F1RC Patch News

According to Ubi Soft, a patch has been completed and sent to the FIA for approval. It's supposed to be released on the 20th. Some people still insist that the FIA has no restrictions on what Ubi Soft can do (like multiplayer). David G Fisher

Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the ambiguities inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." cheers! David "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Os1D6.10577$[email hidden]...

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> According to Ubi Soft, a patch has been completed and sent to the FIA for > approval. It's supposed to be released on the 20th. > > Some people still insist that the FIA has no restrictions on what Ubi Soft > can do (like multiplayer). > > David G Fisher >

>"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes theambiguities > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? David G Fisher "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]...

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> >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > ambiguities > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- May the Downforce be with you... > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > >

>"Jason "Schumi" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote > Actually Dave, I think Frank is asking him to stop using logic whenreplying > to you, because then he cannot properly comprehend it himself, andtherefore > cannot flame you properly when that occurs. > > Logical replies, should in the real world themselves, breed more logical > replies. This will in fact leave Frank out of the conversation, sincelogic > as we know it doesn't seem to work in that twisted little utopia Franklives > in. > > I suspect this frustrates Frank quite a bit, and is usually accompanied by > fits of fury over capitalism vs. Stone Age economics, and posts thatgeneral > read between the lines of "When will the world realize that I am always > right, and that it revolves around me and my idealisms proven to fail in > history." I really admire the attention you give to me! What a sensation of knowing people do care about me -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Actually Dave, I think Frank is asking him to stop using logic when replying to you, because then he cannot properly comprehend it himself, and therefore cannot flame you properly when that occurs. Logical replies, should in the real world themselves, breed more logical replies. This will in fact leave Frank out of the conversation, since logic as we know it doesn't seem to work in that twisted little utopia Frank lives in. I suspect this frustrates Frank quite a bit, and is usually accompanied by fits of fury over capitalism vs. Stone Age economics, and posts that general read between the lines of "When will the world realize that I am always right, and that it revolves around me and my idealisms proven to fail in history." Don't be alarmed Dave, just walk away. It'll leave him baffled, and struggling to find logic for its occurence, subsequently leaving an open question in his mind, since logic does not seem to apply in his world. Don't play into his hands... he'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. Cheers, Schumi "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4n5D6.11517$[email hidden]...

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> So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > David G Fisher > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]... > > >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > ambiguities > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > > > > > > -- > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > >

Actually Dave, I think Frank is asking him to stop using logic when replying to you, because then he cannot properly comprehend it himself, and therefore cannot flame you properly when that occurs. Logical replies, should in the real world themselves, breed more logical replies. This will in fact leave Frank out of the conversation, since logic as we know it doesn't seem to work in that twisted little utopia Frank lives in. I suspect this frustrates Frank quite a bit, and is usually accompanied by fits of fury over capitalism vs. Stone Age economics, and posts that general read between the lines of "When will the world realize that I am always right, and that it revolves around me and my idealisms proven to fail in history." Don't be alarmed Dave, just walk away. It'll leave him baffled, and struggling to find logic for its occurence, subsequently leaving an open question in his mind, since logic does not seem to apply in his world. Don't play into his hands... he'll drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. Cheers, Schumi

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> So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > David G Fisher > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > ambiguities > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > -- > > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > Corporation - helping America into the New World...

How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? -- Don Burnette D Burnette in N4 Some people do nothing wrong. The problem is, they do nothing. And THAT is wrong. "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4n5D6.11517$[email hidden]... > So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > David G Fisher > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]... > > >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > ambiguities > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > > > > > > -- > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > >

>"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote > How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? You didn't know Don? It's all part of the conspiracy to take over the sim community :) On the left corner, we have supposedly Me/Papyrus/My Ubisoft bashing. On the other side, we have DGF/Ubisoft/His GPL bashing. There are some people who really think it's true. Of course, I don't have any relation with Papyrus like DGF doesn't have any with Ubisoft. I also don't hate F1RC, like DGF doesn't hate GPL. We both know that, but exterior people have different ways of thinking. But hey, some people (I don't target anybody but the latest words by a J"S"M kinda hinted that) do think that way. Those people are the same who completely miss the point that we both bring on the table and are brainwashed into thinking it's that conspiracy that makes us both post on the newsgroup, while the two "pugilists" obviously know each other enough that it is almost tongue-in-cheek. Well my post is hard to understand, but DGF completely knows about it and that it's useless to use logic in our situation. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Awww, that explains it. :) -- Don Burnette D Burnette in N4 Some people do nothing wrong. The problem is, they do nothing. And THAT is wrong. "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ZE7D6.591245$[email hidden]... > >"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote > > How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? > > > You didn't know Don? It's all part of the conspiracy to take over the sim > community :) snip

I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to get dragged into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. Whilst I think that Papy is a great company, and I also think GPL/N4 are great Sims, some see fit to bash other games when someone asks if it is any "fun", and if a mistake or an oversight is made by another developer, that developer sucks because they are not as perfect as the Papy guys. So in retrospect, I suppose that DGF's comment was based on something that went a little like this: Ubisoft needs to put a patch on F1RC (I agree with this statement), but so did GPL (numerous patches). Ubisoft are not perfect, but neither is Papy (I can name at least a dozen screwups by Papy, but to error is to be human, move on...). Correct me if I am wrong Dave. Cheers, Schumi "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:nt7D6.15024$[email hidden]...

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> How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? > > -- > Don Burnette > D Burnette in N4 > > Some people do nothing wrong. > The problem is, they do nothing. > And THAT is wrong. > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:4n5D6.11517$[email hidden]... > > So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]... > > > >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > > ambiguities > > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > > > > > > > >

I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to get dragged into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. Whilst I think that Papy is a great company, and I also think GPL/N4 are great Sims, some see fit to bash other games when someone asks if it is any "fun", and if a mistake or an oversight is made by another developer, that developer sucks because they are not as perfect as the Papy guys. So in retrospect, I suppose that DGF's comment was based on something that went a little like this: Ubisoft needs to put a patch on F1RC (I agree with this statement), but so did GPL (numerous patches). Ubisoft are not perfect, but neither is Papy (I can name at least a dozen screwups by Papy, but to error is to be human, move on...). Correct me if I am wrong Dave. Cheers, Schumi

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> How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? > -- > Don Burnette > D Burnette in N4 > Some people do nothing wrong. > The problem is, they do nothing. > And THAT is wrong. > > So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > David G Fisher > > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > > ambiguities > > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > -- > > > -- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard> > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World...

You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this newsgroup, one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and another for the rest of the developers. David G Fisher "Jason "Schumi" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to get dragged > into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game > sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. > > Whilst I think that Papy is a great company, and I also think GPL/N4 are > great Sims, some see fit to bash other games when someone asks if it isany

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> "fun", and if a mistake or an oversight is made by another developer, that > developer sucks because they are not as perfect as the Papy guys. > > So in retrospect, I suppose that DGF's comment was based on something that > went a little like this: > > Ubisoft needs to put a patch on F1RC (I agree with this statement), but so > did GPL (numerous patches). > Ubisoft are not perfect, but neither is Papy (I can name at least a dozen > screwups by Papy, but to error is to be human, move on...). > > Correct me if I am wrong Dave. > > Cheers, > > Schumi > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:nt7D6.15024$[email hidden]... > > How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? > > > > -- > > Don Burnette > > D Burnette in N4 > > > > Some people do nothing wrong. > > The problem is, they do nothing. > > And THAT is wrong. > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:4n5D6.11517$[email hidden]... > > > So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > > > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking? All > > > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]... > > > > >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > > > ambiguities > > > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > > > > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this newsgroup, > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > another for the rest of the developers. First of all, the majority of people who are the "N4 community" are no more here, they have left for Jacob's NG. So the people here are only GPL fans. It might be a shock what I will be telling you. If you take a peek there, you'll see that we are : 1) Not happy about Papyrus' decision to shut their mouths about the patch 2) VERY unhappy about N4, with many people who simply have left the community or are racing other sims 3) We've heard plenty of rumors that the patch doesn't fix all the important problems And yes, that includes me. I am 'fed up at Nascar Racing 4. I haven't loaded it for almost a month. The CD is taking dust. The AI isn't very good. I don't run pickups (no veteran does anymore since the NROS has closed), so the leagues are the only alternative left. So everybody has flocked on them, but there is another problem. N4 can't have consistent standings, so it's impossible to have serious league racing at the moment. And if you pass through WON's server list, you get some very weird warping for everybody. Like F1RC, it's a great hotlapper. But hotlapping in N4 is VERY boring. So most of the community (the veterans, now the newbies satisfied by anything) are not really happy at the turnovers created by SIERRA and their lack of customer support. So Papyrus sets the standard now? I don't think so. Happy now David? -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:yJ7D6.15066$[email hidden]... > Awww, that explains it. > :) > -- > Don Burnette > > > > You didn't know Don? It's all part of the conspiracy to take over thesim > > community :) CONSPIRACY?? DID SOMEONE SAY CONSPIRACY?? Have I ever told you how GM and Ford engineer'ed the Gas Crisis and Global Warming to kill the Chrysler\Dodge Hemi engine??????? dave henrie

Geez folks, I was just pointing out that there *really were* ambiguities in DGF's post that would allow two (ostensibly) mutually-exclusive statements to, in fact, be truthful. This ain't nuclear war! cheerio, David "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:d9aD6.12150$[email hidden]...

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> You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this newsgroup, > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > another for the rest of the developers. > > David G Fisher > > "Jason "Schumi" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to get

dragged

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> > into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game > > sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. > > > > Whilst I think that Papy is a great company, and I also think GPL/N4 are > > great Sims, some see fit to bash other games when someone asks if it is > any > > "fun", and if a mistake or an oversight is made by another developer,

that > > developer sucks because they are not as perfect as the Papy guys. > > > > So in retrospect, I suppose that DGF's comment was based on somethingthat > > went a little like this: > > > > Ubisoft needs to put a patch on F1RC (I agree with this statement), butso > > did GPL (numerous patches). > > Ubisoft are not perfect, but neither is Papy (I can name at least adozen

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> > screwups by Papy, but to error is to be human, move on...). > > > > Correct me if I am wrong Dave. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Schumi > > > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:nt7D6.15024$[email hidden]... > > > How did Papyrus get dragged into the below posts? > > > > > > -- > > > Don Burnette > > > D Burnette in N4 > > > > > > Some people do nothing wrong. > > > The problem is, they do nothing. > > > And THAT is wrong. > > > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:4n5D6.11517$[email hidden]... > > > > So when Papyrus tells you they can't do this or that, or include a > > > > particular track or car with their sims, it's really God speaking?

All

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> > > > truth? And when Ubi Soft speaks, it must be the devil? > > > > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:Zc3D6.598763$[email hidden]... > > > > > >"David Karr" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > > > > Those two things can both be true, so long as one recognizes the > > > > > ambiguities > > > > > > inherent in "According to Ubi Soft." > > > > > > > > > > Please stop using logic when replying to DGF :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > > > > > -- May the Downforce be with you... > > > > > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > > > > > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > > > > > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Actually, you might even be right there. Only, the rules aren't an different, but the way of criticism is. The reason being, the people at Papyrus focus on creating a simulation first, and a game on top of it, while, for the most part, other developers start from a creating a game with simulation elements in it. Considering that this is indeed a simulator discussion newsgroup, that's only natural. I'm sure WSC (when it gets released) will recieve a similar treatment to Papyrus' products in here. -Gregor David G Fisher wrote:

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> > You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this newsgroup, > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > another for the rest of the developers. > > David G Fisher >

Where can I find Jacob's NG? "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SfaD6.599694$[email hidden]... > >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > > You've got it just about right. After almost four years on thisnewsgroup, > > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > > another for the rest of the developers. > > > First of all, the majority of people who are the "N4 community" are nomore > here, they have left for Jacob's NG. So the people here are only GPLfans.

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> It might be a shock what I will be telling you. If you take a peek there, > you'll see that we are : > > > 1) Not happy about Papyrus' decision to shut their mouths about the patch > 2) VERY unhappy about N4, with many people who simply have left the > community or are racing other sims > 3) We've heard plenty of rumors that the patch doesn't fix all the

important

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> problems > > > And yes, that includes me. I am 'fed up at Nascar Racing 4. I haven't > loaded it for almost a month. The CD is taking dust. The AI isn't very > good. I don't run pickups (no veteran does anymore since the NROS has > closed), so the leagues are the only alternative left. So everybody has > flocked on them, but there is another problem. N4 can't have consistent > standings, so it's impossible to have serious league racing at the moment. > And if you pass through WON's server list, you get some very weird warping > for everybody. > > Like F1RC, it's a great hotlapper. But hotlapping in N4 is VERY boring.

So > most of the community (the veterans, now the newbies satisfied byanything)

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> are not really happy at the turnovers created by SIERRA and their lack of > customer support. > > > So Papyrus sets the standard now? I don't think so. > > Happy now David? > > > > -- > -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> > -- May the Downforce be with you... > -- http://www.ymenard.com/ > -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez > Corporation - helping America into the New World... > > >

Back on the topic of the F1RC patch, does anyone know specifically what its going to fix (apart from the AI which we have already presumed)? Thanks Matt.

Jason \"Schumi\" Murray wrote: Why have you put "Schumi" between your arse cheeks....just out of interest? Gerry

David G Fisher wrote: > > You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this newsgroup, > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > another for the rest of the developers. > > David G Fisher Lucky you David, you've found a friend and his name is Schumi too. How sweet :). Gerry "Michael feels the same way about safety in auto racing as I do. Great minds think alike." -- David G Fisher

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001 12:02:54 GMT, "Matt" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Back on the topic of the F1RC patch, does anyone know specifically what its >going to fix (apart from the AI which we have already presumed)? > >Thanks >Matt. On VROC someone told me that the patch will lessen the grip.. don't know if it's true. Andre

SENT TO THE FIA???????????????? ROTFLMAOID!!!! ed_ David G Fisher wrote: > According to Ubi Soft, a patch has been completed and sent to the FIA for > approval. It's supposed to be released on the 20th. > > Some people still insist that the FIA has no restrictions on what Ubi Soft > can do (like multiplayer).

"Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7qjD6.10558$[email hidden]... > ROTFLMAOID!!!! This is a new one for me. "ID" = In Diapers? Or what? (no offence Ed, I'm just curious).

>I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to get dragged >into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game >sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. It's because, based on the independent opinions of the majority of people on this group, most sims really are "no GPL". What's wrong with that? -- Cheers! Graeme Nash "You'll see I'm right, as usual" - David G Fisher, 2001.

I'm not so sure I would classify N2 or N3 as great simulators. N4? It' not bad, but I've found some arcade racers to be (when competing against the best) even more challenging). As I pointed out in another thread, the same group here at r.a.s. who say Papyrus makes "sumulations first" once said F1RS by Ubi Soft was the greatest sim ever. This newsgroup is basically no different than an NFL or soccer newsgroup/forum. People have their favorite "team" and cheer for it no matter what the facts are. As for me, I like whatever seems best at any point in time. Loyalty to developers of computer sims seems kind of silly. David G Fisher "Gregor Veble" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Actually, you might even be right there. Only, the rules aren't an > different, but the way of criticism is. The reason being, the people at > Papyrus focus on creating a simulation first, and a game on top of it, > while, for the most part, other developers start from a creating a game > with simulation elements in it. Considering that this is indeed a > simulator discussion newsgroup, that's only natural. > > I'm sure WSC (when it gets released) will recieve a similar treatment to > Papyrus' products in here. > > -Gregor > > David G Fisher wrote: > > > > You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this

newsgroup, > > one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and > > another for the rest of the developers. > > > > David G Fisher > >

God help us then! Iain > On VROC someone told me that the patch will lessen the grip.. don't > know if it's true. > > Andre >

>"Rob Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote > "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote > > ROTFLMAOID!!!! > > This is a new one for me. "ID" = In Diapers? Or what? (no offence Ed, I'm > just curious). No... it's a real minuscule entity, a rotlfmaoid. It causes some brain damage as it will send you into a short burst of laugh :) -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > As I pointed out in another thread, the same group here at r.a.s. who say > Papyrus makes "sumulations first" once said F1RS by Ubi Soft was the > greatest sim ever. This is where your logic fails (Oh I said the "L" word ;-) ). F1RS, after the initial shock (it was very advanced graphically on anything ever seen back in those days), most of the people disliked F1RS. Especially that NINE patches didn't really fix any of the problem. > This newsgroup is basically no different than an NFL or soccer > newsgroup/forum. People have their favorite "team" and cheer for it no > matter what the facts are. Wow we are Papyrus hooligans ;-) -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

ID = In Disbelief ed_ Rob Adams wrote:

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> > "Ed Solheim"wrote: > > ROTFLMAOID!!!! > > This is a new one for me. "ID" = In Diapers? Or what? (no offence Ed, I'm > just curious). > >

Thanks, that makes more sense. I liked ymenard's answer better though! The things I learn on this newsgroup! Now if only any of them were useful (i.e. made me millions of $!). "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lWnD6.9227$[email hidden]...

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> ID = In Disbelief > > ed_ > > Rob Adams wrote: > > > > "Ed Solheim"wrote: > > > ROTFLMAOID!!!! > > > > This is a new one for me. "ID" = In Diapers? Or what? (no offence Ed,

I'm > > just curious). > > > > > >

Oh nonsense! The patches fixed almost everything - but as usual I guess you'll never be satisfied! Iain > This is where your logic fails (Oh I said the "L" word ;-) ). F1RS, after > the initial shock (it was very advanced graphically on anything ever seen > back in those days), most of the people disliked F1RS. Especially thatNINE > patches didn't really fix any of the problem. >

There is nothing wrong with it Graeme, and for the most part I agree (GPL being the most realistic, and a great game/sim overall). The comment was merely an answer to the thread that was above it: "How did Papy get dragged into this?" Thaz all :) As for the rest... same story from me... there are other games/Sims out there, and whilst they may not be as REAL as GPL, they still provide a lot of fun for a lot of people, and provide you the general Sim feedback a lot of people look for (including a lot with instant gratification... which was GPL's downfall to the general public). So bashing the crap out of them (developers other than Papy) for some programmer oversights, etc. is uncalled for in my books, and counter-productive to our cause. Its when those problems (sometimes BIG problems) go ignored and unfixed, that I can see a reason to rant and rave on the developers, and I'd probably be one of them who joins in. Funny how a post that was basically a "FYI, patch is on the way" turned into a flame war only 2 threads in (don't mean you DK). It may look like I am as guilty as the next guy when it comes to flaming certain people, but in reality my intentions are to flame back on those who flame for no apparent reason. Meaning... a guy posts an general heads-up FYI, and he gets flamed... I'll pull out my flamethrower and fight back. Guess its in my nature, as flawed as it may be. Just wondering where civilized discussions went... Cheers, Schumi "Graeme Nash" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > >I suppose Papy was dragged into this post because they seem to getdragged

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> >into every other topic about other games. Mostly by virtue of "The game > >sucks, don't buy it, it's no GPL", etc. > > It's because, based on the independent opinions of the majority of > people on this group, most sims really are "no GPL". What's wrong with > that? > > -- > Cheers! > Graeme Nash > > "You'll see I'm right, as usual" > > - David G Fisher, 2001.

There is nothing wrong with it Graeme, and for the most part I agree (GPL being the most realistic, and a great game/sim overall). The comment was merely an answer to the thread that was above it: "How did Papy get dragged into this?" Thaz all :) As for the rest... same story from me... there are other games/Sims out there, and whilst they may not be as REAL as GPL, they still provide a lot of fun for a lot of people, and provide you the general Sim feedback a lot of people look for (including a lot with instant gratification... which was GPL's downfall to the general public). So bashing the ***out of them (developers other than Papy) for some programmer oversights, etc. is uncalled for in my books, and counter-productive to our cause. Its when those problems (sometimes BIG problems) go ignored and unfixed, that I can see a reason to rant and rave on the developers, and I'd probably be one of them who joins in. Funny how a post that was basically a "FYI, patch is on the way" turned into a flame war only 2 threads in (don't mean you DK). It may look like I am as guilty as the next guy when it comes to flaming certain people, but in reality my intentions are to flame back on those who flame for no apparent reason. Meaning... a guy posts an general heads-up FYI, and he gets flamed... I'll pull out my flamethrower and fight back. Guess its in my nature, as flawed as it may be. Just wondering where civilized discussions went... Cheers, Schumi

Hi David, I'm not cheering for any team, I enjoy any sim if it's what I expect from it (heh, I'm one of the few here praising GP3 :) ). The first game I got from Papyrus was GPL, and Nascar 4 was the second one, so I hardly qualify as a hardcore Papyrus groupie. These two sims were the ones that created by far the most favourable impressions on me when I first tried them (even as demos), and those first impressionss lasted. Note that I didn't even follow Nascar untill I got Nascar 4, but it gave me a whole new appreciation for the series. Probably, but to a smaller extent, the same goes for GPL and vintage F1 racing. Also, it's not only arguably the best physics model that lifts the Papyrus sims I own, but the overall atmosphere and enthusiasm for the sport that shines through. The only other sim that, for its time, gave that to me was GP2. GP3 is better than it in every respect, but the same 'glow' quite isn't there. Everything else I tried scores even much lower in the overall atmosphere department. To another point, do not confuse difficulty with realism. It's very easy to create an arcade racer that is more difficult to play than a full blown simulation (try any Lankhor F1(-like) game/demo). Ask Chris West of World Sports Cars, he'll say that if a physics model approaches reality, it becomes easier, not harder to drive, as real life inputs produce real life effects to which we are more accustomed to. GPL might be hard because the cars of the era were hard to drive themselves, but Nascar 4 is much easier to play moderately competitively, even though it's physics engine is an advance over GPL's. -Gregor David G Fisher wrote:

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> I'm not so sure I would classify N2 or N3 as great simulators. N4? It' not > bad, but I've found some arcade racers to be (when competing against the > best) even more challenging). > > As I pointed out in another thread, the same group here at r.a.s. who say > Papyrus makes "sumulations first" once said F1RS by Ubi Soft was the > greatest sim ever. > > This newsgroup is basically no different than an NFL or soccer > newsgroup/forum. People have their favorite "team" and cheer for it no > matter what the facts are. > > As for me, I like whatever seems best at any point in time. Loyalty to > developers of computer sims seems kind of silly. > > David G Fisher > > > > "Gregor Veble" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > >> Actually, you might even be right there. Only, the rules aren't an >> different, but the way of criticism is. The reason being, the people at >> Papyrus focus on creating a simulation first, and a game on top of it, >> while, for the most part, other developers start from a creating a game >> with simulation elements in it. Considering that this is indeed a >> simulator discussion newsgroup, that's only natural. >> >> I'm sure WSC (when it gets released) will recieve a similar treatment to >> Papyrus' products in here. >> >> -Gregor >> >> David G Fisher wrote: >> >>> You've got it just about right. After almost four years on this >> > newsgroup, > >>> one thing I'm sure of is that there is one set of rules for Papyrus, and >>> another for the rest of the developers. >>> >>> David G Fisher >>> >>

>"Iain Mackenzie" <[email hidden]> wrote > Oh nonsense! The patches fixed almost everything Sorry but after NINE patch it was still extremely buggy. Oh and it never had sound in replay <G> -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

In article <q6lD6.13255$[email hidden]>, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> writes: >This newsgroup is basically no different than an NFL or soccer >newsgroup/forum. People have their favorite "team" and cheer for it no >matter what the facts are. > >As for me, I like whatever seems best at any point in time. Loyalty to >developers of computer sims seems kind of silly. You've never bought (or even looked forward to) any game because you liked the company's previous effort? That's all (most)people are doing here... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On Wed, 18 Apr 2001 16:43:17 -0700, "Jason \"Schumi\" Murray" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Funny how a post that was basically a "FYI, patch is on the way" turned into >a flame war only 2 threads in (don't mean you DK). > >It may look like I am as guilty as the next guy when it comes to flaming >certain people, but in reality my intentions are to flame back on those who >flame for no apparent reason. Meaning... a guy posts an general heads-up >FYI, and he gets flamed... I'll pull out my flamethrower and fight back. >Guess its in my nature, as flawed as it may be. Just wondering where >civilized discussions went...

Obviously, you are unaware of the context of DGF's past posts here. If you are truely uninformed and curious, do a Deja/Google search on "NASCAR Should Be Shut Down" (late February). Trolls reap what they sow. "But in a way, fear is a big part of racing, because if there was nothing to be frightened of, and no limit, any fool could get into a motor car and racing would not exist as a sport." -- Jim Clark

Iain Mackenzie wrote: > > God help us then! > Iain At least we can enable traction control without being called arcade weenies... ;) > > On VROC someone told me that the patch will lessen the grip.. don't > > know if it's true. > > > > Andre > > -- l8er ronny Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change to take effect. Reboot now? |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

EldredP <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <q6lD6.13255$[email hidden]>, "David GFisher"

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> <[email hidden]> writes: > > >This newsgroup is basically no different than an NFL or soccer > >newsgroup/forum. People have their favorite "team" and cheer for it no > >matter what the facts are. > > > >As for me, I like whatever seems best at any point in time. Loyalty to > >developers of computer sims seems kind of silly. > > You've never bought (or even looked forward to) any game because you liked

the > company's previous effort? That's all (most)people are doing here... > > Eldred Then they are being duped. Just because they got it half right before, doesnt mean they did it right this time. They have great graphics. Period > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beatsyou > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply. >

In article <OV4E6.2341$[email hidden]>, "Aviator" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> You've never bought (or even looked forward to) any game because you liked >the >> company's previous effort? That's all (most)people are doing here... >> >> Eldred > >Then they are being duped. Just because they got it half right before, >doesnt mean they did it right this time. >

Well, it depends on the company. For a period of time, I bought *every* WWI game that was put out by SSI. I liked what they did in previous games, expected the same in successive games, and bought them first time I saw them on the shelf. I was never disappointed. I also did the same with Papyrus up until Nascar 3. Aside from my system being too slow at the time to run a couple of them well, I've never been disappointed there, either. Although I've probably bought almost every racing game that's come along, I can understand that people tend to stick with what they like. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.