Mosport in GPL- still a mysetry to me

No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out. Now granted my PB is a 1:23.95...so im not really slow...but I cant figure out how to go faster. I turn a lap that "feels" slow and its near my PB. Then I go out and really attack the track and end up with a lap that "feels" fast but is almost 3 seconds off my average pace. At almost every other track if I run a fast lap I know it...I dont even have to see the lap time to know its fast (except the ring...cant tell jack there either). Is Mosport one of those "go slow to go fast" tracks? Has anyone else noticed this here? And I know the time is in the track...but where is it? What turn (or turns) save you the most time? Any help with solving this riddle would be appreciated. Chris 44.64 GPLRank and falling...

Have you downloaded any fast lap replays? It sometimes helps to watch the really fast guys to see where they are gaining the time. You can also compare your laps to theirs using Replay Analyzer to see where you are losing most of your time. Mind you, it can be depressing to see how much faster the good guys are. If you'd like, I can start you off with my 1:23.01 PB replay :) "Schlomo4" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out.Now > granted my PB is a 1:23.95...so im not really slow...but I cant figure outhow > to go faster. I turn a lap that "feels" slow and its near my PB. Then Igo > out and really attack the track and end up with a lap that "feels" fastbut is > almost 3 seconds off my average pace. At almost every other track if Irun a > fast lap I know it...I dont even have to see the lap time to know its fast > (except the ring...cant tell jack there either). Is Mosport one of those"go > slow to go fast" tracks? Has anyone else noticed this here? And I knowthe > time is in the track...but where is it? What turn (or turns) save you themost > time? Any help with solving this riddle would be appreciated. > > Chris > 44.64 GPLRank and falling...

> No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out... Tell me about it. I had to do a 3/4 GP here over the weekend (didn't even complete it, got thru 38laps), tried it in f3/f2/fg/fd/f1, and I'm no better off than I was friday. My pb is the same as yours, and I'm just as clueless. rms [email hidden]

>"Schlomo4" <[email hidden]> wrote > Is Mosport one of those "go > slow to go fast" tracks? That is true imho. Mosport is a track where almost all corner exit situations are bound to wheelspin. The same can be said of Kyalami. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- People think it must be fun to be a genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

I consider that another of those "go slow to go fast" tracks. Some people say Silverstone is all about "rythm" and I find that to be true of Mosport also...I'm in the high 1:22s to low 1:23s myself... "Schlomo4" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out.Now > granted my PB is a 1:23.95...so im not really slow...but I cant figure outhow > to go faster. I turn a lap that "feels" slow and its near my PB. Then Igo > out and really attack the track and end up with a lap that "feels" fastbut is > almost 3 seconds off my average pace. At almost every other track if Irun a > fast lap I know it...I dont even have to see the lap time to know its fast > (except the ring...cant tell jack there either). Is Mosport one of those"go > slow to go fast" tracks? Has anyone else noticed this here? And I knowthe > time is in the track...but where is it? What turn (or turns) save you themost > time? Any help with solving this riddle would be appreciated. > > Chris > 44.64 GPLRank and falling...

It's all about the exit speed baby. I remember comparing top speeds and low speeds to a person 1 second faster than me at mosport...I was always 2 MPH faster at the apex, but he would be a good many MPH faster at the end of each straight. Don't worry so much about driving the corners really fast and hard, just try to slide the car through them and setup the car for a fast exit (leave yourself a lot of room) and give the car a lot of throttle. Try running the track in a cooper...that will really teach you to get good exit speed since it accelerates so slow...I would say a good chunk of time can be gained in the hairpin...try slowing down more than normal and taking a late...but still tight-to-the-curb apex so you can get on the gas real soon. The sooner you are on the gas there, the faster you will be ALL the way down that straight. I think a good bit of time can be gained on the exit of turn 2, also. Many people overcook the corner and spend most of their time trying to gather up the car. If you go through it a bit slower, you can drive the car out a little wide in the middle and then get hard on the gas much before the second apex to help your speed to turn 3. Well if you have anymore questions, email me at [email hidden] JB "Schlomo4" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out.Now > granted my PB is a 1:23.95...so im not really slow...but I cant figure outhow > to go faster. I turn a lap that "feels" slow and its near my PB. Then Igo > out and really attack the track and end up with a lap that "feels" fastbut is > almost 3 seconds off my average pace. At almost every other track if Irun a > fast lap I know it...I dont even have to see the lap time to know its fast > (except the ring...cant tell jack there either). Is Mosport one of those"go > slow to go fast" tracks? Has anyone else noticed this here? And I knowthe > time is in the track...but where is it? What turn (or turns) save you themost > time? Any help with solving this riddle would be appreciated. > > Chris > 44.64 GPLRank and falling...

In article <Bmyb6.848$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > It's all about the exit speed baby. I remember comparing top speeds and low > speeds to a person 1 second faster than me at mosport...I was always 2 MPH > faster at the apex, but he would be a good many MPH faster at the end of > each straight. I found looking at the really quick world record laps from drivers like Huttu, at slow corners, they would take 2nd gear where I would be taking first - and because the revs were lower they get less wheelspin and hence more exit speed. I was just revving the nuts off it with the consequent wheelspin. It's hard to make yourself do it because it *sounds* slower. - Michael

yes, that is the biggest thing people do is use a lower gear because it sounds fast...and also because the trailing throttle oversteer is more evident...in a lower gear (1st instead of 2nd) the engine braking is much more...so you get more TTO. The side effect is that when you get off the gas, you lose a lot more speed than with a higher gear, so you don't have as high of exit speed and thus lose speed down the straight. JB

In article <[email hidden]>, MichaelJP <[email hidden]> writes:

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>In article <Bmyb6.848$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] >says... >> It's all about the exit speed baby. I remember comparing top speeds and >low >> speeds to a person 1 second faster than me at mosport...I was always 2 MPH >> faster at the apex, but he would be a good many MPH faster at the end of >> each straight. > >I found looking at the really quick world record laps from drivers like >Huttu, at slow corners, they would take 2nd gear where I would be taking >first - and because the revs were lower they get less wheelspin and >hence more exit speed. I was just revving the nuts off it with the >consequent wheelspin. > >It's hard to make yourself do it because it *sounds* slower. > >- Michael

Someone else also suggested the following idea to me. Maybe the hotshoes are using a higher gear because they're able to carry more speed through the corners. For us to try the same gearing with a lower speed would bog down the engine, and cost us speed down the next straight. Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL F1 hcp. +28.80...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

I think this is true if you're WAY slower (like 5-10s per lap) but when you get closer (like a tenth or two slower on each corner) then the cornering speeds are fairly similar and using a higher gear through slow corners helps. I know that when I started using 3rd through Lesmos and Parabolica (with Greger's "GH" setup) I improved my times significantly. But I only started doing that when I could consistently get 1:29's. I still mostly drive 1:29's but now I sprinkle some 28's in there sometimes. At Mosport, using 3rd and 4th instead of 2nd and 3rd on some corners helped a lot. "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Someone else also suggested the following idea to me. Maybe the hotshoesare > using a higher gear because they're able to carry more speed through the > corners. For us to try the same gearing with a lower speed would bog downthe > engine, and cost us speed down the next straight.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

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> >It's hard to make yourself do it because it *sounds* slower. > > > >- Michael > > Someone else also suggested the following idea to me. Maybe the hotshoes are > using a higher gear because they're able to carry more speed through the > corners. For us to try the same gearing with a lower speed would bog down the > engine, and cost us speed down the next straight. > > Eldred

You can tell if this is true by looking at the revs. In the situation I'm talking about, the revcounter is at "7-o'clock" in 2nd where I previously would have been at 9 or 10 o'clock in 1st. - Michael

Well I gotta thank everyone here for the help...especially since it worked :) Im down to a 1:23.18 now at Mosport. I find Im taking almost half the track in 3rd gear now and it really does help on exit speeds. Now if I can only knock that next 4 seconds off I'll be giving GH a run for his money (hey...I can dream right :) Chris

Hey slow down - you're only .17 off my PB! Like you, I use 3rd for a lot of Mosport. I only get below 3rd at Moss, which I do in 2nd. "Schlomo4" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Well I gotta thank everyone here for the help...especially since it worked:) > Im down to a 1:23.18 now at Mosport. I find Im taking almost half thetrack in > 3rd gear now and it really does help on exit speeds. Now if I can onlyknock > that next 4 seconds off I'll be giving GH a run for his money (hey...I can > dream right :) > > Chris

In article <[email hidden]>, MichaelJP <[email hidden]> writes:

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>In article <[email hidden]>, >[email hidden] says... >> >It's hard to make yourself do it because it *sounds* slower. >> > >> >- Michael >> >> Someone else also suggested the following idea to me. Maybe the hotshoes >are >> using a higher gear because they're able to carry more speed through the >> corners. For us to try the same gearing with a lower speed would bog down >the >> engine, and cost us speed down the next straight. >> >> Eldred > >You can tell if this is true by looking at the revs. In the situation >I'm talking about, the revcounter is at "7-o'clock" in 2nd where I >previously would have been at 9 or 10 o'clock in 1st. >

You mean comparing the tach in the hotlap replay to the tach in yours, using the same setup? I never thought of that... Eldred -- Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL F1 hcp. +28.80...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

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> >> Someone else also suggested the following idea to me. Maybe the hotshoes > >are > >> using a higher gear because they're able to carry more speed through the > >> corners. For us to try the same gearing with a lower speed would bog down > >the > >> engine, and cost us speed down the next straight. > >> > >> Eldred > > > >You can tell if this is true by looking at the revs. In the situation > >I'm talking about, the revcounter is at "7-o'clock" in 2nd where I > >previously would have been at 9 or 10 o'clock in 1st. > > > > You mean comparing the tach in the hotlap replay to the tach in yours, using > the same setup? I never thought of that... > > Eldred

Yes, that's right. Of course the best thing would be if you could have a "ghost car" mode where you could practice against one of the hotshoes. An essential component would be a jump key which caught you right back up again after the inevitable crash:-) - Michael

In article <[email hidden]>, Schlomo4 <[email hidden]> writes

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>No matter what I do I cannot for the life of me figure this track out. Now >granted my PB is a 1:23.95...so im not really slow...but I cant figure out how >to go faster. I turn a lap that "feels" slow and its near my PB. Then I go >out and really attack the track and end up with a lap that "feels" fast but is >almost 3 seconds off my average pace. At almost every other track if I run a >fast lap I know it...I dont even have to see the lap time to know its fast >(except the ring...cant tell jack there either). Is Mosport one of those "go >slow to go fast" tracks? Has anyone else noticed this here? And I know the >time is in the track...but where is it? What turn (or turns) save you the most >time? Any help with solving this riddle would be appreciated. >

I've managed a low 1:20.something which I achieved because I discovered pretty early on that many of the corners at this track require and early turn in, that is earlier than you would normally expect. Turn in at the point you would normally expect to and the car is already drifting too wide and you're having to bleed off too much speed. So when I turn in I'm actually aiming for a part of the corner that is pre-apex and, for some reason, this seems to work well here. -- Peter Ives - (AKA Ivington) Remove ALL_STRESS before replying No person's opinions can be said to be more correct than another's, because each is the sole judge of his or her own experience.