Alex in Menu dei Motori has posted a few tracks converted from GTR to
rFactor. This is a banned topic in RSC so you will not see a lot of
publicity around it. Seems Simbin has specifically forbidden its GTR
tracks to be converted to rFactor.
The tracks availabe are Brno, Estoril, Enna, Anderstorp, Oschersleben,
Spa, Donnington and Enna. Brno does a CTD with an error message and I
had an error in Estoril the first time I tried it. The remaining tracks
however, look absolutely fantastic (same quality as in GTR) and have
great frame rates too.
A must have (even if banned...)
Flame warGTR tracks converted to rFactor spark legality row
A poster reported that Menu dei Motori had posted GTR tracks converted to rFactor, a topic banned at RSC because Simbin forbade it; the links quickly went dead. Alan Bernardo criticised ISI and Simbin for being restrictive, while others pointed out the conversions were illegal and that track licences prevented sharing. Byron Forbes again attacked Simbin over GTR multiplayer, and the exchanges grew personal.
Automated summary.
"Joao Gonzalez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Unless I missed something, did you provide a link? That's a lot of talk and
build up of how good the tracks are without giving all of us a link to where
we can get them.
Alanb
Quoted text (13 lines)
> Alex in Menu dei Motori has posted a few tracks converted from GTR to > rFactor. This is a banned topic in RSC so you will not see a lot of > publicity around it. Seems Simbin has specifically forbidden its GTR > tracks to be converted to rFactor. > > The tracks availabe are Brno, Estoril, Enna, Anderstorp, Oschersleben, > Spa, Donnington and Enna. Brno does a CTD with an error message and I > had an error in Estoril the first time I tried it. The remaining tracks > however, look absolutely fantastic (same quality as in GTR) and have > great frame rates too. > > A must have (even if banned...) >I actually typed "Alex at Menu dei Motori", thought this was a known
site by now.
www.menudeimotori.com
http://www.menudeimotori.com/downloads/index.php
As I paid for both (and am about to buy GTL), I'm not feeling too
guilty.
I respect RSC's right to ban posting on the topic, but Simbin had to
know this would happen eventually. The original GTR mods were taken
from the FIA's IP, after all.
Simbin has every right to go after Alex's site, of course
What would be better in the long run would be for someone to do what
Dave Noonan did - create a track converter that required you to have
the original tracks. Hell - they could could even check for an
original CD (I've got an ATI MPEG decoder installer that does just this
- requires an original ATI driver CD).
Kendt
Alan Bernardo wrote:
Quoted text (21 lines)
> "Joao Gonzalez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Alex in Menu dei Motori has posted a few tracks converted from GTR to > > rFactor. This is a banned topic in RSC so you will not see a lot of > > publicity around it. Seems Simbin has specifically forbidden its GTR > > tracks to be converted to rFactor. > > > > The tracks availabe are Brno, Estoril, Enna, Anderstorp, Oschersleben, > > Spa, Donnington and Enna. Brno does a CTD with an error message and I > > had an error in Estoril the first time I tried it. The remaining tracks > > however, look absolutely fantastic (same quality as in GTR) and have > > great frame rates too. > > > > A must have (even if banned...) > > > > Unless I missed something, did you provide a link? That's a lot of talk and > build up of how good the tracks are without giving all of us a link to where > we can get them. > > Alanb> Go after Alex's site...
And guess what - that's exactly what they did (I suppose) - links are
dead now.
Kendt - who didn't click quick enough
"Joao Gonzalez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>I actually typed "Alex at Menu dei Motori", thought this was a known
> site by now.
>
> www.menudeimotori.com
>
Thanks.
Alanb
"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Yes, dead. I got I think four of the converted tracks: Spa, Oschersleben,
Anderstorp, and Estoril. Anyone out there feel the need to post on maybe
one of the binaries? :)
Alanb
Quoted text (7 lines)
>> Go after Alex's site... > > And guess what - that's exactly what they did (I suppose) - links are > dead now. > > Kendt - who didn't click quick enough >Alan Bernardo wrote:
OH I see, this group touts the rules when it suits them, but wham bam
when they need something, screw the rules. Thats why sim racing has
declined to its current state. I am ashamed at you, Alan
Quoted text (19 lines)
> "[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > >>>Go after Alex's site... >> >>And guess what - that's exactly what they did (I suppose) - links are >>dead now. >> >>Kendt - who didn't click quick enough >> > > > Yes, dead. I got I think four of the converted tracks: Spa, Oschersleben, > Anderstorp, and Estoril. Anyone out there feel the need to post on maybe > one of the binaries? :) > > Alanb > >
"JEBEDIAH DUPREE" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:MCRcf.3058$[email hidden]...
I tout no rules. I own GTR, GTL, and rFactor, and if you ask me ISI is only
concerned about CASH. If they'd think a bit and would be kind to their
BUYING CUSTOMERS, maybe they'd get some respect otherwise. I mean, please,
if ISI and whomever had an inkling (which I'm sure they did) that these
tracks could be converted, they should've met this thing head on instead of
waiting for the inevitable.
The current state of sim racing has declined, IMO, because sim makers are
not loyal to their customers. It's the cash first, while all else plays a
subordinate role. If these folks would stop and think, treating customers
the right way first would in the end bring in more money than they ever
envisioned in the first place.
Give me the tracks. :)
Alanb
Quoted text (21 lines)
> Alan Bernardo wrote: >> "[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:[email hidden]... >> >>>>Go after Alex's site... >>> >>>And guess what - that's exactly what they did (I suppose) - links are >>>dead now. >>> >>>Kendt - who didn't click quick enough >>> >> >> >> Yes, dead. I got I think four of the converted tracks: Spa, >> Oschersleben, Anderstorp, and Estoril. Anyone out there feel the need to >> post on maybe one of the binaries? :) >> >> Alanb > OH I see, this group touts the rules when it suits them, but wham bam when > they need something, screw the rules. Thats why sim racing has declined to > its current state. I am ashamed at you, Alan"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:
Have fun with them Alan. I'll be elsewhere...2003 Spa does me no good.
I am looking for the 2004 version and not something ripped from the
RH2004/5 mods.
The Champcar mod for F1c has enough new tracks to amuse me for awhile.
I don't need to suck up the GTR copies when, if I want to race on those
tracks, all I need to do if fire up GTR. Which...still offers a superior
offline enviroment than rF. Why import tracks that you already have in
another sim that has features rF can't support yet?
dave henrie(uses rF for online TPTCC league racing. and suprise..it's
good!)
Quoted text (11 lines)
> > The current state of sim racing has declined, IMO, because sim makers > are not loyal to their customers. It's the cash first, while all else > plays a subordinate role. If these folks would stop and think, > treating customers the right way first would in the end bring in more > money than they ever envisioned in the first place. > > Give me the tracks. :) > > Alanb >"Why import tracks that you already have in
another sim that has features rF can't support yet?"
I haven't gotten rF yet. What features are not supported in rF Dave? I have
my hands full with GTR, and just got GT Legends.
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Quoted text (29 lines)
> "Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in > news:[email hidden]: > >> >> The current state of sim racing has declined, IMO, because sim makers >> are not loyal to their customers. It's the cash first, while all else >> plays a subordinate role. If these folks would stop and think, >> treating customers the right way first would in the end bring in more >> money than they ever envisioned in the first place. >> >> Give me the tracks. :) >> >> Alanb >> > Have fun with them Alan. I'll be elsewhere...2003 Spa does me no good. > I am looking for the 2004 version and not something ripped from the > RH2004/5 mods. > > The Champcar mod for F1c has enough new tracks to amuse me for awhile. > I don't need to suck up the GTR copies when, if I want to race on those > tracks, all I need to do if fire up GTR. Which...still offers a superior > offline enviroment than rF. Why import tracks that you already have in > another sim that has features rF can't support yet? > > dave henrie(uses rF for online TPTCC league racing. and suprise..it's > good!) > > >
"Tiny Lund" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> "Why import tracks that you already have in
> another sim that has features rF can't support yet?"
>
This is true. rFactor is just not going anywhere for me at the moment. GTR
isn't either, actually. I'm enjoying GTL a little too much to be all that
concerned with rFactor. In general, however, ISI has rubbed me the wrong
way. They are too much on the high horse for me. When it comes to support
and a group whose primary aim is to make a good sim and secondarily to make
money, LFS is tops.
ISI and all those involved in GTR, rFactor, and GTL must not know very much
about how to support a product, besides using censorship, and limiting
growth by stifling community involvement.
GTL is my favorite, even though I disagree with the methods of its creators.
Alanb
"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
I will not be buying any product put out by simbin. F simbin and rsc.
Their attitude sucks, and they can shove it right up their tight asses!
Quoted text (20 lines)
> > "Tiny Lund" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > "Why import tracks that you already have in > > another sim that has features rF can't support yet?" > > > > This is true. rFactor is just not going anywhere for me at the moment. GTR > isn't either, actually. I'm enjoying GTL a little too much to be all that > concerned with rFactor. In general, however, ISI has rubbed me the wrong > way. They are too much on the high horse for me. When it comes to support > and a group whose primary aim is to make a good sim and secondarily to make > money, LFS is tops. > > ISI and all those involved in GTR, rFactor, and GTL must not know very much > about how to support a product, besides using censorship, and limiting > growth by stifling community involvement. > > GTL is my favorite, even though I disagree with the methods of its creators. >Maybe I'm missing something here.. but how exactly is ISI limiting
rFactor with censorship and stifling community involvement?
Alan Bernardo wrote:
--
Scott B. Husted
http://www.Husted.cc
Quoted text (10 lines)
> > ISI and all those involved in GTR, rFactor, and GTL must not know very much > about how to support a product, besides using censorship, and limiting > growth by stifling community involvement. > > GTL is my favorite, even though I disagree with the methods of its creators. > > Alanb > >
"Scott B. Husted" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Maybe I'm missing something here.. but how exactly is ISI limiting rFactor
> with censorship and stifling community involvement?
>
>The boards-- folks can't say what they want to say, as if somehow ISI, etc.,
is afraid of open discussion.
The track conversion thing-- why doesn't ISI, etc., just leave it be. In
the end, if they are more open and receptive and not so darn tight, the
community will grow faster.
That's my take.
Alanb
Alan Bernardo wrote:
rFactor is the most open release ever made. I don't see how ISI is
doing anything but encouraging community involvement.
You do realize ISI and Simbin are not the same organization don't you?
--
Scott B. Husted
http://www.Husted.cc
Quoted text (20 lines)
> "Scott B. Husted" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > >>Maybe I'm missing something here.. but how exactly is ISI limiting rFactor >>with censorship and stifling community involvement? >> >> > > The boards-- folks can't say what they want to say, as if somehow ISI, etc., > is afraid of open discussion. > > The track conversion thing-- why doesn't ISI, etc., just leave it be. In > the end, if they are more open and receptive and not so darn tight, the > community will grow faster. > > That's my take. > > Alanb > >"Dave" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:
> I will not be buying any product put out by simbin. F simbin and rsc.
> Their attitude sucks, and they can shove it right up their tight asses!
I understand Richards Burns is a good title...happy simming.
dave henrie
That is a specious argument at best and does nothing to counter the fact
that what ISI have done/are doing is completely legal and what you have
done/are doing is completely illegal.
You can try and justify your pathetic actions and approach any way you like
but it doesn't alter the fact that you are a thief who is preaching theft.
BK
"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
>
> I tout no rules. I own GTR, GTL, and rFactor, and if you ask me ISI isonly
> concerned about CASH. If they'd think a bit and would be kind to their
> BUYING CUSTOMERS, maybe they'd get some respect otherwise....etc
"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
ISI can't actively support conversions of commercial tracks and cars without
dropping themselves into lots of deep legal crap.
as for support. drop one of the dev's an email or pm through the forums if
you have a problem. as they work their way through them all, they'll answer
when they can. they're actively in the forums helping out with issues that
people post.
but you can't keep everyone happy. I respect your view that you aren't
happy with them. but thats your opinion and you're entitled to it. its
different to mine, but doesn't make either of us right :)
cheers
steve
Quoted text (18 lines)
> > "Scott B. Husted" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> Maybe I'm missing something here.. but how exactly is ISI limiting >> rFactor with censorship and stifling community involvement? >> >> > The boards-- folks can't say what they want to say, as if somehow ISI, > etc., is afraid of open discussion. > > The track conversion thing-- why doesn't ISI, etc., just leave it be. In > the end, if they are more open and receptive and not so darn tight, the > community will grow faster. > > That's my take. > > Alanb >
"JEBEDIAH DUPREE" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:MCRcf.3058$[email hidden]...
>>
> OH I see, this group touts the rules when it suits them, but wham bam when
> they need something, screw the rules. Thats why sim racing has declined to
> its current state. I am ashamed at you, Alan
Yes, imagine the hide stiffing a wonderful, honest bunch like Simbin -
how can people live with themselves. Everyone knows they have that perfect
multiplay they worked oh so hard on.
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
> dave henrie(uses rF for online TPTCC league racing. and suprise..it's
> good!)
>
..........but not on GTR tracks he's already payed for....................
"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Yep, why ISI and RSC don't do all they can to publically promote illegal
activity is a total mystery. Wouldn't you think they'd drag their fat lazy
arses off their beds of nails and get the ball rolling on this! Just
incredible! <shaking head>
Quoted text (18 lines)
> > "Scott B. Husted" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> Maybe I'm missing something here.. but how exactly is ISI limiting >> rFactor with censorship and stifling community involvement? >> >> > The boards-- folks can't say what they want to say, as if somehow ISI, > etc., is afraid of open discussion. > > The track conversion thing-- why doesn't ISI, etc., just leave it be. In > the end, if they are more open and receptive and not so darn tight, the > community will grow faster. > > That's my take. > > Alanb > Spoken like a true dago Bruce - Mario would be proud of you! :)
"Bruce Kennewell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:43743861$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (21 lines)
> That is a specious argument at best and does nothing to counter the fact > that what ISI have done/are doing is completely legal and what you have > done/are doing is completely illegal. > > You can try and justify your pathetic actions and approach any way you > like > but it doesn't alter the fact that you are a thief who is preaching theft. > > BK > > > "Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> >> >> I tout no rules. I own GTR, GTL, and rFactor, and if you ask me ISI is > only >> concerned about CASH. If they'd think a bit and would be kind to their >> BUYING CUSTOMERS, maybe they'd get some respect otherwise....etc > >
"Bruce Kennewell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:43743861$[email hidden]...
> That is a specious argument at best and does nothing to counter the fact
> that what ISI have done/are doing is completely legal and what you have
> done/are doing is completely illegal.
>
I own all three games. I didn't say a thing about the legality of the
issue. ISI can do what it wants. What I said was that I don't think ISI is
doing the wise thing if they want to support community involvement and
continue to make its customers pleased, which is only good for them. It's
the old shooting themselves in the foot or the nose-face deal.
Alanb
Alan Bernardo wrote:
Well you are saying they should do whatever it takes to make the
community happy on one side, then on the other you say you didn't say
anything about the legality (it's illegal)... So you are saying that
ISI should break the law in order to please the community because it's
good for them in the long run?
I'm still confused on why you are mad at ISI for not helping "the
community" steal SimBin's tracks? *scratches head*
The fact remains ISI has produced a sim with the most open architecture
this community has ever seen. They are working on tools to help the mod
community make items for their sim. I think ISI has done the most, by
far, of any developer in sim racing to promote their sim through
community involvement and development.
--
Scott B. Husted
http://www.Husted.cc
Quoted text (18 lines)
> "Bruce Kennewell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:43743861$[email hidden]... > >>That is a specious argument at best and does nothing to counter the fact >>that what ISI have done/are doing is completely legal and what you have >>done/are doing is completely illegal. >> > > > I own all three games. I didn't say a thing about the legality of the > issue. ISI can do what it wants. What I said was that I don't think ISI is > doing the wise thing if they want to support community involvement and > continue to make its customers pleased, which is only good for them. It's > the old shooting themselves in the foot or the nose-face deal. > > Alanb > >The problem is that youre using logic and common sense Scott. When you see
a guy arguing with a Stop sign you have a pretty good indication that the
conversation isn't going very far :)
Mitch
"Scott B. Husted" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:-pKcnagR9aoiI->
Well you are saying they should do whatever it takes to make the
Quoted text (17 lines)
> community happy on one side, then on the other you say you didn't say > anything about the legality (it's illegal)... So you are saying that ISI > should break the law in order to please the community because it's good > for them in the long run? > > I'm still confused on why you are mad at ISI for not helping "the > community" steal SimBin's tracks? *scratches head* > > The fact remains ISI has produced a sim with the most open architecture > this community has ever seen. They are working on tools to help the mod > community make items for their sim. I think ISI has done the most, by > far, of any developer in sim racing to promote their sim through community > involvement and development. > > -- > Scott B. Husted > http://www.Husted.cc
"Mitch_A" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:kK3df.15243$q%[email hidden]...
> The problem is that youre using logic and common sense Scott. When you
> see a guy arguing with a Stop sign you have a pretty good indication that
> the conversation isn't going very far :)
>
>
You're probably right [Stop]. The only thing is that I don't think they
should sweat it. It's not like they are losing cash. Let it be and be easy
and allow it. That way the community doesn't have the feeling that ISI is
only about the money, which will stop others, in the long run, from
purchasing an ISI product in the future. I think that by getting all out of
sorts because of this track thing is just not a good PR move: let things be
and move on. Heck, if they would've been a little proactive ISI could've
charged a small fee for the conversions and done it themselves. I think
most would pay five bills a track to get these into rFactor and all would've
been fine and settled.
Alanb
Again Lord Byron has to bring GTR multi into a track conversion talk, way to
go!!
As for ISI/Simbin allowing tracks from one to another, you are living in
fantasy land. They are competitors, perhaps you don't understand business
real well. Remember, these guys actually have a job and need to earn a
living right?
"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:4374af4d$0$13316$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (12 lines)
> > "JEBEDIAH DUPREE" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:MCRcf.3058$[email hidden]... >>> >> OH I see, this group touts the rules when it suits them, but wham bam >> when they need something, screw the rules. Thats why sim racing has >> declined to its current state. I am ashamed at you, Alan > > Yes, imagine the hide stiffing a wonderful, honest bunch like Simbin - > how can people live with themselves. Everyone knows they have that perfect > multiplay they worked oh so hard on. >Hahaha,
Yeah, ISI should just charge a small fee and sell Simbin's tracks.
Excellent idea! I'm sure Simbin wont mind...
Now, I do own GTR (and GTL), so I'm not going to feel guilty about
installing these converted tracks if I can d/l them, but your argument
against ISI seems WAY OFF BASE! They have done everything (legally)
that they can to make rFactor as open to modding as they can - but you
are expecting them to cross the line of legality and actively promote
stealing another company's products... If you want to criticize Simbin
for not giving away their tracks, then go ahead (Although I think that
criticism is ridiculous also!).
The more I read your posts, the more I keep wondering if you realize
that SImbin and ISI are two completely seperate companies -- and in
many ways competitors. You probably need to understand that fact
before continuing your argument...
CK
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
I meant SimBin. I know they are different. :)
Alanb
Quoted text (21 lines)
> Hahaha, > > Yeah, ISI should just charge a small fee and sell Simbin's tracks. > Excellent idea! I'm sure Simbin wont mind... > > Now, I do own GTR (and GTL), so I'm not going to feel guilty about > installing these converted tracks if I can d/l them, but your argument > against ISI seems WAY OFF BASE! They have done everything (legally) > that they can to make rFactor as open to modding as they can - but you > are expecting them to cross the line of legality and actively promote > stealing another company's products... If you want to criticize Simbin > for not giving away their tracks, then go ahead (Although I think that > criticism is ridiculous also!). > > The more I read your posts, the more I keep wondering if you realize > that SImbin and ISI are two completely seperate companies -- and in > many ways competitors. You probably need to understand that fact > before continuing your argument... > > CK >Byron,
GTR's netcode is certainly far from perfect. GTL's seems much better,
so apparently they DID work hard on it. Regardless, I hardly see how
the quality of netcode can be attributed to Simbin's honesty (or
dishonesty) - or how it gives anyone the right to steal from them.
Feel free to set me straight...
CK
Fenech???
BK
"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:4374b335$0$13321$[email hidden]
...
> Spoken like a true dago Bruce - Mario would be proud of you! :)
Good enough.
"Bruce Kennewell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:437505c6$[email hidden]...
Quoted text (10 lines)
> Fenech??? > > BK > > "Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:4374b335$0$13321$[email hidden] > ... >> Spoken like a true dago Bruce - Mario would be proud of you! :) > >Good enough.
Quoted text (9 lines)
> Fenech??? > BK > ... >> Spoken like a true dago Bruce - Mario would be proud of you! :)
"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
> I meant SimBin. I know they are different. :)
>
So let me get this straight - in all those posts you made you had Simbin
confused with ISI?
You're off your trolley!
"Chad Rogers" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Again Lord Byron has to bring GTR multi into a track conversion talk, way
> to go!!
>
They'll never live that down, especially considering they were outright
lying to the public about it months after even they knew it would never be
fixed.
> As for ISI/Simbin allowing tracks from one to another, you are living in
> fantasy land. They are competitors, perhaps you don't understand business
> real well. Remember, these guys actually have a job and need to earn a
> living right?
>
The only reason that would fail is that Simbin know that if all the
tracks available for GTR/GTL are also available for rFactor then that's the
end of GTR and GTL - you could finally drive all these tracks, even online,
with software that .........<drumroll>......................actually WORKS!
:)
I'm sure those of us on the rFactor side of the fence would have no
problem with a track swapping arrangement.
Quoted text (17 lines)
> > "Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:4374af4d$0$13316$[email hidden]... >> >> "JEBEDIAH DUPREE" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:MCRcf.3058$[email hidden]... >>>> >>> OH I see, this group touts the rules when it suits them, but wham bam >>> when they need something, screw the rules. Thats why sim racing has >>> declined to its current state. I am ashamed at you, Alan >> >> Yes, imagine the hide stiffing a wonderful, honest bunch like Simbin - >> how can people live with themselves. Everyone knows they have that >> perfect multiplay they worked oh so hard on. >> > >
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
Not a problem.
On a relatively minor yet still important point, GTL allows a max of 15
online, correct. May as well be using F1C.
Main point is that Simbin were quoted in magazines 6 months after release,
stating that there was a faultless multiplay experience to be had with GTR -
that was an outright lie. See previous issue of Autosimsport for proof -
it's all in there.
GTR is garbageware to anyone interested in online racing - an ideal world
would have such garbage products withdrawn from circulation immediately and
disband a company even thinking about releasing such rubbish.
Quoted text (8 lines)
> Byron, > > GTR's netcode is certainly far from perfect. GTL's seems much better, > so apparently they DID work hard on it. Regardless, I hardly see how > the quality of netcode can be attributed to Simbin's honesty (or > dishonesty) - or how it gives anyone the right to steal from them. > Feel free to set me straight... >"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:43758cc1$0$13315$[email hidden]
.au:
Just to sum up. Sim Bin Paid licensing fees to the FIA or the individual
tracks, so most likely the FIA and Simbin have had lawyers tie up the
agreement with restrictions that prevent Simbin from releasing these
licensed tracks anywhere else. If they do they are stealing potential
income from the FIA.. Now the FIA is about one thing and it is not racing.
Making money is also apparently a BAD thing? So freakin what if ISI or
SImbin is only about making money? Good golly gosh man. You expect people
to beg on the street for food while making these titles? I hope they make
HUGE piles of cash. That is, funnily enough, called the AMERICAN WAY. BUt
I think you will find it almost world wide...make money. Deliver a product
the consumer can use. Enrich your lives in the process. Gee, the poor
sots don't they know they are supposed to give their work away so we, the
game-playing public, can get something for nothing? Screw their families,
screw their houses, screw their cars.
The moment Simbin or ISI began working as companies, they had
responsibilities that we, the gamers, do not. Each has chosen a different
route to achieve some sort of POSSIBLE financial sucess. Good for each.
Go get'em. ISI or SIMBIN cannot share content. Not because of some ill-
thought anti-consumer, anti-simming, ego trip. They cannot because lawyers
prevent them. And lawyers are not about protecting the law, they are about
making money. So frag on ISI,and SIMBIN all you want. But that won't
change their circumstances.
We can 'CHOOSE' to step around the restrictions, and then we can CHOOSE
to make up some farcical reasoning to justify our actions. Similarly,
others can CHOOSE to look past the next five minutes and realize that
'someday,' at some future point, we, the gamers, will need a new title, a
new product, and when we have made Simbin or ISI, or iracing go POOF! then
we the gamers will not be gamers anymore.
dave henrie
Quoted text (15 lines)
> > "Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> >> I meant SimBin. I know they are different. :) >> > > So let me get this straight - in all those posts you made you had > Simbin > confused with ISI? > > You're off your trolley! > > >"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:437590fd$0$13321$[email hidden]
.au:
>
> GTR is garbageware to anyone interested in online racing - an ideal
> world would have such garbage products withdrawn from circulation
> immediately and disband a company even thinking about releasing such
> rubbish.
Again, I must throw an Americanism at the group.
"Buyer Beware." We in the States had months of reviews by peers that
clearly indicated GTR was not the multiplayer heaven they claimed it to be.
(Heck right now our TPTCC online league is STRUGGLING with rFactor and
online issues.) We, armed with that knowledge then make the choice of
whether or not to purchase such product. I'd like to thank my Euro
brethern for alerting the rest of us. If others were amoung the first to
throw money at Simbin, I can only say you have to determine what attracts
you to a title and if that title meets your needs. If not, then do not
purchase. I don't purchase a car based on the promise they will figure out
how to attach wheels at some future date.
GTR is not online nirvana, but it is certainly one of the premier offline
sims in the racing world. The features they have brought to the table are
above and beyond the original code the title was based upon. Can you name
more than one or two other titles that Simulate their target racing series
as well as GTR does?
(and just as a teaser, I have chatted with aquaintences inside Simbin
who probably would verify that the company itself was split by failure of
the multiplayer to live up to the marketing claims.)
dave<who asks everyone not to steal>henrie
"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:43758cc1$0$13315$[email hidden]...
I may be of my trolley, but I knew the companies were different. That's is
why I used the "etc." shortcut a lot. But even though they are not the
same, they are closely connected, aren't they?
Simbin is the real problem as I see it. ISI also is not the most
consumer-friendly company. Most, however, are like ISI: I was comparing
company's consumer friendliness to LFS, which really lets everyone what is
going on. Small group, yes. Less bureaucracy Simbin and ISI are terrible
at public relations and in that way (among others) they are the same.
Alanb
Quoted text (12 lines)
> > "Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> >> I meant SimBin. I know they are different. :) >> > > So let me get this straight - in all those posts you made you had > Simbin confused with ISI? > > You're off your trolley! >Alan Bernardo wrote:
LOL - I'm starting to think you are not just off your trolley, but your
trolley is in San Francisco and you are in Tibet. ;)
I was convinced that you were just confusing Simbin with ISI in all your
posts, but it seems you still can't really distinguish the two
entities. Could you explain to me how ISI is not consumer-friendly and
how they are terrible at public relations? Seriously, I really would
like to hear your explanation for it as It really does confuse me.
As far as Simbin, they have licenses for the tracks they produce which
they are legally obligated to protect. I think Dave's post sums up that
whole issue very well. However it seems you still expect ISI to help
you steal Simbin's work, correct?
Wow.. and I thought "I" sometimes had unreasonable expectations. <G>
Now, if I were Simbin would "I" make a sim that is more mod friendly?
Yes, "I" would... but that is where rFactor shines because they aren't
using third party licenses on their product. Basically, at some point
in the not too distant future, you are going to essentially have a
GTL-like clone in rFactor produced by the talent in this community. To
steal from the Guinness commercials - "Brilliant!" Pending on the
timing of a US release, this could hurt US sales of GTL. Although I
already bought a copy from GoGamer.com and am enjoying it immensely even
though I have yet to race it online which for me personally will
demonstrate if the "truth is in the pudding".
If you want to talk about a community un-friendly group with terrible
public relations you could discuss FIRST / iRacing - at least there,
IMHO, you could offer up a reasonable debate.
--
Scott B. Husted
http://www.Husted.cc
Quoted text (29 lines)
> "Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:43758cc1$0$13315$[email hidden]... > >>"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >>news:[email hidden]... >> >>>I meant SimBin. I know they are different. :) >>> >> >> So let me get this straight - in all those posts you made you had >>Simbin confused with ISI? >> >> You're off your trolley! >> > > > I may be of my trolley, but I knew the companies were different. That's is > why I used the "etc." shortcut a lot. But even though they are not the > same, they are closely connected, aren't they? > > Simbin is the real problem as I see it. ISI also is not the most > consumer-friendly company. Most, however, are like ISI: I was comparing > company's consumer friendliness to LFS, which really lets everyone what is > going on. Small group, yes. Less bureaucracy Simbin and ISI are terrible > at public relations and in that way (among others) they are the same. > > Alanb > >"Simbin is the real problem as I see it. ISI also is not the most
consumer-friendly company. "
Alan -
This has already been said, but maybe with too many words.
Simbin and ISI sign contracts with various organizations in order to
use the tracks. The contracts undoubtably specify the exact manner in
which the tracks can be used. If Simbin and ISI in any way encouraged
or even tolerated their use elsewhere, they'd have legal problems.
They could be the consumer-friendliest people in the world, but they
_can't_ support this. Not even if you already bought the tracks from
them.
"Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:4374b04d$0$13315$[email hidden]
.au:
> ..........but not on GTR tracks he's already payed
> for....................
For those tracks, I use GTR. Which has weather and Rubber buildup.
These are not available in rF. WHY would I gut a track just to run it's
facimile in another sim?
dh
.au:
For those tracks, I use GTR. Which has weather and *** buildup.
These are not available in rF. WHY would I gut a track just to run it's
facimile in another sim?
dh
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
good point, but still not online (with any confidence)
Quoted text (12 lines)
> "Byron Forbes" <[email hidden]> wrote in > news:4374b04d$0$13315$[email hidden] > .au: > >> ..........but not on GTR tracks he's already payed >> for.................... > > For those tracks, I use GTR. Which has weather and Rubber buildup. > These are not available in rF. WHY would I gut a track just to run it's > facimile in another sim? > > dh"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
The idea of offline racing is 100 times more painful than the idea of
going back to GPL! :)
Quoted text (26 lines)
> > Again, I must throw an Americanism at the group. > "Buyer Beware." We in the States had months of reviews by peers that > clearly indicated GTR was not the multiplayer heaven they claimed it to > be. > (Heck right now our TPTCC online league is STRUGGLING with rFactor and > online issues.) We, armed with that knowledge then make the choice of > whether or not to purchase such product. I'd like to thank my Euro > brethern for alerting the rest of us. If others were amoung the first to > throw money at Simbin, I can only say you have to determine what attracts > you to a title and if that title meets your needs. If not, then do not > purchase. I don't purchase a car based on the promise they will figure > out > how to attach wheels at some future date. > > GTR is not online nirvana, but it is certainly one of the premier offline > sims in the racing world. The features they have brought to the table are > above and beyond the original code the title was based upon. Can you name > more than one or two other titles that Simulate their target racing series > as well as GTR does? > (and just as a teaser, I have chatted with aquaintences inside Simbin > who probably would verify that the company itself was split by failure of > the multiplayer to live up to the marketing claims.) > dave<who asks everyone not to steal>henrie > >
"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
so where can I get the tracks! lol!
