OT: Ticket prices, CART at Rockingham

Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): Practice Day only: $36.85. Qualifying Day only: $60.00 Race tickets: Race day only: from $110.80 to $146.76, with limited premier seating for $219.81. I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so...

In article <[email hidden]>, Bart Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: > Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, > check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at > Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): You ain't kidding! Five of us over here were planning on going, taking wives/girlfriends, etc, but we found out the prices about a week ago and took a very sharp intake of breath. Just hope they're not trying to get all their investment back in one go.... Colin Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

On Sun, 17 Dec 2000 08:30:32 GMT, Bart Brown <[email hidden]> thus spoke:

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>Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, >check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at >Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > >Practice Day only: $36.85. >Qualifying Day only: $60.00 >Race tickets: Race day only: from $110.80 to $146.76, with limited >premier seating for $219.81. > >I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so... > >

The U.K. gets it up the ass again. :-)

>"Bart Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote <snip> > I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so... How sad, but this somehow is the same for every form of serious professional motorsport in the UK. It's *way* over-priced, hopefully there is enough demand for it. Rockingham is surely not a place where CART would love to see 50% attendance. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

In article <0C1%5.13137$[email hidden]>, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote: > >"Bart Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote <snip> > > I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so... > > How sad, but this somehow is the same for every form of seriousprofessional > motorsport in the UK. It's *way* over-priced, hopefully there isenough > demand for it. To be fair, TOCA isn't over-priced, (I paid �22 0r about $40ish for a weekend's worth at Donny and also Thruxton) but then again it's fighting for survival. Half-full it may not be, as it's the first one, it'll get a lot of people like myself, who want to say they were there.Subsequent ones, though, had better come down in price dramatically. Colin Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

I think they have to stump up the bill, along with the Lauzenring, for getting all the teams and their equpiment over here. Bart Brown wrote:

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> Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, > check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at > Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > > Practice Day only: $36.85. > Qualifying Day only: $60.00 > Race tickets: Race day only: from $110.80 to $146.76, with limited > premier seating for $219.81. > > I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so...

-- Rob Swindells /////////////

That's outrageous! What a rip-off!!! The CART race in Houston that my Wife and I attended last year cost us $100 per ticket, for all three days (Fri-Sun) which included an SCCA Trans-Am race and a Toyota Atlantic race too! Pit/Paddock passes were $40 for all three days, and allowed you to go into the air conditioned convention center they were using as the paddock to see the cars, teams and drivers up close (this was a particular bonus, as Houston in September is VERY hot and humid, each day was over 95 degrees F. !) I have to wonder just how popular CART racing is in England and Europe anyway? I mean, now that Blundell is out, and there isn't any concrete word on Herbert, just how many Europeans are there in the Fed-Ex CART series? Probably fewer than there are Americans (only 3 this year that I can think of!) If this event and the one in Germany doesn't sell out, it will be quite embarrassing to see empty grandstands on TV at an inaugural event! Just goes to show you what kind of incompetence runs that series :-( Jay J <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:91i1bl$ebu$[email hidden]...

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> In article <[email hidden]>, > Bart Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: > > Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, > > check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at > > Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > > You ain't kidding! Five of us over here were planning on going, taking > wives/girlfriends, etc, but we found out the prices about a week ago > and took a very sharp intake of breath. Just hope they're not trying to > get all their investment back in one go.... > > > Colin > > > Sent via Deja.com > http://www.deja.com/

Unfortunately, professional motorsporsport in general is hugely overpriced in the UK - think yourselves lucky you don't have to shell out well over �100 for the British GP. Rockingham are making the usual excuses about equipment costs - in fact, they're just trying to screw the British public for every penny they can get. A part of me would love to see half-empty grandstands - bu then CART might not come back at all... -- David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.92) The GPL Scrapyard - http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.

ymenard wrote: > Rockingham is surely not a place where CART would love to > see 50% attendance. Indeed. The full article goes on to compare Rockingham's prices to other venues, and especially to the German 500, the other European CART race on this season's schedule -- and note that Rockingham is splitting the CART air transport costs with the German event. Kinda hard to fathom for a series which doesn't exactly have a huge audience in Europe... The author of this article goes on to say that this is THE topic of many of the CART/Indy online boards, and EVERYONE is screaming bloody murder. (NOTE: the prices in this excerpt are in Canadian dolla; in the original message I posted, I had already converted them to $US) From 10-Tenths: " ... Next I went to the site for the German 500, the other new race. [Another thing the Rockingham people forgot to mention, in their protest that they had "flyaway" costs to this race that other races did not have, was that they are splitting the flyaway costs with Germany.] This is what I found there: This is the same criteria I used above - the lowest available price for midlevel reserved seats over 3 days: Friday; $19-$38 Saturday: $12-$24 Sunday: $55-$173 Bottom line at Rockingham - $304 Bottom line at German 500 - $143.62"

"Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I think they have to stump up the bill, along with the Lauzenring, for > getting all the teams and their equpiment over here. > I'd like to compare this with what the Aussies pay. I still think this is another case of-rip off Britain Alan

>Unfortunately, professional motorsporsport in general is hugely overpriced >in the UK - think yourselves lucky you don't have to shell out well over >�100 for the British GP. *Everything* is overpriced here! For example it still cracks me up when Americans complain about their petrol prices... If only they knew what they were missing :-) -- Cheers! Graeme Nash

There are actually a lot of Europeans in CART, Max Papis and Oriol Servia (I know I am spelling his first name wrong) and Kenny Brack come to mind first. That price is not that bad really. I was talking with some people from England at the US GP and the entire price to come to the US, spend three days in Indy and four in Daytona was cheaper then going to the Silverstone GP. -Stuart Becktell "Jay J" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:U86%5.41626$[email hidden]... > That's outrageous! What a rip-off!!! > > The CART race in Houston that my Wife and I attended last year cost us$100 > per ticket, for all three days (Fri-Sun) which included an SCCA Trans-Am > race and a Toyota Atlantic race too! > > Pit/Paddock passes were $40 for all three days, and allowed you to go into > the air conditioned convention center they were using as the paddock tosee > the cars, teams and drivers up close (this was a particular bonus, as > Houston in September is VERY hot and humid, each day was over 95 degreesF. > !) > > I have to wonder just how popular CART racing is in England and Europe > anyway? I mean, now that Blundell is out, and there isn't any concreteword

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> on Herbert, just how many Europeans are there in the Fed-Ex CART series? > Probably fewer than there are Americans (only 3 this year that I can think > of!) > > If this event and the one in Germany doesn't sell out, it will be quite > embarrassing to see empty grandstands on TV at an inaugural event! > > Just goes to show you what kind of incompetence runs that series :-( > > Jay J > > > <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:91i1bl$ebu$[email hidden]... > > In article <[email hidden]>, > > Bart Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, > > > check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at > > > Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > > > > You ain't kidding! Five of us over here were planning on going, taking > > wives/girlfriends, etc, but we found out the prices about a week ago > > and took a very sharp intake of breath. Just hope they're not trying to > > get all their investment back in one go.... > > > > > > Colin > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com > > http://www.deja.com/ > >

In article <U86%5.41626$[email hidden]>, "Jay J" <[email hidden]> wrote: > That's outrageous! What a rip-off!!! <SNIP> > Just goes to show you what kind of incompetence runs that series :-( There was a slight ray of hope for the short period of time when Bobby Rahal was temporarily at the helm, but once they named Craig's permanent successor, it sounded a lot like the final nail being driven into the coffin to me. Can anybody else say "Formula 5000?" Can anybody else REMEMBER Formula 5000? - JB Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/

>"Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote > I think they have to stump up the bill, along with the Lauzenring, for > getting all the teams and their equpiment over here. Same goes for Rio, or Surfer's Paradise. They don't have incredibly high ticket prices because of that. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.WeRace.net -- People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

If memory serves me correctly, I think you'll find that those prices are in Dollars, but in pounds!! "Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I think they have to stump up the bill, along with the Lauzenring, for > getting all the teams and their equpiment over here. > > Bart Brown wrote: > > > Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, > > check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at > > Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > > > > Practice Day only: $36.85. > > Qualifying Day only: $60.00 > > Race tickets: Race day only: from $110.80 to $146.76, with limited > > premier seating for $219.81. > > > > I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so... > > -- > Rob Swindells > ///////////// > >

On 17 Dec 2000 18:04:42 GMT, [email hidden] (David Buttery) wrote:

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>Unfortunately, professional motorsporsport in general is hugely overpriced >in the UK - think yourselves lucky you don't have to shell out well over >�100 for the British GP. > >Rockingham are making the usual excuses about equipment costs - in fact, >they're just trying to screw the British public for every penny they can >get. A part of me would love to see half-empty grandstands - bu then CART >might not come back at all...

I think it's very unfortunate for the UK motorsport fans, but it's a simple matter of supply and demand. There's a big audience for motorsport in the UK, so the prices are higher. I don't think you can blame any business venture for trying to maximize their revenue. -Matt S.

I WAS going to go to Rockingham, after all it was reasonable to expect CART prices to be similar in the UK as in the US - wasn't it? But no. Instead of say, �50 / �60 on raceday, I've got to shell out as much as the British Grand Prix. We continue to be persistantly screwed over by "The System" (who or whatever that might be!) Guess I'll have to stick to Castle Combe (�10 all in!!!) - and more overtaking than F1 - just less than Cart. Doug "Graeme Nash" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ga$[email hidden]... > > >Unfortunately, professional motorsporsport in general is hugelyoverpriced

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> >in the UK - think yourselves lucky you don't have to shell out well over > >�100 for the British GP. > > *Everything* is overpriced here! > > For example it still cracks me up when Americans complain about their > petrol prices... If only they knew what they were missing :-) > > -- > Cheers! > Graeme Nash

Matthew D. Sullivan wrote on 18 Dec 2000: >I think it's very unfortunate for the UK motorsport fans, but it's a >simple matter of supply and demand. There's a big audience for >motorsport in the UK, so the prices are higher. I don't think you can >blame any business venture for trying to maximize their revenue. Same argument football clubs use for pricing out ordinary fans in favour of yuppies... and they'll have to change their tune if they do get half-empty seats. In any case, this is so short-term in its thinking. If you want a future for motorsport, you have to attract young fans - who are generally not that well off. -- David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.92) The GPL Scrapyard - http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.

> The CART race in Houston that my Wife and I attended last year cost us$100 > per ticket, for all three days (Fri-Sun) which included an SCCA Trans-Am > race and a Toyota Atlantic race too! > > Pit/Paddock passes were $40 for all three days, and allowed you to go into Cool!!! I'll be there in 2001 :) Hena

"Jay J" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:U86%5.41626$[email hidden]... > That's outrageous! What a rip-off!!! > Just goes to show you what kind of incompetence runs that series :-( > > Jay J I agree that the stated prices, if true, are too high, but you must realize that CART does not set the ticket prices, that is up to the whims of the promoter. Go to the forums at www.cart.com and register your complaints, there are some good folks working there and they will get the word to the higher ups at CART, who may be able to put some pressure on the promoters to drop the prices a bit. -- don New GPL Programs for the Converted Tracks: http://www.ianparker.co.uk/gpl/bapom/

"David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In any case, this is so short-term in its thinking. If you want a future > for motorsport, you have to attract young fans - who are generally notthat > well off. Somebody carve that into stone and place it where every race promoter in the world will see it! -- don New GPL Programs for the Converted Tracks: http://www.ianparker.co.uk/gpl/bapom/

Well, CART isn't carried on live television a lot of the time in the UK, and certainly not on normal TV. Eurosport (A satellite and cable channel) show live CART about 75% of the time - maybe less...so I'd suggest that the interest in CART in the UK is vastley over exagerated. I think that Rockingham are going to have a very bad time of it when they don't sell out, and we see empty seats on the TV. Doug "don hodgdon" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:91l5qv$a6b$[email hidden]...

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> > "David Buttery" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In any case, this is so short-term in its thinking. If you want a future > > for motorsport, you have to attract young fans - who are generally not > that > > well off. > > Somebody carve that into stone and place it where every race promoter in

the

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> world will see it! > > -- > don > > New GPL Programs for the Converted Tracks: > http://www.ianparker.co.uk/gpl/bapom/ > > > >

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> > That's outrageous! What a rip-off!!! > > <SNIP> > > > Just goes to show you what kind of incompetence runs that series :-( > > There was a slight ray of hope for the short period of time when Bobby > Rahal was temporarily at the helm, but once they named Craig's > permanent successor, it sounded a lot like the final nail being driven > into the coffin to me. > > Can anybody else say "Formula 5000?" Can anybody else REMEMBER Formula > 5000?

My Dad can. I saw one in an all-comers race at Castle Combe (Southwest England) about 4 years ago, and wondered what the hell it was. Was soundly beaten by ex-FF1600s and FF2000s. Andy

> I WAS going to go to Rockingham, after all it was reasonable to expectCART > prices to be similar in the UK as in the US - wasn't it? But no. Insteadof > say, �50 / �60 on raceday, I've got to shell out as much as the British > Grand Prix. > > We continue to be persistantly screwed over by "The System" (who orwhatever > that might be!) > > Guess I'll have to stick to Castle Combe (�10 all in!!!) - and more > overtaking than F1 - just less than Cart. I'm yet to find better value than CC ... even after 16 years of attendance. I got to see Johnny Herbert, and Mark Blundell on my first appearance there, and I've been a fan of Johnny ever since. Andy

Did somebody mention Castle Combe??? Would love to see that in a sim....... :-) Colin Andy Laurence <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:pWp%5.2465$[email hidden]... > > I WAS going to go to Rockingham, after all it was reasonable to expect > CART > > prices to be similar in the UK as in the US - wasn't it? But no.Instead

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> of > > say, �50 / �60 on raceday, I've got to shell out as much as the British > > Grand Prix. > > > > We continue to be persistantly screwed over by "The System" (who or > whatever > > that might be!) > > > > Guess I'll have to stick to Castle Combe (�10 all in!!!) - and more > > overtaking than F1 - just less than Cart. > > I'm yet to find better value than CC ... even after 16 years of

attendance. > I got to see Johnny Herbert, and Mark Blundell on my first appearancethere, > and I've been a fan of Johnny ever since. > > Andy > >

"Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Bap%5.13865$[email hidden]... > Well, CART isn't carried on live television a lot of the time in the UK,and > certainly not on normal TV. Its not live on basic terrestrial TV here in the UK, but it is shown on basic terrestrial TV on about a days delay and being at University now I am thankful for that. > Eurosport (A satellite and cable channel) show live CART about 75% of the > time - maybe less...so I'd suggest that the interest in CART in the UK is > vastley over exagerated. 75%, thats a bit over-exagerated, maybe 25% I think in all Motegi, Vancouver, Toronto and Houston were the only races shown live, several were shown on various delays of up to a day and then heavily butchered to about 40 mins in an unsensituve fashion and two were not shown at all (Detroit, Gateway). When the contract stupulated at the start of the year by CART.com was 12 live races, 6 short delays and 2 longer delays. It was about as far from that as possible. To give them a fair shake of it their season review from Rockingham the other night wasn't bad, but they did steel a lot of features from past editions of Inside CART. > > > In any case, this is so short-term in its thinking. If you want afuture > > > for motorsport, you have to attract young fans - who are generally not > > that well off. > > > > Somebody carve that into stone and place it where every race promoter inthe > > world will see it! This is very true, I have been following the series for almost four years now and I am a student and I can just about afford possibly to get a means of seeing the races on TV next year, I was dearly willing to go and I was ready to pay up to about �60 for a seat, but this is a huge amount of money and travel just for the day would easily be twice that and it is just something I cannot afford. I am also disappointed that the F1 race here in the UK didn't end up at Brands Hatch as I could walk there from home. :( -- Adam Hatton

On Sun, 17 Dec 2000 08:30:32 GMT, Bart Brown <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Buckos, if you think attending a race here in the States costs a bit, >check out these prices ($US) for the upcoming inaugural CART race at >Rockingham, England (from 10-Tenths Motorsport): > >Practice Day only: $36.85. >Qualifying Day only: $60.00 >Race tickets: Race day only: from $110.80 to $146.76, with limited >premier seating for $219.81. > >I certainly hope those prices include VAT, but even so... >

Yeah - I mean I am a dedicated follower of motorsports, and will go, especially as I am quite close in the West Midlands but the price does stink I feel, especially for families. However Rockingham/Cart whoever seem to me to be making a terrible strategic mistake. The fact of the matter is that getting the public to see anything other than F1 or TOCA in the UK verges on the impossible. I go to other national/club/historic meetings at Silverstone/Donington/Mallory/Oulton and others during the season and am struck by the lack of spectators. In fact following the UK Historic Finals at Silverstone this autumn, columnist Marcus Pye writing in Autosport commented that he knew most of the people in the (thinly-populated) main grandstand ! It seems to me to be no way to market a new product/brand. I just hope that CART coverage this coming season will be sufficiently comprehensive on both terrestial and satellite TV to attract people on the day, or the organisers will get a bloody nose. Ian

Next time you're @ CC - pop a head around the Kevin Mills Racing awning in the paddock and ask if Kev's mum will make you some tea....Good to see John Hutch' do well last year - I introduced him to data logging and re-figured his racing lap - took 0.5 off his laps in a real nasty car!!! That's why I'm so keen for GPLEA to do a CC for GPL Doug "Andy Laurence" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:pWp%5.2465$[email hidden]... > > I WAS going to go to Rockingham, after all it was reasonable to expect > CART > > prices to be similar in the UK as in the US - wasn't it? But no.Instead

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> of > > say, �50 / �60 on raceday, I've got to shell out as much as the British > > Grand Prix. > > > > We continue to be persistantly screwed over by "The System" (who or > whatever > > that might be!) > > > > Guess I'll have to stick to Castle Combe (�10 all in!!!) - and more > > overtaking than F1 - just less than Cart. > > I'm yet to find better value than CC ... even after 16 years of

attendance. > I got to see Johnny Herbert, and Mark Blundell on my first appearancethere, > and I've been a fan of Johnny ever since. > > Andy > >

You people are all missing the point. Premier motor racing is NOT a sport for the fans anymore in the UK. It's for the suits to sell their wares and Rockingham will be full of their customers chomping on their canapes and guzzling back their Bucks Fizz. Those quiet turbo engines are far less intrusive than F1 screamers when closing a deal <G> !! MS