Where's the damn F1RC patch!!!!!!

Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through their asses about why it is not out yet.

hehe Papy they ain't! Nos wrote: > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > their asses about why it is not out yet. -- Rob Swindells ///////////// Caps Lock

Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months to release a patch for N4, and not letting anybody have a clue as to when it would be released or what it would contain. David G Fisher "Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> hehe Papy they ain't! > > Nos wrote: > > > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > > their asses about why it is not out yet. > > -- > Rob Swindells > ///////////// > Caps > Lock > >

It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate request. David G Fisher "Nos" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > their asses about why it is not out yet.

I wouldn't hold my breath since they won't even answer e-mail from a paying customer. J. P. Hovercraft (who's bitter about spending over $60.00 Can...$20.00 US...for a game that won't run on "supported" hardware) Nos wrote: > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > their asses about why it is not out yet. -- ?&*#!#...TREES! %&#@...HEDGES! $%*&$@*...ARMCO! GPLF3 Regulars

On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 22:34:26 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote: >It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate >request. > >David G Fisher I knew it would work. Go play your shitty game of bumper cars, we don't need Ubisoft apologists around here.

Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit just suck so fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? Maybe you can't hit your braking points?. Maybe you swerve off your line, especially in the corners? Maybe you just plain suck at simracing? Ahhh, this is fun. I like using bad words and engaging in name-calling. David G Fisher "Nos" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 22:34:26 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate > >request. > > > >David G Fisher > > I knew it would work. Go play your shitty game of bumper cars, we > don't need Ubisoft apologists around here. >

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> >It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate > >request. > > > >David G Fisher > > I knew it would work. Go play your shitty game of bumper cars, we > don't need Ubisoft apologists around here. >

I think he's got an application in for a Ubi PR job. Maybe he can get us a discount on F1RC2 when it's released. Jerry Morelock

"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ddyT6.36521$[email hidden]... > Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months to release a patchfor > N4, and not letting anybody have a clue as to when it would be released or > what it would contain. > > David G Fisher > And the large, juicy Royal Wulff floats down the stream, a perfect drift free presentation and. . . YES! A rise, and it's hooked! Now for the fight. KFG

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months to release a patchfor > N4 Actually, there was a patch released for N4 a day or two after it was on the shelves. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit just suckso > fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? LOL! You are clearly morphing into the "Ubisoft mentality" DGF, that the AI doesn't suck, it's the real drivers who do. Yep even when we start at the back and watch the mega carnage in T1 on the first lap 70% of the time. > Ahhh, this is fun. I like using bad words and engaging in name-calling. Well, you're a troll that's normal. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

LOL, my goodness. You'd rather them to do like Ubisoft? LOL. I am sure grateful I did not purchase F1RC. Don Burnette "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ddyT6.36521$[email hidden]... > Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months to release a patchfor

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> N4, and not letting anybody have a clue as to when it would be released or > what it would contain. > > David G Fisher > > "Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > hehe Papy they ain't! > > > > Nos wrote: > > > > > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > > > their asses about why it is not out yet. > > > > -- > > Rob Swindells > > ///////////// > > Caps > > Lock > > > > >

Since Papyrus's "way" of doing things was laughable as well, then I would say both approaches should be scrapped in the future. Ubi Soft has said there will be a patch and it will be released when it's ready and approved by the FIA. Bad Ubi. Although, since only about .005% of the people who bought either title have peed their pants over the patches, then the developers/publishers probably shouldn't feel too bad. The .005% who whine, cry, jump up and down, and create conspiracy theories really ought to see a therapist in order to find a little perspective in their lives. David G Fisher "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:qeCT6.120343$[email hidden]...

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> LOL, my goodness. You'd rather them to do like Ubisoft? LOL. > I am sure grateful I did not purchase F1RC. > > Don Burnette > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ddyT6.36521$[email hidden]... > > Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months to release a patch > for > > N4, and not letting anybody have a clue as to when it would be released

or

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> > what it would contain. > > > > David G Fisher > > > > "Rob Swindells" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > hehe Papy they ain't! > > > > > > Nos wrote: > > > > > > > Losing patience now and I think that Ubisift has been lieing through > > > > their asses about why it is not out yet. > > > > > > -- > > > Rob Swindells > > > ///////////// > > > Caps > > > Lock > > > > > > > > > >

Here's a tissue. David G Fisher "chainbreaker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:oWzT6.119958$[email hidden]...

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> > > >It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate > > >request. > > > > > >David G Fisher > > > > I knew it would work. Go play your shitty game of bumper cars, we > > don't need Ubisoft apologists around here. > > > > I think he's got an application in for a Ubi PR job. Maybe he can get us

a > discount on F1RC2 when it's released. > > Jerry Morelock > >

"ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:2SBT6.36095$[email hidden]... > >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > > Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit justsuck > so > > fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? > > LOL! You are clearly morphing into the "Ubisoft mentality" DGF, that theAI > doesn't suck, it's the real drivers who do. Yep even when we start at the > back and watch the mega carnage in T1 on the first lap 70% of the time. My game doesn't do that for some reason. It doesn't do that for others either. The "learning AI" must be learning some bad traits from some of you. DGF

Maybe he is finally starting to panic that his Ubi-Stock is plummeting to the bottom? hahahaha "Nos" wrote:

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| I knew it would work. Go play your shitty game of bumper cars, we | don't need Ubisoft apologists around here. | | On Wed, 06 Jun 2001 22:34:26 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> | wrote: | | >It's coming, especially now after your beautiful, moving and articulate | >request. | > | >David G Fisher

--- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/6/2001

Kevin, Ur soo bad!! lol Are you trolling, spinning or flying??..hahaha "Kevin Gavitt" wrote: | And the large, juicy Royal Wulff floats down the stream, a perfect drift | free presentation and. . . YES! A rise, and it's hooked! | Now for the fight. | | KFG --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/6/2001

Did you get all this insight & again distorted data from your last Ubi-Stock Holders meeting? huh? huh?huh? <G> This is getting to easy anymore..lol "David G Fisher" wrote: | Although, since only about .005% of the people who bought either titlehave | peed their pants over the patches, then the developers/publishers probably | shouldn't feel too bad. | David G Fisher --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/6/2001

In article <J%CT6.37244$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > Here's a tissue. > > David G Fisher > > Can you afford to be handing out brain tissue? MRSisson -- LOAD "GPL",8,1 RUN

On Thu, 07 Jun 2001 00:28:33 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit just suck so >fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? Maybe you can't >hit your braking points?. Maybe you swerve off your line, especially in the >corners? > >Maybe you just plain suck at simracing? The AI crashes into each other on a regular basis, no help from me needed. Explain that one Einstien. >Ahhh, this is fun. I like using bad words and engaging in name-calling. Me too, you poopy head.

On Thu, 07 Jun 2001 00:30:12 GMT, "chainbreaker" <[email hidden]> wrote: >I think he's got an application in for a Ubi PR job. Maybe he can get us a >discount on F1RC2 when it's released. Probably not, but I'm sure he'll get a free copy for service beyond expectations.

On Thu, 07 Jun 2001 03:59:13 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Since Papyrus's "way" of doing things was laughable as well, then I would >say both approaches should be scrapped in the future. Ubi Soft has said >there will be a patch and it will be released when it's ready and approved >by the FIA. Bad Ubi. > >Although, since only about .005% of the people who bought either title have >peed their pants over the patches, then the developers/publishers probably >shouldn't feel too bad.

The other 99.995% put the game on the shelf to collect dust. >The .005% who whine, cry, jump up and down, and create conspiracy theories >really ought to see a therapist in order to find a little perspective in >their lives. > It's us .005% who keep the industry in check. We, the internet soldiers, who are willing to give up our social lives to make gaming better for all mankind. We, the few, oh so brave.

On Thu, 07 Jun 2001 04:21:25 GMT, "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote: >Maybe he is finally starting to panic that his Ubi-Stock is plummeting to >the bottom? hahahaha Not until after IL-2 Sturmovik and Lock On are released I hope.

Lock On ? Jan. =--- "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. Nos wrote... > Not until after IL-2 Sturmovik and Lock On are > released I hope.

Besides acknowledgement of the bug(s) and them having people on the job, there was nothing we needed to know. It's that trust thingy again... pretty amazing stuff, ain't it? ;-) Jan. =--- "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. David G Fisher wrote... > Yep, Papy sure did a great thing by taking two months > to release a patch for N4, and not letting anybody have > a clue as to when it would be released or what it would > contain. > > David G Fisher

Explain something to me... how come a bugfix needs to be checked when the actual game, containing the bug(s) and therefore not a good representation of F1, was passed for release? I don't buy the FIA approval story. I would buy "it's proving more difficult than we anticipated", but saying that would diminish their manlyhood, I guess. <g> Jan. =--- "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. David G Fisher wrote... > Ubi Soft has said there will be a patch and it will be released > when it's ready and approved by the FIA. Bad Ubi. ><snip>

"Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> Lock On ? > > Jan. > =--- > "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. > > Nos wrote... > > Not until after IL-2 Sturmovik and Lock On are > > released I hope. >

Lock On is the next in the Flanker series - and will feature flyable Western Aircraft (F15C and A10 to be precise) as well as a wider assortment of Eastern hardware. Ian

Dave I know I get sucked into these ludicrously irrational threads at times myself, but the best thing to do is try to ignore it. It's still pretty weird though that some people experience this mega carnage at T1 (regardless of circuit?) so often. Certainly doesn't happen with me, you or many others. Do you think it's a setting issue somewhere? Although we know the AI isn't right (although nothing like as bad as some of the people say on ras) it's interesting to compare with F1CS (my current 2nd favourite modern F1) which a lot of people here say the AI is near to perfection. I think when people say perfection, what they mean is forgiving. Try going down a straight in F1CS, ram on the brakes, and see how many cars behind pile into you. The answer is none! No matter how close they are, they all go round you. Realistic or what? Let's see a driver try that at Montreal on sunday! Miss a gear in real F1 and you've got someone up your ass! Iain "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:NfDT6.37250$[email hidden]...

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> > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:2SBT6.36095$[email hidden]... > > >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit just > suck > > so > > > fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? > > > > LOL! You are clearly morphing into the "Ubisoft mentality" DGF, that

the > AI > > doesn't suck, it's the real drivers who do. Yep even when we start atthe > > back and watch the mega carnage in T1 on the first lap 70% of the time. > > My game doesn't do that for some reason. It doesn't do that for others > either. The "learning AI" must be learning some bad traits from some ofyou. > > DGF >

Of course they will!!! It's called F1RC2...hahahaha | David G Fisher wrote... | > Ubi Soft has said there will be a patch and it will be released | > when it's ready and approved by the FIA. Bad Ubi. | <snip> --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001

This makes me curious..... Does NASCAR have to check/"okey" the patches for N4? Or what about all the teams? Do they have to okey a patch? I mean all of them? And then what about the manufacturers - there's another 5 that clearly got a say. Not forgetting the driver's ofcourse.. add another 40 or so that have to say the magic word. Then there's the track owners and then th... - oh, wait - no - thats all I think. Did Ferrari, Ford, Lotus, AAR etc. have to approve the patches for GPL?? Why the hell does the FIA have to "okey" a patch to F1RC??? Afaik - they dont even own the commercial rights to F1! Nor is sim-racing a FIA-sanctioned "sport". I cannot understand why on earth FIA has to approve a *patch* to a game?? I mean - I seriously doubt that the FAA have to approve patches for MS flight-simulator! -- ed_ -- NOTE! Return address is *not* my own - but the e-mail address to some spammers that has bothered me one time to many! This weeks winners: [email hidden] - Eat this - suckers! "David G Fisher" wrote: > Since Papyrus's "way" of doing things was laughable as well, then I would > say both approaches should be scrapped in the future. Ubi Soft has said > there will be a patch and it will be released when it's ready and approved > by the FIA. Bad Ubi.

Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars finished the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems, but then I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake as fast as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road course and their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing. If you make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an accident. If a simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is, you have to be goooood. Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, and then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? David G Fisher "Iain Mackenzie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UXPT6.28537$[email hidden]... > Dave > I know I get sucked into these ludicrously irrational threads at times > myself, but the best thing to do is try to ignore it. > It's still pretty weird though that some people experience this megacarnage > at T1 (regardless of circuit?) so often. Certainly doesn't happen withme, > you or many others. Do you think it's a setting issue somewhere? > Although we know the AI isn't right (although nothing like as bad as someof > the people say on ras) it's interesting to compare with F1CS (my current2nd > favourite modern F1) which a lot of people here say the AI is near to > perfection. I think when people say perfection, what they mean is > forgiving. Try going down a straight in F1CS, ram on the brakes, and see > how many cars behind pile into you. The answer is none! No matter how > close they are, they all go round you. Realistic or what? Let's see a > driver try that at Montreal on sunday! Miss a gear in real F1 and you'vegot

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> someone up your ass! > Iain > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:NfDT6.37250$[email hidden]... > > > > "ymenard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:2SBT6.36095$[email hidden]... > > > >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > > > > Maybe you and some of the others who complain about getting hit just > > suck > > > so > > > > fu**en bad that the AI can't deal with your shitty driving? > > > > > > LOL! You are clearly morphing into the "Ubisoft mentality" DGF, that > the > > AI > > > doesn't suck, it's the real drivers who do. Yep even when we start at > the > > > back and watch the mega carnage in T1 on the first lap 70% of the

time.

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> > > > My game doesn't do that for some reason. It doesn't do that for others > > either. The "learning AI" must be learning some bad traits from some of > you. > > > > DGF > > > >

DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. "David G Fisher" wrote: | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI carsfinished | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems, butthen

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| I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake as fast | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road course and | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing. If you | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an accident. If a | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is, you

have | to be goooood. | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, and | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? | David G Fisher --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001

I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I even wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of the monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. I started racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. David G Fisher "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]...

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> DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars > finished > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems, but > then > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake as

fast > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road courseand > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing. Ifyou > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an accident. Ifa

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> | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is, you > have > | to be goooood. > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, and > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > | David G Fisher > > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > >

Well I guess if you ask an ass a honest question you will get nothing but the ass'end of his buttheaded jokez! Now this says alot DGF!! You are a legend in you own mind & have no need for anyone but yourself! I do hope you & your delusional mind have a long distorted life! Congrads to your shrinks, they have failed you miserably..hahaha :o)~ "David G Fisher" wrote: | I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I even | wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of the | monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. Istarted | racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. | David G Fisher --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001

You're not really SAVATS are you? ;-) "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I even > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of the > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. Istarted

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> racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. > > David G Fisher > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars > > finished > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems,

but

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> > then > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake as > fast > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road course > and > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing. If > you > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an accident.

If > a > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is,you > > have > > | to be goooood. > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza,and

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> > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > >

That's right David, the ol' sarcasm to dodge a challenge trick. 's true though, you don't need any credentials to be credible... after all, "it's just a game" to you and any skill, therefore, is irrelevant. Jan. =--- "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. David G Fisher wrote...

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> I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's > greatest sim racer. I even wear racing booties, > gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front > of the monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, > but I also show no mercy. I started racing online > four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever > since. > > David G Fisher

<snip>

Ah... was unaware of that, thank you. -- Jan. =--- Ian Riches wrote... > <snip> > Lock On is the next in the Flanker series - and will > feature flyable Western Aircraft (F15C and A10 to be > precise) as well as a wider assortment of Eastern > hardware. > > Ian

OMG! Alex Touche` It must be and he has the same @home path I do and SAVATS lives 20minutes from me!! Busted!! hahahaha "Alex Cameron" wrote: | You're not really SAVATS are you? ;-) --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001

I honestly don't even know who or what a SAVATS is. David G Fisher "Alex Cameron" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:12eU6.139698$[email hidden]... > You're not really SAVATS are you? ;-) > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. Ieven > > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front ofthe

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> > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. I > started > > racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. > > > > David G Fisher > > > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad > > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or > > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really > > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars > > > finished > > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems, > but > > > then > > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an > > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake

as > > fast > > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a roadcourse > > and > > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing.If > > you > > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause anaccident.

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> If > > a > > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is, > you > > > have > > > | to be goooood. > > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, > and > > > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > --- > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > > > > > > > >

David G Fisher wrote: > > I honestly don't even know who or what a SAVATS is. An open-wheel God, in his own mind. ;-) -- Fester

LOL, There are talkers, and then there are do-ers. I doubt it would be hard to tell what applies here. Don Burnette "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I even > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of the > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. Istarted

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> racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. > > David G Fisher > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars > > finished > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems,

but

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> > then > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake as > fast > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road course > and > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing. If > you > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an accident.

If > a > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is,you > > have > > | to be goooood. > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza,and

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> > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > >

You truly want me to "take up the challenge"? Desperately looking for another way to gather the girls together to pick on poor wittle me? Challenging my "sim racing manhood" hoping I'll set myself up for more criticism from the club? So clever. I realize now that saying that all other sims besides GPL don't "suck" is evil. I realize now that criticizing NASCAR and it's fans over their attitudes towards the death of drivers was completely out of line. But now this? My skiiiiiiiils? I thought that r.a.s. frowned upon those who seriously questioned the skills of another. I've seen others question a posters skills, and quickly be criticized for doing so. There's the old double standard again. Ok, Jan. Let's see. I've been a core beta tester for CPR, MTM2, RC2000, and 4x4 Evo. John O'Keefe from VROC and TRi had me be one of a small group to beta VROC (yes, VROC for GPL---can you believe it?) before the public beta, and it's release. I wonder why? ISI asked me to be part of a focus group (since EA controls the beta testing in-house). I've got another racing game beta testing opportunity coming up soon. You see Janni, no one (developers or other members of other forums) have ever had a problem (quite the contrary) with any of my opinions because people outside of r.a.s. (GPL fan club headquarters) haven't made GPL their girlfriend, and aren't hyper-sensitive when someone talks about her. That's why I keep getting beta invitations. As far as "rankings", I don't race the N2/3/4 series because as you surely know, I think NASCAR is a joke, easy, and boring. GPL became boring after about 6 months, which is normal for non-Papy cheerleaders, so I don't have the cute little rank some of you have. I did however start racing online long before most here at r.a.s. (the majority of r.a.s. was very slow to turn on to online racing) with POD four years ago and competed in a $10,000 tourney where I placed about 15th out of the 50 who were fast enough to qualify. My ghost laps were among the best. I raced CPR online and held the number one spot (and stayed in the top 5 as long as I wanted) on Case's CPR ladder, while racing against many talented drivers (including eventual GPL'ers) like George Sandman. I placed 5th or 6th in the MS MTM2 tourney (out of about 100) in which the top prize was a new truck. Yes, POD and MTM2 are arcade type racers, but the people who compete at the top level are as fast and good as you'll find ANYWHERE. I'm not much for hotlapping (gets boring very quickly) except to work on setups (which I made available and which helped many), but I've never had any trouble in challenging the top times for whatever sim I was into at the time (RC2000, F12000/CS, GP3, F1RC, etc.). Being smooth and driving realistically is my style. And guess what? I don't spend hours and hours and hours and hours over the course of 1, 2, or even 3 years practicing with the same sim in order to be competitive. If I did, I'd be embarrassed to announce any improvements I'd made. I don't have anywhere near the availbale time to do so even if I wanted to. I know how much time it takes me to get up to speed, and if it starts taking longer, than I know I'm slipping. If I raced the Papyrus NASCAR series and over the years had done a million laps at the same tracks, I wouldn't be quick to brag either. A talented sim racer can get up to speed against the top times quickly, regardless of what racing game you are using. I know who is fast at places like the BHM hotlap competitions (Jure, Bell, Duhan, Morgan,Tsimenoglou), and I can keep up with their times with a half dozen hours worth of practice at a particular track. Any more than that, and I get bored, and don't feel like I've truly accomplished anything. I've even had segments of some of my sim reviews and beta reports be published at web sites like HG. What are the big "achievements" that you or anyone else who responds to this topic have? Please, no GPL nonsense. 3 years of practice? Come on. What couldn't a person do perfectly after that much practice? Claiming improvement or achievement after 1,856,742 laps is bizarre at best. To tell you the truth, your average GPL'er is probably less talented than most other racers, for one simple reason. They are definitely older than most who are into racing games, and therefor lack the attitude or the eye/hand coordination and quickness of other racers. Maybe that's why the slower cars appeal to them? One last thing, I have NEVER criticized another racer in ANY way in any online situation because I don't really care how good someone is as long as they try to race clean. Just to be clear everyone, I was triple dog-dared by the third graders to post the above. "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > That's right David, the ol' sarcasm to dodge a challenge trick. > > 's true though, you don't need any credentials to be credible... afterall,

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> "it's just a game" to you and any skill, therefore, is irrelevant. > > Jan. > =--- > "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. > > David G Fisher wrote... > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's > > greatest sim racer. I even wear racing booties, > > gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front > > of the monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, > > but I also show no mercy. I started racing online > > four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever > > since. > > > > David G Fisher > <snip> > >

Let me guess Don, you are quick in N4? David G Fisher "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UvfU6.124515$[email hidden]...

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> LOL, > There are talkers, and then there are do-ers. > I doubt it would be hard to tell what applies here. > > Don Burnette > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I

even > > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front ofthe

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> > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. I > started > > racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever since. > > > > David G Fisher > > > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a bad > > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? Or > > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you really > > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI cars > > > finished > > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have problems, > but > > > then > > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can cause an > > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake

as > > fast > > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a roadcourse > > and > > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. Amazing.If > > you > > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause anaccident.

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> If > > a > > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact is, > you > > > have > > > | to be goooood. > > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, > and > > > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > --- > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > > > > > > > >

No, actually I am slow in N4 for whatever reason, haven't got it quite pinned down yet. I was reasonably quick in N3/N2/N1. Don Burnette "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:VwgU6.5051$[email hidden]...

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> Let me guess Don, you are quick in N4? > > David G Fisher > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:UvfU6.124515$[email hidden]... > > LOL, > > There are talkers, and then there are do-ers. > > I doubt it would be hard to tell what applies here. > > > > Don Burnette > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I > even > > > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of > the > > > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. I > > started > > > racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever

since.

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> > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want to > > > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a

bad > > > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre??Or > > > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing youreally > > > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... Thom_j. > > > > > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AIcars > > > > finished > > > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to haveproblems, > > but > > > > then > > > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can causean

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> > > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and brake > as > > > fast > > > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road > course > > > and > > > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap.

Amazing.

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> If > > > you > > > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an > accident. > > If > > > a > > > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact

is, > > you > > > > have > > > > | to be goooood. > > > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps atMonza,

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> > and > > > > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

I guess you're not a do-er than either. David G Fisher "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UFgU6.124551$[email hidden]...

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> No, actually I am slow in N4 for whatever reason, haven't got it quite > pinned down yet. I was reasonably quick in N3/N2/N1. > > Don Burnette > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:VwgU6.5051$[email hidden]... > > Let me guess Don, you are quick in N4? > > > > David G Fisher > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:UvfU6.124515$[email hidden]... > > > LOL, > > > There are talkers, and then there are do-ers. > > > I doubt it would be hard to tell what applies here. > > > > > > Don Burnette > > > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > > > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer.

I > > even > > > > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in frontof

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> > the > > > > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy. I > > > started > > > > racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever > since. > > > > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > > > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself want

to

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> > > > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is he a > bad > > > > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any race genre?? > Or > > > > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > > > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > > > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you > really > > > > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia...

Thom_j.

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> > > > > > > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > > > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI > cars > > > > > finished > > > > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > > > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have > problems, > > > but > > > > > then > > > > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > > > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can

cause > an > > > > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate andbrake

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> > as > > > > fast > > > > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road > > course > > > > and > > > > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. > Amazing. > > If > > > > you > > > > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an > > accident. > > > If > > > > a > > > > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen. Fact > is, > > > you > > > > > have > > > > > | to be goooood. > > > > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at > Monza, > > > and > > > > > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > > > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Ohh yes, I'm a do-er. Doesn't mean I have to be the fastest out there. Don Burnette "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SIgU6.5068$[email hidden]...

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> I guess you're not a do-er than either. > > David G Fisher > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:UFgU6.124551$[email hidden]... > > No, actually I am slow in N4 for whatever reason, haven't got it quite > > pinned down yet. I was reasonably quick in N3/N2/N1. > > > > Don Burnette > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:VwgU6.5051$[email hidden]... > > > Let me guess Don, you are quick in N4? > > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:UvfU6.124515$[email hidden]... > > > > LOL, > > > > There are talkers, and then there are do-ers. > > > > I doubt it would be hard to tell what applies here. > > > > > > > > Don Burnette > > > > > > > > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:VycU6.4521$[email hidden]... > > > > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim

racer. > I > > > even > > > > > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down infront > of > > > the > > > > > monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, but I also show no mercy.I

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> > > > started > > > > > racing online four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever > > since. > > > > > > > > > > David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > > "Thom j." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > news:zs3U6.3491$[email hidden]... > > > > > > DGF has alot of answers & insight but George Carlin & myself

want > to > > > > > > know who DGF is... Is he a good racer? Is he fair a racer? Is hea > > bad > > > > > > racer? Does he race online? Does he have stats in any racegenre??

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> > Or > > > > > > is he just an enigma that voices subjective opinions? > > > > > > No BS DGF what about you & your racing abilities? You seem to be > > > > > > so vocal' but let us know who you really are & what racing you > > really > > > > > > do DGF...I would really like to know so how bout it? Tia... > Thom_j. > > > > > > > > > > > > "David G Fisher" wrote: > > > > > > | Earlier tonight I did a 50% race at Montreal, and 14 of the AI > > cars > > > > > > finished > > > > > > | the race. No first turn pile up. AI was excellent. > > > > > > | I read that altering the physics can cause the AI to have > > problems, > > > > but > > > > > > then > > > > > > | I have never done that so I wouldn't know from experience. > > > > > > | You're right, a missed shift or braking 30 meters early can > cause > > an > > > > > > | accident. F1 is all about precision. The cars accelerate and > brake > > > as > > > > > fast > > > > > > | as current technology allows. The travel 2 miles around a road > > > course > > > > > and > > > > > > | their lap times are somehow within a few tenths every lap. > > Amazing. > > > If > > > > > you > > > > > > | make even a slight mistake, you are very likely to cause an > > > accident. > > > > If > > > > > a > > > > > > | simulator is realistic, then the same thing should happen.

Fact

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> > is, > > > > you > > > > > > have > > > > > > | to be goooood. > > > > > > | Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at > > Monza, > > > > and > > > > > > | then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier? > > > > > > | David G Fisher > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > > > Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Almost forgot, I had one of the fastest times at the BHM F1RC demo hotlap competition in expert mode at Spa. Impressed? Nah. Didn't think so. David G Fisher "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6wgU6.5049$[email hidden]... > You truly want me to "take up the challenge"? Desperately looking for > another way to gather the girls together to pick on poor wittle me? > Challenging my "sim racing manhood" hoping I'll set myself up for more > criticism from the club? So clever. I realize now that saying that allother > sims besides GPL don't "suck" is evil. I realize now that criticizingNASCAR > and it's fans over their attitudes towards the death of drivers was > completely out of line. But now this? My skiiiiiiiils? > > I thought that r.a.s. frowned upon those who seriously questioned theskills > of another. I've seen others question a posters skills, and quickly be > criticized for doing so. There's the old double standard again. > > Ok, Jan. Let's see. I've been a core beta tester for CPR, MTM2, RC2000,and > 4x4 Evo. John O'Keefe from VROC and TRi had me be one of a small group to > beta VROC (yes, VROC for > GPL---can you believe it?) before the public beta, and it's release. I > wonder why? ISI asked me to be part of a focus group (since EA controlsthe > beta testing in-house). I've got another racing game beta testing > opportunity coming up soon. You see Janni, no one (developers or other > members of other forums) have ever had a problem (quite the contrary) with > any of my opinions because people outside of r.a.s. (GPL fan club > headquarters) haven't made GPL their girlfriend, and aren'thyper-sensitive

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> when someone talks about her. That's why I keep getting beta invitations. > > As far as "rankings", I don't race the N2/3/4 series because as you surely > know, I think NASCAR is a joke, easy, and boring. GPL became boring after > about 6 months, > which is normal for non-Papy cheerleaders, so I don't have the cute little > rank some of you have. I did however start racing online > long before most here at r.a.s. (the majority of r.a.s. was very slow to > turn on to online racing) with POD four years ago and competed in a

$10,000

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> tourney where I placed about 15th out of the 50 who were fast enough to > qualify. My ghost laps were among the best. I > raced CPR online and held the number one spot (and stayed in the top 5 as > long as I wanted) on Case's CPR ladder, while racing against many talented > drivers (including eventual GPL'ers) like George Sandman. I placed 5th or > 6th in the MS > MTM2 tourney (out of about 100) in which the top prize was a new truck.

Yes, > POD and MTM2 are > arcade type racers, but the people who compete at the top level are asfast > and good as you'll find ANYWHERE. I'm not much for hotlapping (gets boring > very quickly) except to work > on setups (which I made available and which helped many), but I've neverhad > any trouble in challenging the top times for whatever sim I was > into at the time (RC2000, F12000/CS, GP3, F1RC, etc.). Being smooth and > driving realistically is my style. And guess what? I > don't spend hours and hours and hours and hours over the course of 1, 2,or > even 3 years practicing with the same sim in order to be competitive. If I > did, I'd be embarrassed to announce any improvements I'd made. I don'thave > anywhere near the availbale time to do so even if I wanted to. I know how > much time it takes me to get up to speed, and if it starts taking longer, > than I know I'm slipping. If I raced the Papyrus NASCAR series and overthe > years had done a million laps at the same tracks, I wouldn't be quick to > brag either. A talented > sim racer can get up to speed against the top times quickly, regardless of > what > racing game you are using. I know who is fast at places like the BHMhotlap > competitions (Jure, Bell, Duhan, Morgan,Tsimenoglou), and I can keep upwith > their times with a half dozen hours worth of practice at a particulartrack.

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> Any more than that, and I get bored, and don't feel like I've truly > accomplished anything. > > I've even had segments of some of my sim reviews and beta reports be > published at web sites like HG. > > What are the big "achievements" that you or anyone else who responds to

this

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> topic have? Please, no GPL nonsense. 3 years of practice? Come on. What > couldn't a person do perfectly after that much practice? Claiming > improvement or achievement after 1,856,742 laps is bizarre at best. > To tell you the truth, your average GPL'er is probably less talented than > most other racers, for one simple reason. They are definitely older than > most who are into racing games, and therefor lack the attitude or the > eye/hand coordination and quickness of other racers. Maybe that's why the > slower cars appeal to them? > > One last thing, I have NEVER criticized another racer in ANY way in any > online situation because I don't really care how good someone is as long

as

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> they try to race clean. > > Just to be clear everyone, I was triple dog-dared by the third graders to > post the above. > > > "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > That's right David, the ol' sarcasm to dodge a challenge trick. > > > > 's true though, you don't need any credentials to be credible... after > all, > > "it's just a game" to you and any skill, therefore, is irrelevant. > > > > Jan. > > =--- > > "Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn. > > > > David G Fisher wrote... > > > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's > > > greatest sim racer. I even wear racing booties, > > > gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front > > > of the monitor. I'm a fair and courteous racer, > > > but I also show no mercy. I started racing online > > > four years ago, and have crushed my opponents ever > > > since. > > > > > > David G Fisher > > <snip> > > > > > >

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > I'm not a good racer............I'm the world's greatest sim racer. I even > wear racing booties, gloves and a helmet when I plunk down in front of the > monitor. Yep, I think the world has now eluded the enigma that DGF = Y2kRick. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote > I honestly don't even know who or what a SAVATS is. Which really shows how shallow you are with our own simracing community. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Not really, I'm not that big on hotlapping and/or use of hotlapping techniques in simracing. I'll reply to your other message when I get home from work. Jan. =--- David G Fisher wrote... > Almost forgot, I had one of the fastest times at the BHM > F1RC demo hotlap competition in expert mode at Spa. > Impressed? Nah. Didn't think so. > > David G Fisher<snip>

David G Fisher wrote... > You truly want me to "take up the challenge"? Depends what you mean by "the challenge". If you're talking Russian Roulette, I'm out. <g> > Desperately looking for another way to gather > the girls together to pick on poor wittle me? > Challenging my "sim racing manhood" hoping I'll > set myself up for more criticism from the club? No, though my message was crafted to provoke, you're doing a fine job on your own. For the 2nd time: there is no conspiracy and I, nor anyone else on this group is out to get/bother you. You just have tendancy to make these sweeping generalisations which rub people the wrong way; some examples of which follow... BTW: good to know you read my statement concerning the "FIA approved" patch. Very clever taunt... wasted however. ;-) > So clever. I realize now that saying that all > other sims besides GPL don't "suck" is evil. A premise which is just not true and you know it. Not even the hardest of hardcore GPL heads on RAS think this way. Heck, some of them are even warming up to SoS1937 so convincingly I'm considering giving it a 2nd look. > I realize now that criticizing NASCAR and it's > fans over their attitudes towards the death of > drivers was completely out of line. Not at all, it's your typification of NASCAR and NASCAR fans which pisses people off.

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> But now this? My skiiiiiiiils? > > I thought that r.a.s. frowned upon those who > seriously questioned the skills of another. I've > seen others question a posters skills, and > quickly be criticized for doing so. There's the > old double standard again.

<sigh> The old "reversal of argument" trick... ok, I'll bite and quote from this thread: "Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 million laps at Monza, and then marvel at breaking the 1:28 barrier?" There's a nice example of the pot calling the kettle black, eh? -On two levels in fact, if one includes your boast about your F1RC demo hotlap in this thread. > Ok, Jan. Let's see. I've been a core beta tester for > CPR, MTM2, RC2000, and 4x4 Evo. Fairly impressive, but what does that prove? Working for a Microsoft subsidiary I beta tested Win95 (then called Windows Chicago), does that mean I am a "power user"? No, in fact, it's probably safe to say I'm a better simracer than Windows guru by a considerable margin. > John O'Keefe from VROC and TRi had me be one of a > small group to beta VROC (yes, VROC for GPL---can > you believe it?) before the public beta, and it's > release. I wonder why? If I'd have to take a guess I'd say because a) he knew you and b) you had your internet connection sorted out through experience with POD and F1RS/MGPRS. Had he asked me I would have been useless at the time due to bad modem settings and shitty internet provider. If you actually meant that as a question, I'm sure you're better of asking John. > ISI asked me to be part of a focus group (since EA > controls the beta testing in-house). I've got another > racing game beta testing opportunity coming up soon. Tell me something... have you actually ever mentioned anything to the developers other than compatibility/functionality issues? -Have you ever disagreed with them? > You see Janni, no one (developers or other members > of other forums) have ever had a problem (quite the > contrary) with any of my opinions because people > outside of r.a.s. (GPL fan club headquarters) haven't > made GPL their girlfriend, and aren't hyper-sensitive > when someone talks about her. Call me sensitive, but I hate it when people bastardize my name. As for the rest, like I said before, these sweeping generalization generated by your perception of people will get you into real trouble some day. > That's why I keep getting beta invitations. Exactly, you tell them what they want to hear. ;-) Seriously, racing game developers (with a few exceptions <g>) seem to want to ignore GPL was ever made. And in a certain sense they're right... GPL's groundbraking (at the time) features and technical advancements only really appeal to a very small portion of the market. A segment economically speaking not worth catering for unless one puts a value on good press and brownie points. They want the general games player part of the market and as such they are right to pick someone representative of this group. That's perfectly alright from where I'm sitting. Kudos to you. Unfortunately, simracers look at titles from another perspective, just like they (generally speaking) look at and appreciate real racing differently from the general public. I am amazed that you seemingly have not yet fully realised your "common sense" arguments will just not work in this environment. > As far as "rankings", I don't race the N2/3/4 series > because as you surely know, I think NASCAR is a joke, > easy, and boring. Again, a view which shows you have no idea what it takes to race cars, no appreciation of what it is racing drivers do and how hard it is do at any competitive level. > GPL became boring after about 6 months, which is normal > for non-Papy cheerleaders so I don't have the cute > little rank some of you have. There is nothing cute about having a GPLRank. It's just like a golf handicap or any other amateur sport ranking. I am sick and tired of you belittling people in this manner.

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> I did however start racing online long before most here > at r.a.s. (the majority of r.a.s. was very slow to turn > on to online racing) with POD four years ago and > competed in a 10,000 tourney where I placed about 15th > out of the 50 who were fast enough to qualify. My ghost > laps were among the best. I raced CPR online and held > the number one spot (and stayed in the top 5 as long as > I wanted) on Case's CPR ladder, while racing against many > talented drivers (including eventual GPL'ers) like George > Sandman. I placed 5th or 6th in the MS MTM2 tourney (out > of about 100) in which the top prize was a new truck.

I didn't get into online racing at an early stage as at the time I had a lot of difficulty staying connected to (usually) US-based hosts. There still is nearly no interest for online simracing here in Belgium. Did manage some MotoRacer and played a fair amount of Doom though, but that's another genre altogether. Once I had a decent (cable) connection I immediatly got into the swing of things. > Yes, POD and MTM2 are arcade type racers, but the people > who compete at the top level are as fast and good as you'll > find ANYWHERE. I'll agree to that.

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> I'm not much for hotlapping (gets boring very quickly) > except to work on setups (which I made available and > which helped many), but I've never had any trouble in > challenging the top times for whatever sim I was into > at the time (RC2000, F12000/CS, GP3, F1RC, etc.). Being > smooth and driving realistically is my style. > > And guess what? I don't spend hours and hours and hours > and hours over the course of 1, 2, or even 3 years > practicing with the same sim in order to be competitive. > If I did, I'd be embarrassed to announce any improvements > I'd made.

What's the matter? -Afraid of losing face in public? ;-) Seriously, let me let you into a secret... neither do we. We all have lives, jobs, families, commitments. And nobody does it just to improve his or her "cute little rank" either. We do it because we enjoy it. > I don't have anywhere near the availbale time to do so > even if I wanted to. I know how much time it takes me to > get up to speed, and if it starts taking longer, than I > know I'm slipping. Has it occured to you the challenge might not always be equal? > If I raced the Papyrus NASCAR series and over the years had > done a million laps at the same tracks, I wouldn't be quick > to brag either. You lack mathematical intuition. A million laps is proposterous. At say an average of 36s per lap (for easy calculation purposes) that equates to 10000hrs or just under 3 1/2 years @ 8 hours a day. Nobody does a million laps, nobody even does a thousand. It does take a disproportionate amount of time to really get going at first though. The time before the visual and audible clues get translated into a sense of "feeling" what the simulated car does automatically can be quite frustrating. > A talented sim racer can get up to speed against the top times > quickly, regardless of what racing game you are using. True, but not everybody is. Which is why it's good less talented simracers have a place where they can be proud of their acchievements, regardless of how long it took them. So what you're saying is unless you can get up to speed quickly it's not a good simulation? -Strange, that's diametrically opposed to my view. If I get into things quickly and start posting real life times or better "right away" I get suspicious, for I know I could never be as quick in real life. > I know who is fast at places like the BHM hotlap competitions > (Jure, Bell, Duhan, Morgan,Tsimenoglou), and I can keep up with > their times with a half dozen hours worth of practice at a > particular track. That's still disproportionately long with reference to the amount of time it would take you in real life (except maybe at the Ring). > Any more than that, and I get bored, and don't feel like I've > truly accomplished anything. So if you couldn't learn to play golf to PGA standard within 6 hours, you wouldn't bother? > I've even had segments of some of my sim reviews and beta > reports be published at web sites like HG. You should really (when possible with regard to non-disclosure and exclusivity) reproduce those here. It would help people to get a feel for your perspective without having to keep tabs on a number of sites. I don't know about others, but I only occasionally visit sim sites and, in fact, don't remember ever reading anything from your pen there. You do realise part of the waves you create here are due to nobody knowing "where you're coming from"? > What are the big "achievements" that you or anyone else who > responds to this topic have? So you think the acchievements you list here allow you to be a complete ass about things and belittle people? > Please, no GPL nonsense. 3 years of practice? > Come on. What couldn't a person do perfectly > after that much practice? Racing? ;-) Achievements?? Well, I've reached many personal milestones, I've successfully helped other people along their personal simracing path and I've gained a wider understanding and deeper appreciation of real racing. I've made a couple of friends and I've found a simulation which continues to entertain and challenge me (and I'm not supposed to mention ;-)). > Claiming improvement or achievement after 1,856,742 > laps is bizarre at best. Bizar if one look at it as a mere game, rather than as a hobby. I wouldn't expect to be able to play chess (or race RC cars or whatever) competently with only 3 years of experience. > To tell you the truth, your average GPL'er is probably > less talented than most other racers, for one simple > reason. They are definitely older than most who are into > racing games, and therefor lack the attitude or the eye/ > hand coordination and quickness of other racers. Maybe > that's why the slower cars appeal to them? Well, think I might have to hand you that. I certainly am not talented, not as sharp as I used to be and definately prefer the less frantic cockpit workload of GPL. As I posted in another thread, I recently raced GP3 at Monaco and, for the first time, found things rushing at me uncomfortably fast. > One last thing, I have NEVER criticized another racer in > ANY way in any online situation because I don't really > care how good someone is as long as they try to race clean. Who said you did? Perhaps you confuse us with another online argument you're conducting? <g> > Just to be clear everyone, I was triple dog-dared by the > third graders to post the above. Oh please, you give us way too much credit. ;-) Jan. =---

Jan You need help.... and I'm serious! Iain "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> David G Fisher wrote... > > You truly want me to "take up the challenge"? > > Depends what you mean by "the challenge". If you're talking Russian > Roulette, I'm out. <g> > > > Desperately looking for another way to gather > > the girls together to pick on poor wittle me? > > Challenging my "sim racing manhood" hoping I'll > > set myself up for more criticism from the club? > > No, though my message was crafted to provoke, you're doing a fine job on > your own. For the 2nd time: there is no conspiracy and I, nor anyone else

on > this group is out to get/bother you. You just have tendancy to make these > sweeping generalisations which rub people the wrong way; some examples of > which follow... BTW: good to know you read my statement concerning the"FIA

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> approved" patch. Very clever taunt... wasted however. ;-) > > > So clever. I realize now that saying that all > > other sims besides GPL don't "suck" is evil. > > A premise which is just not true and you know it. Not even the hardest of > hardcore GPL heads on RAS think this way. Heck, some of them are even > warming up to SoS1937 so convincingly I'm considering giving it a 2nd

look.

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> > > I realize now that criticizing NASCAR and it's > > fans over their attitudes towards the death of > > drivers was completely out of line. > > Not at all, it's your typification of NASCAR and NASCAR fans which pisses > people off. > > > But now this? My skiiiiiiiils? > > > > I thought that r.a.s. frowned upon those who > > seriously questioned the skills of another. I've > > seen others question a posters skills, and > > quickly be criticized for doing so. There's the > > old double standard again. > > <sigh> The old "reversal of argument" trick... ok, I'll bite and quote

from

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> this thread: > > "Practice kiddies. You know, like how you do 8 > million laps at Monza, and then marvel at > breaking the 1:28 barrier?" > > There's a nice example of the pot calling the kettle black, eh? -On two > levels in fact, if one includes your boast about your F1RC demo hotlap in > this thread. > > > Ok, Jan. Let's see. I've been a core beta tester for > > CPR, MTM2, RC2000, and 4x4 Evo. > > Fairly impressive, but what does that prove? Working for a Microsoft > subsidiary I beta tested Win95 (then called Windows Chicago), does that

mean

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> I am a "power user"? No, in fact, it's probably safe to say I'm a better > simracer than Windows guru by a considerable margin. > > > John O'Keefe from VROC and TRi had me be one of a > > small group to beta VROC (yes, VROC for GPL---can > > you believe it?) before the public beta, and it's > > release. I wonder why? > > If I'd have to take a guess I'd say because a) he knew you and b) you had > your internet connection sorted out through experience with POD and > F1RS/MGPRS. Had he asked me I would have been useless at the time due to

bad

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> modem settings and shitty internet provider. > > If you actually meant that as a question, I'm sure you're better of asking > John. > > > ISI asked me to be part of a focus group (since EA > > controls the beta testing in-house). I've got another > > racing game beta testing opportunity coming up soon. > > Tell me something... have you actually ever mentioned anything to the > developers other than compatibility/functionality issues? -Have you ever > disagreed with them? > > > You see Janni, no one (developers or other members > > of other forums) have ever had a problem (quite the > > contrary) with any of my opinions because people > > outside of r.a.s. (GPL fan club headquarters) haven't > > made GPL their girlfriend, and aren't hyper-sensitive > > when someone talks about her. > > Call me sensitive, but I hate it when people bastardize my name. As for

the

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> rest, like I said before, these sweeping generalization generated by your > perception of people will get you into real trouble some day. > > > That's why I keep getting beta invitations. > > Exactly, you tell them what they want to hear. ;-) > > Seriously, racing game developers (with a few exceptions <g>) seem to want > to ignore GPL was ever made. And in a certain sense they're right... GPL's > groundbraking (at the time) features and technical advancements only

really > appeal to a very small portion of the market. A segment economically > speaking not worth catering for unless one puts a value on good press and > brownie points. They want the general games player part of the market andas > such they are right to pick someone representative of this group. That's > perfectly alright from where I'm sitting. Kudos to you. > > Unfortunately, simracers look at titles from another perspective, justlike

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> they (generally speaking) look at and appreciate real racing differently > from the general public. I am amazed that you seemingly have not yet fully > realised your "common sense" arguments will just not work in this > environment. > > > As far as "rankings", I don't race the N2/3/4 series > > because as you surely know, I think NASCAR is a joke, > > easy, and boring. > > Again, a view which shows you have no idea what it takes to race cars, no > appreciation of what it is racing drivers do and how hard it is do at any > competitive level. > > > GPL became boring after about 6 months, which is normal > > for non-Papy cheerleaders so I don't have the cute > > little rank some of you have. > > There is nothing cute about having a GPLRank. It's just like a golf

handicap

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> or any other amateur sport ranking. I am sick and tired of you belittling > people in this manner. > > > I did however start racing online long before most here > > at r.a.s. (the majority of r.a.s. was very slow to turn > > on to online racing) with POD four years ago and > > competed in a 10,000 tourney where I placed about 15th > > out of the 50 who were fast enough to qualify. My ghost > > laps were among the best. I raced CPR online and held > > the number one spot (and stayed in the top 5 as long as > > I wanted) on Case's CPR ladder, while racing against many > > talented drivers (including eventual GPL'ers) like George > > Sandman. I placed 5th or 6th in the MS MTM2 tourney (out > > of about 100) in which the top prize was a new truck. > > I didn't get into online racing at an early stage as at the time I had a

lot > of difficulty staying connected to (usually) US-based hosts. There stillis > nearly no interest for online simracing here in Belgium. Did manage some > MotoRacer and played a fair amount of Doom though, but that's anothergenre > altogether. Once I had a decent (cable) connection I immediatly got intothe

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> swing of things. > > > Yes, POD and MTM2 are arcade type racers, but the people > > who compete at the top level are as fast and good as you'll > > find ANYWHERE. > > I'll agree to that. > > > I'm not much for hotlapping (gets boring very quickly) > > except to work on setups (which I made available and > > which helped many), but I've never had any trouble in > > challenging the top times for whatever sim I was into > > at the time (RC2000, F12000/CS, GP3, F1RC, etc.). Being > > smooth and driving realistically is my style. > > > > And guess what? I don't spend hours and hours and hours > > and hours over the course of 1, 2, or even 3 years > > practicing with the same sim in order to be competitive. > > If I did, I'd be embarrassed to announce any improvements > > I'd made. > > What's the matter? -Afraid of losing face in public? ;-) > > Seriously, let me let you into a secret... neither do we. We all have

lives,

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> jobs, families, commitments. And nobody does it just to improve his or her > "cute little rank" either. We do it because we enjoy it. > > > I don't have anywhere near the availbale time to do so > > even if I wanted to. I know how much time it takes me to > > get up to speed, and if it starts taking longer, than I > > know I'm slipping. > > Has it occured to you the challenge might not always be equal? > > > If I raced the Papyrus NASCAR series and over the years had > > done a million laps at the same tracks, I wouldn't be quick > > to brag either. > > You lack mathematical intuition. A million laps is proposterous. At say an > average of 36s per lap (for easy calculation purposes) that equates to > 10000hrs or just under 3 1/2 years @ 8 hours a day. Nobody does a million > laps, nobody even does a thousand. > > It does take a disproportionate amount of time to really get going at

first

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> though. The time before the visual and audible clues get translated into a > sense of "feeling" what the simulated car does automatically can be quite > frustrating. > > > A talented sim racer can get up to speed against the top times > > quickly, regardless of what racing game you are using. > > True, but not everybody is. Which is why it's good less talented simracers > have a place where they can be proud of their acchievements, regardless of > how long it took them. > > So what you're saying is unless you can get up to speed quickly it's not a > good simulation? -Strange, that's diametrically opposed to my view. If I

get > into things quickly and start posting real life times or better "rightaway"

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> I get suspicious, for I know I could never be as quick in real life. > > > I know who is fast at places like the BHM hotlap competitions > > (Jure, Bell, Duhan, Morgan,Tsimenoglou), and I can keep up with > > their times with a half dozen hours worth of practice at a > > particular track. > > That's still disproportionately long with reference to the amount of time

it

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> would take you in real life (except maybe at the Ring). > > > Any more than that, and I get bored, and don't feel like I've > > truly accomplished anything. > > So if you couldn't learn to play golf to PGA standard within 6 hours, you > wouldn't bother? > > > I've even had segments of some of my sim reviews and beta > > reports be published at web sites like HG. > > You should really (when possible with regard to non-disclosure and > exclusivity) reproduce those here. It would help people to get a feel for > your perspective without having to keep tabs on a number of sites. I don't > know about others, but I only occasionally visit sim sites and, in fact, > don't remember ever reading anything from your pen there. You do realise > part of the waves you create here are due to nobody knowing "where you're > coming from"? > > > What are the big "achievements" that you or anyone else who > > responds to this topic have? > > So you think the acchievements you list here allow you to be a complete

ass

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> about things and belittle people? > > > Please, no GPL nonsense. 3 years of practice? > > Come on. What couldn't a person do perfectly > > after that much practice? > > Racing? ;-) > > Achievements?? Well, I've reached many personal milestones, I've > successfully helped other people along their personal simracing path and > I've gained a wider understanding and deeper appreciation of real racing. > I've made a couple of friends and I've found a simulation which continues

to

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> entertain and challenge me (and I'm not supposed to mention ;-)). > > > Claiming improvement or achievement after 1,856,742 > > laps is bizarre at best. > > Bizar if one look at it as a mere game, rather than as a hobby. I wouldn't > expect to be able to play chess (or race RC cars or whatever) competently > with only 3 years of experience. > > > To tell you the truth, your average GPL'er is probably > > less talented than most other racers, for one simple > > reason. They are definitely older than most who are into > > racing games, and therefor lack the attitude or the eye/ > > hand coordination and quickness of other racers. Maybe > > that's why the slower cars appeal to them? > > Well, think I might have to hand you that. I certainly am not talented,

not

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> as sharp as I used to be and definately prefer the less frantic cockpit > workload of GPL. As I posted in another thread, I recently raced GP3 at > Monaco and, for the first time, found things rushing at me uncomfortably > fast. > > > One last thing, I have NEVER criticized another racer in > > ANY way in any online situation because I don't really > > care how good someone is as long as they try to race clean. > > Who said you did? Perhaps you confuse us with another online argument

you're

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> conducting? <g> > > > Just to be clear everyone, I was triple dog-dared by the > > third graders to post the above. > > Oh please, you give us way too much credit. ;-) > > Jan. > =--- > >

You really think so? Jan.<g> =--- Iain Mackenzie wrote... > Jan > You need help.... and I'm serious! > Iain > <snip>

Isn't that what the GPL rank is all about? David G Fisher "Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UlmU6.20973$[email hidden]...

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> Not really, I'm not that big on hotlapping and/or use of hotlapping > techniques in simracing. > > I'll reply to your other message when I get home from work. > > Jan. > =--- > David G Fisher wrote... > > Almost forgot, I had one of the fastest times at the BHM > > F1RC demo hotlap competition in expert mode at Spa. > > Impressed? Nah. Didn't think so. > > > > David G Fisher > <snip> > >

David G Fisher wrote:

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> > You truly want me to "take up the challenge"? Desperately looking for > another way to gather the girls together to pick on poor wittle me? > Challenging my "sim racing manhood" hoping I'll set myself up for more > criticism from the club? So clever. I realize now that saying that all other > sims besides GPL don't "suck" is evil. I realize now that criticizing NASCAR > and it's fans over their attitudes towards the death of drivers was > completely out of line. But now this? My skiiiiiiiils?

OK now... take a deep breath & repeat after me. Forgive me Papy, for I have sinned. 25 times in the morning & before you go to bed for a week, along with a 40 hr week on VROC with GPL & we'll declare you clean! <g> -- Fester

It might be for some people, not to me though. I don't actively drive to improve it (ok, that's a lie, I spent about 2 hours yesterday "filling in the blanks" to get a MonsterRank <g>). I just log on if I set a PB in training or in a race then possibly spend half an hour checking how familiar names are doing... where they're slower or faster than me and what car they're best at. I keep meaning to approach people when I see a particularly big gap and ask about their approach, but somehow never get around to it. Which is dumb, as I'm not getting much faster on my own. ;-) I don't know if others use the site like me or if their aim is different... might be a good idea for a thread someday. Jan. =--- David G Fisher wrote... > Isn't that what the GPL rank is all about? > > David G Fisher

>"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote <snip> DGF = narcissist with and ego the size of Texas. My god, you are in love with yourself! Your credentials are no better or worse then any other member of this community. Others have done 100x more then you, others 100x less then you. I pity you to consider yourself "superior" because you basically were testing a piece of code, or did some web articles (ooooohhhh, the journalist background you have lmao! bet you'll write that in bold in your resume). BFD. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- May the Downforce be with you... -- http://www.ymenard.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Only Texas Fran�ois? hahahaha "ymenard" wrote:

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| >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote | | <snip> | | DGF = narcissist with and ego the size of Texas. My god, you are in love | with yourself! Your credentials are no better or worse then any other | member of this community. Others have done 100x more then you, others

100x | less then you. I pity you to consider yourself "superior" because you | basically were testing a piece of code, or did some web articles(ooooohhhh, | the journalist background you have lmao! bet you'll write that in bold in | your resume). BFD.<snipp'ed> --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.259 / Virus Database: 130 - Release Date: 6/5/2001

> > DGF = narcissist with and ego the size of Texas. My god, you are in love > with yourself! Your credentials are no better or worse then any other > member of this community. Others have done 100x more then you, others100x > less then you. I pity you to consider yourself "superior" because you > basically were testing a piece of code, or did some web articles(ooooohhhh, > the journalist background you have lmao! bet you'll write that in bold in > your resume). BFD. > > Well, keep in mind that he *was* "triple-dog-dared" to reveal his autobiography, LOL! Jerry Morelock

"Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > David G Fisher wrote... > Not at all, it's your typification of NASCAR and NASCAR fans which pisses > people off. I love NFL football, but I don't get the least bit upset when someone rips into NFL fans. A huge number of them deserve the criticism. Doesn't bother me a bit. > Tell me something... have you actually ever mentioned anything to the > developers other than compatibility/functionality issues? -Have you ever > disagreed with them? Of course. > They want the general games player part of the market and as > such they are right to pick someone representative of this group. That's > perfectly alright from where I'm sitting. Kudos to you. Nice backhanded insult. The truth is, I simply use logic instead of emotion to form my opinions. > Unfortunately, simracers look at titles from another perspective, justlike > they (generally speaking) look at and appreciate real racing differently > from the general public. I am amazed that you seemingly have not yet fully > realised your "common sense" arguments will just not work in this > environment. Fanatics never have an accurate perspective on anything.

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> > As far as "rankings", I don't race the N2/3/4 series > > because as you surely know, I think NASCAR is a joke, > > easy, and boring. > > Again, a view which shows you have no idea what it takes to race cars, no > appreciation of what it is racing drivers do and how hard it is do at any > competitive level.

"NASCAR is farmers driving around in circles" - Eddie Irvine If you lived in the U.S., you'd understand the view on NASCAR I and millions of others have. It's often put in the same category as the WWF. > > I don't have anywhere near the availbale time to do so > > even if I wanted to. I know how much time it takes me to > > get up to speed, and if it starts taking longer, than I > > know I'm slipping. > > Has it occured to you the challenge might not always be equal? GPL was not more of a challenge, just different. > > If I raced the Papyrus NASCAR series and over the years had > > done a million laps at the same tracks, I wouldn't be quick > > to brag either. >Nobody does a million > laps, nobody even does a thousand. A million? Of course not. I was obviously exaggerating. Thousands? Absolutely. > > A talented sim racer can get up to speed against the top times > > quickly, regardless of what racing game you are using. > > True, but not everybody is. Which is why it's good less talented simracers > have a place where they can be proud of their acchievements, regardless of > how long it took them. So you agree that the challenge is basically the same regardless of the sim? > So what you're saying is unless you can get up to speed quickly it's not a > good simulation? -Strange, that's diametrically opposed to my view. If Iget > into things quickly and start posting real life times or better "rightaway" > I get suspicious, for I know I could never be as quick in real life. You wouldn't be as quick in real life because of fear and financial concerns . Real life times are one thing, but equaling the fastest known sim times are another. Wasn't the Spa real life time shattered pretty quickly in GPL? Pick the fastest time at Imola in F1RC (or an arcade racer), and then see how long it takes to match it. Then check that time again six months from now. No different than GPL. Also, as people like Doug Arnao has said, driving a race car is not as difficult as some sims would have you believe. Driving a car is actually one of the easiest things a person does everyday of their life. Really old people do it. Kids do it. Idiots do it. People with no athletic ability, or decent eye/hand coordination do it. > > I know who is fast at places like the BHM hotlap competitions > > (Jure, Bell, Duhan, Morgan,Tsimenoglou), and I can keep up with > > their times with a half dozen hours worth of practice at a > > particular track. > > That's still disproportionately long with reference to the amount of timeit > would take you in real life (except maybe at the Ring). Again, because of fear of injury to my bones and my wallet. > > Any more than that, and I get bored, and don't feel like I've > > truly accomplished anything. > > So if you couldn't learn to play golf to PGA standard within 6 hours, you > wouldn't bother? Golf? Wouldn't bother. :-) There's a huge difference when comparing the mastering of an entire real sporting event to one tiny challenge (hotlapping on one track) in one computer car simulator. > > I've even had segments of some of my sim reviews and beta > > reports be published at web sites like HG. > > You should really (when possible with regard to non-disclosure and > exclusivity) reproduce those here. It would help people to get a feel for > your perspective without having to keep tabs on a number of sites. Actually, they were taken from my postings here at r.a.s. and another forum. >I don't > know about others, but I only occasionally visit sim sites and, in fact, > don't remember ever reading anything from your pen there. You do realise > part of the waves you create here are due to nobody knowing "where you're > coming from"? After four years? I certainly know exactly where ymenard, yourself, Andre, Andrew, etc. are coming from. :-) David G Fisher

"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:S4bW6.15467$[email hidden]... > > [ Snipped :-) ] > > Golf? Wouldn't bother. :-) There's a huge difference when comparing the > mastering of an entire real sporting event to one tiny challenge(hotlapping > on one track) in one computer car simulator. Sorry, David, this is the whole point you're missing. The reason why I (and I believe many others) like playing GPL rather than the other computer racing games around is precisely because there is far more involved in learning the game, which makes it feel much more like a sport. Golf is quite a good analogy, as it doesn't really involve much in the way of physical exercise either: just a lot of hand-eye coordination, concentration, practice, etc. etc. Whether or not it's easier to post the fastest times in GPL or some other game is not really the point: it's the process of getting there that provides the fun - GPL just provides more of it (IMO) than the other games. It may be harder to start with, but just as with golf, that only makes it more satisfying when you start to improve. Having read quite a few of your posts, I can't help feeling that you have got it in for GPL because it's the one game you haven't managed to get near the top of the leaderboard in. You don't have to keep trying to justify yourself: we all have our own interests, and we don't think any less of you because you didn't manage to master GPL (honest!). You have to bear in mind that with most games the average player doesn't practice anywhere near as much as a GPLr, as they tend to get bored and move on. There may not be as many people out there playing GPL, but they tend to work harder at it, and in consequence the standard is higher. I would also suspect that it tends to attract the sort of people who would be good at racing games in general.

David G Fisher wrote... > I love NFL football, but I don't get the least bit upset > when someone rips into NFL fans. A huge number of them > deserve the criticism. Doesn't bother me a bit. Well there's your difference right there. I don't place myself above "the average NASCAR fan". > > <snip> > Nice backhanded insult. The truth is, I simply use logic > instead of emotion to form my opinions. Thank you, I learned from the best. ;-) Seriously, how can you possibly approach a form of entertainment logically? -If you're not moved by it to beyond mere logic, it's not entertainment by definition!! That's like stepping and freezeframing through a movie to spot editing or continuity mistakes instead of experiencing the characters and the plot. > > <snip> > Fanatics never have an accurate perspective on anything. So simracers who prefer GPL/N4 are fanatics? -Other way around, actually. Simracers who, in the face of the two best simracing games of our time still prefer another are fanatics! ;-)) > "NASCAR is farmers driving around in circles" - Eddie Irvine Oh come on, using a tongue in cheek quote to support your argument? > If you lived in the U.S., you'd understand the view on NASCAR > I and millions of others have. It's often put in the same > category as the WWF. If I lived in the US, I might actually get to see some NASCAR (sporadic coverage here). Anyway, I don't think NASCAR is anywhere as staged and fake as WWF. The only (if any) similarity I can see is that both are fan-friendly organisations, especially towards "average" people and kids. Unlike F1, which is a much more exclusive affair in that respect. > <snip> > GPL was not more of a challenge, just different. From the hotlapping perspective, perhaps. More on that later. > <snip> > A million? Of course not. I was obviously exaggerating. > Thousands? Absolutely. Might be true for those who're heavily into Nx... ok, I'll agree to that. > <snip> > So you agree that the challenge is basically the same > regardless of the sim? Perhaps from a hotlapping perspective. Again, more later. > > <snip> > You wouldn't be as quick in real life because of fear > and financial concerns. Not completely true... there is that, but neither will stop the driver from trying to get the most out of the car/track combination. The approach is different as no-one can afford to crash countless times in the pursuit of speed, but it's not fear nor finance which prevent fast times in the end. Ability, setup and equipment do (ok, the money will help/impeed the last part of that threesome). > Real life times are one thing, but equaling the fastest > known sim times are another. Wasn't the Spa real life > time shattered pretty quickly in GPL? Pick the fastest > time at Imola in F1RC (or an arcade racer), and then > see how long it takes to match it. Then check that time > again six months from now. No different than GPL. <sound of penny dropping> Ah I see, another graduate of the Ian Lake school of simracing thought. I prefer to call this hotlapping, but that is a topic for discussion in it's own right. I'm not going there as I've covered this extensively with mr. Lake in the past (though not on this forum) and in the end had to agree to disagree. The basic premise of what is considered simracing is different and so is the appreciation of what challenge in a simracing game consists of. It's no use me arguing GPL is more challenging than other simracing games and you claiming challenge is constant across multiple games as we're not measuring with the same yardstick. In fact our expectations and experience of respective sims are so vastly different we might as well be in alternate realities. > Also, as people like Doug Arnao has said, driving a race car > is not as difficult as some sims would have you believe. > Driving a car is actually one of the easiest things a person > does everyday of their life. Really old people do it. Kids do > it. Idiots do it. People with no athletic ability, or decent > eye/hand coordination do it. I know it isn't, that's not the point. I've never said driving the cars in GPL is not disproportionally hard. Then again, seeing as we do have the advantage of invulnerability and unlimited budget, making it "as easy as it should be" (cars should be at least a second quicker "in-line" IMO) might spoil the magic of the game, as (through limitations of it's physics model, again: IMO) it allows the player to get away with overdriving the car quite badly. Having it "as it is" allows the player only to be competitive when dangerously flirting with the limit, thus providing lasting appeal for the game. In my opinion, of course. > > <snip> > Again, because of fear of injury to my bones and my wallet. Not to mention having to use one's eyes and ears to know what the car is doing instead of just "feeling" it in the simworld and therefore not having enough "computing power" available to analyse and plan ahead as you drive. As apposed to real life, where one can "think one's feet" more. > > <snip> > Golf? Wouldn't bother. :-) There's a huge difference when > comparing the mastering of an entire real sporting event to > one tiny challenge (hotlapping on one track) in one computer > car simulator. Neil said it better than I could hope to do, so I'll refer to his reply. I distance myself from his "chip on shoulder" comment, though, as this (in my experience) not necessarily the case. > > <snip> > Actually, they were taken from my postings here at r.a.s. and > another forum. Have to admit I'm not an attentive reader, like I said before, never noticed anything by your pen on my visits to said sites otherwise it might have had some sense of deja vu. Or maybe not. > After four years? I certainly know exactly where ymenard, > yourself, Andre, Andrew, etc. are coming from. :-) Perhaps emotion is easier to understand and relate to than logic applied to a subjective experience? -I only gained some understanding from this lastest message. Jan. =---

"Neil Raine" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:992598035.203843@dionysos...

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> > "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:S4bW6.15467$[email hidden]... > The reason why I (and I believe many others) like playing GPL rather than > the other computer racing games around is precisely because there is far > more involved in learning the game, which makes it feel much more like a > sport.

It's steering, throttle, brake, picking the correct line, etc. Nothing more than any other racing sim. Some people, to avoid criticism (being made fun of) simply feel the need to justify their hobbies by making them seem soooo complex. It's a racing game. Nothing more. > Having read quite a few of your posts, I can't help feeling that you have > got it in for GPL because it's the one game you haven't managed to getnear > the top of the leaderboard in. > > You don't have to keep trying to justify yourself: we all have our own > interests, and we don't think any less of you because you didn't manage to > master GPL (honest!). Nice try. > You have to bear in mind that with most games the average player doesn't > practice anywhere near as much as a GPLr, as they tend to get bored andmove > on. Fasn of GPL are older. It takes them longer to become good at racing games. A typical GPL fan will talk and talk, and analyze and analyze, and practice and practice to be able to post a specific time. A 14 year old will just do it. > There may not be as many people out there playing GPL, but they tend to > work harder at it, and in consequence the standard is higher. I wouldalso > suspect that it tends to attract the sort of people who would be good at > racing games in general. The standard is no higher except in their own minds. Insecurity seems to be the culprit. David G Fisher

"Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:cHsW6.36012$[email hidden]...

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> David G Fisher wrote... > > Real life times are one thing, but equaling the fastest > > known sim times are another. Wasn't the Spa real life > > time shattered pretty quickly in GPL? Pick the fastest > > time at Imola in F1RC (or an arcade racer), and then > > see how long it takes to match it. Then check that time > > again six months from now. No different than GPL. > > <sound of penny dropping> Ah I see, another graduate of the Ian Lake

school > of simracing thought. I prefer to call this hotlapping, but that is atopic > for discussion in it's own right. I'm not going there as I've covered this > extensively with mr. Lake in the past (though not on this forum) and inthe > end had to agree to disagree. The basic premise of what is considered > simracing is different and so is the appreciation of what challenge in a > simracing game consists of. I discussed this with Ian long ago. If I remember correctly, he felt that hotlapping was a good measurement of how well a person could race online. With the abilities of most online sim racers what they are, he's probably right. A very good hotlapper will win most races. As I said before, I actually don't like hotlapping at all. It has to be done though in order to check setups. I prefer racing, and as I said in my other post, have done very well in the tourneys I entered, and the hundreds of online races I've had. Regardless of the game, the challenge of pushing the vehicle to it's limit (hotlapping or racing), and the level(s) of competition were always basically the same. To prove this, pick up an arcade racer (like MTM2), find the fastest known times, and try to beat them. Race the best known drivers online. David G Fisher

In article <kfPY6.31596$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher <[email hidden]> writes

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> >"Neil Raine" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:992598035.203843@dionysos... >> >> "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:S4bW6.15467$[email hidden]... >> The reason why I (and I believe many others) like playing GPL rather than >> the other computer racing games around is precisely because there is far >> more involved in learning the game, which makes it feel much more like a >> sport. > >It's steering, throttle, brake, picking the correct line, etc. Nothing more >than any other racing sim. Some people, to avoid criticism (being made fun >of) simply feel the need to justify their hobbies by making them seem soooo >complex. It's a racing game. Nothing more. >

Why should anyone be criticized or made fun of for liking GPL? I don't understand. All racing games are equal, but some racing games are more equal than others. :) More seriously, all bat/ball games are just about co-ordinating the swing of the bat in the best way possible to hit the ball. Therefore, if you're good at one bat/ball game you should be good at them all, right? The mechanics are the same. Indeed racing is about steering, throttle, brake, picking the correct line, etc but surely what works in one game won't necessarily work in another. There's a whole myriad of combinations of all those things that make no 2 games play the same. However, as in bat/ball games the grounding is the same and yet, in order to get good at each game, you will have to play it at length in order to discover its subtleties. All racing games have subtleties, but some racing games have more subtleties than others. :) <snip>

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>> You have to bear in mind that with most games the average player doesn't >> practice anywhere near as much as a GPLr, as they tend to get bored and >move >> on. > >Fasn of GPL are older. It takes them longer to become good at racing >games.

Both the statements by you and Neil may be true. Who knows? Has there been a study? >A typical GPL fan will talk and talk, and analyze and analyze, and practice >and practice to be able to post a specific time. A 14 year old will just do >it. > I doubt there is really much difference between an older racer and a 14 year old when it comes to practicing to become good. The difference is that the older you are the more likely you will ALSO want to discuss with others, whereas a 14 year will just get on with learning and perhaps casual chat with his/her mates. It is unlikely a 14 year old is going to feel confident enough to discuss at detail the ins and outs of a particular racing game with those older than themselves - the like of which you see here - and that is why you don't hear from them. It doesn't mean that they aren't thinking about it as much.

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>> There may not be as many people out there playing GPL, but they tend to >> work harder at it, and in consequence the standard is higher. I would >also >> suspect that it tends to attract the sort of people who would be good at >> racing games in general. > >The standard is no higher except in their own minds. Insecurity seems to be >the culprit. >

I would accept that the standard is unlikely to be higher. -- Peter Ives Remove ALL_STRESS before replying If you know what's good for you, don't listen to me GPLRank Joystick -50.63 Wheel -17.06