >price bracket? From what I've seen, nothing else comes close to it. > --------------------------------------------- LWFF Ball Bearing conversion at: http://members.nbci.com/JensSchu/ GPLRank: -2.61

Daxe, bring back the new Logi GP, and try to mount the MSFF-clamp under the LWFF ;-) the MS clamps are excellent from what I heard JensSchumi On Thu, 09 Nov 2000 04:29:05 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> >In a hurry here, but I can reflect on this for you. > >I have a gameport version of the MSFF and I like it a lot. It still >works great and I have no real problems with the positioning of >anything on the wheel. I can reach the paddle buttons just fine >unless the wheel is turned very far to one side or the other.

<snip> --------------------------------------------- LWFF Ball Bearing conversion at: http://members.nbci.com/JensSchu/ GPLRank: -2.61

Amp, I know the answer already: We don't consider the user being capable of dismantling such a high-technology item. So we don't stock USB-adapters and we strongly advise the user to purchase a complete unit for his convenience. If wished, discount of US$ 20 can be granted on returning the existing wheel (shipping paid by sender) <sarcasm off> JensSchumi On Fri, 10 Nov 2000 09:54:19 GMT, [email hidden] (Amp) wrote: > >If it doesn't then contact Logitech and say you lost your serial>usb >adapter and would like to buy one off them. Maybe they keep this part >in stock. I'm considering ordering the old LWFF wheel from Justdeals >too, but they just emailed me and said shipping to Canada is $29.95 >USD. Gulp! --------------------------------------------- LWFF Ball Bearing conversion at: http://members.nbci.com/JensSchu/ GPLRank: -2.61

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:20:01 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) thus spoke:

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>Amp, >I know the answer already: >We don't consider the user being capable of dismantling such a high-technology >item. So we don't stock USB-adapters and we strongly advise the user to purchase >a complete unit for his convenience. >If wished, discount of US$ 20 can be granted on returning the existing wheel >(shipping paid by sender) > ><sarcasm off>

Yea, I'll have to pass because USB is a must have for me. Besides that, they also want me to send my Visa number via email. No way.

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:20:00 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) wrote: >Daxe, >bring back the new Logi GP, I'm more likely to give it to someone as a gift. I'm not a "returner." >and try to mount the MSFF-clamp under the LWFF ;-) >the MS clamps are excellent from what I heard The MS clamp really holds well and engages and disengages in a second. However, removing it from the MSFF would mean I couldn't use that wheel which is so far still my favorite. Thanks for your suggestions, though! ~daxe

On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 18:55:18 -0900, Slash <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 17:06:10 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> >scribbled: > >>On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:20:00 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) wrote: >> >>>Daxe, >>>bring back the new Logi GP, >> >>I'm more likely to give it to someone as a gift. I'm not a >>"returner." > ><subliminal mode on> > >Boy, one of these days I've gotta get myself a wheel. Playing with a >gamepad just isn't fun any more. :( > ><subliminal mode off> > >;)

..hmmmm did somebody say something?... ~daxe

I ordered a LWFF from Justdeals, and it =did= come with the serial-to-USB adapter. But then again, maybe I just got lucky. - Bubba In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> Doug Appleyard wrote: > > > > I just ordered the old LWFF from justdeals because the > > price is hard to resist. I have been using the LWFFGP. > > I have the following questions about the old LWFF: > > > > 1. What does it mean, "*Please Note this DOES NOT INCLUDE The > > USB connector!* Does it mean I just buy a USB connector > > cable from BestBuys and all is well, or does it mean I have > > to use my game port? > > The original LWFF connected to the serial port, but also came with an > adapter that allowed you to use the USB port instead. Apparently

this

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> serial port to USB port adapter is not included. > > -- > > Chuck Kandler > >

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Actually, the Ferrari wheel uses belts similar to, but thinner than, those used in the Force RS. Only the LWFF uses cables. In article <8ufl3t$jis$[email hidden]>, "Krunch" <[email hidden]> wrote: > The Guillemot Ferrari FF wheel is absulutely fantastic. Uses the same > I-Force cable system as the LWFF, has paddles AND a gear shift lever,and is > usually cheaper. I have had no problems with it after 4 months of useand > wouldn't be without it. > > Krunch > > -- Slot Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

Can anyone here recommend the new model Logitech FF wheel? Any suggestions, comments, good or bad, alternatives to look at, seen any reviews? Come on guys, lets hear from you. Thanks, KA

I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitech clamps are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto the table from time to time. The Logitech hasn't moved on me yet. Oh, and it works with Windows 2000. The Gameport version of the MSFFW doesn't (with full capabilities), and it looks like MS has no intention of supporting it's customers with a SideWinder update :( -Larry "daxe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 02:20:00 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) wrote: > > >Daxe, > >bring back the new Logi GP, > > I'm more likely to give it to someone as a gift. I'm not a > "returner." > > >and try to mount the MSFF-clamp under the LWFF ;-) > >the MS clamps are excellent from what I heard > > The MS clamp really holds well and engages and disengages in a second. > However, removing it from the MSFF would mean I couldn't use that > wheel which is so far still my favorite. > > Thanks for your suggestions, though! > > ~daxe

On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:31:27 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: >I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitech clamps >are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. > >With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto the table >from time to time. Is the clamp on the MSFFW the same as the one on the MSPPW? If so then I can't believe what you are saying. The clamp on the MS wheel is way better than those crappy hex screws on the GP wheel. The GP wheel only clamps the edge of the desk and comes lose continuously. If they didn't then why would that guy design a contraption to correct the problem? The MS clamp secures firmly about 6inches into the desk (depth). No comparison.

[email hidden] (Amp) writes:

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> On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:31:27 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitech clamps > >are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. > > > >With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto the table > >from time to time. > > Is the clamp on the MSFFW the same as the one on the MSPPW? If so then > I can't believe what you are saying. The clamp on the MS wheel is way > better than those crappy hex screws on the GP wheel. The GP wheel only > clamps the edge of the desk and comes lose continuously. If they > didn't then why would that guy design a contraption to correct the > problem? The MS clamp secures firmly about 6inches into the desk > (depth). No comparison.

Well, If you have a table like mine where there is this vertical board about three inches from the edge of the table, the MSFF doesn't really work at all without careful driving. I can't apply any other forces to the wheel than tortion. When other people try GPL they pull the wheel off the table :) -- Olav K. Malmin remove .spam when replying

On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 08:52:37 -0000, "Keith Archer" <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>Can anyone here recommend the new model Logitech FF wheel? > >Any suggestions, comments, good or bad, alternatives to look at, seen any >reviews? > >Come on guys, lets hear from you. > >Thanks, > >KA > >

I had it and returned it. It has a gritty feel to it and the clamping system is horrible. IMO.

On 13 Nov 2000 11:06:57 +0100, [email hidden] (Olav K. Malmin) thus spoke: >Well, If you have a table like mine where there is this vertical board >about three inches from the edge of the table, the MSFF doesn't really >work at all without careful driving. I can't apply any other forces to >the wheel than tortion. When other people try GPL they pull the wheel >off the table :) I see. Yes, the MS clamping system is no good in your situation or for anyone with one of those keyboard trays that sits under the desk. It clamps too far deep into the desk if you have such a setup.

On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:31:27 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitech clamps >are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. As someone else noted, this may have to do with the thickness of your desk. I use a huge antique table from a sewing factory as a computer desk and it has a 3/4 inch lip all the way around it. I had to use the extenders to clamp it on. Plus, the Logitech still feels like a toy. >With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto the table >from time to time. I never have to do this with the MSFF but I have to do it consantly with the LWFFGP. Go figure. Not only that, the wheel downshifts when I shove it back on the desk! >Oh, and it works with Windows 2000. The Gameport version of the MSFFW >doesn't (with full capabilities), and it looks like MS has no intention of >supporting it's customers with a SideWinder update :( I'm sure they would just say you were using the wrong OS for games. Oh, well. ~daxe

On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 06:18:55 GMT, [email hidden] (Amp) wrote:

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>On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:31:27 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > >>I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitech clamps >>are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. >> >>With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto the table >>from time to time. > >Is the clamp on the MSFFW the same as the one on the MSPPW? If so then >I can't believe what you are saying. The clamp on the MS wheel is way >better than those crappy hex screws on the GP wheel. The GP wheel only >clamps the edge of the desk and comes lose continuously. If they >didn't then why would that guy design a contraption to correct the >problem? The MS clamp secures firmly about 6inches into the desk >(depth). No comparison.

I agree with you, amp. I think it's the fact that the LWFFGP only clamps at the front. It may be different for different people, too. A lot of folks I have try out my setup who are not sim racers yank the MSFF wheel right off the desk in about 20 seconds. ~daxe

"Keith Archer" a �crit dans le message news: > Can anyone here recommend the new model Logitech FF wheel? > > Any suggestions, comments, good or bad, alternatives to look at, seen any > reviews? > > Come on guys, lets hear from you. Hi, I got one of those new wheel and i kind of like it now although it took some getting used to and a few pieces of rubber underneat to hold the damn thing on the table. I prefer the older steering wheel i have on the non-ff (yellow) logitech though. But overtime it's nice to feel the road with this new wheel, i never tried the previous one so i can't compare them, but for the price i paid, i'm satisfy. C. G.

Opps, I made a mistake about the Modena. It is going to be the European version of the Pro Digital 2. The Ferrari is still current and is temporarily backordered at many places. -- Slot Tweaks & Reviews www.slottweak.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.

In article <[email hidden]>, Amp <[email hidden]> writes

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>On 13 Nov 2000 11:06:57 +0100, [email hidden] (Olav K. >Malmin) thus spoke: > > >>Well, If you have a table like mine where there is this vertical board >>about three inches from the edge of the table, the MSFF doesn't really >>work at all without careful driving. I can't apply any other forces to >>the wheel than tortion. When other people try GPL they pull the wheel >>off the table :) > >I see. Yes, the MS clamping system is no good in your situation or for >anyone with one of those keyboard trays that sits under the desk. It >clamps too far deep into the desk if you have such a setup.

Works fine for me. I put the keyboard on the desk and clamp the wheel to the keyboard tray, works a treat. -- Sean Black

Daxe, removing the clamp from the MSFF was more on the joke-side. JensSchumi On Sat, 11 Nov 2000 17:06:10 GMT, daxe <[email hidden]> wrote: <snip>

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>The MS clamp really holds well and engages and disengages in a second. >However, removing it from the MSFF would mean I couldn't use that >wheel which is so far still my favorite. > >Thanks for your suggestions, though! > >~daxe

--------------------------------------------- LWFF Ball Bearing conversion at: http://members.nbci.com/JensSchu/ GPLRank: -2.61

On Tue, 14 Nov 2000 03:54:44 GMT, [email hidden] (JS) wrote: >Daxe, >removing the clamp from the MSFF was more on the joke-side. > >JensSchumi DOH!! Thanks, JS. ~dx

It's not that bad, short of the damned squeak mine has developed. It's actually quite stout for such a lightweight. Only _some_ have problems with the wheel loosening. I believe it depends on if you are using the extenders or not. In any case, a stick-on rubber pad on each clamp from Radio Shack will fix it. -Larry "Andre Warringa" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Wed, 8 Nov 2000 17:55:12 -0600, "Greg Cisko" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >I have the original Logitech Formula Force and like it > >quite a bit. A friend of mine was looking at getting one > >and was looking at one of the new versions. I saw one > >at a local best buy and think it is way worse than my > >original wheel. The paddled have been replaces with > >MS-FF type buttons which immediately makes the > >wheel suck IMHO. Does anyone have this new wheel? > > I have the original, but in all reviews about the LWGP wheel I read > that it is worse in every way.. no paddles, buttons are clumsy to > reach, wheel is partly from plastic instead of rubber, and yesterday I > read a message here on RAS that the new GP wheel come loose from the > desk, which does not happen with the LWFF. > I think your friend should search for the LWFF instead of the LWGP.. > > Andre

The MS clamp is spongy. You can move the wheel up and down quite a bit. I stand by what I said whether you belive it or not :) I was ALWAYS having to re-position the MSFFW and have yet had to re-position the Force GP. I prefer the MSFFW, but MS is proving their statement that Win2K is a business operating system by not supporting their controllers under it. -Larry "Amp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Mon, 13 Nov 2000 01:31:27 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> thus spoke: > > >I went from a MSFFW to the Logitech Force GP. I think the Logitechclamps > >are FAR more secure than the MSFFW. > > > >With the MSFFW, I was forever having to push the wheel back onto thetable

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> >from time to time. > > Is the clamp on the MSFFW the same as the one on the MSPPW? If so then > I can't believe what you are saying. The clamp on the MS wheel is way > better than those crappy hex screws on the GP wheel. The GP wheel only > clamps the edge of the desk and comes lose continuously. If they > didn't then why would that guy design a contraption to correct the > problem? The MS clamp secures firmly about 6inches into the desk > (depth). No comparison.

On Sat, 25 Nov 2000 08:32:05 GMT, "Larry" <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>The MS clamp is spongy. You can move the wheel up and down quite a bit. > >I stand by what I said whether you belive it or not :) I was ALWAYS having >to re-position the MSFFW and have yet had to re-position the Force GP. > >I prefer the MSFFW, but MS is proving their statement that Win2K is a >business operating system by not supporting their controllers under it. >

I don't have the MSFF wheel, but I do have the MSPP wheel which uses the same clamnping system. It doesn't budge at all on my desk.