World Sports Cars

Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? Seems that by the time it gets out of the gate (at this rate) they're going to have to change their carsets, or make it a "Legends" thing... BB

>"Barton Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote > Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers > site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? It's in full production. Unfortunately the producer Infogrames has put a mandatory stop on any kind of public information, and they need their approval to release such things. > Seems that by the > time it gets out of the gate (at this rate) they're going to have to > change their carsets, or make it a "Legends" thing... Anyway WSC is almost a "fantasy" racing sim as it will feature cars from many eras and perhaps tracks from different eras also. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- People think it must be fun to be a genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 19:20:54 GMT, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote: >It's in full production. Unfortunately the producer Infogrames has put a >mandatory stop on any kind of public information, and they need their >approval to release such things. Does Infogames own Empire? I thought Empire is the producer.

"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > It's in full production. Unfortunately the producer Infogrames has put a > mandatory stop on any kind of public information, and they need their > approval to release such things. >That's not a bad thing, maybe then they'll have more time to right code instead of telling the world how great their code will be. Question: If there's a gag order, how do you know it's in full production?

Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote on 26 Feb 2001: >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West >Brothers site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating >WSC sim?<Snip> The Wests are still hard at it, AFAIK. Sadly the powers that be (Infogrames) are of the standard "how dare our developers speak to anyone ever" school of thought, so we won't get much beyond bland[1] press releases for some while. [1] Relatively speaking. A bland press release for WSC is a damn sight more interesting than most things! -- David. (GPLRank handicap: -5.92; Monsters of GPLRank h/cap +287.79) The GPL Scrapyard: http://scrapyard.9ug.com Earn (not very much) cash with "Ciao!" reviews - http://uk.ciao.com "After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll, really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.

On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:58:00 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers >site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is >it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit harsh? "But in a way, fear is a big part of racing, because if there was nothing to be frightened of, and no limit, any fool could get into a motor car and racing would not exist as a sport." -- Jim Clark

>"Jagg" <[email hidden]> wrote > Does Infogames own Empire? I thought Empire is the producer. I'm not sure, thought it was Infograme who owned Empire. Could be the opposite, but I think the "official" producer at the moment is Empire, your right. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- People think it must be fun to be a genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

>"Art McEwen" <[email hidden]> wrote > Question: If there's a gag order, how do you know it's in full production? What else do you think their doing? Practicing their GPL setups for a online racing championship? ;-D (okay that was a funny joke). -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- People think it must be fun to be a genius, but they don't realise how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

"Jeff Vincent" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:58:00 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers > >site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is > >it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? > > Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit > harsh?

Well since the original release date was before Christmas...LAST CHRISTMAS!!! You can see how some of our fine population might be getting antsy...remember Trans Am Racing? dave henrie

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:03:14 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> >"Jeff Vincent" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:58:00 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> >> wrote: >> >> >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers >> >site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is >> >it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? >> >> Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit >> harsh? > Well since the original release date was before Christmas...LAST >CHRISTMAS!!! You can see how some of our fine population might be >getting antsy...remember Trans Am Racing?

So, 15 months ago it was 12 months away (if I read that right). Today it's about 6 months way. We may not be there yet, but we're getting there quicker... (A positive variation on the "the further I go, the behinder I get" distortion of the space-time continuum. ;) "But in a way, fear is a big part of racing, because if there was nothing to be frightened of, and no limit, any fool could get into a motor car and racing would not exist as a sport." -- Jim Clark

ymenard wrote: > > It's in full production. Unfortunately the producer Infogrames has put a > mandatory stop on any kind of public information, and they need their > approval to release such things. > Anyway WSC is almost a "fantasy" racing sim as it will feature cars from > many eras and perhaps tracks from different eras also. Thankee, Frankie... BB

Art McEwen wrote: > > Question: If there's a gag order, how do you know it's in full production? A-ha! Answer the man nicely, now Fran�ois -- Ontario's right next door!

Jeff Vincent wrote: > > Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit > harsh? Just asking, dewd -- didn't know about the Q301 date (I told you I was lazy!); just seemed to be a long time in gestation. BB

Dave Henrie wrote: > > Well since the original release date was before Christmas...LAST > CHRISTMAS!!! You can see how some of our fine population might be > getting antsy...remember Trans Am Racing? > dave henrie The one that turned into "Pukes of Hazzard?" How could one forget? BB

On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 23:52:18 GMT, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>>"Jagg" <[email hidden]> wrote >> Does Infogames own Empire? I thought Empire is the producer. > > >I'm not sure, thought it was Infograme who owned Empire. Could be the >opposite, but I think the "official" producer at the moment is Empire, your >right.

Let me get this straight, Frank -- were you actually wrong for once? ;-) -- JB F1CS2K Rank Handicap 59.118 http://f1cs2krank.dhs.org/

On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 23:53:37 GMT, "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>>"Art McEwen" <[email hidden]> wrote >> Question: If there's a gag order, how do you know it's in full production? > >What else do you think their doing? Practicing their GPL setups for a >online racing championship? > >;-D (okay that was a funny joke).

That WAS a good one! Hehehe! ;-D -- JB F1CS2K Rank Handicap 59.118 http://f1cs2krank.dhs.org/

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 00:03:14 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote: <SNIP> >> Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit >> harsh? > Well since the original release date was before Christmas...LAST >CHRISTMAS!!! You can see how some of our fine population might be >getting antsy...remember Trans Am Racing? >dave henrie Trans Am Racing? Oh! You mean the "Dukes of Hazzard" game, right? Talk about let-down!! :-P -- JB F1CS2K Rank Handicap 59.118 http://f1cs2krank.dhs.org/

> Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers > site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is > it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? Seems that by the > time it gets out of the gate (at this rate) they're going to have to > change their carsets, or make it a "Legends" thing... You can check the latest development update (posted in January) at http://www.simracingnews.com/article.php?page=1&id=9. Development is really very much in progress, they're currently slaving away very hard on the game and a lot less online then before, so that's a good sign. Also, some people speak about a 'gagging' order, but that's not been the case for at least a month now. They have two new producers, who are very willing to help out websites at the moment, that's why that development update ended up on our site as well. I think it's a bit harsh claiming this is vapoware, as the game has always been planned for Q2 2001 and has been moved to Q3 2001. A 3-month delay isn't that much in the gaming community. You're not seeing much new screenshots at the moment, because the West Brothers have worked on a lot of seperate things and they're currently putting them together. So there wasn't much new stuff to show the past couple of months (while work DID go on of course). So, I hope this answers your question and clears up some of the confusion. I never got the idea that the game wouldn't be released or that it would be released in two or three years time instead of this year. Have been following the development on a weekly basis. -- Kenneth Verburg Editor-in-chief High Gear http://www.simracingnews.com

"Jeff Vincent" <[email hidden]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:[email hidden]... > On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:58:00 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> > wrote: Hi! > >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers > >site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is > >it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? > > Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit > harsh? I don't think so. Let me remember about a nice little GPL tool that was to be released the forthcoming night and we never saw it. Recall its name? Does 'GPaL' mean something to you? Oh no, now I've wakened the titan again *runshisassoff* *vbg* Regards Crash

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:03:57 +0100, "Joachim Blum" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I don't think so. Let me remember about a nice little GPL tool that was to >be released the forthcoming night and we never saw it. Recall its name? Does >'GPaL' mean something to you? >Oh no, now I've wakened the titan again *runshisassoff* *vbg* > >Regards >Crash

Gee, thanks for reminding me Joachim, after two years of councelling my shrink allmost made me forget about GPaL. But thanks to you it's all coming back now.. Wait a sec.. I have this urge to.. to.. AAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! Andre "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great minds think alike." - David G Fisher

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 07:36:08 GMT, "Kenneth Verburg" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>So, I hope this answers your question and clears up some of the confusion. I >never got the idea that the game wouldn't be released or that it would be >released in two or three years time instead of this year. Have been >following the development on a weekly basis. >-- >Kenneth Verburg >Editor-in-chief High Gear >http://www.simracingnews.com

I absolutely don't expect that it will become vaporware, but I do expect some more delays.. The West Bro's seem perfectionists (thank god) and I don;t think they will release it before it's done. I rather wait some more untill the game is finished than to see a game released while it's not ready (Nascar Heat, Nascar 4). Andre "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great minds think alike." - David G Fisher

Good question.. I wonder if we will be racing wheel'less race cars by then? Like in "Back to the Future II".. <g> "Barton Brown" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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| Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers | site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is | it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? Seems that by the | time it gets out of the gate (at this rate) they're going to have to | change their carsets, or make it a "Legends" thing... | | BB

Things that make you say hmmmm? Good point Art!! "Art McEwen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:97ed4p$6mu$[email hidden]... | Question: If there's a gag order, how do you know it's in full production?

Things that make you say hmmmm? Good point Art!! | Question: If there's a***order, how do you know it's in full production?

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 19:01:34 GMT, Jagg <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 10:36:54 GMT, [email hidden] (Andre >Warringa) wrote: > > >>I absolutely don't expect that it will become vaporware, but I do >>expect some more delays.. The West Bro's seem perfectionists (thank >>god) and I don;t think they will release it before it's done. > >I wouldn't count on that. Empire is known to push games out the door >before they are ready. Take a look at the recently released Battle of >Britain flight sim to see what I mean.

Unfortunately we see that more and more.. games being released with errors that become apparent within 5 minutes of playing.. We can only hope the West Bro's do have some influence on the time of release, to avoid a Nascar Heat like product.. great engine, allready an allmost forgotten game due to it's many errors. What was it with Battle of Britain by the way? I thought about buying it, I read a couple of good reviews, but it also has some big problems? Andre

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 19:34:12 -0000, "Mark Seery" <[email hidden]> wrote: >As part of your rehab Andre, You should visit the website 3 times a day to >check and see whether the installer is finished or not. Last reports were >that it's only hours away now <G> Not necessary, Jack promised me to mail me as soon as the installer is ready, since I'm a beta tester.. So I check my mail ten times a day for two years now to see if Jack mailed me..

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> >MS >Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 09:03:57 +0100, "Joachim Blum" >> <[email hidden]> wrote: >> >> >I don't think so. Let me remember about a nice little GPL tool that was >to >> >be released the forthcoming night and we never saw it. Recall its name? >Does >> >'GPaL' mean something to you? >> >Oh no, now I've wakened the titan again *runshisassoff* *vbg* >> > >> >Regards >> >Crash >> >> Gee, thanks for reminding me Joachim, after two years of councelling >> my shrink allmost made me forget about GPaL. But thanks to you it's >> all coming back now.. Wait a sec.. I have this urge to.. to.. >> >> AAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! >> >> >> Andre >> >> "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great >minds >> think alike." - David G Fisher >

GraDee wrote: > >....can this really be THAT realistic... it's > all hype so far.!! Well, I hate to sound negative (no, really...!), but so far all the screen shots have been (according to the captions I've seen, anyway) static -- that is, NOT generated by the graphics engine of the sim itself. I don't know doodlum-squat about coding, but I think I'd have a warmer fuzzy if the core engine of the thing was up and running ... wouldn't I? Bart "Don't Know Enough To Ask The Right Questions" Brown

Andre Warringa wrote: > > What was it with Battle of Britain by the way? I thought about buying > it, I read a couple of good reviews, but it also has some big > problems? Yeah, me too. I know it's not on topic, so email me privately if you like, but what's the bad news on BoB? Bart

What is GPaL? I don't think I have that utility yet. Joachim Blum <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:97fn1d$rua$05$[email hidden]...

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> "Jeff Vincent" <[email hidden]> schrieb im Newsbeitrag > news:[email hidden]... > > On Mon, 26 Feb 2001 17:58:00 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> > > wrote: > > Hi! > > > >Because I'm too lazy to try and dig out the URL for the West Brothers > > >site, I'll ask here: what's become of their long-gestating WSC sim? Is > > >it just vaporware, or is it really gonna be launched? > > > > Since it's not scheduled until Q3-2001, isn't "vaporware" a bit > > harsh? > > I don't think so. Let me remember about a nice little GPL tool that was to > be released the forthcoming night and we never saw it. Recall its name?

Does > 'GPaL' mean something to you? > Oh no, now I've wakened the titan again *runshisassoff* *vbg* > > Regards > Crash >

Hi Barton Sorry to have to correct you on this, but so far every screenshot from WSC has been taken directly from the game :O) No fakeing or touching up at all, as I hope anyone who has seen the game at E3 or ECTS can back me up on this one :O) Chris Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> GraDee wrote: > > > >....can this really be THAT realistic... it's > > all hype so far.!! > > Well, I hate to sound negative (no, really...!), but so far all the > screen shots have been (according to the captions I've seen, anyway) > static -- that is, NOT generated by the graphics engine of the sim > itself. I don't know doodlum-squat about coding, but I think I'd have a > warmer fuzzy if the core engine of the thing was up and running ... > wouldn't I? > > Bart "Don't Know Enough To Ask The Right Questions" Brown

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 02:27:05 -0000, "Chris West" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Hi Barton > >Sorry to have to correct you on this, but so far every screenshot from WSC >has been taken directly from the game :O) No fakeing or touching up at all, >as I hope anyone who has seen the game at E3 or ECTS can back me up on this >one :O) Bart, I hope you're happy now. WSC will be delayed another two minutes for Chris to make this reply. :) "But in a way, fear is a big part of racing, because if there was nothing to be frightened of, and no limit, any fool could get into a motor car and racing would not exist as a sport." -- Jim Clark

On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 23:27:59 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> wrote: >What was it with Battle of Britain by the way? I thought about buying >it, I read a couple of good reviews, but it also has some big >problems? > >Andre It's a good game so don't let my comment put you off buying it. One problem, stuttering, seems to be something people with faster cpu's get. Damaging an anemy plane doesn't seem to slow it down. Some problems are just due to design. Cockpit is too zoomed in by default and zooming it out doesn't stick for the next session. Joystick sensitivity is way too twitchy (my biggest gripe). There are other issues and there is a list availalbe of all the fixes needed, but can't remember the url. Sorry.

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 01:32:56 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote: >Yeah, me too. I know it's not on topic, so email me privately if you >like, but what's the bad news on BoB? > >Bart Nothing *really* bad. It was just released well before it was ready.

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 01:25:48 GMT, Barton Brown <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Well, I hate to sound negative (no, really...!), but so far all the >screen shots have been (according to the captions I've seen, anyway) >static -- that is, NOT generated by the graphics engine of the sim >itself. I don't know doodlum-squat about coding, but I think I'd have a >warmer fuzzy if the core engine of the thing was up and running ... >wouldn't I? > >Bart "Don't Know Enough To Ask The Right Questions" Brown

Haven't you seen the videos? They are not a bunch of static pics stitched together. :-)

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 04:05:47 GMT, Jagg <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Tue, 27 Feb 2001 23:27:59 GMT, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> >wrote: > > >>What was it with Battle of Britain by the way? I thought about buying >>it, I read a couple of good reviews, but it also has some big >>problems? >> >>Andre > >It's a good game so don't let my comment put you off buying it. One >problem, stuttering, seems to be something people with faster cpu's >get. Damaging an anemy plane doesn't seem to slow it down. Some >problems are just due to design. Cockpit is too zoomed in by default >and zooming it out doesn't stick for the next session. Joystick >sensitivity is way too twitchy (my biggest gripe). There are other >issues and there is a list availalbe of all the fixes needed, but >can't remember the url. Sorry.

Ah, so no really serious issues, I'll buy it then. About that joystick sensitivity, weren't those Spitfires way to sensitive in real life? Andre "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great minds think alike." - David G Fisher

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 02:27:05 -0000, "Chris West" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Hi Barton > >Sorry to have to correct you on this, but so far every screenshot from WSC >has been taken directly from the game :O) No fakeing or touching up at all, >as I hope anyone who has seen the game at E3 or ECTS can back me up on this >one :O) > >Chris

While you're here Chris.. you've read this thread, you know how anxious we all are about WSC.. is there a chance that we will see WSC indeed in Q3? Andre "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great minds think alike." - David G Fisher

And might we take this opportunity to prod you for a demo as well? ;-)) Jan. =--- Andre Warringa wrote...

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> <snip> > While you're here Chris.. you've read this thread, you know how > anxious we all are about WSC.. is there a chance that we will see WSC > indeed in Q3? > > Andre > > "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great

minds > think alike." - David G Fisher

rik anthrax wrote: > > What is GPaL? > I don't think I have that utility yet. It's a cheat for GPL. You can use it to modify some game parameters such as grip level, car weight, etc.

Chris West wrote:

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> > Hi Barton > > Sorry to have to correct you on this, but so far every screenshot from WSC > has been taken directly from the game :O) No fakeing or touching up at all, > as I hope anyone who has seen the game at E3 or ECTS can back me up on this > one :O) > > Chris

Sorry, CHris -- I coulda sworn I saw a disclaimer somewhere... well, there goes *my* credibility (as if I ever HAD any). Thanks for the correction, and now how about some news? Bart

Jeff Vincent wrote: > > Bart, I hope you're happy now. WSC will be delayed another two > minutes for Chris to make this reply. :) Dang! And I'm usually SO right! Guffaw, guffaw.... BB

Jagg wrote: > > Haven't you seen the videos? They are not a bunch of static pics > stitched together. :-) Hey, you can DO that in QuickTime... I've already recanted, so now I go to the penalty box and I feel shame... BB

Baritone Brown wrote:

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> > Chris West wrote: > > > > Hi Barton > > > > Sorry to have to correct you on this, but so far every screenshot from WSC > > has been taken directly from the game :O) No fakeing or touching up at all, > > as I hope anyone who has seen the game at E3 or ECTS can back me up on this > > one :O) > > > > Chris > > Sorry, CHris -- I coulda sworn I saw a disclaimer somewhere... well, > there goes *my* credibility (as if I ever HAD any). Thanks for the > correction, and now how about some news? > > Bart

Never mind Bart, you may be omnipotent as regards spelling and grammar, but your comprehension sucks ;). Gerry "I'm completely alone in my views." -- David G Fisher

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 08:59:41 GMT, [email hidden] (Andre Warringa) wrote: >Ah, so no really serious issues, I'll buy it then. About that joystick >sensitivity, weren't those Spitfires way to sensitive in real life? Go read some comments at the forum at www.simhq.com and at the flight-sim news group first. Some people really don't like it, other call it a diamond in the rough. Yes, the spit was agile, but due to the lack of SA in a computer sim we need concessions made. Try the demo first too. It's an early demo, but it gives you a fairly good idea of what to expect.

Gerry Aitken wrote: > Never mind Bart, you may be omnipotent as regards spelling and grammar, > but your comprehension sucks ;). But, dewd... Ah, well -- at least I admit it when I step on my own ...., unlike some David G Fishers I can think of.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Andre Warringa) writes: >Gee, thanks for reminding me Joachim, after two years of councelling >my shrink allmost made me forget about GPaL. But thanks to you it's >all coming back now.. Wait a sec.. I have this urge to.. to.. > >AAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! Andre - Here's a prescription for you: Take two laps at the Nurburgring and call me in the morning...<g> Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73 Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 19:22:35 GMT, Jagg <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>On Wed, 28 Feb 2001 08:59:41 GMT, [email hidden] (Andre >Warringa) wrote: > > >>Ah, so no really serious issues, I'll buy it then. About that joystick >>sensitivity, weren't those Spitfires way to sensitive in real life? > >Go read some comments at the forum at www.simhq.com and at the >flight-sim news group first. Some people really don't like it, other >call it a diamond in the rough. Yes, the spit was agile, but due to >the lack of SA in a computer sim we need concessions made. Try the >demo first too. It's an early demo, but it gives you a fairly good >idea of what to expect.

Well, I bought it yesterday, I saw it in a shop for $20usd. First impressions are good, but I could only test it for an hour or so. Thanks for the forum link, I didn't know that site. Andre "The physics model in the final version of 4x4 Evolution will me much better than it is in the demo" - David G Fisher

[email hidden] (Andre Warringa) wrote: > is there a chance that we will > see WSC indeed in Q3? They can take till 2010 for all I care (assuming someone'll keep paying them :-) as long as it's good when it's released. I'd prefer it to be a little sooner though, I'll be pushing 50 by then and hearts tend to wear out early in my corner of the genetic cesspool :-> Andrew McP