F12001 Physics

I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could point out other tracks which have similiar examples. At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the above examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a little more exciting. I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Why not? David G Fisher

"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SUzS7.308387$[email hidden]...

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> I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way > the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For > example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. > Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could

point > out other tracks which have similiar examples. >agreed. while i don't turn "alien" laptimes, i find the sim too easy at times ala scgt. perhaps we need an "advanced options patch" to liven it up a bit?

hi David, I'm not as knowledgeable as you to say which is better. regarding SPA, i love racing it in F1RC as i feel i can push the car more closely to the edge. obviously, my impression of the edge might not be the same as the hotshoes, but i do try. with F1 2001, on the other hand, i can't seem to push it to the edge. it seems the transition from 'in-control' to 'losing it' happens very quickly. either that or i'm not spotting the signs. very possible as i am not a physics nut. i don't consider myself a hot driver by any means. what f1 2001 has for me that f1rc doesn't have to the same degree is the sense of absolute terror and fear when playing. the sensation of speed seems to convey the seriousness of racing a bit more. its purely subjective of course. the glossiness and smoothness of the tracks & graphics seem to be its only shortcoming. a little more grit and bumps would make it perfect. :) anyway, my personal opinion is that all of these games (including GPL) are games. realistic games and simulations of course, but *games*. some people here make a big fuss of the realism of gpl or nascar 4, but it sooooo far removed from actual racing (IMO) to make seem like a wasted exercise to say which is more realistic. we have moved on from pole position to get to where we are now. we need a similar jump before we can talk about approach 'realistic' simulators. anyway, enough of that. bottom line. f1rc is excellent, sorely needs a patch. i *will* eagerly await the reviews of f1rc2 if it comes and probably buy it. EA did the same thing with F12000 and F12000CE so I don't blame Ubisoft. f1 2001 is also excellent, but at least we can tweak it. some nut will probably figure out how to improve things to give you the feel you want. that probably is out of the question if the current legal position around f1rc is to be believed (which i do). On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 05:04:09 GMT, "rik zeppelin" <[email hidden]> wrote: > >"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:SUzS7.308387$[email hidden]... >> I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much >> detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. >> Regards all, istoff

hmmm.. for once I don't totally agree with you Dave. Eau Rouge is pretty easy with the right setup I agree. Blanchimont is an easy no challenge flat out turn in reality so nothing untoward there, and I think you'll find if you watch the replays that the drivers don't lift off through the 2 Pouhon corners either. Don't agree with your opinion on Stavelot either, I don't find it easy at all!!! Still my best time is 1:49 so I've got a bit to go! Copse certainly is too easy as are some of the Maggots/Becketts corners. Although I liked F1RC a lot, going back to it now occasionally, I find it pretty unrealistic (as far as I know what that is!) compared with F1 2001. The car needs a lot more control in F1 2001 especially when braking - getting the throttle/braking control right is a real challenge when pushing to the limit. Iain "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SUzS7.308387$[email hidden]...

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> I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way > the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For > example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. > Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could

point > out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge > slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > > In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in theabove

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> examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and > will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I > find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a > little more exciting. > > I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Why not? > > David G Fisher > > >

On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 10:10:24 -0000, "Iain Mackenzie" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>hmmm.. for once I don't totally agree with you Dave. Eau Rouge is pretty >easy with the right setup I agree. Blanchimont is an easy no challenge flat >out turn in reality so nothing untoward there, and I think you'll find if >you watch the replays that the drivers don't lift off through the 2 Pouhon >corners either. >Don't agree with your opinion on Stavelot either, I don't find it easy at >all!!! Still my best time is 1:49 so I've got a bit to go!

Wow.. you allmost kind of sort of disagree with David.. :) Andre

I agree with everything you've said, and those are a *few* of the reasons why I dislike F1 2001....and why I still only play F1RC. It's too easy going through Eau Rouge in the wet. as well :/ Maybe when the next F1 2001 patch comes out, I can actually play it with pedals that function correctly :\ On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could point >out other tracks which have similiar examples. > >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the above >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a >little more exciting. > >I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Why not? > >David G Fisher > >

> At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge > slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. This is something which bugs me - it feels like I'm powersliding around corners most of the time. I don't have a problem with the grip at high speed - after all, these things generate a LOT of downforce at high speed.

> hmmm.. for once I don't totally agree with you Dave. Eau Rouge is pretty > easy with the right setup I agree. Blanchimont is an easy no challengeflat

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> out turn in reality so nothing untoward there, and I think you'll find if > you watch the replays that the drivers don't lift off through the 2 Pouhon > corners either. > Don't agree with your opinion on Stavelot either, I don't find it easy at > all!!! Still my best time is 1:49 so I've got a bit to go! > Copse certainly is too easy as are some of the Maggots/Becketts corners. > Although I liked F1RC a lot, going back to it now occasionally, I find it > pretty unrealistic (as far as I know what that is!) compared with F1 2001. > The car needs a lot more control in F1 2001 especially when braking - > getting the throttle/braking control right is a real challenge when

pushing > to the limit. I seem to find the cars very unstable under brakes. Braking into corners also doesn't feel anything like any other sim I've played. Has anyone got any tips for setting up brake sensitivity?

On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could point >out other tracks which have similiar examples. > >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race.

There are examples of those too, I don't think it's too far off from things I've seen this year. A problem with assessing this is that the drivers tend not to try to do it too often 'cause it's not exactly helping your speed. :) It's really easy to get a return when it bites aswell. Anyhow, I do think that the high-speed grip is too high. Maybe it is because of gaining too much downforce for the drag? >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the above >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a >little more exciting. I definitely think that F1 2001 has better underworkings in the physics department. My feeling about F1RC was that it could be a bit erratic and unpredictable at times. High-downforce was better than low-downforce where it became waayy too unstable. The hamfisted steering-adjustments don't exactly help either. Another thing was that if you got a dip in framerates the it seemed to affect the handling. A thing in F1RC I didn't like is that the racing line doesn't seem to matter much. When racing the ghostcar I can see that I don't lose time when I have two meters left to the kerb on the exit, but if I miss mashing the throttle by a tenth of a second I lose 20-30 meters or more.

In an interview this year some F1 driver said Eau Rouge was easy- flat in the real cars.

"David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SUzS7.308387$[email hidden]...

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> I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way > the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For > example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. > Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could

point > out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge > slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > > In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in theabove

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> examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and > will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I > find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a > little more exciting. > > I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Why not? > > David G Fisher > >

I haven't owned a modern F1 sim since gp2, so it's been a while (lowly p2-300 keeps it that way!), but doesn't the high speed grip vary with wing so that with little enough wing, Eau Rouge becomes tippy-toes? Isn't that the balancing act you're trying for? Or is it too easy even with minimum wing? Ben

A realistic, competitive setup would have a rear wing set between 25 and 30 for the Ferrari. I was able to lower it to 10 and still take Eau Rouge flat out. David G Fisher "Ben Coleman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> doesn't the high speed grip vary with wing > so that with little enough wing, Eau Rouge becomes tippy-toes? Isn't that > the balancing act you're trying for? Or is it too easy even with minimum > wing? > > Ben > >

In the slow cars it was easier (also depended on fuel load which effected speed), but in the faster cars in qualifying trim, most said they had to lift a bit. David G Fisher <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In an interview this year some F1 driver said Eau Rouge was easy- flat > in the real cars.

I haven't tried it in the wet yet, but it certainly shouldn't be too easy. David G Fisher "Pooyan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> I agree with everything you've said, and those are a *few* of the > reasons why I dislike F1 2001....and why I still only play F1RC. > > It's too easy going through Eau Rouge in the wet. as well :/ > > Maybe when the next F1 2001 patch comes out, I can actually > play it with pedals that function correctly :\ > > > On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > > > >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the

way > >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For > >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. > >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > > >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I couldpoint > >out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > > >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge > >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > > > >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in theabove > >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping,and > >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's whyI > >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a > >little more exciting. > > > >I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Whynot? > > > >David G Fisher > > > > >

You might be right about the flaws of the physics in F1 2001, but at least it doesn't have the mistake of F1RC, where you can drive a full! lap with locked front wheels. Remco On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the way >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could point >out other tracks which have similiar examples. > >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the above >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, and >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why I >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a >little more exciting.

In <SUzS7.308387$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher wrote: > I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. Here is what I love about the physics and modelling in the game. Rev the engine when you are stopped. The car body will twist. Sit in the pits and turn the wheel left to right - the car body will move. Watch the car from top view. Watch the individual grip being modelled on each wheel by seeing the different tyre tracks (assuming you have assists off and you have full effects on (set in graphics)). Sit in the hoop camera view, and do the weaving tyre warmup thing - you can see tyre tracks being left behind from the front wheels if you do it quick enough. Also the tracks are different every time. This reflects the physics model. Notice how individual wheels have different grip. Then get the telemetry replay tool and spend some time looking at all the parameters the physics engine is modelling (make sure you have high fidelity replay recording on - I think it requires it). You can get it from here. <http://www.the-best.racesim.net/> > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the > way the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. > For example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes > closed. Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. You must be an amazingly good driver. With all assists off I can not take Eau Rouge flat out with my eyes closed. The other corners definitely not. it is incredibly easy to upset the car - especially when you start going over down hill. Of course I could easily do this with all the assists on (brake point, steering etc etc etc). You can check what assists you have on with by cycling through the various LCD modes. I only use invulnerability and use throttle help when I don't want to spin out the back end too much :-) > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could > point out other tracks which have similiar examples. > >This sounds like you have assists on or you are a Mr Schumaker. > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch > huge slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. Have you watched Montoya drive ;-) - actually I can and can't catch slides. My best strategy is exactly like GPL - push in the clutch and try to release it at the right time. What fun. Maybe you have spin assist on. > In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the > above examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start > chirping, and will eventually break loose. This happens in F1-2001 with assists off. If you have assists on you don't get this. Anyone can drive it (which was the point of the assists of course). I get squirrely all the time with and without throttle assists. >You have to "dance on the > edge". That's why I find the driving experience to be a lot more > "physical" in F1RC, and a little more exciting. This is exactly what I get in F1-2001. With the force feedback patch you can feel this through the wheel. > I know a few people here have noticed these things, but not many. Why > not? I think they all have some kind of assists on or they are much much much better drivers than I am. This game feels as good as GPL in the physics department and in some ways feels better. --- Bill

"Bill Ryder" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the > > way the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. > > For example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes > > closed. Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > You must be an amazingly good driver. > > With all assists off I can not take Eau Rouge flat out with my eyes > closed. > > The other corners definitely not. it is incredibly easy to upset the car - > especially when you start going over down hill.

Many people have said the same thing I have, both in this thread, this newsgroup, and at other forums such as High Gear.

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> Of course I could easily do this with all the assists on (brake point, > steering etc etc etc). You can check what assists you have on with by > cycling through the various LCD modes. I only use invulnerability and use > throttle help when I don't want to spin out the back end too much :-) > > > > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could > > point out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > > > > This sounds like you have assists on or you are a Mr Schumaker.

You can be sure I have no assists on. > > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch > > huge slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > > Have you watched Montoya drive ;-) I've seen him crash. :-) >- actually I can and can't catch > slides. My best strategy is exactly like GPL - push in the clutch and try > to release it at the right time. What fun. > > Maybe you have spin assist on. Nope. I can send you a setup for Spa in case it's your setup that's holding you back. I even took the setup I have and moved the rear wing from 27 (which is about where it should be for a realistic and competitive setup) to 10 and was still able to take Eau Rouge flat out. David G Fisher

???? David G Fisher "Remco Moedt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> > > > You might be right about the flaws of the physics in F1 2001, but at > least it doesn't have the mistake of F1RC, where you can drive a full! > lap with locked front wheels. > > Remco > > > > On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much > >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. > > > >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the

way > >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For > >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. > >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. > > > >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I couldpoint > >out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > > >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge > >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > > > >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in theabove > >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping,and > >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's whyI > >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a > >little more exciting. >

Real cars won't actually turn a corner if the front wheels are locked ;) -- Ian P <email invalid due to spam> "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fotT7.313879$[email hidden]... > ???? > > David G Fisher > > "Remco Moedt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > You might be right about the flaws of the physics in F1 2001, but at > > least it doesn't have the mistake of F1RC, where you can drive a full! > > lap with locked front wheels. > > > > Remco

That's what I thought when I noticed that. Remco On Mon, 17 Dec 2001 21:24:27 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>???? > >David G Fisher > >"Remco Moedt" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> >> >> >> You might be right about the flaws of the physics in F1 2001, but at >> least it doesn't have the mistake of F1RC, where you can drive a full! >> lap with locked front wheels. >> >> Remco >> >> >> >> On Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:59:46 GMT, "David G Fisher" >> <[email hidden]> wrote: >> >> >I'm surprised the physics model of F12001 hasn't been discussed in much >> >detail, especially considering many are saying it's the best F1 sim yet. >> > >> >As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in the >way >> >the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone IMO. For >> >example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your eyes closed. >> >Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. >> > >> >At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could >point >> >out other tracks which have similiar examples. >> > >> >At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch huge >> >slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. >> > >> >In F1RC, you have to work the throttle and be much more precise in the >above >> >examples or the car gets a little squirrely, the tires start chirping, >and >> >will eventually break loose. You have to "dance on the edge". That's why >I >> >find the driving experience to be a lot more "physical" in F1RC, and a >> >little more exciting. >> > >

In <VntT7.313878$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher wrote:

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> "Bill Ryder" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> > As much as I love it, there certainly seems to be something off in >> > the way the cars handle. The grip at medium to high speed is overdone >> > IMO. For example, at Spa, you can take Eau Rouge flat out with your >> > eyes closed. Pouhon is easy. Stavelot and Blanchimont also. >> >> You must be an amazingly good driver. >> >> With all assists off I can not take Eau Rouge flat out with my eyes >> closed. >> >> The other corners definitely not. it is incredibly easy to upset the >> car - especially when you start going over down hill. > > Many people have said the same thing I have, both in this thread, this > newsgroup, and at other forums such as High Gear.

I bet they didn't have their eyes closed.

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>> Of course I could easily do this with all the assists on (brake point, >> steering etc etc etc). You can check what assists you have on with by >> cycling through the various LCD modes. I only use invulnerability and >> use throttle help when I don't want to spin out the back end too much >> :-) >> >> >> > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could >> > point out other tracks which have similiar examples.

Jeeze man - you are definitely a Schumaker. There is nothing breezy about running through those corners flat. I am not saying it is not possible, just that it is bloody hard to too for me.

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> >> > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch >> > huge slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. >> >> Have you watched Montoya drive ;-) > > I've seen him crash. :-)

Hehe - he was lots of fun to watch when he first started - all loose like he was driving a champ car. > Nope. I can send you a setup for Spa in case it's your setup that's > holding you back. That'll be cool. bryder at paradise dot net dot nz What would also be cool is a hotlap so I can look at the telemetry. I am sure it my driving though. It isn't as easy for me as it is for you. I still get Eau Rouge wrong sometimes but if I get it right you can go through flat - just like in Real Life(TM). So given you find the game so easy what are your laptimes for Spa and Silverstone for example? have you registered with the hotlap place (with your replays)? (From here <http://www.the-best.racesim.net/> ) --- Bill

"Bill Ryder" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In <VntT7.313878$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher > I bet they didn't have their eyes closed. I don't really do it with my eyses closed. :-) I do have the throttle pressed flat all the way through, and it is very easy compared to F1RC.

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> >> Of course I could easily do this with all the assists on (brake point, > >> steering etc etc etc). You can check what assists you have on with by > >> cycling through the various LCD modes. I only use invulnerability and > >> use throttle help when I don't want to spin out the back end too much > >> :-) > >> > >> > >> > At Silverstone, Copse and Maggotts/Becketts are a breeze too. I could > >> > point out other tracks which have similiar examples. > > Jeeze man - you are definitely a Schumaker. There is nothing breezy about > running through those corners flat. I am not saying it is not possible, > just that it is bloody hard to too for me.

I only have to brake at the last turn before Chapel. In F1RC it's a little more tricky.

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> >> > At low speeds, the cars seem too slippery at times. I can also catch > >> > huge slides which I don't see occurr too often in a real F1 race. > >> > >> Have you watched Montoya drive ;-) > > > > I've seen him crash. :-) > > > Hehe - he was lots of fun to watch when he first started - all loose like > he was driving a champ car. > > > > > Nope. I can send you a setup for Spa in case it's your setup that's > > holding you back. > > That'll be cool. bryder at paradise dot net dot nz

I'll send one for Silverstone and Spa. They are Ian Bell's actually. > So given you find the game so easy what are your laptimes for Spa and > Silverstone for example? I didn't say I find the game easy. I find one aspect of the game easy compared to F1RC, which is high speed grip. I've only driven a handful of laps at Spa. My Silverstone time is 1:19.6 after 50 laps with no split axis (Iain M. was able to fix that for us both last night). I didn't know about the site below. Any holaps I've done were for Relay. For Relay, you have to keep a wheel on the asphalt at all times or the laps don't count. At the site below, you just need to keep your wheels on the curbing. I think the Relay rules are much better and more realistic. Maybe I'll do some laps for that site too.

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> > have you registered with the hotlap place (with your replays)? > > (From here <http://www.the-best.racesim.net/> ) > > --- > Bill

In <Z7aU7.319806$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher wrote:

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> "Bill Ryder" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... >> In <VntT7.313878$[email hidden]>, David G Fisher >> I bet they didn't have their eyes closed. > > I don't really do it with my eyses closed. :-) I do have the throttle > pressed flat all the way through, and it is very easy compared to F1RC.

Hehe. Me too. As someone else says in real life they can do it flat.I do have a problem getting my line right everytime (I tend to run wide sometimes coming out of it). >> That'll be cool. bryder at paradise dot net dot nz > > I'll send one for Silverstone and Spa. They are Ian Bell's actually. Excellent! > >> So given you find the game so easy what are your laptimes for Spa and >> Silverstone for example? > > I didn't say I find the game easy. I find one aspect of the game easy > compared to F1RC, which is high speed grip. I see. All I can say is thank goodness the grip is so high :-)

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> I've only driven a handful > of laps at Spa. My Silverstone time is 1:19.6 after 50 laps with no > split axis (Iain M. was able to fix that for us both last night). I > didn't know about the site below. Any holaps I've done were for Relay. > For Relay, you have to keep a wheel on the asphalt at all times or the > laps don't count. At the site below, you just need to keep your wheels > on the curbing. I think the Relay rules are much better and more > realistic. Maybe I'll do some laps for that site too.

What are the F1 rules? I thought you could run over the curbs but can't cut the corners completely if you gain advantage (or don't lose a place). In F1-2k1 it can be very expensive to run the curbs depending on the track (you end up bouncing). Does that happen in f1rc? (the bouncing and subsequent loss of grip). ---Bill

"Bill Ryder" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> What are the F1 rules? I thought you could run over the curbs but can't > cut the corners completely if you gain advantage (or don't lose a place). > > In F1-2k1 it can be very expensive to run the curbs depending on the > track (you end up bouncing). Does that happen in f1rc? (the bouncing and > subsequent loss of grip). > > ---Bill

I'm not sure what the rules are in real F1 with regards to curbs. The curbs in F1RC seem to have more of an effect on the cars than in F12001. At Suzuka in F12001, you need to be very careful, but for most of the tracks they seem rather flat. David G Fisher