1. Michelin Rally Masters physics/driving model...
2. Long rally stages (ala Mobil 1 Rally Championship)
3. Licensed world rally cars and stages
4. True multi-player rallies on the Internet*
Seems pretty simple to me. As per number 4, I still don't think this has
been done properly on any rally sim yet. The best way to implement this
would be to establish an authenticating server that simply collects stage
times from everyone participating in the rally. The hell with trying to run
the cars in head-to-head demolition derbies, it is unnecessary for a true
rally sim. Lag wouldn't be an issue either. The only real-time feedback to
the drivers should be how you are doing compared to the other drivers.
Someone? Pretty please? I'd pay $100 for it...
Rally Trophy will have #4 next week ;)
http://rt.relaygames.com
Although it has Short Stages, and no "Licensed Stages" to speak of.
Cheers,
Schumi
"Bill Hyman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:0iRN7.21807$[email hidden]...
run
> the cars in head-to-head demolition derbies, it is unnecessary for a true
> rally sim. Lag wouldn't be an issue either. The only real-time feedbackto
> the drivers should be how you are doing compared to the other drivers.
>
> Someone? Pretty please? I'd pay $100 for it...
>
>
>
Quoted text (9 lines)
> 1. Michelin Rally Masters physics/driving model... > 2. Long rally stages (ala Mobil 1 Rally Championship) > 3. Licensed world rally cars and stages > 4. True multi-player rallies on the Internet* > > Seems pretty simple to me. As per number 4, I still don't think this has > been done properly on any rally sim yet. The best way to implement this > would be to establish an authenticating server that simply collects stage > times from everyone participating in the rally. The hell with trying to I would like to see it run as in the real world....i.e. driver A in Norway
goes off at 10am....driver b from England waits to start until 10:01(or
whatever the separation time is...) That way...you actually could see other
cars from time to time...especially if they crash and park.
dave henrie
"Schumi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:dhVN7.10254$[email hidden]...
has
> > been done properly on any rally sim yet. The best way to implement this
> > would be to establish an authenticating server that simply collectsstage
> > times from everyone participating in the rally. The hell with trying to
> run
> > the cars in head-to-head demolition derbies, it is unnecessary for atrue
> > rally sim. Lag wouldn't be an issue either. The only real-timefeedback
Quoted text (17 lines)
> Rally Trophy will have #4 next week ;) > > http://rt.relaygames.com > > Although it has Short Stages, and no "Licensed Stages" to speak of. > > Cheers, > Schumi > > "Bill Hyman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:0iRN7.21807$[email hidden]... > > 1. Michelin Rally Masters physics/driving model... > > 2. Long rally stages (ala Mobil 1 Rally Championship) > > 3. Licensed world rally cars and stages > > 4. True multi-player rallies on the Internet* > > > > Seems pretty simple to me. As per number 4, I still don't think thisQuoted text (9 lines)
> to > > the drivers should be how you are doing compared to the other drivers. > > > > Someone? Pretty please? I'd pay $100 for it... > > > > > > > >"Bill Hyman" <[email hidden]> writes:
How about realtime comparison to the other drivers? Let everybody else be
ghost cars.
--
-asbjxrn
Quoted text (12 lines)
> 1. Michelin Rally Masters physics/driving model... > 2. Long rally stages (ala Mobil 1 Rally Championship) > 3. Licensed world rally cars and stages > 4. True multi-player rallies on the Internet* > > Seems pretty simple to me. As per number 4, I still don't think this has > been done properly on any rally sim yet. The best way to implement this > would be to establish an authenticating server that simply collects stage > times from everyone participating in the rally. The hell with trying to run > the cars in head-to-head demolition derbies, it is unnecessary for a true > rally sim. Lag wouldn't be an issue either. The only real-time feedback to > the drivers should be how you are doing compared to the other drivers.Hmmm... I may have inadvertently mislead you guys by virtue of ommission. My
apologies for that.
Whilst we will be doing an Online Community for Rally Trophy (I've looked
around the Net, and I think I am safe in saying that this will be the most
advanced online Rally Sim Community to date), we will not be facilitating
the Online Play mechanisms for Rally Trophy.
We have decided this for a number of reasons. Some easy to understand, and
some not-so-easy to understand.
First the easy to understand:
JoWood and BugBear have chosen GameSpy to run the online aspects of the
game. Whilst I may disagree with their choice out of bias, it is also
because I know that Rally Trophy online is all but dead in the water, before
it even gets out of the gates. Basically, it took us no longer than 3 hours
to decode the BZF files, and inside those BZF files we have found a clump of
ini files (plain text) that control the physics. At this very point in time,
I am fully capable of setting my game to possess (for mild example) tarmac
grip on the winter roads, along with boosting the HP of the Mini to
outperform the Renault Alpine/Lancia Stratos in the straights at top speed,
nevermind the torque settings to ensure maximum acceleration out of that
slow corner (that I can now increase my braking efficiency 10 fold at will).
Bottom line is that I *could* (not saying I do) cheat at any moment online
through GameSpy, and no one would be the wiser. This is because of the
archaeic methodology of GameSpy and total lack of support for the games and
the community that surrounds it. Meaning further.... GameSpy does not
possess the technology to detect advanced cheat checking in a realtime
manner. We will be releasing an editor with the release of Rally Trophy
Relay, but we will be restricting the function of that editor to only
include things like image editing, and sound editing, and then eventually
pacenote editing. We will NOT be releasing any method to alter the physics,
simply because it would destroy the online gaming end of it, which would
inturn be completely irresponsible of us. However, it would not be that hard
for a dedicated individual with a smidgen of knowledge to crack the BZF
format. Combine that person with a bad sense of judgement, and you've got
undetectable physics mods online.
However, what we DO have is our offline hotshoe program called Casper which
CAN check the physics values (and anything else we specify in the selected
BZF files at will). So... we will be holding a Online-Hybrid Championship,
and fully real-time cheat-checked Hotshoe Competition. This will entail
users to simply launch Rally Tophy through Casper, and have their results
for either the Championship or the Hotshoe Comp. ready to upload to the
ranking system real-time.
Now for the not so easy to understand (although still pretty easy):
We respect JoWood's and BugBear's decision to use GameSpy, and we also
respect teh contract for which they are now bound by with GameSpy. For this
reason, we have no intention of placing JoWood or BugBear in a precarious
position of dealing with what would certainly amount to a lot of GameSpy
bitching about our support. As much as we would like to provide the online
play... Relay takes the position of "working WITH the developers/publishers"
not against them.
Now the hard-to-chew part of this:
We do not feel that (as Simmers) racing Head-to-Head against other drivers
starting at the same time is realistic. It just doesn't happen that way in
real Rallying except for special promotional demonstrations where certain
high profile Rally drivers do side-by-side (different tracks) at the same
time, and then switch, and compare total times.
So we actually feel that what we will be providing will be more realistic,
and at the same time, not step on anyone's toes. We are also hopeful that
you will like the miriad of features and statictics the community will host.
Anyways, that's the nuts and bolts of the whole thing, and my apologies if I
inadvertently mislead you. Expect a showing early next week, fully
functional (we are literally just tying up some loose ends int eh
documentation, and the backend statistics engine).
Cheers,
Schumi
"Schumi" <[email hidden]> writes:
(This does not actually have anything to do with you, just my view of
rallysimming. And I'm drunk.)
Because it is impossible in real life, but does that mean rallying wouldn't
be run that way if possible?
Nowadays the drivers are careful not to drive too fast at the
beginning of the rally, so they don't have to sweep the road later
(And won't be able to check their time agains the "leaders".) If it was
possible to give everyone identical conditions, don't you think they
would have? Should we have to be bothered by the limitations of the
real world in a sim race? Why not utilize our advantages, they've got
g-forces and "seat of the pants" info, we've got "pure" contest, equal
conditions. Let the best man win.
--
-asbjxrn
Quoted text (7 lines)
> Now the hard-to-chew part of this: > > We do not feel that (as Simmers) racing Head-to-Head against other drivers > starting at the same time is realistic. It just doesn't happen that way in > real Rallying except for special promotional demonstrations where certain > high profile Rally drivers do side-by-side (different tracks) at the same > time, and then switch, and compare total times.
"> JoWood and BugBear have chosen GameSpy to run the online aspects of the
> game. Whilst I may disagree with their choice out of bias, it is also
> because I know that Rally Trophy online is all but dead in the water,before
> it even gets out of the gates. Basically, it took us no longer than 3hours
> to decode the BZF files, and inside those BZF files we have found a clumpof
> ini files (plain text) that control the physics. At this very point intime,
> I am fully capable of setting my game to possess (for mild example) tarmac
> grip on the winter roads, along with boosting the HP of the Mini to
> outperform the Renault Alpine/Lancia Stratos in the straights at topspeed,
> nevermind the torque settings to ensure maximum acceleration out of that
> slow corner (that I can now increase my braking efficiency 10 fold atwill).
> Bottom line is that I *could* (not saying I do) cheat at any moment online
> through GameSpy, and no one would be the wiser. This is because of the
> archaeic methodology of GameSpy and total lack of support for the gamesand
> the community that surrounds it. Meaning further.... GameSpy does not
> possess the technology to detect advanced cheat checking in a realtime
> manner. We will be releasing an editor with the release of Rally Trophy
> Relay, but we will be restricting the function of that editor to only
> include things like image editing, and sound editing, and then eventually
> pacenote editing. We will NOT be releasing any method to alter thephysics,
> simply because it would destroy the online gaming end of it, which would
> inturn be completely irresponsible of us. However, it would not be thathard
> for a dedicated individual with a smidgen of knowledge to crack the BZF
> format. Combine that person with a bad sense of judgement, and you've got
> undetectable physics mods online."
That's FANTASTIC news! Did anyone figure out how to change the 3d models or
if you can make the cars AWD? If so, we could have a Group B add-on or
something and that would be sweet....If everything is decodable, it could
mean new tracks, mods, etc! I'm getting very excited now, and you talk about
it like it's a bad thing! I don't really care for rallying online that much
anyway, unless they release a patch where you can select start intervals for
each stage to do a championship and also have realistic damage so you can
drive by your rival upside down in a ditch :)
Thanks,
Alex
"> JoWood and BugBear have chosen GameSpy to run the online aspects of the
> game. Whilst I may disagree with their choice out of bias, it is also
> because I know that Rally Trophy online is all but dead in the water,before
> it even gets out of the gates. Basically, it took us no longer than 3hours
> to decode the BZF files, and inside those BZF files we have found a clumpof
> ini files (plain text) that control the physics. At this very point intime,
> I am fully capable of setting my game to possess (for mild example) tarmac
> grip on the winter roads, along with boosting the HP of the Mini to
> outperform the Renault Alpine/Lancia Stratos in the straights at topspeed,
> nevermind the torque settings to ensure maximum acceleration out of that
> slow corner (that I can now increase my braking efficiency 10 fold atwill).
> Bottom line is that I *could* (not saying I do) cheat at any moment online
> through GameSpy, and no one would be the wiser. This is because of the
> archaeic methodology of GameSpy and total lack of support for the gamesand
> the community that surrounds it. Meaning further.... GameSpy does not
> possess the technology to detect advanced cheat checking in a realtime
> manner. We will be releasing an editor with the release of Rally Trophy
> Relay, but we will be restricting the function of that editor to only
> include things like image editing, and sound editing, and then eventually
> pacenote editing. We will NOT be releasing any method to alter thephysics,
> simply because it would destroy the online gaming end of it, which would
> inturn be completely irresponsible of us. However, it would not be thathard
> for a dedicated individual with a smidgen of knowledge to crack the BZF
> format. Combine that person with a bad sense of judgement, and you've got
> undetectable physics mods online."
That's FANTASTIC news! Did anyone figure out how to change the 3d models or
if you can make the cars AWD? If so, we could have a Group B add-on or
something and that would be sweet....If everything is decodable, it could
mean new tracks, mods, etc! I'm getting very excited now, and you talk about
it like it's a bad thing! I don't really care for rallying online that much
anyway, unless they release a patch where you can select start intervals for
each stage to do a championship and also have realistic damage so you can
drive by your rival upside down in a ditch :)
Thanks,
Alex
"> JoWood and BugBear have chosen GameSpy to run the online aspects of the
> game. Whilst I may disagree with their choice out of bias, it is also
> because I know that Rally Trophy online is all but dead in the water,before
> it even gets out of the gates. Basically, it took us no longer than 3hours
> to decode the BZF files, and inside those BZF files we have found a clumpof
> ini files (plain text) that control the physics. At this very point intime,
> I am fully capable of setting my game to possess (for mild example) tarmac
> grip on the winter roads, along with boosting the HP of the Mini to
> outperform the Renault Alpine/Lancia Stratos in the straights at topspeed,
> nevermind the torque settings to ensure maximum acceleration out of that
> slow corner (that I can now increase my braking efficiency 10 fold atwill).
> Bottom line is that I *could* (not saying I do) cheat at any moment online
> through GameSpy, and no one would be the wiser. This is because of the
> archaeic methodology of GameSpy and total lack of support for the gamesand
> the community that surrounds it. Meaning further.... GameSpy does not
> possess the technology to detect advanced cheat checking in a realtime
> manner. We will be releasing an editor with the release of Rally Trophy
> Relay, but we will be restricting the function of that editor to only
> include things like image editing, and sound editing, and then eventually
> pacenote editing. We will NOT be releasing any method to alter thephysics,
> simply because it would destroy the online gaming end of it, which would
> inturn be completely irresponsible of us. However, it would not be thathard
> for a dedicated individual with a smidgen of knowledge to crack the BZF
> format. Combine that person with a bad sense of judgement, and you've got
> undetectable physics mods online."
That's FANTASTIC news! Did anyone figure out how to change the 3d models or
if you can make the cars AWD? If so, we could have a Group B add-on or
something and that would be sweet....If everything is decodable, it could
mean new tracks, mods, etc! I'm getting very excited now, and you talk about
it like it's a bad thing! I don't really care for rallying online that much
anyway, unless they release a patch where you can select start intervals for
each stage to do a championship and also have realistic damage so you can
drive by your rival upside down in a ditch :)
Thanks,
Alex
Sorry for the triple post. I stopped the sending and started it again a few
times because I thought it wasnt going through, when I guess it really was.
(It would say it was sending and never seemed to finish, so when I stopped
it, it put it in the outbox so I could try again)
Thanks,
Alex
"Alex Kihurani" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:O9BO7.1315$[email hidden]...
clump
> of
> > ini files (plain text) that control the physics. At this very point in
> time,
> > I am fully capable of setting my game to possess (for mild example)tarmac
online
eventually
got
> > undetectable physics mods online."
>
> That's FANTASTIC news! Did anyone figure out how to change the 3d modelsor
> if you can make the cars AWD? If so, we could have a Group B add-on or
> something and that would be sweet....If everything is decodable, it could
> mean new tracks, mods, etc! I'm getting very excited now, and you talkabout
> it like it's a bad thing! I don't really care for rallying online thatmuch
> anyway, unless they release a patch where you can select start intervalsfor
