Archive / 2002 / January

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

274 posts by 33 people · 27 Jan 2002 05:20 UTC - 01 Feb 2002 17:59 UTC

Windows XP product activation problems and debate

Larry reported that removing and reinstalling his network card driver forced Windows XP to demand reactivation by phone. This started a 274-post debate over Microsoft's product activation: critics called it intrusive and pointless when cracked versions circulated, while Chris H. defended it and explained the hardware tolerance rules. The thread wandered into dropping Windows for Linux, backup tools and driver support.

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Automated summary.

Larry (The Other Larry) 27 Jan 2002 05:20 UTC#139674

Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation was _bound_ to screw up eventually. Well, it did. This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on my XP Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honored tradition of removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting Windows re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC card and reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activation notice! It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. Sure, why not. However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the system boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation could not do it's thing over the Internet. Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had a choice). I called the toll-free number. Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process, where you punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back your activation key. Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of using an operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. I didn't get the impression that this person really understood the technical issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I did get re-activated. Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was back on the Internet. So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling from Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot 98/2K (2K won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned trash can. We don't need this crap. Larry

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 06:14 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139684

Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if this ever occurs in the future: http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system information, which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correct it, which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in Device Manager was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, and e-mail them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people for further investigation. You might also note, if you know, the names of the persons who assisted in the activation center, the time and date of your call. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation was > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > Well, it did. > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on my XP > Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honored tradition of > removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting Windows > re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. > > Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC card and > reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activation notice! > > It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware > Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. > > Sure, why not. > > However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the system > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation could not do > it's thing over the Internet. > > Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had a choice). > > I called the toll-free number. > > Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process, where you > punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back your > activation key. > > Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. > > Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. > > Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of using an > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. I > didn't get the impression that this person really understood the technical > issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I did get > re-activated. > > Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was back on the > Internet. > > So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling from > Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. > > Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data > locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot 98/2K (2K > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > trash can. > > We don't need this crap. > > Larry > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 27 Jan 2002 06:25 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139686

Chris, There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Network problems. The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer DVD-116 DVD drive. I assure you I was suprised as well :) I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and that I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. Thanks for your input! -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if thisever > occurs in the future: > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system information, > which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean > install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correctit, > which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in Device Manager > was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, and e-mail > them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people forfurther

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> investigation. You might also note, if you know, the names of the persons > who assisted in the activation center, the time and date of your call. > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation

was > > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > > > Well, it did. > > > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on myXP > > Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honored traditionof > > removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting > Windows > > re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. > > > > Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC card and > > reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activationnotice!

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> > > > It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware > > Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. > > > > Sure, why not. > > > > However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the system > > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation could not > do > > it's thing over the Internet. > > > > Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had a choice). > > > > I called the toll-free number. > > > > Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process, where > you > > punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back

your

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> > activation key. > > > > Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. > > > > Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. > > > > Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of using

an > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. > I > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood thetechnical

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> > issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I did get > > re-activated. > > > > Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was back on > the > > Internet. > > > > So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling

from > > Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. > > > > Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data > > locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot 98/2K(2K

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> > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > > trash can. > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > Larry > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 27 Jan 2002 06:27 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139687

Oh, forgot. Home version. -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if thisever > occurs in the future: > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system information, > which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean > install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correctit, > which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in Device Manager > was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, and e-mail > them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people forfurther

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an > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. > I > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood thetechnical

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> > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > > trash can. > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > Larry > > > > > > > >

Rob Adams 27 Jan 2002 06:31 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139590

A single hardware change won't, EXCEPT if it's the network card. Don't ask why... "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if thisever > occurs in the future: > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system information, > which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean > install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correctit, > which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in Device Manager > was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, and e-mail > them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people forfurther

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an > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. > I > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood thetechnical

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> > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > > trash can. > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > Larry > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 27 Jan 2002 06:35 UTC↳ reply to Rob Adams #139591

Yeah, but I didn't actually remove the hardware. This would, in a way, indicate that WPA is working off of the driver for the hardware, and not the hardware itself. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is a scary thought. BTW. the NIC card caries more weight due to the MAC Address, which, like fingerprints, is supposed to be totally unique to each and every Ethernet interface on earth. -Larry "Rob Adams" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:J8N48.7044$[email hidden]...

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> A single hardware change won't, EXCEPT if it's the network card. Don't ask > why... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if this > ever > > occurs in the future: > > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system

information, > > which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean > > install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correct > it, > > which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in DeviceManager > > was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, ande-mail > > them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people for > further > > investigation. You might also note, if you know, the names of thepersons

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> > who assisted in the activation center, the time and date of your call. > > -- > > Chris H. > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > Associate Expert > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > > > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation > was > > > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > > > > > Well, it did. > > > > > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on

my > XP > > > Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honoredtradition > of > > > removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting > > Windows > > > re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. > > > > > > Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC cardand

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> > > reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activation > notice! > > > > > > It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware > > > Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. > > > > > > Sure, why not. > > > > > > However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the

system > > > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > > > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation couldnot

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> > do > > > it's thing over the Internet. > > > > > > Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had a choice). > > > > > > I called the toll-free number. > > > > > > Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process,

where

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> > you > > > punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back > your > > > activation key. > > > > > > Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. > > > > > > Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. > > > > > > Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of

using > an > > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on thetelephone. > > I > > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood the > technical > > > issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I didget > > > re-activated. > > > > > > Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was backon

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> > the > > > Internet. > > > > > > So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling > from > > > Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. > > > > > > Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my

data > > > locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot 98/2K > (2K > > > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in thedamned

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> > > trash can. > > > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Milhouse 27 Jan 2002 07:59 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139597

Which is why you just hack WPA out of XP. It can't be terribly hard if versions modified as such were floating around the internet long before XP was even released... Milhouse "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]...

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> Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation was > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > Well, it did. > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on my XP > Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honored tradition of > removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting

Windows

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> re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. > > Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC card and > reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activation notice! > > It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware > Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. > > Sure, why not. > > However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the system > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation could not

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> it's thing over the Internet. > > Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had a choice). > > I called the toll-free number. > > Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process, where

you

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> punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back your > activation key. > > Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. > > Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. > > Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of using an > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone.

I > didn't get the impression that this person really understood the technical > issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I did get > re-activated. > > Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was back onthe

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> Internet. > > So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling from > Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. > > Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data > locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot 98/2K (2K > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > trash can. > > We don't need this crap. > > Larry > >

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 08:20 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139599

The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the system is reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sort of saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day. Then those changes are reset to zero and adding the NIC would not have triggered anything because it would only have been count one or two (at most) of the four to six allowed changes. At this moment, I don't see anything but activation seeing a "different" system, therefore requiring the telephone call. I can see where activation may have been triggered by the numerous changes within a single, 120-day period, but if you'd like I'll continue to track it down so we know for sure. It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. 8-) GPL, with the update patch, runs quite well for me on a clean NTFS install of Windows XP Pro, an AMD Thunderbird 1 GB with 512 PC133 RAM and a GeForce2 MX400 w/64 Megs. 8-) -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Network problems. > > The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the > installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard > drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer > DVD-116 DVD drive. > > I assure you I was suprised as well :) > > I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. > > The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I > didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and that > I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > Thanks for your input! > > -Larry

Tim Wheatley 27 Jan 2002 08:55 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139602

Well... why do you believe you needed to reinstall something which was working? Tim "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]...

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Windows

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Tim Wheatley 27 Jan 2002 08:56 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139603

Ah, forget my reply then. "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Networkproblems.

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> > The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the > installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard > drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer > DVD-116 DVD drive. > > I assure you I was suprised as well :) > > I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. > > The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I > didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and

that

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> I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > Thanks for your input! > > -Larry > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if this > ever > > occurs in the future: > > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system

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system > > > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > > > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation couldnot

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where

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> > > trash can. > > > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 08:58 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139604

"Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Networkproblems.

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that

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> I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > Thanks for your input! > > -Larry

I read that if you save the wpa.dbl file you can always restore it by going to minimal safe mode. Also, there are cracks for XP if you really want to avoid the assinine activation scheme that Microsoft has foisted upon it's customers and caused us all this grief while the pirates still continue to provide pirated copies of XP.

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 08:59 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139605

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > three other changes, too. That's not six changes is it? We were told we would be allowed to make six changes every six months.

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 09:02 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139606

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS > SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. Why? A joystick/wheel doesn't count as a hardware change.

Blake 27 Jan 2002 09:29 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139609

When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:JfP48.280$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > > The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > > three other changes, too. > > That's not six changes is it? We were told we would be allowed to make six > changes every six months. > > >

Gerry Aitken 27 Jan 2002 10:19 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139610

"Chris H." wrote: > It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS > SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. Oh dear, your OS is commanding part of your life. :( How so very sad! Cheers Gerry

Gerry Aitken 27 Jan 2002 10:30 UTC↳ reply to Tim Wheatley #139611

Tim Wheatley wrote: > Well... why do you believe you needed to reinstall something which was > working? Working?! He was having problems with his network! "Larry (The Other Larry)" wrote: > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on my XP > Client Machine

Richard Walker 27 Jan 2002 11:13 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139613

In message <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]> "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > We don't need this crap. Except for the small fact that, clearly, you do. If you didn't need 'this crap', you wouldn't be running Windows XP. Don't like WPA? Don't use Windows XP. Heck, just don't use Windows. -- Richard. "I am the eggman, they are the eggmen. I am the walrus, goo goo g'joob."

Richard Walker 27 Jan 2002 11:15 UTC↳ reply to Blake #139612

In message <TLP48.141564$[email hidden]> "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote: > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. -- Richard. "And he never shows his feelings, But the fool on the hill."

jon 27 Jan 2002 14:37 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139626

Agreed!! I Won't run it!! Richard Walker <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In message <TLP48.141564$[email hidden]> > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > > MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't like

it,

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> then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. > > > -- > Richard. > > "And he never shows his feelings, But the fool on the hill."

Steve Levett 27 Jan 2002 15:13 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139631

That does make me laugh, people who buy it have to go through the hassle of activation yet a corporate version that doesn't need to be activated is freely available for download. Rather than discourage piracy I believe this has just made more people download XP corporate. -- Steve Levett "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ieP48.279$[email hidden]... > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Network > problems. > > > > The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the > > installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard > > drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer > > DVD-116 DVD drive. > > > > I assure you I was suprised as well :) > > > > I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. > > > > The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I > > didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and > that > > I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > > > Thanks for your input! > > > > -Larry > > I read that if you save the wpa.dbl file you can always restore it by going > to minimal safe mode. Also, there are cracks for XP if you really want to > avoid the assinine activation scheme that Microsoft has foisted upon it's > customers and caused us all this grief while the pirates still continue to > provide pirated copies of XP. > >

Steve Levett 27 Jan 2002 15:14 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139632

XP without the WPA is available easily on the net. The only ones who suffer this are the people who buy it, not the people with illegal copies. -- Steve Levett "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In message <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]> > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > We don't need this crap. > > Except for the small fact that, clearly, you do. > > If you didn't need 'this crap', you wouldn't be running Windows XP. > > Don't like WPA? Don't use Windows XP. Heck, just don't use Windows. > > > -- > Richard. > > "I am the eggman, they are the eggmen. I am the walrus, goo goo g'joob."

Marc Collins 27 Jan 2002 15:16 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139633

WOW, this is a faster response than if posted to a Microsoft newsgroup!!!!!! Marc "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PUM48.46302$[email hidden]... > Windows XP should absolutely NOT react like that since a single hardware > change should never have sent the activation out of tolerance. See: > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > Additionally, this Microsoft Knowledge Base article should help if thisever > occurs in the future: > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > I would suggest you make quick notes of precisely your system information, > which version of Windows XP (Home or Pro), method of installation (clean > install or upgrade), the original problem and steps you took to correctit, > which brand Ethernet card it was, what the error message in Device Manager > was which prompted you to uninstall the card and reinstall it, and e-mail > them to me so I can forward the information to the proper people forfurther

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your

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an > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. > I > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood thetechnical

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> > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > > trash can. > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > Larry > > > > > > > >

Richard Walker 27 Jan 2002 15:46 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139637

In message <a315g7$14iosg$[email hidden]> "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote: > XP without the WPA is available easily on the net. The only ones who > suffer this are the people who buy it, not the people with illegal copies. Mmmnnn... not quite. There are 'legal' users, casual pirates, and 'expert' pirates. It's the latter group who have got the 'non-WPA' versions of XP, but WPA is probably stopping the casual pirates. In any case, I can't think of anything that *requires* Windows XP to run. I only use Windows (Me) for games. It runs Grand Prix 2/3, GPL, NASCAR 4, Sports Car GT, TOCA 1/2, and a handful of demos, without any problems. I certainly won't be upgrading (*unless* a stunning new game demands me to). All my other computing activities are carried out on different platforms, which free me from Microsoft! :-) -- Richard. "Free As A Bird. It's the next best thing to be, free as a bird."

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 16:02 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139489

No, not that I'm changing something, but that I'm busy doing things. I've made no changes on my system (I seem to like the way it runs) and just haven't had the time between newsgroups, monitoring an online racing site I help out, testing various software and watching hockey, NFL playoffs and playing taxi for three daughters. 8-) Then there's shoveling snow . . . So many activities, so little time for GPL. BTW - Windows XP has a very excellent Help and Support. I believe it to be the best advancement of any portion of the product, compared to what was done in Win98SE, Millennium or Windows 2K. Go into H&S and put "List of troubleshooters" in the Search section. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:siP48.281$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > > It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS > > SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. > > Why? A joystick/wheel doesn't count as a hardware change. > > >

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 16:46 UTC↳ reply to Blake #139493

"Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make onMY > system?? WTF is that lame crap! Yea, they really pissed off a lot of customers with this BS scheme. They think they own us.

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 16:50 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139494

"Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't likeit, > then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. Which means we won't get new drivers for our expensive hardware either! Already lots of hardware manufacturers have their noses up Microsfts ass and are only writing new drivers for XP. We are being railroaded, pure and simple. Sure I could stop buying updated OS's but then I would have to stop buying updated hardware too. I'm sure MS and the hardware manufacturers would be the whining ones instead of us if we all did that.

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 16:52 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139496

Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's arms and force them into buying XP. I've got friends who love Millennium, for instance, and are happy with it on their systems. Personally, I don't care for it, so don't run it, and prefer Win98SE on the machines where I'm not running XP. If something else works for you, and does what you want it to, there is absolutely no reason at all to change. The power of the consumer pocketbooks speaks volumes. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:F5W48.332$[email hidden]... > > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > MY > > system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > Yea, they really pissed off a lot of customers with this BS scheme. They > think they own us. > > >

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 16:52 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139497

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4wV48.142523$[email hidden]... > BTW - Windows XP has a very excellent Help and Support. I believe it tobe > the best advancement of any portion of the product, compared to what was > done in Win98SE, Millennium or Windows 2K. Go into H&S and put "List of > troubleshooters" in the Search section. You have to have remote desktop enabled to use that right? Which I've already disabled, along with any auto-update stuff too. I don't need my hand held thanks.

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 16:55 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139498

"Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a315dv$146tpl$[email hidden]... > That does make me laugh, people who buy it have to go through the hassleof > activation yet a corporate version that doesn't need to be activated is > freely available for download. Rather than discourage piracy I believethis > has just made more people download XP corporate. Apparetnly people were downloading the Pro version directly from a Microsoft FTP server for four days before they figured out it was happening.

Aguirre 27 Jan 2002 16:58 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139500

"Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In any case, I can't think of anything that *requires* Windows XP to run. If you want decent drivers for a Santa Cruz soundcard you do. There will be more to follow also as hardware manufacturers focus on XP drivers and slack off on Win98 driver support. Stop being an apologist, people have a right to complain.

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 17:07 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139502

No. It has nothing to do with Remote Desktop. You may be confusing Remote Desktop (which is your access to another of your computers from a different location) and Remote Assistance, which is asking someone else who knows Windows XP to come into your system to assist you. Help and Support is available offline or online from Start/Help and Support. If you're online, you can also get related Knowledge Base articles which may be of further assistance with understanding whatever issue has come up. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:dbW48.334$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:4wV48.142523$[email hidden]... > > BTW - Windows XP has a very excellent Help and Support. I believe it to > be > > the best advancement of any portion of the product, compared to what was > > done in Win98SE, Millennium or Windows 2K. Go into H&S and put "List of > > troubleshooters" in the Search section. > > You have to have remote desktop enabled to use that right? Which I've > already disabled, along with any auto-update stuff too. I don't need my hand > held thanks. > > >

Steve Levett 27 Jan 2002 18:23 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139509

How about when all the website run media that will require WMP8 to play? That's not available (last time I checked) to download so you either use XP or dont watch/listen to you favourite media. Also, havent the sales of XP been disapointing which suggests the customers arenot happy with it? -- Steve Levett "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_eW48.60111$%[email hidden]... > Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install > Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's arms and > force them into buying XP. I've got friends who love Millennium, for > instance, and are happy with it on their systems. Personally, I don't care > for it, so don't run it, and prefer Win98SE on the machines where I'm not > running XP. If something else works for you, and does what you want it to, > there is absolutely no reason at all to change. The power of the consumer > pocketbooks speaks volumes. > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:F5W48.332$[email hidden]... > > > > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > > MY > > > system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > > > Yea, they really pissed off a lot of customers with this BS scheme. They > > think they own us. > > > > > > > >

Steve Levett 27 Jan 2002 18:25 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139510

Well, I know someone who downloaded XP before its release date and he was going to buy it (as he does with all his windows software) but since he found out about this activation he just carried on using his downloaded copy, I imagine this activation put off others as well. -- Steve Levett "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In message <a315g7$14iosg$[email hidden]> > "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > XP without the WPA is available easily on the net. The only ones who > > suffer this are the people who buy it, not the people with illegal copies. > > Mmmnnn... not quite. There are 'legal' users, casual pirates, and 'expert' > pirates. It's the latter group who have got the 'non-WPA' versions of XP, > but WPA is probably stopping the casual pirates. > > In any case, I can't think of anything that *requires* Windows XP to run. I > only use Windows (Me) for games. It runs Grand Prix 2/3, GPL, NASCAR 4, > Sports Car GT, TOCA 1/2, and a handful of demos, without any problems. I > certainly won't be upgrading (*unless* a stunning new game demands me to). > All my other computing activities are carried out on different platforms, > which free me from Microsoft! :-) > > > -- > Richard. > > "Free As A Bird. It's the next best thing to be, free as a bird."

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 18:40 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139513

Isn't that the web site's decision? Media Player 8 is written for Windows XP, and not a Win9x series program. Sort of like going to the www.mlb.com (major league baseball) where you need to pay $4.95 before hearing baseball games. And then you're required to download RealPlayer 8 Basic, even though it is free. The National Basketball Assn. does the same thing - $29.95 for the season, and you need to download RealPlayer. The National Hockey League, which does use Media Player, offers a link which automatically correctly identifies a Win9x system for the currently available MP 7.1 version when a 6.x version is installed. Accessing the same site with Windows XP, the site tells the user the "correct version is already installed." -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a31gj1$149mpo$[email hidden]... > How about when all the website run media that will require WMP8 to play? > That's not available (last time I checked) to download so you either use XP > or dont watch/listen to you favourite media. Also, havent the sales of XP > been disapointing which suggests the customers arenot happy with it? > > -- > > Steve Levett > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:_eW48.60111$%[email hidden]... > > Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install > > Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's arms > and > > force them into buying XP. I've got friends who love Millennium, for > > instance, and are happy with it on their systems. Personally, I don't > care > > for it, so don't run it, and prefer Win98SE on the machines where I'm not > > running XP. If something else works for you, and does what you want it > to, > > there is absolutely no reason at all to change. The power of the consumer > > pocketbooks speaks volumes. > > -- > > Chris H. > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > Associate Expert > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:F5W48.332$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make > on > > > MY > > > > system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > > > > > Yea, they really pissed off a lot of customers with this BS scheme. They > > > think they own us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Milhouse 27 Jan 2002 18:42 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139515

People have a right to complain, as long as there is no other recourse. You even posted about another recourse aside from whining against WPA... Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:mgW48.336$[email hidden]... > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In any case, I can't think of anything that *requires* Windows XP torun. > > If you want decent drivers for a Santa Cruz soundcard you do. There willbe > more to follow also as hardware manufacturers focus on XP drivers andslack > off on Win98 driver support. Stop being an apologist, people have a rightto > complain. > >

Milhouse 27 Jan 2002 18:45 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139516

"Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In message <a315g7$14iosg$[email hidden]> > "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > XP without the WPA is available easily on the net. The only ones who > > suffer this are the people who buy it, not the people with illegalcopies. > > Mmmnnn... not quite. There are 'legal' users, casual pirates, and'expert' > pirates. It's the latter group who have got the 'non-WPA' versions of XP, > but WPA is probably stopping the casual pirates. Anyone who's avoiding even a pirated version of XP because of WPA doesn't even deserve the name 'pirate', really. In fact, I've never seen a WPA-enabled version of XP floating around, period...it's as easy to get as most games and other programs, maybe even easier, despite being a 500MB download. Another thing. I know lots of people using XP...but nobody who purchased it... Milhouse > In any case, I can't think of anything that *requires* Windows XP to run.I

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> only use Windows (Me) for games. It runs Grand Prix 2/3, GPL, NASCAR 4, > Sports Car GT, TOCA 1/2, and a handful of demos, without any problems. I > certainly won't be upgrading (*unless* a stunning new game demands me to). > All my other computing activities are carried out on different platforms, > which free me from Microsoft! :-) > > > -- > Richard. > > "Free As A Bird. It's the next best thing to be, free as a bird."

EldredP 27 Jan 2002 18:50 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139517

In article <lLO48.140579$[email hidden]>, "Chris H." <[email hidden]> writes:

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>The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made >three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of >changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the system is >reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sort of >saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the >controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's >counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day.

So how to you troubleshoot problems caused by a new hardware install. Common procedure(as stated by Larry) is to remove one or more components, and find which ones cause the conflict. Having to re-activate the OS adds another drawn out(and stupid, IMHO) step... ...So why do we need this new whiz-bang system...? I'll stick with win98se for a while... I change my configuration too often to deal with this shit. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 27 Jan 2002 18:50 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139518

In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to $400 or something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or lose all your data. Sounds like extortion to me... :( Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Richard Walker 27 Jan 2002 18:51 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139520

In message <39W48.333$[email hidden]> "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't like > > it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. > > Which means we won't get new drivers for our expensive hardware either! > Already lots of hardware manufacturers have their noses up Microsfts ass > and are only writing new drivers for XP.

So don't buy that particular hardware. > We are being railroaded, pure and simple. True. But if people just put up with it, then it makes Microsoft's position even stronger. It's no good moaning about something being awful, but subscribing to it! :-) -- Richard. "I wanna hold your hand, I wanna hold your hand."

Jens H. Kruuse 27 Jan 2002 19:44 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139527

Chris, You are so full of Bill-dumpings! It is not at all the same thing and I suppose only a deluded Billbehindkisser such as yourself would believe that utter rubbish! "Associate Expert"? Is that a bit like "Ignorant Fool" or rather "Quasi-intelligent retarded monkey"? You are FORCING people to upgrade at an outrageous cost. Your favorite company is a conficted abuser of a monopoly, so don't even think about passing these wildly different practices off as the "same thing". Worst part? You probably believe the spin yourself. /Jens, having a Jan day. "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:eQX48.62244$%[email hidden]...

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> Isn't that the web site's decision? Media Player 8 is written for Windows > XP, and not a Win9x series program. Sort of like going to the www.mlb.com > (major league baseball) where you need to pay $4.95 before hearing baseball > games. And then you're required to download RealPlayer 8 Basic, even though > it is free. The National Basketball Assn. does the same thing - $29.95 for > the season, and you need to download RealPlayer. The National Hockey > League, which does use Media Player, offers a link which automatically > correctly identifies a Win9x system for the currently available MP 7.1 > version when a 6.x version is installed. Accessing the same site with > Windows XP, the site tells the user the "correct version is already > installed." > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone >

Jens H. Kruuse 27 Jan 2002 19:47 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139528

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry $The > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my data > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to $400 or > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or lose all

your > data. > Sounds like extortion to me... :( >It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). /Jens

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 20:25 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139530

During setup, Windows XP does a check of software (on an upgrade) and hardware for compatibility. If there is a conflict or problem, it is noted with recommendations prior to installation. The user can deal with them in advance of the installation. Several programs of mine, including PartitionMagic 7.0 raise flags on upgrades. Installing it after an upgrade works perfectly. As I said, no one forces anyone to purchase and install Windows XP. That's a user choice, and by doing homework first like checking the hardware compatibility list (http://www.microsoft.com/hcl/) and doing things like reading this newsgroup, the install is fine. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <lLO48.140579$[email hidden]>, "Chris H." > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > >three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of > >changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the system is > >reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sort of > >saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the > >controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's > >counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day. > > So how to you troubleshoot problems caused by a new hardware install. Common > procedure(as stated by Larry) is to remove one or more components, and find > which ones cause the conflict. Having to re-activate the OS adds another drawn > out(and stupid, IMHO) step... > ...So why do we need this new whiz-bang system...? I'll stick with win98se for > a while... I change my configuration too often to deal with this shit. > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply. >

Chris H. 27 Jan 2002 20:27 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139531

Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fLY48.1765$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > You are so full of Bill-dumpings! It is not at all the same thing and I suppose > only a deluded Billbehindkisser such as yourself would believe that utter > rubbish! > > "Associate Expert"? Is that a bit like "Ignorant Fool" or rather > "Quasi-intelligent retarded monkey"? You are FORCING people to upgrade at an > outrageous cost. Your favorite company is a conficted abuser of a monopoly, so > don't even think about passing these wildly different practices off as the "same > thing". > > Worst part? You probably believe the spin yourself. > > /Jens, having a Jan day.

Don Burnette 27 Jan 2002 20:29 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139532

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:CVX48.8640$[email hidden]...

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> > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In message <a315g7$14iosg$[email hidden]> > > "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > XP without the WPA is available easily on the net. The only ones who > > > suffer this are the people who buy it, not the people with illegal > copies. > > > > Mmmnnn... not quite. There are 'legal' users, casual pirates, and > 'expert' > > pirates. It's the latter group who have got the 'non-WPA' versions of

XP,

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> > but WPA is probably stopping the casual pirates. > > Anyone who's avoiding even a pirated version of XP because of WPA doesn't > even deserve the name 'pirate', really. In fact, I've never seen a > WPA-enabled version of XP floating around, period...it's as easy to get as > most games and other programs, maybe even easier, despite being a 500MB > download. > > Another thing. I know lots of people using XP...but nobody who purchased > it... >

Well, I purchased it happily, and am loving it - it's an awesome OS. I don't care for WPA any more than the next guy, but I will not use it as an excuse to download and install a cracked pirated version - that's just stealing plain and simple. Matter of fact, it's people like that, that is the reason for this type of nonsense to begin with. Don Burnette

Asbjørn Bjørnstad 27 Jan 2002 23:12 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139542

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > Well, I purchased it happily, and am loving it - it's an awesome OS. I don't > care for WPA any more than the next guy, but I will not use it as an excuse > to download and install a cracked pirated version - that's just stealing > plain and simple. Uh? If you have bought and paid for windows XP, how can downloading and installing a crack be stealing? -- -asbjxrn

EldredP 28 Jan 2002 00:02 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139545

In article <4nZ48.150130$[email hidden]>, "Chris H." <[email hidden]> writes: >During setup, Windows XP does a check of software (on an upgrade) and >hardware for compatibility. If there is a conflict or problem, it is noted >with recommendations prior to installation. The user can deal with them in >advance of the installation. Several programs of mine, including >PartitionMagic 7.0 raise flags on upgrades. Installing it after an upgrade >works perfectly. I'm not talking about during the install of XP. I'm talking about a situation such as upgrading your soundcard or video. Sometimes you get conflicts with existing hardware that require shifting cards around. I ran into a situation where my modem wouldn't work in the slot directly next to my AGP graphics card. I had to move my SBLive from the slot where it had been working perfectly and put it next to the video. The modem worked fine in the slot vacated by the SBLive. All that shifting around might have triggered the re-activation... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Jens H. Kruuse 28 Jan 2002 00:12 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139546

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <4nZ48.150130$[email hidden]>, "Chris H." > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >During setup, Windows XP does a check of software (on an upgrade) and > >hardware for compatibility. If there is a conflict or problem, it is noted > >with recommendations prior to installation. The user can deal with them in > >advance of the installation. Several programs of mine, including > >PartitionMagic 7.0 raise flags on upgrades. Installing it after an upgrade > >works perfectly. > > I'm not talking about during the install of XP. I'm talking about a situation > such as upgrading your soundcard or video. Sometimes you get conflicts with > existing hardware that require shifting cards around. I ran into a situation > where my modem wouldn't work in the slot directly next to my AGP graphics

card. > I had to move my SBLive from the slot where it had been working perfectly and > put it next to the video. The modem worked fine in the slot vacated by the > SBLive. All that shifting around might have triggered the re-activation... > Eldred, you are missing the point here: Chris doesn't care. Bill said it is good, thus it is good. You're just a regular user (a technically sophisticated one with networking skills etc.) but you're not supposed to act like you own the pc. Just buy a Dell/Compaq/Gateway and leave it at that. Smile, be happy. Chris is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly. Cheers, Jens

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 01:19 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139550

Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you really should have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as "changes," to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once the threshold as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, this would force a free telephone call. There's a pretty good 10-item list on that site which describes what is tracked and the method used. There are also a few suggestions for those who do change hardware quite often. People have even changed out the motherboard, for instance, without triggering a new activation. Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yet I voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an unwarranted attack. Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what version I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate, but untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off the shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I received for beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs afterward. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone

Ed Solheim 28 Jan 2002 01:39 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139551

Just curious Chris.... but what sim is your favourite.... ? Or is this a case or "big brother" is watching.... ;-) -- ed_ "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote: > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone

Ed Solheim 28 Jan 2002 01:43 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139552

Chris, Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto simulation group. Thanks! "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i melding news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]...

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> Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone >

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 01:57 UTC↳ reply to Ed Solheim #139554

GPL, then F1 Championship Season 2000 (not really what I'd call a sim, though). I really, really prefer GPL. And the only Microsoft game I have on my system is a role playing game I'm beta testing. - Chris H. "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3Z158.3386$[email hidden]...

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> Just curious Chris.... but what sim is your favourite.... ? > Or is this a case or "big brother" is watching.... ;-) > > -- > ed_ > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote: > > http://www.microsoft.com/piracy/basics/activation/ > > http://support.microsoft.com/directory/article.asp?ID=KB;EN-US;q305356 > > Chris H. > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > Associate Expert > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > >

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:08 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139556

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_eW48.60111$%[email hidden]... > Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install > Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's armsand > force them into buying XP. Yea, yea, I should have stopped supporting the software monkeys at MS and just stuck with Dos right? What ever happened to giving the customer what they want? The fact is if I want to continue being a gamer and buying future games I will be railroaded into having to use XP and XP compatible hardware so don't tell me I have a choice, because I don't. Look, I like lots of things about XP but this activation crap really sucks so telling me not to use it if I don't like it is just an arrogant stance coming from a bunch of Micorsoft brown noser's. And don't even get me started on the spyware, Passport and forced loading of messenger on XP.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:11 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139557

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > /Jens, having a Jan day. Would that be Jan Brady?

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:17 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139558

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:YsW48.143347$[email hidden]... > No. It has nothing to do with Remote Desktop. You may be confusingRemote > Desktop (which is your access to another of your computers from adifferent > location) and Remote Assistance, which is asking someone else who knows > Windows XP to come into your system to assist you. Well, I disabled remote assistance too. Actually, I've disabled so much XP stuff that I may as well go back to Win98. :-) > Help and Support is available offline or online from Start/Help andSupport. > If you're online, you can also get related Knowledge Base articles whichmay > be of further assistance with understanding whatever issue has come up. Yes, I've been reading knowledge base articles and going to XP specific sites. P.S. I do have one techie question for you that maybe you can answer for me. Why when I burn files to cdrom in XP are they not readable on a Win98 system? This is using drag and drop method of burning in XP and not 3rd party software.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:28 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139559

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4nZ48.150130$[email hidden]... > As I said, no one forces anyone to purchase and install Windows XP.That's > a user choice, and by doing homework first like checking the hardware > compatibility list (http://www.microsoft.com/hcl/) and doing things like > reading this newsgroup, the install is fine. Yes, but if one buys new hardware after they have XP up and running nicely and this new hardware causes a problem with some other device then they may be required to pull out old hardware and try other hardware until they track the problem down. The activation scheme can cause a big pain in the arse because of this. People have already reported that they have been getting the heavy hand from MS when they have needed to reactivate over the phone because they couldn't online. This is bullshit Chris, most computer users here are power users and are continually upgrading hardware. Just answer me this one question though, does MS have plans to make their OS rentware in the near future? If yes, then I can stop worrying about all this and vow never to buy another piece of MS software again. Maybe I'll even buy a Mac one of these days. Me, and millions of others that think like I do can make or break MS, tell your buddy Bill that too.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:31 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139561

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I'm not talking about during the install of XP. I'm talking about asituation > such as upgrading your soundcard or video. Sometimes you get conflictswith > existing hardware that require shifting cards around. I ran into asituation > where my modem wouldn't work in the slot directly next to my AGP graphicscard. > I had to move my SBLive from the slot where it had been working perfectlyand > put it next to the video. The modem worked fine in the slot vacated bythe > SBLive. All that shifting around might have triggered there-activation... > > Eldred Just a tip. Try not to use the PCI slot next to the AGP slot as that slot always shares the IRQ with the AGP slot. That is why your modem had a problem. Some divices can share and others can't, even though MS and the mb manufactureres tell us all PnP hardware can. In practice it is always better to let your video card have it's own IRQ.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:34 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139562

"Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:HF058.6893$[email hidden]... >Smile, be happy. Heh...this reminds me of an old song by Ice-T. Shut up, and be Happy. He was talking about governement, but it can easily apply to MS too. :-)

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:37 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139563

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:9e258.72284$%[email hidden]... > GPL, then F1 Championship Season 2000 (not really what I'd call a sim, > though). Get F12001. It's just as much a sim as GPL, IMO.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:39 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139564

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:HSX48.8639$[email hidden]... > People have a right to complain, as long as there is no other recourse. > > You even posted about another recourse aside from whining against WPA... > > Milhouse I shouldn't have to take that recourse though, should I?

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 02:42 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139565

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7rZ48.47917$[email hidden]... > Matter of fact, it's people like that, that is the reason for this type of > nonsense to begin with. > > Don Burnette Yea, thx to *your* buddies Millhouse we have to put up with this crap. Some nice friends you have there.

Mitch_A 28 Jan 2002 02:53 UTC↳ reply to Ed Solheim #139567

Ed, If you read the entire thread you will see that Chris is not the spammer here. The other larry began the thread as an OT and Chris did nothing more than reply to the question and all of the replies. Just because he is standing up to the anti-MS crowd you decide he is the spammer and you reply to him in a faux-polite tone asking him to leave. Perhaps you should re-read the thread and ask the *spammer* to leave instead of the person who replies to the original post. Just an observation not a war :) Mitch "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:s1258.3390$[email hidden]...

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> Chris, > > Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto simulation > group. > Thanks! > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i melding > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) > > -- > > Chris H. > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > Associate Expert > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > >

jon 28 Jan 2002 03:14 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139568

This is what I wonder about. I have done reinstalls of 98 and 2000 on two computers, one of them a dual boot system. Now what happens to the product activation if I buy xp, and 3 years from now MS decides they no longer offer support for it. Will they release something to bypass activation on it so users familiar with it can reinstall it, or will you have to buy the newest version of windows because you cant get the older copy "activated"? Aguirre <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:LC258.392$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:4nZ48.150130$[email hidden]... > > As I said, no one forces anyone to purchase and install Windows XP. > That's > > a user choice, and by doing homework first like checking the hardware > > compatibility list (http://www.microsoft.com/hcl/) and doing things like > > reading this newsgroup, the install is fine. > > Yes, but if one buys new hardware after they have XP up and running nicely > and this new hardware causes a problem with some other device then they

may > be required to pull out old hardware and try other hardware until theytrack

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> the problem down. The activation scheme can cause a big pain in the arse > because of this. People have already reported that they have been getting > the heavy hand from MS when they have needed to reactivate over the phone > because they couldn't online. This is bullshit Chris, most computer users > here are power users and are continually upgrading hardware. > > Just answer me this one question though, does MS have plans to make their

OS > rentware in the near future? If yes, then I can stop worrying about allthis > and vow never to buy another piece of MS software again. Maybe I'll evenbuy > a Mac one of these days. Me, and millions of others that think like I do > can make or break MS, tell your buddy Bill that too. > >

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 03:59 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139573

I really don't know much about burning software, but I'll check it for you. I would imagine it is related to the "native" burning method in XP and how a Win9x reads the files off the CD. The CD writing in XP is a Roxio "light" program, not something Microsoft has written. Bill who? I don't have a friend by that name, and certainly am not privy to Microsoft's plans for the future although I hear rumors to the affirmative. Regarding the future, they've said if support ever ends for the Windows XP line, a downloadable upgrade to the system would be furnished to eliminate activation. BTW - You mentioned wanting to purchase software in the future, but have you noticed most of the great racing games discussed in this newsgroup being run on Windows XP these days are not written specifically for XP or even Windows 2000? Regarding getting rid of Messenger: You have to edit sysoc.inf (located in /WINDOWS/inf). Under [Components] you should see the following line: msmsgs=ocgen.dll,OcEntry,msmsgs.inf,hide,7 Now, take the word 'hide' out of the line, and it should look like this: msmsgs=ocgen.dll,OcEntry,msmsgs.inf,,7 Now exit and save the file. Go to Control Panel/Add or Remove Programs, and click on Add/Remove Windows Components in the left panel. There you should now be able to uncheck the MSN Messenger Service, and by clicking Next it will uninstall. I'll get back to you with the CD burner issue. - Chris H. "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Fs258.389$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:YsW48.143347$[email hidden]... > > No. It has nothing to do with Remote Desktop. You may be confusing > Remote > > Desktop (which is your access to another of your computers from a > different > > location) and Remote Assistance, which is asking someone else who knows > > Windows XP to come into your system to assist you. > > Well, I disabled remote assistance too. Actually, I've disabled so much XP > stuff that I may as well go back to Win98. :-) > > > Help and Support is available offline or online from Start/Help and > Support. > > If you're online, you can also get related Knowledge Base articles which > may > > be of further assistance with understanding whatever issue has come up. > > Yes, I've been reading knowledge base articles and going to XP specific > sites. > > P.S. I do have one techie question for you that maybe you can answer for

me. > Why when I burn files to cdrom in XP are they not readable on a Win98 > system? This is using drag and drop method of burning in XP and not 3rd > party software. > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:16 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139576

Which amplifies the fact that MS WPA system is a royal pain in the ass. It is NOT as innocent as MS makes it out to be, and my little adventure with it surely won't be the last. If I find a way to rip it out, it will be gone. Thanks for your input, Chris :) -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of > changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the systemis > reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sortof

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> saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the > controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's > counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day. > > Then those changes are reset to zero and adding the NIC would not have > triggered anything because it would only have been count one or two (at > most) of the four to six allowed changes. At this moment, I don't see > anything but activation seeing a "different" system, therefore requiring

the

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> telephone call. I can see where activation may have been triggered by the > numerous changes within a single, 120-day period, but if you'd like I'll > continue to track it down so we know for sure. > > It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS > SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. 8-) GPL, with the update > patch, runs quite well for me on a clean NTFS install of Windows XP Pro,

an > AMD Thunderbird 1 GB with 512 PC133 RAM and a GeForce2 MX400 w/64 Megs.8-)

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> -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Network > problems. > > > > The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the > > installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard > > drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer > > DVD-116 DVD drive. > > > > I assure you I was suprised as well :) > > > > I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. > > > > The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I > > didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and > that > > I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > > > Thanks for your input! > > > > -Larry > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:17 UTC↳ reply to Blake #139577

WPA. Windows Product Allocation, er, I mean, Activation. -Larry "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make onMY

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> system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:JfP48.280$[email hidden]... > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > > > The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you

made > > > three other changes, too. > > > > That's not six changes is it? We were told we would be allowed to makesix > > changes every six months. > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:18 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139578

What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad technology any more, Richard? -Larry "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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it,

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> then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. > > > -- > Richard. > > "And he never shows his feelings, But the fool on the hill."

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:20 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139579

I'm afraid the power of the consumers pocketbook doesn't mean squat when it comes to MS. If it's what is shipping on new machines, then MS gets a mark on the board with or without upgraders. Of course, the next answer will be "Well, don't buy a new machine". It's all nonsense. -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_eW48.60111$%[email hidden]... > Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install > Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's armsand > force them into buying XP. I've got friends who love Millennium, for > instance, and are happy with it on their systems. Personally, I don'tcare > for it, so don't run it, and prefer Win98SE on the machines where I'm not > running XP. If something else works for you, and does what you want itto,

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> there is absolutely no reason at all to change. The power of the consumer > pocketbooks speaks volumes. > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:F5W48.332$[email hidden]... > > > > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:TLP48.141564$[email hidden]... > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make

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> > MY > > > system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > > > Yea, they really pissed off a lot of customers with this BS scheme. They > > think they own us. > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:23 UTC↳ reply to Mitch_A #139581

Mitch, So I am a 'Spammer', because I posted an OT that someone else might find useful? You have NO idea what the term SPAM means, that's obvious. -Larry "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Y2358.2847$[email hidden]... > Ed, > > If you read the entire thread you will see that Chris is not the spammer > here. The other larry began the thread as an OT and Chris did nothingmore > than reply to the question and all of the replies. Just because he is > standing up to the anti-MS crowd you decide he is the spammer and youreply > to him in a faux-polite tone asking him to leave. Perhaps you should > re-read the thread and ask the *spammer* to leave instead of the personwho

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> replies to the original post. Just an observation not a war :) > > Mitch > > > "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:s1258.3390$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto simulation > > group. > > Thanks! > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i melding > > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > > Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) > > > -- > > > Chris H. > > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > > Associate Expert > > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:26 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139583

Eldred, The scariest part is that I didn't even remove the hardware :) I just pulled the entry from the device manager and then got caught in a WPA initiated catch-22. -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <lLO48.140579$[email hidden]>, "ChrisH." > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > >three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of > >changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the systemis > >reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sortof > >saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the > >controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's > >counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day. > > So how to you troubleshoot problems caused by a new hardware install.Common > procedure(as stated by Larry) is to remove one or more components, andfind > which ones cause the conflict. Having to re-activate the OS adds anotherdrawn > out(and stupid, IMHO) step... > ...So why do we need this new whiz-bang system...? I'll stick withwin98se for

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> a while... I change my configuration too often to deal with this shit. > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:31 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139584

Chris, I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would reinstall the driver at the next restart. That suggests that alterations in SOFTWARE can also trigger WPA, and that sucks. Though I appreciate your input, there is NO excuse for Microsoft's digital leash known as WPA. What if I had been working on a time-sensitive deliverable? Would Microsoft have refunded me the money lost due to this defect in their product? Of course, the answer is no... -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you reallyshould > have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as "changes," > to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once thethreshold > as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, this wouldforce > a free telephone call. > > There's a pretty good 10-item list on that site which describes what is > tracked and the method used. There are also a few suggestions for thosewho

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> do change hardware quite often. People have even changed out the > motherboard, for instance, without triggering a new activation. > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yet I > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > unwarranted attack. > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what

version > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate,but > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off the > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I receivedfor > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programsafterward.

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> -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:33 UTC↳ reply to Tim Wheatley #139585

Tim, What are you talking about? -Larry "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:acP48.32990$[email hidden]...

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> Well... why do you believe you needed to reinstall something which was > working? > > Tim > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation

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your

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an > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the telephone. > I > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood thetechnical

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> > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the damned > > trash can. > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > Larry > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:36 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139587

Richard, That's such a lame reply. I have a reason for running XP, and excuse me, but I reserve my right to complain about defects or other nonsense concerning the OS. I paid for it, I'm gonna gripe about it if deemed necessary. Larry "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In message <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]> > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > We don't need this crap. > > Except for the small fact that, clearly, you do. > > If you didn't need 'this crap', you wouldn't be running Windows XP. > > Don't like WPA? Don't use Windows XP. Heck, just don't use Windows. > > > -- > Richard. > > "I am the eggman, they are the eggmen. I am the walrus, goo goo g'joob."

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 04:38 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139588

Well, meet one. Paid for in cash at the local OfficeDepot. -Larry "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:CVX48.8640$[email hidden]...

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XP,

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run. > I > > only use Windows (Me) for games. It runs Grand Prix 2/3, GPL, NASCAR 4, > > Sports Car GT, TOCA 1/2, and a handful of demos, without any problems.I > > certainly won't be upgrading (*unless* a stunning new game demands meto). > > All my other computing activities are carried out on differentplatforms,

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> > which free me from Microsoft! :-) > > > > > > -- > > Richard. > > > > "Free As A Bird. It's the next best thing to be, free as a bird." > >

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 05:31 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139440

Drat! Wish we could pinpoint it, Larry, because it just plain isn't supposed to happen. Not to you, not to me, not to anyone. I'd sure like to be able to document, step-by-step, an error in WPA and forward to one of the guys I know. -- Chris H. Microsoft MVP - Windows XP Associate Expert Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:9u458.14468$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. > > I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply > removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would reinstall > the driver at the next restart. > > That suggests that alterations in SOFTWARE can also trigger WPA, and that > sucks. > > Though I appreciate your input, there is NO excuse for Microsoft's digital > leash known as WPA. > > What if I had been working on a time-sensitive deliverable? Would Microsoft > have refunded me the money lost due to this defect in their product? Of > course, the answer is no... > > -Larry

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 07:16 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139446

No, I think WPA is as much a crappy idea as anyone else. But sitting around in RAS whining about it is about the second least effective method of getting that fixed...the only one less effective might be alt.fan.heinlein or some other obscure NG. ;) So, just don't deal with WPA. Get a version of XP that's had it removed, or remove it from yours yourself. It's that simple. Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:5N258.396$[email hidden]...

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> > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:HSX48.8639$[email hidden]... > > People have a right to complain, as long as there is no other recourse. > > > > You even posted about another recourse aside from whining against WPA... > > > > Milhouse > > I shouldn't have to take that recourse though, should I? > >

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 07:19 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139447

If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything they sell - you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computer than the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt piracy would be any problem. And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a newsgroup any day. Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:GP258.397$[email hidden]... > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7rZ48.47917$[email hidden]... > > Matter of fact, it's people like that, that is the reason for this typeof > > nonsense to begin with. > > > > Don Burnette > > Yea, thx to *your* buddies Millhouse we have to put up with this crap.Some > nice friends you have there. > >

Mitch_A 28 Jan 2002 07:35 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139449

Uhhhh Larry wake up man. I didn't call you a spammer I simply quoted from the previous post in which the post-er did actually call Chris a spammer (yeah incorrect but not my point). I have no problems whatsoever in off topic threads when OT is used in the subject line. I do have fire shootin outta my fingers right now but I'll refrain from flamin ya cause I believe it's simply a reading comprehension issue <G>. Follow a little closer next time k. Oh yeah, unfortunately I do know what the SPAM is. Nasty tastin stuff eh? Mitch "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> fumbled the ball on the 1 yard line losing the Super Bowl.news:xn458.14436$[email hidden]...

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> Mitch, > > So I am a 'Spammer', because I posted an OT that someone else might find > useful? > > You have NO idea what the term SPAM means, that's obvious. > > -Larry > > "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Y2358.2847$[email hidden]... > > Ed, > > > > If you read the entire thread you will see that Chris is not the spammer > > here. The other larry began the thread as an OT and Chris did nothing > more > > than reply to the question and all of the replies. Just because he is > > standing up to the anti-MS crowd you decide he is the spammer and you > reply > > to him in a faux-polite tone asking him to leave. Perhaps you should > > re-read the thread and ask the *spammer* to leave instead of the person > who > > replies to the original post. Just an observation not a war :) > > > > Mitch > > > > > > "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:s1258.3390$[email hidden]... > > > Chris, > > > > > > Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto

simulation

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> > > group. > > > Thanks! > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i melding > > > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > > > Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) > > > > -- > > > > Chris H. > > > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > > > Associate Expert > > > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 08:03 UTC↳ reply to Mitch_A #139451

"Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:gb758.2938$[email hidden]... > Uhhhh Larry wake up man. I didn't call you a spammer I simply quoted from > the previous post in which the post-er did actually call Chris a spammer > (yeah incorrect but not my point). I have no problems whatsoever in off > topic threads when OT is used in the subject line. I do have fire shootin > outta my fingers right now but I'll refrain from flamin ya cause I believe > it's simply a reading comprehension issue <G>. Follow a little closernext > time k. Oh yeah, unfortunately I do know what the SPAM is. Nasty tastin > stuff eh? > > Mitch > *snicker* That reminds me of a kid in the same honors physics class I'm taking, but earlier in the day...they paid him a few bucks in class to eat a whole raw can of Lite Spam. Being a slightly developmentally challenged football player, he did it, of course. Hehe. I wonder if they set up the schedule so there's at least one football player in each of his classes...the one in mine has this thing for hitting himself in the face with whatever we're using - projectile launchers, rockets, bicycle pumps, rulers, those planes that fly around on string - with the prop at full speed, of course...idiotic, yet funny. ;) Milhouse

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> > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> fumbled the ball on the 1 yard > line losing the Super > Bowl.news:xn458.14436$[email hidden]... > > Mitch, > > > > So I am a 'Spammer', because I posted an OT that someone else might find > > useful? > > > > You have NO idea what the term SPAM means, that's obvious. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Y2358.2847$[email hidden]... > > > Ed, > > > > > > If you read the entire thread you will see that Chris is not the

spammer

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> > > here. The other larry began the thread as an OT and Chris did nothing > > more > > > than reply to the question and all of the replies. Just because he is > > > standing up to the anti-MS crowd you decide he is the spammer and you > > reply > > > to him in a faux-polite tone asking him to leave. Perhaps you should > > > re-read the thread and ask the *spammer* to leave instead of the

person

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> > who > > > replies to the original post. Just an observation not a war :) > > > > > > Mitch > > > > > > > > > "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:s1258.3390$[email hidden]... > > > > Chris, > > > > > > > > Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto > simulation > > > > group. > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i melding > > > > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > > > > Jan is my Wife's name. 8-) > > > > > -- > > > > > Chris H. > > > > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > > > > Associate Expert > > > > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Tim Wheatley 28 Jan 2002 08:31 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139454

I'm not sure, infact, I've been feeling ill recently.. so I couldn't er... read... I had my eyes closed... it was foggy, Look officer, I was on holiday, it couldn't have been me. Tim "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3w458.14479$[email hidden]...

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> Tim, > > What are you talking about? > > -Larry > > "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:acP48.32990$[email hidden]... > > Well... why do you believe you needed to reinstall something which was > > working? > > > > Tim > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > > > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product activation > was > > > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > > > > > Well, it did. > > > > > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on

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system > > > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed to > > > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation couldnot

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where

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> > > trash can. > > > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > > > > > > > >

Gutty 28 Jan 2002 08:56 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139467

Do you really think we can make or break MS...too late I think. I'd like to hear your plan however :) "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:LC258.392$[email hidden]...

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may > be required to pull out old hardware and try other hardware until theytrack

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Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 10:25 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139460

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:t0458.75507$%[email hidden]... > BTW - You mentioned wanting to purchase software in the future, but haveyou > noticed most of the great racing games discussed in this newsgroup beingrun > on Windows XP these days are not written specifically for XP or evenWindows > 2000? Yes, but it won't remain that way for too much longer. > Regarding getting rid of Messenger: You have to edit sysoc.inf (locatedin > /WINDOWS/inf). Yes, I've already done that and deleted MSN at the same time. But the files for Messenger are still on my system even though it did stop it from loading automatically. But, my point is that I shouldn't have to jump through hoops to make XP behave as I want it to and MS shouldn't be hiding uninstall features of programs like Messenger, a program I consider a security risk. Remember how in Win98 you had the option to remove the online provider stuff in the add/remove program? Well, it never did remove anything. When installing Win98 you had the option to install this crap or not, if you chose no it installed it anyway. Now what is up with that? > I'll get back to you with the CD burner issue. OK, thx.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 10:31 UTC↳ reply to jon #139461

"jon " <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a32fp4$t4j$[email hidden]... > This is what I wonder about. I have done reinstalls of 98 and 2000 on two > computers, one of them a dual boot system. Now what happens to the product > activation if I buy xp, and 3 years from now MS decides they no longeroffer > support for it. Will they release something to bypass activation on it so > users familiar with it can reinstall it, or will you have to buy thenewest > version of windows because you cant get the older copy "activated"? Chris said to me in another post that if this comes to be then they will offer a download that will disable the activation process. He also said he has heard rumours that MS plan to make their OS rentware but isnt' privvy to that info himself, and so have I. Bye-bye Microsoft.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 10:36 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139462

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:KV658.11332$[email hidden]... > No, I think WPA is as much a crappy idea as anyone else. But sittingaround > in RAS whining about it is about the second least effective method of > getting that fixed...the only one less effective might be alt.fan.heinlein > or some other obscure NG. ;) I did send MS a comment that I think it sucks. :-) Look at he bottom of this page. You too can send MS a comment on what you think of WPA. http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;Q305356&VOTE=1 > So, just don't deal with WPA. Get a version of XP that's had it removed,or > remove it from yours yourself. It's that simple. Yes, I've already looked into it and do have the files to do it. But there is more than one method around and some people seem to think they can cause problems in XP so I don't want to use it unless I really have to. I've changed harware a number of times now and have not had a problem with activation yet. Fingers crossed.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 10:40 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139463

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything theysell - > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computer than > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt piracy > would be any problem. I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that Norton Ghost 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say that XP gives far more bng for the buck. > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in anewsgroup > any day. At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are some modern day Robin Hood's or what?

Richard Walker 28 Jan 2002 10:41 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139464

In message <si458.14413$[email hidden]> "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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> "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly > > simple. > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad technology > any more, Richard?

Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's products but keep buying them!!! That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all their F1 titles... ;-) -- Richard. "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog."

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 10:47 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139468

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in anewsgroup > any day. P.S. How can I possibly be 100% anti-MS when I actually paid MS for using WinXP? You need a core logic upgrade dude.

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 11:59 UTC↳ reply to Gutty #139472

":: Blank ::" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Do you really think we can make or break MS...too late I think. I'd liketo > hear your plan however :) Sure, just stop buying their products, make a noise about your opinion of WPA etc. Maybe we can't break them but we can certainly make them think twice about their policies. Just look at Intel as an example of a company who has been humbled in the last year throught the dominance of AMD and many consumers choice of cpu. Now they are making DDR mb's availalbe and RDRAM is just about as cheap as DDR. At one time they were trying to railroad us into expensive RDRAM. Any company can be king one day and a pauper the next if they piss off the consumer enough.

Steve Levett 28 Jan 2002 15:07 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139485

http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,18423,00.html Is this the real reason MS want all our info. I'm think it is and the passport system just proves it to me. Maybe they are collecting info for a rent system in the future. -- Steve Levett "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:9u458.14468$[email hidden]... > Chris, > > I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. > > I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply > removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would reinstall > the driver at the next restart. > > That suggests that alterations in SOFTWARE can also trigger WPA, and that > sucks. > > Though I appreciate your input, there is NO excuse for Microsoft's digital > leash known as WPA. > > What if I had been working on a time-sensitive deliverable? Would Microsoft > have refunded me the money lost due to this defect in their product? Of > course, the answer is no... > > -Larry > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you really > should > > have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as "changes," > > to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once the > threshold > > as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, this would > force > > a free telephone call. > > > > There's a pretty good 10-item list on that site which describes what is > > tracked and the method used. There are also a few suggestions for those > who > > do change hardware quite often. People have even changed out the > > motherboard, for instance, without triggering a new activation. > > > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yet I > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > > unwarranted attack. > > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what > version > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate, > but > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off the > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I received > for > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs > afterward. > > -- > > Chris H. > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > Associate Expert > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > >

Ed Solheim 28 Jan 2002 16:13 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139390

Touchï¿½! :-) -- ed_ "Chris H." wrote: > GPL, then F1 Championship Season 2000 (not really what I'd call a sim, > though). I really, really prefer GPL. And the only Microsoft game I have > on my system is a role playing game I'm beta testing. > > - Chris H. >

Aguirre 28 Jan 2002 16:35 UTC↳ reply to Gutty #139393

":: Blank ::" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Do you really think we can make or break MS...too late I think. I'd liketo > hear your plan however :) Well, after reading this article below I have made up my mind. I'm going back to Win98, I'm going to install Win98Lite by Shane Brooks to gut out IE, I'm going to use Opera as my web browser and I'm going to use Agent for news and email. This is as far as I'm ever going with Microsft softare for the forseeable future. http://www.junkbusters.com/microsoft.html#demandslist "Second, we do not recommend consumers use any Microsoft products, for a variety of reasons including its history on privacy and security. Creating something called an "import privacy rule" for IE6 constitutes an implied endorsement very remote from our estimation of the company and its products. Regrettably, the products we recommend for people to protect their privacy online are not made by Microsoft. Other web browsers have consistently provided better cookie management features and less privacy-invasive defaults. It is very sad that the largest software manufacturer has done so little for privacy, and is willfully continuing that trailership position."

Gerry Aitken 28 Jan 2002 17:21 UTC↳ reply to Tim Wheatley #139400

Tim Wheatley wrote: > > I'm not sure, infact, I've been feeling ill recently.. so I couldn't er... > read... I had my eyes closed... it was foggy, Look officer, I was on > holiday, it couldn't have been me. Yeah, yeah, and of course you swear you thought the girl was over 16 ;) Gerry

Tim Wheatley 28 Jan 2002 17:58 UTC↳ reply to Gerry Aitken #139403

Have you seen how they dress these days? I swear when I'm 80 and can't pull a bird anymore I'm gonna move house opposite a girls school ;-) "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > > Tim Wheatley wrote: > > > > I'm not sure, infact, I've been feeling ill recently.. so I couldn'ter... > > read... I had my eyes closed... it was foggy, Look officer, I was on > > holiday, it couldn't have been me. > > Yeah, yeah, and of course you swear you thought the girl was over 16 ;) > > Gerry

EldredP 28 Jan 2002 18:23 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139407

In article <YF258.393$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> writes: >Just a tip. Try not to use the PCI slot next to the AGP slot as that slot >always shares the IRQ with the AGP slot. That is why your modem had a >problem. Some divices can share and others can't, even though MS and the mb >manufactureres tell us all PnP hardware can. >In practice it is always better to let your video card have it's own IRQ. Yeah, I know that NOW, but I didn't 2 years ago when I ran into the problem. I didn't have another slot available anyway, so I had to make it work. Swapping a couple of board fixed the problem. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 28 Jan 2002 18:23 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139408

In article <AG158.153796$[email hidden]>, "Chris H." <[email hidden]> writes: >Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you really should >have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as "changes," >to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once the threshold >as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, this would force >a free telephone call. Ok, thanks for the link. A bit troubling, though - I wonder what the 'hold times' are when you call. I can see having to wait for 45 minutes just to talk to a person... :( Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 28 Jan 2002 18:23 UTC↳ reply to Ed Solheim #139406

In article <s1258.3390$[email hidden]>, "Ed Solheim" <[email hidden]> writes: >Chris, > >Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto simulation >group. >Thanks! In Chris's defense, he only originally responded to assist someone who was having a problem. He may be a bit 'over-zealous', but he tried to help. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Jens H. Kruuse 28 Jan 2002 18:35 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139411

"Aguirre" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:vn258.388$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > > /Jens, having a Jan day. > > Would that be Jan Brady? > >

Who? Nah, somebody of talent and style. And good at the Ring. ;-)

Jens H. Kruuse 28 Jan 2002 18:44 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139413

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yet I > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > unwarranted attack. >I believe I have done much more to help people her in r.a.s than you have. Unwarranted attack? You are lying through your teeth using outrageous spin to sell the product. So the attack is warranted.

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> Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what version > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate, but > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off the > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I received for > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs afterward. > --

Funny, you never said that you bought it. Thus you received it from MS. And as you are a self-appointed expert et al, they presumably gave it to you without activation required. I noticed you didn't mention activating your XP. You're spinning so fast, you could be a DVD player. I think it is time I invoked Eldred's rule.

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:01 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139436

I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before services even launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because the NIC card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit you to COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't held hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. Oh, well :) -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Em558.155219$[email hidden]... > Drat! Wish we could pinpoint it, Larry, because it just plain isn't > supposed to happen. Not to you, not to me, not to anyone. I'd sure liketo > be able to document, step-by-step, an error in WPA and forward to one ofthe

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> guys I know. > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:9u458.14468$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. > > > > I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply > > removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would

reinstall > > the driver at the next restart. > > > > That suggests that alterations in SOFTWARE can also trigger WPA, andthat > > sucks. > > > > Though I appreciate your input, there is NO excuse for Microsoft'sdigital

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Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:06 UTC↳ reply to Mitch_A #139435

That's not how I read it, but I'm ok with the situation as explained :) Now, go dip yer fingers in some Gasoline. LOL! Just kidding :) -Larry "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:gb758.2938$[email hidden]... > Uhhhh Larry wake up man. I didn't call you a spammer I simply quoted from > the previous post in which the post-er did actually call Chris a spammer > (yeah incorrect but not my point). I have no problems whatsoever in off > topic threads when OT is used in the subject line. I do have fire shootin > outta my fingers right now but I'll refrain from flamin ya cause I believe > it's simply a reading comprehension issue <G>. Follow a little closernext

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> time k. Oh yeah, unfortunately I do know what the SPAM is. Nasty tastin > stuff eh? > > Mitch > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> fumbled the ball on the 1 yard > line losing the Super > Bowl.news:xn458.14436$[email hidden]... > > Mitch, > > > > So I am a 'Spammer', because I posted an OT that someone else might find > > useful? > > > > You have NO idea what the term SPAM means, that's obvious. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Y2358.2847$[email hidden]... > > > Ed, > > > > > > If you read the entire thread you will see that Chris is not the

spammer

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person

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Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:06 UTC↳ reply to Tim Wheatley #139437

Ok, that 'splains everything :) -Larry "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4X758.39611$[email hidden]...

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> I'm not sure, infact, I've been feeling ill recently.. so I couldn't er... > read... I had my eyes closed... it was foggy, Look officer, I was on > holiday, it couldn't have been me. > > Tim > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:3w458.14479$[email hidden]... > > Tim, > > > > What are you talking about? > > > > -Larry > > > > "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:acP48.32990$[email hidden]... > > > Well... why do you believe you needed to reinstall something which was > > > working? > > > > > > Tim > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:O6M48.6388$[email hidden]... > > > > Well, it was bound to happen. Windows XP's stupid product

activation

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> > was > > > > _bound_ to screw up eventually. > > > > > > > > Well, it did. > > > > > > > > This evening, I was troubleshooting network connectivity problems on > my > > XP > > > > Client Machine. One of the steps I took was the time-honored > tradition > > of > > > > removing the Ethernet Card entry in the Device Manager, and letting > > > Windows > > > > re-detect it and reinstall the drivers during restart. > > > > > > > > Well, instead of Windows XP booting up and redetecting the NIC card > and > > > > reinstalling the drivers, I got the dreaded Windows XP Activation > > notice! > > > > > > > > It said something about not being able to validate my Hardware > > > > Configuration, and asked me if I wanted to re-activate. > > > > > > > > Sure, why not. > > > > > > > > However, because this stupid Product Activation would not let the > system > > > > boot up into Windows, the damned NIC card drivers were not allowed

to > > > > reinstall and. This means, of course, that product activation could > not > > > do > > > > it's thing over the Internet. > > > > > > > > Ok, fine. I've got 10 minutes to waste (like I really had achoice).

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> > > > > > > > I called the toll-free number. > > > > > > > > Now, I went through the drawn-out automated re-activation process, > where > > > you > > > > punch in this ridiculously long number, and wait for it to read back > > your > > > > activation key. > > > > > > > > Except, it said it could not validate my hardware configuration. > > > > > > > > Now, I had to get passed to a 'human' to get it done. > > > > > > > > Ok, so now I get to plead my case for the continuing privilage of > using > > an > > > > operating system that I paid good money for to someone on the > telephone. > > > I > > > > didn't get the impression that this person really understood the > > technical > > > > issue behind this (which I consider a bug in activation), but I did > get > > > > re-activated. > > > > > > > > Windows finally booted, installed my NIC card drivers, and I was

back

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> on > > > the > > > > Internet. > > > > > > > > So, my solution fixed my Network problem, but it was like travelling > > from > > > > Virginia to Maryland, by way of San Diego. > > > > > > > > Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my > data > > > > locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > If it weren't for the fact that I'd have to go back to Dual-Boot

98/2K

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> > (2K > > > > won't run all of my software), I would throw this XP disk in the > damned > > > > trash can. > > > > > > > > We don't need this crap. > > > > > > > > Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:07 UTC↳ reply to Tim Wheatley #139438

LOL! -Larry "Tim Wheatley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:iig58.42607$[email hidden]...

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> Have you seen how they dress these days? > > I swear when I'm 80 and can't pull a bird anymore I'm gonna move house > opposite a girls school ;-) > > "Gerry Aitken" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > Tim Wheatley wrote: > > > > > > I'm not sure, infact, I've been feeling ill recently.. so I couldn't > er... > > > read... I had my eyes closed... it was foggy, Look officer, I was on > > > holiday, it couldn't have been me. > > > > Yeah, yeah, and of course you swear you thought the girl was over 16 ;) > > > > Gerry > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:14 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139434

Well, I don't know about Bye-Bye Microsoft. That's a bit too tough especially since I make a decent living supporting PC's and MS products, but that doesn't mean some stuff can't be 'offloaded' from Windows. I have one of the new LCD iMac's on order. The one with the DVD burner and other goodies. I intend on offloading as much personal stuff as I can to this machine and the really superb MacOS X. I have 4 PC's (including two servers) running at home that will continue to do so for work purposes and sim racing. All of my 'Digital Media' stuff and home computing will move to the iMac. This is actually kind of funny, but guess what was the first software package I bought? Yep. Microsoft Office v.X. LOL! Ya can't truly win, can you :) -Larry "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:qH958.435$[email hidden]... > > "jon " <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:a32fp4$t4j$[email hidden]... > > This is what I wonder about. I have done reinstalls of 98 and 2000 ontwo > > computers, one of them a dual boot system. Now what happens to theproduct > > activation if I buy xp, and 3 years from now MS decides they no longer > offer > > support for it. Will they release something to bypass activation on itso

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> > users familiar with it can reinstall it, or will you have to buy the > newest > > version of windows because you cant get the older copy "activated"? > > Chris said to me in another post that if this comes to be then they will > offer a download that will disable the activation process. He also said he > has heard rumours that MS plan to make their OS rentware but isnt' privvy

to > that info himself, and so have I. Bye-bye Microsoft. > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:16 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139433

Richard, You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will continue to run XP. That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right to point out technical glitches and other complaints. -Larry "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In message <si458.14413$[email hidden]> > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly > > > simple. > > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad

technology > > any more, Richard? > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's products but > keep buying them!!! > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all theirF1

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> titles... ;-) > > > > -- > Richard. > > "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog."

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:18 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139432

It's frightening that Microsoft doesn't even know what they, themselves, are doing with the data they collect! Man, I can't wait to see the bloopers that crop up with .NET. It will be epic, truly epic. -Larry "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a33pfr$15bhqu$[email hidden]...

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> http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,18423,00.html Is this the real > reason MS want all our info. I'm think it is and the passport system just > proves it to me. Maybe they are collecting info for a rent system in the > future. > > -- > > Steve Levett > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:9u458.14468$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. > > > > I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply > > removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would

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> > leash known as WPA. > > > > What if I had been working on a time-sensitive deliverable? Would > Microsoft > > have refunded me the money lost due to this defect in their product? Of > > course, the answer is no... > > > > -Larry > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > > Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you really > > should > > > have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as > "changes," > > > to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once the > > threshold > > > as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, this would > > force > > > a free telephone call. > > > > > > There's a pretty good 10-item list on that site which describes what

is > > > tracked and the method used. There are also a few suggestions forthose > > who > > > do change hardware quite often. People have even changed out the > > > motherboard, for instance, without triggering a new activation. > > > > > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions,yet

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> I > > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > > > unwarranted attack. > > > > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what > > version > > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only

inaccurate, > > but > > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off > the > > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which Ireceived

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> > for > > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs > > afterward. > > > -- > > > Chris H. > > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > > Associate Expert > > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:21 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139431

Eldred, You are correct. That's why I've been carful to try and not direct any of the blame for this mess in his direction. I do level-3 support, and I know what it's like :) -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <s1258.3390$[email hidden]>, "Ed Solheim" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >Chris, > > > >Please be nice and take your spam elsewhere... this is a auto simulation > >group. > >Thanks! > > In Chris's defense, he only originally responded to assist someone who was > having a problem. He may be a bit 'over-zealous', but he tried to help. > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 28 Jan 2002 19:23 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139430

The only non-activation copies of XP in existance, that I know of, are the true Corporate License copies. Damn, even the Dealer Action-Pack copies have Activation enabled! -Larry "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:FYg58.2187$[email hidden]... > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yetI > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > > unwarranted attack. > > > I believe I have done much more to help people her in r.a.s than you have. > Unwarranted attack? You are lying through your teeth using outrageous spinto > sell the product. So the attack is warranted. > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world whatversion > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate,but > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available offthe > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I receivedfor > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programsafterward. > > -- > > Funny, you never said that you bought it. Thus you received it from MS.And as > you are a self-appointed expert et al, they presumably gave it to youwithout > activation required. I noticed you didn't mention activating your XP.You're > spinning so fast, you could be a DVD player. > > I think it is time I invoked Eldred's rule. > >

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 19:31 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139418

As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW than anyone, but dug out some information for you. A good starting point is http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a pretty good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2). There are also a couple other interesting links on that page. Without knowing the specific CD-ROMs involved on your XP or Win98 systems or the specific media you're using, some of this is just a shot in the dark. (1) Some CD-ROMs are partial to one brand or other CDs, and it depends on whether a CD-R or CD-RW is used in some cases. (2) Shell recording creates Mode 2 multisession discs in a standard ISO-9660/Joliet format. Some older players can't handle mode 2 -- and some can't handle multisession discs. The combination needs an up to date reader - though up to date in this context really means something that's no older than a few years. (3) The recorded discs do read okay on Windows XP, correct? Shell recording is also just terminally broken with some recorders, and an unreadable disc is one of the symptoms. (4) Media quality can play a part in something like this as well. There's a lot of cheap stuff floating around (some of it under well known brand names), so one of the standard suggestions is to try different media -- preferably good quality, not the 100 blanks for $9.99 things that sometimes show up at the box stores. (5) The approach of testing a different program also may work, like Nero has a free, 30-day trial version available to see if the writing software is the program. Be sure to clear the enable tab for shell recording in the recorder's properties, though. (6) You can try going into the recording page and set the speed down to a manual level - one within the CD-RW speed of the drive. If you're using CD-RW media, the built-in software sees it as CD-R and will record at CD-R speed (usually twice as fast) if left to make the decision. (7) If you're using multi-session Mode 2 CDRs that haven't been closed, then that may be why the Win98 system cannot read the disks although there are very few CD-ROMs now which can't handle multi-session such as certain early NECs up to about 1995. (8) Burning compatible CDs and using them from one system to the next is described as being an "art," getting the disk where the laser will fully burn out a pit, without thinning down the background too much, coupled with the setting in the reader for the reflected intensity switches between being recognized as 0 or 1. Computer CD-ROMs need to be officially multi-read to be able to read CD-RW media, no matter the other file format considerations, along with problems with some readers and "80-minute" disks. (9) Without knowing the equipment you're using, there also seems to be a common laser frequency issue below 4-speed and even up to 8-speed on some drives. (10) Some CD-R media (the "specials") have very thin top paint layer which are intended to be labeled, that don't reflect adequately. And thanks to your asking the question, I know have an "inkling" of a little bit of information about CD-R/RW functions. -- Chris H. "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Fs258.389$[email hidden]... > > P.S. I do have one techie question for you that maybe you can answer for me. > Why when I burn files to cdrom in XP are they not readable on a Win98 > system? This is using drag and drop method of burning in XP and not 3rd > party software.

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 20:15 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139427

Would you like to see the receipt, Jens? It was $194.99 at the local Staples, plus 5% tax here, for $204.74 total. Activated after I installed it and fed the ICS wizard information on my DSL connection. BTW, I'm not pushing sales of any product. In fact, I've only said to NOT purchase anything if someone is happy with their system. I've never said to go buy anything - that's all your own idea. Do we run out and buy all the new cars the automobile manufacturers advertise every year? Not when we're happy with what we've got, which in my case happens to be two '95 vehicles, one which we bought used. I've got two machines here which will never see XP installed, because they're running other operating systems just fine and upgrading isn't necessary for their purpose. Just like other people, money counts. Now if GPL 2 came out at the local store, I would have to convince my Wife that I just couldn't live without it. 8-) - Chris H. "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:FYg58.2187$[email hidden]... > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, yetI > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > > unwarranted attack. > > > I believe I have done much more to help people her in r.a.s than you have. > Unwarranted attack? You are lying through your teeth using outrageous spinto > sell the product. So the attack is warranted. > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world whatversion > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only inaccurate,but > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available offthe > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I receivedfor > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programsafterward. > > -- > > Funny, you never said that you bought it. Thus you received it from MS.And as > you are a self-appointed expert et al, they presumably gave it to youwithout > activation required. I noticed you didn't mention activating your XP.You're > spinning so fast, you could be a DVD player. > > I think it is time I invoked Eldred's rule. > > >

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 20:32 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139193

I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using Safe Mode without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believe it'll let you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive. - Chris H. "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before serviceseven > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because theNIC

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> card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit you to > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't held > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > Oh, well :) > > -Larry

Chris H. 28 Jan 2002 20:45 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139196

I believe, unless something changed, the personal information/preferences/etc. data doesn't go any farther than the user's own hard drive. Quite similar to the download/install file accessed when you go to Windows Update and ask it to check for something new. This was the direction it was headed back in October-November anyway, unless I totally misunderstood. The way it was explained to me was like, say, a bank account. The account information is kept on the user hard drive, when you contact the bank, the bank requests permission to access the info on your hard drive and you either grant or deny it. Without the user entering their own password to access the bank system, the bank won't even know who you are and where to check for the information. The Remote Assistance in XP is similar. You have a problem, e-mail or Messenger a request to someone with XP for help. They contact you as instructed in the message, and you authorize access. If you don't want them there, or at any time during the assistance the person starts heading in a direction you don't want, you can immediately kill the authorization and they're gone. The user, who sees on their own screen what is happening, controls the situation, even being able to set a time limit for authorization in the initial assistance request. - Chris H. "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:tuh58.17290$[email hidden]... > It's frightening that Microsoft doesn't even know what they, themselves,are > doing with the data they collect! > > Man, I can't wait to see the bloopers that crop up with .NET. It will be > epic, truly epic. > > -Larry

Steve Levett 28 Jan 2002 21:21 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139197

You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected music CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being able to play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. Shops had a very high percentage returned so Philips listen to the consumer and wuthdrew these CDs. I wonder if MS will do the same with this activation? -- Steve Levett "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Rrh58.17287$[email hidden]... > Richard, > > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. > > I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will > continue to run XP. > > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right to > point out technical glitches and other complaints. > > -Larry > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In message <si458.14413$[email hidden]> > > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly > > > > simple. > > > > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad > technology > > > any more, Richard? > > > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's products but > > keep buying them!!! > > > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all their > F1 > > titles... ;-) > > > > > > > > -- > > Richard. > > > > "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog." > >

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 23:17 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139207

People aren't exactly returning XP, though... And I don't think Philips made any. Rather, they said - as they hold lots of copyrights/patents on the CD standard - that any such CD cannot be actually called a compact disc. Kinda pointless, yes. But it's kinda like the old SNK NES games. Milhouse "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]... > You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protectedmusic > CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being ableto > play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them.Shops

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> had a very high percentage returned so Philips listen to the consumer and > wuthdrew these CDs. I wonder if MS will do the same with this activation? > > -- > > Steve Levett > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Rrh58.17287$[email hidden]... > > Richard, > > > > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? > > > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. > > > > I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will > > continue to run XP. > > > > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right to > > point out technical glitches and other complaints. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > In message <si458.14413$[email hidden]> > > > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's perfectly > > > > > simple. > > > > > > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad > > technology > > > > any more, Richard? > > > > > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's products > but > > > keep buying them!!! > > > > > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all > their > > F1 > > > titles... ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Richard. > > > > > > "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog." > > > > > >

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 23:22 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139208

"Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything they > sell - > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computerthan > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubtpiracy > > would be any problem. > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that NortonGhost > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say that XP > gives far more bng for the buck. Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even deal with NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. Milhouse

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> > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > newsgroup > > any day. > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are some > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > >

Milhouse 28 Jan 2002 23:22 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139209

Well, then you spoke with your dollars and decided that WPA obviously wasn't that bad at the time. Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:EW958.439$[email hidden]...

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> > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > newsgroup > > any day. > > P.S. How can I possibly be 100% anti-MS when I actually paid MS for using > WinXP? > You need a core logic upgrade dude. > >

Richard Walker 28 Jan 2002 23:39 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139348

In message <Rrh58.17287$[email hidden]> "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. Not really. I'm just as cynical as yourself when I want to be! :-) > I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will > continue to run XP. That's OK. > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right to > point out technical glitches and other complaints. Again, that's OK (of course) but it just seems odd moaning about these things when you are quite happy to buy the product. There is not reason at all for Microsoft to stop using WPA now. Yes, some people moan, but the *vast* majority are still buying. Microsoft have won. Me? I'll be sticking with RISC OS[*] for a while longer, and possibly moving to Linux or Mac OS X when/if RISC OS dies completely. I won't be running Microsoft Office on a Mac OS X setup, either. Microsoft? I don't need 'em! :-) [*] see http://www.riscos.org or similar -- Richard. "All you need is love, love. Love is all you need."

Goy Larsen 28 Jan 2002 23:47 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139214

Milhouse wrote:

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> > People aren't exactly returning XP, though... > > And I don't think Philips made any. Rather, they said - as they hold lots > of copyrights/patents on the CD standard - that any such CD cannot be > actually called a compact disc. Kinda pointless, yes. But it's kinda like > the old SNK NES games.

Correct, and they actually took it one step further, saying they would develop CD-burners that would overcome this copy protection, and if they changed the protection, they would develop a new burner, and so forth, Philips did NOT like this at all It seems to have been dropped now though, Virgin gave it another think, but then again, the only 2 CD's released so far that I know of was Natalie Imbruglia (who ?) and Westlife (yippe, since I don't own a regular stereo, I'll never play their CD by accident should anyone leave one around here for some strange and obscure reason, thx Virgin, actually I'd like to see more CD's with this copy protection when I think about it, ........:-) Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy http://www.theuspits.com http://www.teammirage.com "A woman is an occasional pleasure but a cigar is always a smoke" --Groucho Marx--

mark jeangerard 29 Jan 2002 00:28 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139220

Whoa... Hold it right there! We're restricted to how many hardware changes we make? I know you work for MS, Chris, but you've obviously never owned Windows. You see, when you have a Windows OS, some days the best thing you can do is remove everything and let it start over. ....and, that's half the fun of Windows - digging all your goodies out of your closet or other computers that you have laying around and seeing what run with what. :-) I do have a serious question though, what about a computer with no internet connection like my ProTools machine in the studio? -- "Racing! - Science for the action minded." mark "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lLO48.140579$[email hidden]... > The NIC does carry extra weight in the calculation, Larry, plus you made > three other changes, too. Remember, if you're going to make a lot of > changes, note the date you've activated because after 120 days the system is > reset to "zero" amount of the calculated hardware changes. This is sort of > saying if you were 100 days into your first activation, changing of the > controller, hard drive and adding another drive (don't believe that's > counted, but anyway) would count only until the 121st day. > > Then those changes are reset to zero and adding the NIC would not have > triggered anything because it would only have been count one or two (at > most) of the four to six allowed changes. At this moment, I don't see > anything but activation seeing a "different" system, therefore requiring the > telephone call. I can see where activation may have been triggered by the > numerous changes within a single, 120-day period, but if you'd like I'll > continue to track it down so we know for sure. > > It is stuff like this which is keeping me from installing my USB MS > SideWinder FF wheel and hitting the GPL tracks. 8-) GPL, with the update > patch, runs quite well for me on a clean NTFS install of Windows XP Pro, an > AMD Thunderbird 1 GB with 512 PC133 RAM and a GeForce2 MX400 w/64 Megs. 8-) > -- > Chris H. > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > Associate Expert > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:o3N48.6997$[email hidden]... > > Chris, > > > > There was no error on the card in the device manager. It was simply my > > desire to 'freshen' the installation and the drivers for the Intel > > In-Business 10/100 NIC Card, which did, in the end, fix my Network > problems. > > > > The only hardware changes that have been made to this computer are the > > installation of a Maxtor ATA/133 Controller and 80GB Maxtor D740X hard > > drive, and the replacement of an old Pioneer DVD-113 with a new Pioneer > > DVD-116 DVD drive. > > > > I assure you I was suprised as well :) > > > > I don't know the exact time, but it was about 9pm this evening. > > > > The guy on the phone was nice and all. No complaints there. However I > > didn't get the impression that he understood what I was reporting, and > that > > I felt it was a bug in the Activation system. > > > > It still all boils down to the fact that we don't need this nonsense. > > > > Thanks for your input! > > > > -Larry > >

mark jeangerard 29 Jan 2002 00:33 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139222

Ah.... Jan Verschueren. Had the pleasure to share a bit of asphalt with the man myself. It is always a pleasure. -- "Racing! - Science for the action minded." mark "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:yQg58.2180$[email hidden]... > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > news:vn258.388$[email hidden]... > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:SoZ48.62730$[email hidden]... > > > > /Jens, having a Jan day. > > > > Would that be Jan Brady? > > > > > > Who? > > Nah, somebody of talent and style. And good at the Ring. ;-) > >

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 00:46 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139224

> > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > > MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't likeit, > then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. That's the reason why I haven't bought it. It's nice to confirm that my suspensions where correct.

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 00:46 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139223

Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0. -- Chris H. "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything they > > sell - > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computer > than > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt > piracy > > > would be any problem. > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that Norton > Ghost > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say that XP > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even deal with > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. > > Milhouse > > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > > newsgroup > > > any day. > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are some > > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > > > > > > >

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 00:48 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139225

> > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about badtechnology > > any more, Richard? > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's products but > keep buying them!!! > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all theirF1 > titles... ;-) I'll agree with you on that one, but it was nice to read some of the problems, so those of us who haven't bought it can continue to hold our ground.

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 00:57 UTC↳ reply to mark jeangerard #139227

Mark, wish I had your signature line. As for the serious question, when one installs on a system which isn't connected to the Internet, the toll free number (regional, around the world) is shown. I don't work for anyone. I'm disabled and on permanent Social Security Disability. I've also run everything from DOS 1.0 until today. I posted a link to a very good explanation of what goes into the activation count earlier: http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm - Chris H. "Mark Jeangerard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a34qco$lmq$[email hidden]... > Whoa... Hold it right there! We're restricted to how many hardware changes > we make? I know you work for MS, Chris, but you've obviously never owned > Windows. You see, when you have a Windows OS, some days the best thing you > can do is remove everything and let it start over. ....and, that's halfthe > fun of Windows - digging all your goodies out of your closet or other > computers that you have laying around and seeing what run with what. :-) > > I do have a serious question though, what about a computer with nointernet

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> connection like my ProTools machine in the studio? > > -- > > "Racing! - Science for the action minded." > > mark

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 00:58 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139228

> Eldred, you are missing the point here: Chris doesn't care. Bill said itis > good, thus it is good. You're just a regular user (a technicallysophisticated > one with networking skills etc.) but you're not supposed to act like youown the > pc. Just buy a Dell/Compaq/Gateway and leave it at that. Smile, be happy.Chris > is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly. I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thats another subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you go out and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is the finacial one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwise why should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software. Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which is what this tread started out being).

Gutty 29 Jan 2002 03:26 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139238

Hmm interesting, but what happends when GPL 2 comes out and it needs XP? "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:O0f58.463$[email hidden]...

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> > ":: Blank ::" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Do you really think we can make or break MS...too late I think. I'd like > to > > hear your plan however :) > > Well, after reading this article below I have made up my mind. I'm going > back to Win98, I'm going to install Win98Lite by Shane Brooks to gut out

IE, > I'm going to use Opera as my web browser and I'm going to use Agent fornews

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> and email. This is as far as I'm ever going with Microsft softare for the > forseeable future. > > http://www.junkbusters.com/microsoft.html#demandslist > > "Second, we do not recommend consumers use any Microsoft products, for a > variety of reasons including its history on privacy and security. Creating > something called an "import privacy rule" for IE6 constitutes an implied > endorsement very remote from our estimation of the company and its

products. > Regrettably, the products we recommend for people to protect their privacy > online are not made by Microsoft. Other web browsers have consistently > provided better cookie management features and less privacy-invasive > defaults. It is very sad that the largest software manufacturer has doneso > little for privacy, and is willfully continuing that trailershipposition." > > >

Don Burnette 29 Jan 2002 03:49 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139240

I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 Don Burnette "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Qhm58.569$[email hidden]...

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> Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0. > -- > Chris H. > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything they > > > sell - > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computer > > than > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt > > piracy > > > > would be any problem. > > > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that Norton > > Ghost > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say

that > XP > > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even dealwith

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> > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. > > > > Milhouse > > > > > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > > > newsgroup > > > > any day. > > > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are some > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:05 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139259

Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his Win98 doesn't have the UDF driver installed. Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where some software burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normal format and need help. -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3Gh58.87924$%[email hidden]... > As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW thananyone, > but dug out some information for you. A good starting point is > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a pretty > good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2). > There are also a couple other interesting links on that page. > > Without knowing the specific CD-ROMs involved on your XP or Win98 systemsor

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> the specific media you're using, some of this is just a shot in the dark. > > (1) Some CD-ROMs are partial to one brand or other CDs, and it depends on > whether a CD-R or CD-RW is used in some cases. > (2) Shell recording creates Mode 2 multisession discs in a standard > ISO-9660/Joliet format. Some older players can't handle mode 2 -- and some > can't handle multisession discs. The combination needs an up to date > reader - though up to date in this context really means something that's

no > older than a few years. > (3) The recorded discs do read okay on Windows XP, correct? Shell > recording is also just terminally broken with some recorders, and an > unreadable disc is one of the symptoms. > (4) Media quality can play a part in something like this as well. There'sa > lot of cheap stuff floating around (some of it under well known brand > names), so one of the standard suggestions is to try different media -- > preferably good quality, not the 100 blanks for $9.99 things thatsometimes > show up at the box stores. > (5) The approach of testing a different program also may work, like Nero > has a free, 30-day trial version available to see if the writing softwareis

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> the program. Be sure to clear the enable tab for shell recording in the > recorder's properties, though. > (6) You can try going into the recording page and set the speed down to a > manual level - one within the CD-RW speed of the drive. If you're using > CD-RW media, the built-in software sees it as CD-R and will record at CD-R > speed (usually twice as fast) if left to make the decision. > (7) If you're using multi-session Mode 2 CDRs that haven't been closed, > then that may be why the Win98 system cannot read the disks although there > are very few CD-ROMs now which can't handle multi-session such as certain > early NECs up to about 1995. > (8) Burning compatible CDs and using them from one system to the next is > described as being an "art," getting the disk where the laser will fully > burn out a pit, without thinning down the background too much, coupled

with > the setting in the reader for the reflected intensity switches betweenbeing > recognized as 0 or 1. Computer CD-ROMs need to be officially multi-readto > be able to read CD-RW media, no matter the other file formatconsiderations, > along with problems with some readers and "80-minute" disks. > (9) Without knowing the equipment you're using, there also seems to be a > common laser frequency issue below 4-speed and even up to 8-speed on some > drives. > (10) Some CD-R media (the "specials") have very thin top paint layerwhich > are intended to be labeled, that don't reflect adequately. > > And thanks to your asking the question, I know have an "inkling" of alittle

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> bit of information about CD-R/RW functions. > -- > Chris H. > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Fs258.389$[email hidden]... > > > > P.S. I do have one techie question for you that maybe you can answer for > me. > > Why when I burn files to cdrom in XP are they not readable on a Win98 > > system? This is using drag and drop method of burning in XP and not 3rd > > party software. > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:07 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139260

Actually, I was talking about the linked story where Microsoft admitted that they collected user data 'by accident', and wasn't quite sure where all of it ended up. -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8Mi58.88759$%[email hidden]... > I believe, unless something changed, the personal > information/preferences/etc. data doesn't go any farther than the user'sown > hard drive. Quite similar to the download/install file accessed when yougo

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> to Windows Update and ask it to check for something new. This was the > direction it was headed back in October-November anyway, unless I totally > misunderstood. > > The way it was explained to me was like, say, a bank account. The account > information is kept on the user hard drive, when you contact the bank, the > bank requests permission to access the info on your hard drive and you > either grant or deny it. Without the user entering their own password to > access the bank system, the bank won't even know who you are and where to > check for the information. > > The Remote Assistance in XP is similar. You have a problem, e-mail or > Messenger a request to someone with XP for help. They contact you as > instructed in the message, and you authorize access. If you don't want

them

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> there, or at any time during the assistance the person starts heading in a > direction you don't want, you can immediately kill the authorization and > they're gone. The user, who sees on their own screen what is happening, > controls the situation, even being able to set a time limit for > authorization in the initial assistance request. > > - Chris H. > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:tuh58.17290$[email hidden]... > > It's frightening that Microsoft doesn't even know what they, themselves, > are > > doing with the data they collect! > > > > Man, I can't wait to see the bloopers that crop up with .NET. It will

be > > epic, truly epic. > > > > -Larry > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:09 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139261

Most places won't take back opened software, but anyway... Phillips did a SMART thing when they notified these stupid record companies that they can NOT use the Compact Disc-Digital Audio certification/insignia on their defective CD's. There are standard behind that symbol, and these defective CD's do not meet that standard. I say, way to go Phillips! -Larry "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ZZk58.12737$[email hidden]... > People aren't exactly returning XP, though... > > And I don't think Philips made any. Rather, they said - as they hold lots > of copyrights/patents on the CD standard - that any such CD cannot be > actually called a compact disc. Kinda pointless, yes. But it's kindalike

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> the old SNK NES games. > > Milhouse > > "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]... > > You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected > music > > CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being

able > to > > play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. > Shops > > had a very high percentage returned so Philips listen to the consumerand > > wuthdrew these CDs. I wonder if MS will do the same with thisactivation?

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> > > > -- > > > > Steve Levett > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Rrh58.17287$[email hidden]... > > > Richard, > > > > > > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? > > > > > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. > > > > > > I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will > > > continue to run XP. > > > > > > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right

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> > > point out technical glitches and other complaints. > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > In message <si458.14413$[email hidden]> > > > > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software. It's

perfectly

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> > > > > > simple. > > > > > > > > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad > > > technology > > > > > any more, Richard? > > > > > > > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's

products

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> > but > > > > keep buying them!!! > > > > > > > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all > > their > > > F1 > > > > titles... ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Richard. > > > > > > > > "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog." > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:10 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139263

What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed out of their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's. Another fine Microsoft idea :( -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:tzi58.81776$[email hidden]... > I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using SafeMode > without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believe it'lllet

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> you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive. > > - Chris H. > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before services > even > > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because the > NIC > > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit you

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> > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't held > > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > > > Oh, well :) > > > > -Larry > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:11 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139264

5.01? There's been an update? Gotta go look :) -Larry "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]...

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> I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > > Don Burnette > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Qhm58.569$[email hidden]... > > Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0. > > -- > > Chris H. > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything

they > > > > sell - > > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on yourcomputer > > > than > > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt > > > piracy > > > > > would be any problem. > > > > > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering thatNorton

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> > > Ghost > > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say > that > > XP > > > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > > > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even deal > with > > > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. > > > > > > Milhouse > > > > > > > > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > > > > newsgroup > > > > > any day. > > > > > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are

some

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> > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 05:14 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139266

I'm sorry, but HOGWASH! Since when did one give up their rights to comment on a product and it's problems because they decided to buy it? I never have understood this philosophy. Not at all... -Larry "jlohman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ltm58.58323$[email hidden]...

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happy. > Chris > > is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly. > > I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't > buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thatsanother > subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you goout > and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is the finacial > one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwise why > should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software. > Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which iswhat > this tread started out being). > >

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 05:17 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139273

In article <a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]>, "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> writes: >You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected music >CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being able to >play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers. I can run a line from my stereo to my computer sound card. Once that's connected, I can make an mp3 of ANYTHING I run through the stereo. TV programs, cassette tapes, albums, etc. You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3 file, if they have the right equipment... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 05:17 UTC↳ reply to Goy Larsen #139275

In article <[email hidden]>, Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> writes:

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>It seems to have been dropped now though, Virgin gave it another think, >but then again, the only 2 CD's released so far that I know of was >Natalie Imbruglia (who ?) and Westlife (yippe, since I don't own a >regular stereo, I'll never play their CD by accident should anyone leave >one around here for some strange and obscure reason, thx Virgin, >actually I'd like to see more CD's with this copy protection when I >think about it, ........:-)

You missed the CDs by Michael Jackson and Incubus. We occasionally get reports from Sony about our students sharing mp3's from those 2 artists. Yep, the copy-protected CDs really kept people from making their mp3's... Bravo, Sony! <g> Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 05:17 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139276

In article <ltm58.58323$[email hidden]>, "jlohman" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>> Eldred, you are missing the point here: Chris doesn't care. Bill said it >is >> good, thus it is good. You're just a regular user (a technically >sophisticated >> one with networking skills etc.) but you're not supposed to act like you >own the >> pc. Just buy a Dell/Compaq/Gateway and leave it at that. Smile, be happy. >Chris >> is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly. > >I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't >buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thats another >subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you go out >and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is the finacial >one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwise why >should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software. >Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which is what >this tread started out being).

I *don't* plan to buy it, as I've stated in another message. However, my dad wants a new computer, which I *know* will come with XP. I'm SERIOUSLY considering re-formatting the damn thing when he gets it, and installing win98se...<g> So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, is that an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Asbjørn Bjørnstad 29 Jan 2002 05:44 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139279

[email hidden] (EldredP) writes: > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang > OS, is that an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? Won't it display this EULA thing and ask if you accept? I seem to remember a bunch of linux fans bying laptops (Which is pretty har to get without an os, with a desktop system you can always build it yourself.) refusing the license and trying to get their money back for the software which they could prove they didn't use. Don't think it worked, though. -- -asbjxrn

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 06:03 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139281

Free download for registered owners from www.powerquest.com . -- Chris H. "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:K9q58.18411$[email hidden]... > 5.01? There's been an update? > > Gotta go look :) > > -Larry > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]... > > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > > > > Don Burnette > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Qhm58.569$[email hidden]... > > > Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0. > > > -- > > > Chris H. > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything > they > > > > > sell - > > > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your > computer > > > > than > > > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt > > > > piracy > > > > > > would be any problem. > > > > > > > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that > Norton > > > > Ghost > > > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say > > that > > > XP > > > > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > > > > > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even deal > > with > > > > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. > > > > > > > > Milhouse > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whining in a > > > > > newsgroup > > > > > > any day. > > > > > > > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are > some > > > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 06:06 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139282

Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the consumer into using just their product and their support? A user can order a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, build your own if you have the knowledge to do so. -- Chris H. "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:49q58.18410$[email hidden]... > What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed out of > their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's. > > Another fine Microsoft idea :( > > -Larry > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:tzi58.81776$[email hidden]... > > I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using Safe > Mode > > without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believe it'll > let > > you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive. > > > > - Chris H. > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > > > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before services > > even > > > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because the > > NIC > > > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > > > > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit you > to > > > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't held > > > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > > > > > Oh, well :) > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > >

Milhouse 29 Jan 2002 07:12 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139340

Exactly. And more and more computers are coming with the "right" equipment standard these days. Any encoded audio is inherently pointless - for people to use it, they need the decoder. Milhouse "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]>, "Steve Levett" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protectedmusic > >CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being ableto > >play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. > > Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers. I can run a line from my > stereo to my computer sound card. Once that's connected, I can make anmp3 of > ANYTHING I run through the stereo. TV programs, cassette tapes, albums,etc. > You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3 file,if

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> they have the right equipment... > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Milhouse 29 Jan 2002 07:15 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139341

Well, then it got updated. No versions I've ever seen so far can write to an NTFS partition at all, and I thought one of those was 7.0... Can't say for sure, since the only person with both XP and Ghost that I know, stuck with FAT32 because of the issues with Ghost. Milhouse "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Qhm58.569$[email hidden]...

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that > XP > > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even dealwith

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Richard Walker 29 Jan 2002 10:15 UTC↳ reply to Asbjørn Bjørnstad #139351

In message <[email hidden]> [email hidden] (Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad) wrote: > I seem to remember a bunch of linux fans bying laptops (Which is pretty > har to get without an os, with a desktop system you can always build it > yourself.) refusing the license and trying to get their money back for the > software which they could prove they didn't use. Don't think it worked, > though. Apparently, you can send the OS back, and get some cash back. I suspect a lot of 'big names' will make this as difficult as possible, though. :-( -- Richard. "Hey you've got to hide your love away."

Uwe Schuerkamp 29 Jan 2002 11:17 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139354

On Mon, 28 Jan 2002 21:21:37 -0000, Steve Levett <[email hidden]> wrote: > had a very high percentage returned so Philips listen to the consumer and > wuthdrew these CDs. I wonder if MS will do the same with this activation? As opposed to Microsoft, Philips is not a monopoly. MS is. Customer actions (or non-actions) only work to a certain extent, and they're next to useless in the face of a monopoly. uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Uwe Schuerkamp 29 Jan 2002 11:23 UTC↳ reply to Gutty #139355

On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 14:26:57 +1100, Gutty <[email hidden]> wrote: > Hmm interesting, but what happends when GPL 2 comes out and it needs XP? > Let's hope Ruud's "racer" will have reached 1.0 by then ;-) Uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Uncle Fester 29 Jan 2002 13:28 UTC↳ reply to Asbjørn Bjørnstad #139370

"Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" wrote:

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> > [email hidden] (EldredP) writes: > > > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang > > OS, is that an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > Won't it display this EULA thing and ask if you accept? > > I seem to remember a bunch of linux fans bying laptops (Which is > pretty har to get without an os, with a desktop system you can always > build it yourself.) refusing the license and trying to get their money > back for the software which they could prove they didn't use. Don't > think it worked, though.

Yes it did work. They got their money back. Forgot where I read about it at the time, it was either Slashdot or 2600.com. -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

Uncle Fester 29 Jan 2002 13:30 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139371

EldredP wrote: > > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, is that > an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? Sure. M$ got their money for another copy of XP didn't they? Cmon Eldred, I know you possess the abilities to build one on your own. Make it YOUR way! <g> -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

jon 29 Jan 2002 14:01 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139374

Why the hell are they so worried? In 1985 I could copy a cassette tape, and in fact did, as did several of the people I knew. I don't believe that I put anybody out of business. EldredP <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]>, "Steve Levett" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protectedmusic > >CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being ableto > >play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. > > Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers. I can run a line from my > stereo to my computer sound card. Once that's connected, I can make anmp3 of > ANYTHING I run through the stereo. TV programs, cassette tapes, albums,etc. > You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3 file,if

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you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:27 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139377

"Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:yQg58.2180$[email hidden]... > Who? Jan Brady from the Brady Bunch TV show of the early '70's. She would have days where nothing went right.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:36 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139380

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3Gh58.87924$%[email hidden]... > As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW thananyone, > but dug out some information for you. A good starting point is > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a pretty > good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2). > There are also a couple other interesting links on that page. OK, thx for the info. I'm reading that web page now. But I don't think my problem is any of the below stuff you posted. I have a Ricoh MP7120A which is one of the better cdrw drives and it can burn/read any format, including RAW mode. This is WinXP specific and the file format it is using. They are perfectly readable under XP, but not Win98. My guess is that Win98 needs a certain file(s) so it can read the cd's burned in XP. Which is more bollocks from XP because I've burned cd's in Win98 and they are readable on any other computer.I can burn with CloneCD (raw mode) in XP and they are readable on any computer. The problem only happens when using XP's built in software.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:39 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139381

"Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:E4q58.18402$[email hidden]... > Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his Win98 > doesn't have the UDF driver installed. > > Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where some software > burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normalformat > and need help. > > -Larry You serious? XP uses packet writing even on a CDR? I don't think it is packet writing because when doing this drag and drop method it writes a lead in/lead out just like when you burn cdr with other software. Packet writing doesn't do that.

Dave Henrie 29 Jan 2002 14:43 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139384

"Aguirre" . The problem only happens when using XP's built in software. > I would suspect they included a pared-down cd burner to get after the fact sales. Probably part of an agreement with whomever coded the XP cd burner. dave henrie

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:45 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139385

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I *don't* plan to buy it, as I've stated in another message. However, mydad > wants a new computer, which I *know* will come with XP. I'm SERIOUSLY > considering re-formatting the damn thing when he gets it, and installing > win98se...<g> > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, isthat > an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > Eldred If your Dad is a computer neophyte he is much better off with XP IMO.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:53 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139289

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even deal with > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once. > > Milhouse Yea, I got a free version with my mb too. That version doesn't read NTFS, but the latest version (2002) does and at FutureShop here in Canada they are asking $119.00 CAD. Ridiculous huh? All it does is one small thing, back up a partion or HD. I just use the restore feature in XP instead.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:54 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139386

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]... > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > Drive Image isn't cheap either. Cheaper than Norton Ghost though.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:57 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139387

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:8_r58.13383$[email hidden]... > Can't say for sure, since the only person with both XP and Ghost that I > know, stuck with FAT32 because of the issues with Ghost. Yea, that's what I should have done but didn't know Ghost couldn't read NTFS at the time. Soon found out when I tried run Ghost on XP though.

Aguirre 29 Jan 2002 14:59 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139388

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:e3l58.12749$[email hidden]... > Well, then you spoke with your dollars and decided that WPA obviouslywasn't > that bad at the time. > Not really, initially I swore I wouldn't buy XP, then one day I was bored and wanted something to tinker with so I bought a copy of XP. Doesn't mean I can't make my opinion known though and doesn't mean I am going to stay with it either.

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 15:10 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139290

The burning software in XP is by Roxio. 8-( Guess what they want you to do? -- Chris H. "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fny58.515$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:3Gh58.87924$%[email hidden]... > > As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW than > anyone, > > but dug out some information for you. A good starting point is > > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a pretty > > good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2). > > There are also a couple other interesting links on that page. > > OK, thx for the info. I'm reading that web page now. But I don't think my > problem is any of the below stuff you posted. I have a Ricoh MP7120A which > is one of the better cdrw drives and it can burn/read any format, including > RAW mode. This is WinXP specific and the file format it is using. They are > perfectly readable under XP, but not Win98. My guess is that Win98 needs a > certain file(s) so it can read the cd's burned in XP. Which is more bollocks > from XP because I've burned cd's in Win98 and they are readable on any other > computer.I can burn with CloneCD (raw mode) in XP and they are readable on > any computer. The problem only happens when using XP's built in software. > > >

Goy Larsen 29 Jan 2002 15:36 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139292

EldredP wrote:

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> > In article <[email hidden]>, Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> writes: > > >It seems to have been dropped now though, Virgin gave it another think, > >but then again, the only 2 CD's released so far that I know of was > >Natalie Imbruglia (who ?) and Westlife (yippe, since I don't own a > >regular stereo, I'll never play their CD by accident should anyone leave > >one around here for some strange and obscure reason, thx Virgin, > >actually I'd like to see more CD's with this copy protection when I > >think about it, ........:-) > > You missed the CDs by Michael Jackson and Incubus. We occasionally get reports > from Sony about our students sharing mp3's from those 2 artists. Yep, the > copy-protected CDs really kept people from making their mp3's... > Bravo, Sony!

Actually, for those "in the know", only the first song on the CD is "impossible" to copy, so much for that, ROFL, oh well, as long as they don't implement this stupid scheme on my fav blues artists I dont mind, I *always* make a copy for use in my car stereo as I hate to have my original CD's scratched Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/ * Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way * "Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 17:00 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139295

> I'm sorry, but HOGWASH! > > Since when did one give up their rights to comment on a product and it's > problems because they decided to buy it? Oh don't get me wrong, I don't think you should not complain about it. It's good for those that are not informed to know the bad things about it. However my complaint is the people who buy it, who know about the "features" and still complain about it, and not do anything about it, and still have it on their hard drive. Microsoft has those people by the nose, leading them around. Sure they are going to complain, but they'll keep buying new software. The only real message to send to Microsoft is the finacial one. By not buying it. By not being lead around by the nose. That is the only message that they will listen to. The bottom line is, there is no real reason to have XP (I suppose there is one or two programs that require XP), that being the case, why buy it?

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 17:31 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139302

Exactly one of my points. Windows XP comes from the NT line of operating systems, and quite honestly does a very good job of combining most of our Win9x line of programs for use. But it really isn't for everyone, and not a grand solution for those limping along with Win98 on their machines. For one, XP is written to take advantage, and work with the most, recent hardware. I would be a fool to think I could slap it into my daughters' machine (AMD K6 233 w/64 MB EDO RAM) and it would instantly speed up their system. It would probably croak because of the ancient hardware, limited RAM and a processor which is slow by today's standards. That's why I've said it is one of the machines we have which will never see XP. Nor Millennium. I don't like Millennium, though it'll run on any machine we've got, but from the very beginning it has had too many "choices" regarding what is installed removed. For instance, I have absolutely no use for MovieMaker, yet there it is, and System Restore isn't as flexible as I'd like it to be where and when it "protects" files. I didn't like it from the beginning, won't buy it and won't install it. My choice. If the user's system is doing what they want, runs the programs they want, there is absolutely no reason to change. -- - Chris H. "jlohman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WyA58.34432$[email hidden]... > > I'm sorry, but HOGWASH! > > > > Since when did one give up their rights to comment on a product and it's > > problems because they decided to buy it? > > Oh don't get me wrong, I don't think you should not complain about it. It's > good for those that are not informed to know the bad things about it. > However my complaint is the people who buy it, who know about the "features" > and still complain about it, and not do anything about it, and still have it > on their hard drive. Microsoft has those people by the nose, leading them > around. Sure they are going to complain, but they'll keep buying new > software. > The only real message to send to Microsoft is the finacial one. By not > buying it. By not being lead around by the nose. That is the only message > that they will listen to. > The bottom line is, there is no real reason to have XP (I suppose there is > one or two programs that require XP), that being the case, why buy it? > > >

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 17:51 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139304

In article <lvy58.517$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> writes: >If your Dad is a computer neophyte he is much better off with XP IMO. > I considered that too, but I haven't made up my mind yet... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 17:51 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139305

In article <vey58.514$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> writes: >"Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:yQg58.2180$[email hidden]... >> Who? > >Jan Brady from the Brady Bunch TV show of the early '70's. She would have >days where nothing went right. I always liked her better than Marsha anyway...<g> Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 17:51 UTC↳ reply to Uncle Fester #139308

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (12 lines)

> >EldredP wrote: >> >> So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, is >that >> an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > >Sure. M$ got their money for another copy of XP didn't they? Cmon >Eldred, I know you possess the abilities to build one on your own. Make >it YOUR way! <g> >

I *did* build my own, and I've very happy with it. I was talking about a system for my dad...<g> He wants all the bells and whistles of a couple of packages he saw on TV...<sigh> I can't match those prices with a homemade system. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 29 Jan 2002 17:51 UTC↳ reply to Asbjørn Bjørnstad #139310

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad) writes:

Quoted text (12 lines)

>[email hidden] (EldredP) writes: > >> So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang >> OS, is that an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > >Won't it display this EULA thing and ask if you accept? > >I seem to remember a bunch of linux fans bying laptops (Which is >pretty har to get without an os, with a desktop system you can always >build it yourself.) refusing the license and trying to get their money >back for the software which they could prove they didn't use. Don't >think it worked, though.

I was just responding to someone who said you teach the company a lesson by not buying the OS. But, if the OS is preinstalled, my decision to purchase the machine shouldn't be looked at as an endorsement of the OS. Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Marc Fraioli 29 Jan 2002 18:20 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139315

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (EldredP) writes:

Quoted text (12 lines)

> In article <a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]>, "Steve Levett" > <[email hidden]> writes: > >>You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected music >>CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being able to >>play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. > > Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers. I can run a line from my > stereo to my computer sound card. Once that's connected, I can make an mp3 of > ANYTHING I run through the stereo. TV programs, cassette tapes, albums, etc. > You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3 file, if > they have the right equipment...

Yes, you can do that, but it's not quite the same. You've introduced noise and such by converting the signal to analog and back to digital again. If you rip it directly off the CD in the PC's CD drive, this doesn't happen-- you get a perfect digital copy. And that's what they're really trying to prevent. Nonetheless, I suspect most people would be perfectly satisfied with the results from your method... Marc

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:21 UTC↳ reply to Richard Walker #139323

Already ahead of ya. New iMac on the way, if the thing ever ships... Except it won't replace the PC's or servers I have at home. That's how I make my living. However, all of my digital media work and home stuff is moving to MacOS X. -Larry "Richard Walker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In message <Rrh58.17287$[email hidden]> > "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ? > > > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices. > > Not really. I'm just as cynical as yourself when I want to be! :-) > > > I have a reason for running XP. I still have that reason, and I will > > continue to run XP. > > That's OK. > > > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right to > > point out technical glitches and other complaints. > > Again, that's OK (of course) but it just seems odd moaning about these > things when you are quite happy to buy the product. There is not reason

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> all for Microsoft to stop using WPA now. Yes, some people moan, but the > *vast* majority are still buying. Microsoft have won. > > Me? I'll be sticking with RISC OS[*] for a while longer, and possibly > moving to Linux or Mac OS X when/if RISC OS dies completely. I won't be > running Microsoft Office on a Mac OS X setup, either. Microsoft? I don't > need 'em! :-) > > > [*] see http://www.riscos.org or similar > > -- > Richard. > > "All you need is love, love. Love is all you need."

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:24 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139324

No, Chris. Since, I believe January of 2000, Microsoft has pressured OEM's to NOT provide full Windows CD's with their computers. From what I understand, the OEM's absolutely HATE the idea, but you know how that goes. Can't risk pissing off the Mothership. Might start getting late/short deliveries and what... It's definetely a MS thing, not an OEM thing. -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:YZq58.178999$[email hidden]... > Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the > consumer into using just their product and their support? A user canorder

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> a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying > hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, build your > own if you have the knowledge to do so. > -- > Chris H. > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:49q58.18410$[email hidden]... > > What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed out of > > their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's. > > > > Another fine Microsoft idea :( > > > > -Larry > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:tzi58.81776$[email hidden]... > > > I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using

Safe > > Mode > > > without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believeit'll

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> > let > > > you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive. > > > > > > - Chris H. > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > > > > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before > services > > > even > > > > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because > the > > > NIC > > > > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > > > > > > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit > you > > to > > > > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't

held

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> > > > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > > > > > > > Oh, well :) > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:24 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139325

On my way! -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WWq58.178958$[email hidden]...

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> Free download for registered owners from www.powerquest.com . > -- > Chris H. > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:K9q58.18411$[email hidden]... > > 5.01? There's been an update? > > > > Gotta go look :) > > > > -Larry > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]... > > > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > > > > > > Don Burnette > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:Qhm58.569$[email hidden]... > > > > Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0. > > > > -- > > > > Chris H. > > > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:d3l58.12748$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > news:tQ958.437$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > > > > > > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > > news:WX658.11333$[email hidden]... > > > > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and

everything

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> > they > > > > > > sell - > > > > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your > > computer > > > > > than > > > > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly > doubt > > > > > piracy > > > > > > > would be any problem. > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that > > Norton > > > > > Ghost > > > > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would

say

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> > > that > > > > XP > > > > > > gives far more bng for the buck. > > > > > > > > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!? Wow. It can't even > deal > > > with > > > > > NTFS partitions! I think I got it packaged with a motherboard

once. > > > > > > > > > > Milhouse > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS prick whiningin > a > > > > > > newsgroup > > > > > > > any day. > > > > > > > > > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friendsare

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> > some > > > > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:27 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139326

While in theory your method would work, it does not work when dealing with a Monopoly. Which is the worst part about a Monopoly. Voting with one's wallet is not a concern to them. -Larry "jlohman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:WyA58.34432$[email hidden]... > > I'm sorry, but HOGWASH! > > > > Since when did one give up their rights to comment on a product and it's > > problems because they decided to buy it? > > Oh don't get me wrong, I don't think you should not complain about it.It's > good for those that are not informed to know the bad things about it. > However my complaint is the people who buy it, who know about the"features" > and still complain about it, and not do anything about it, and still haveit

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> on their hard drive. Microsoft has those people by the nose, leading them > around. Sure they are going to complain, but they'll keep buying new > software. > The only real message to send to Microsoft is the finacial one. By not > buying it. By not being lead around by the nose. That is the only message > that they will listen to. > The bottom line is, there is no real reason to have XP (I suppose there is > one or two programs that require XP), that being the case, why buy it? > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:29 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139328

Microsoft will sure count it as one, Eldred :) -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <ltm58.58323$[email hidden]>, "jlohman" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >> Eldred, you are missing the point here: Chris doesn't care. Bill saidit > >is > >> good, thus it is good. You're just a regular user (a technically > >sophisticated > >> one with networking skills etc.) but you're not supposed to act likeyou > >own the > >> pc. Just buy a Dell/Compaq/Gateway and leave it at that. Smile, behappy. > >Chris > >> is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly. > > > >I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't > >buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thatsanother > >subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you goout > >and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is thefinacial > >one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwisewhy > >should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software. > >Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which iswhat > >this tread started out being). > > I *don't* plan to buy it, as I've stated in another message. However, mydad > wants a new computer, which I *know* will come with XP. I'm SERIOUSLY > considering re-formatting the damn thing when he gets it, and installing > win98se...<g> > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, isthat

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> an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:30 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139329

I agree. But reserve the right to complain about the defective portions of it, such as WPA :) -Larry "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lvy58.517$[email hidden]... > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > I *don't* plan to buy it, as I've stated in another message. However,my > dad > > wants a new computer, which I *know* will come with XP. I'm SERIOUSLY > > considering re-formatting the damn thing when he gets it, and installing > > win98se...<g> > > So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS,is

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> that > > an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > > > Eldred > > If your Dad is a computer neophyte he is much better off with XP IMO. > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:32 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139330

Yeah, it took the guy on TechTV's "TheScreenSavers" all of an hour to get the songs ripped from the so-called unbreakable "Fast and Furious" CD, or whatever the hell it was called. It was funny :) You could tell he wanted to brag about how he did it, but kept his mouth shut in fear of the DMCA. Crap. MORE Censorship, courtesy of the Entertainment Industry. -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <[email hidden]>, Goy Larsen <[email hidden]> writes: > > >It seems to have been dropped now though, Virgin gave it another think, > >but then again, the only 2 CD's released so far that I know of was > >Natalie Imbruglia (who ?) and Westlife (yippe, since I don't own a > >regular stereo, I'll never play their CD by accident should anyone leave > >one around here for some strange and obscure reason, thx Virgin, > >actually I'd like to see more CD's with this copy protection when I > >think about it, ........:-) > > You missed the CDs by Michael Jackson and Incubus. We occasionally get

reports

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> from Sony about our students sharing mp3's from those 2 artists. Yep, the > copy-protected CDs really kept people from making their mp3's... > Bravo, Sony! > <g> > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:33 UTC↳ reply to Marc Fraioli #139331

We're talking MP3 here. Perfect Digital Copies are not a concern... -Larry "Marc Fraioli" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a36p56$p8h$[email hidden]... > In article <[email hidden]>, > [email hidden] (EldredP) writes: > > In article <a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]>, "Steve Levett" > > <[email hidden]> writes: > > > >>You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protectedmusic > >>CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not beingable to > >>play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them. > > > > Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers. I can run a line frommy > > stereo to my computer sound card. Once that's connected, I can make anmp3 of > > ANYTHING I run through the stereo. TV programs, cassette tapes, albums,etc. > > You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3file, if

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> > they have the right equipment... > > Yes, you can do that, but it's not quite the same. You've introduced > noise and such by converting the signal to analog and back to digital > again. If you rip it directly off the CD in the PC's CD drive, this > doesn't happen-- you get a perfect digital copy. And that's what they're > really trying to prevent. > > Nonetheless, I suspect most people would be perfectly satisfied with > the results from your method... > > Marc

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:35 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139332

It wasn't clear _how_ he wrote the CD's. I was just discussing Packet Writing in general as it seemed to fit the symptoms. Another example of software that does Packet Writing that most don't know about. DriveImage creates CD's in packet written format. -Larry "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Fpy58.516$[email hidden]...

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> > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:E4q58.18402$[email hidden]... > > Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his Win98 > > doesn't have the UDF driver installed. > > > > Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where some software > > burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normal > format > > and need help. > > > > -Larry > > You serious? XP uses packet writing even on a CDR? I don't think it is > packet writing because when doing this drag and drop method it writes a

lead > in/lead out just like when you burn cdr with other software. Packetwriting > doesn't do that. > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:36 UTC↳ reply to Uwe Schuerkamp #139333

Hey, you said it first! I want a Royalty Fee! In other words, I agreed 100% in a post about 2 min ago :) -Larry "Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Mon, 28 Jan 2002 21:21:37 -0000, Steve Levett <[email hidden]> wrote: > As opposed to Microsoft, Philips is not a monopoly. MS is. > Customer actions (or non-actions) only work to a certain > extent, and they're next to useless in the face of a monopoly. > > uwe

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:38 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139334

Yeah, but I heard the Dad (I forget his name), was a genuine, prime, grade-A Asshole in real life, and no one on the show could stand to be near the guy between takes :) -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <vey58.514$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> > writes: > > >"Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > >news:yQg58.2180$[email hidden]... > >> Who? > > > >Jan Brady from the Brady Bunch TV show of the early '70's. She would have > >days where nothing went right. > > I always liked her better than Marsha anyway...<g> > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:43 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139336

I hear WinXP can't read DirectCD burnt discs either... I've always avoided that crashware like the plague, so I can't test myself. -Larry "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fny58.515$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:3Gh58.87924$%[email hidden]... > > As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW than > anyone, > > but dug out some information for you. A good starting point is > > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a

pretty > > good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2). > > There are also a couple other interesting links on that page. > > OK, thx for the info. I'm reading that web page now. But I don't think my > problem is any of the below stuff you posted. I have a Ricoh MP7120A which > is one of the better cdrw drives and it can burn/read any format,including > RAW mode. This is WinXP specific and the file format it is using. They are > perfectly readable under XP, but not Win98. My guess is that Win98 needs a > certain file(s) so it can read the cd's burned in XP. Which is morebollocks > from XP because I've burned cd's in Win98 and they are readable on anyother > computer.I can burn with CloneCD (raw mode) in XP and they are readable on > any computer. The problem only happens when using XP's built in software. > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:43 UTC↳ reply to Dave Henrie #139337

Adaptec/Roxio. Ain't that a gag... -Larry "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6yy58.3593$9U4.7415@rwcrnsc54... > > "Aguirre" > . The problem only happens when using XP's built in software. > > > I would suspect they included a pared-down cd burner to get after thefact > sales. Probably part of an agreement with whomever coded the XP cdburner. > dave henrie > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 29 Jan 2002 19:44 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139338

Isn't it funny that Ghost used to be a Shareware package :) -Larry "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jEy58.520$[email hidden]...

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> > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]... > > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > > > Drive Image isn't cheap either. Cheaper than Norton Ghost though. > >

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 19:57 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139141

> While in theory your method would work, it does not work when dealing witha > Monopoly. > > Which is the worst part about a Monopoly. Voting with one's wallet is nota > concern to them. And complaining in a newsgroup that Microsoft probably doesn't even know about, much less cares about is going to make a difference? It is the only choice we have. There is no reason to go to XP, why give them money and support them? Espically if there is no reason to have it. A couple of years ago Intel had the identification built in the the P3. It upset many people, many people did not buy a P3 because of that. When they introduced the P4, they made sure everyone knew it did not have the identification code in it. Although Intel is not a Monopoly, they are close to a monopoly. It seemed to make a difference to Intel. Let me ask you this, if everyone stopped buying XP, and stuck with 98, ME, or 2000, which will still run almost everything you want to run, what would happen to Microsofts profits? Espically with the Xbox (which is costing Microsoft an arm and a leg). I think not buying it, can, and will make a difference. It already has made a difference, there profits where down. They did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in recent time.

Mitch_A 29 Jan 2002 21:11 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139155

"You need to research your false claims *prior* to spewing forth :) > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in > recent time. > >

Chris H. 29 Jan 2002 21:29 UTC↳ reply to Mitch_A #139159

Not to argue the point, but figures can all be in the point of view. ZDNet reported shortly about disappointing sales after the launch, decrying that "only about 300,000" copies sold in the first few days. Other sources, including MSNBC, noted a second-month sales decrease of about 150,000 copies in November compared to second-month Win98 or Win98SE sales. Oh, the poor babies. Only 650-750,000 copies sold from October 25 through December 1. So much is based on "knowledgeable industry sources' expectations" perceive should happen. When it doesn't, whatever the item is turns out to be a flop. It isn't their projection that's wrong. I wouldn't mind three-quarters of a million of something selling. 8-) -- Chris H. "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:7eE58.40020$[email hidden]... > "You need to research your false claims *prior* to spewing forth :) > > > > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in > > recent time.

Tim Miser 29 Jan 2002 21:29 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139157

Geez Larry, you sound like my wife! No...Just because I didn't say you look skinny doesn't mean I think you are fat! "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:xn458.14436$[email hidden]...

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> Mitch, > > So I am a 'Spammer', because I posted an OT that someone else might find > useful? > > You have NO idea what the term SPAM means, that's obvious. > > -Larry >

Ronald Stoehr 29 Jan 2002 21:39 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139165

jlohman wrote:

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> > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make on > > > MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > > > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't like > it, > > then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. > > That's the reason why I haven't bought it. It's nice to confirm that my > suspensions where correct.

^^^^^^^^^^^ Hey, that's the first almost-on-topic-post in this thread? ;^) Just kidding, this thread is very interesting... -- l8er ronny Your mouse has moved. Windows must be restarted for the change to take effect. Reboot now?

Goy Larsen 29 Jan 2002 22:33 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139172

"Chris H." wrote: > > Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the > consumer into using just their product and their support? A user can order > a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying > hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, build your > own if you have the knowledge to do so. Depends, as an OEM manufacturer you *can* choose to supply the OS on a CD instead of doing the recovery CD thing, but the cost is a fair bit higher, and with the low profit margin amongst OEM manufacturers, that is really not an option in most cases We offer it as an extra cost option if the customer asks for it Beers and cheers (uncle) Goy http://www.theuspits.com http://www.teammirage.com "A woman is an occasional pleasure but a cigar is always a smoke" --Groucho Marx--

Milhouse 29 Jan 2002 23:13 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139178

I never have liked XP's integraded CD-writing...it's kinda nifty but I'll take Nero 5.5 ANY day. Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fny58.515$[email hidden]...

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Milhouse 29 Jan 2002 23:17 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139180

You really want something to tinker with? Go download Linux. ;) "It's only free if you work for nothing..." Milhouse "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:XIy58.522$[email hidden]...

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> > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:e3l58.12749$[email hidden]... > > Well, then you spoke with your dollars and decided that WPA obviously > wasn't > > that bad at the time. > > > > Not really, initially I swore I wouldn't buy XP, then one day I was bored > and wanted something to tinker with so I bought a copy of XP. Doesn't mean

I > can't make my opinion known though and doesn't mean I am going to staywith > it either. > >

jlohman 29 Jan 2002 23:39 UTC↳ reply to Mitch_A #139181

"> "You need to research your false claims *prior* to spewing forth :) > > > > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in > > recent time. I don't know why I bothered to look it up, your reply totally convinced me I was wrong. But here it is anyway. http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1106-802522.html

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:20 UTC↳ reply to jon #139104

You will.... "jon " <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a3133h$4te$[email hidden]...

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> Agreed!! I Won't run it!! > > Richard Walker <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In message <TLP48.141564$[email hidden]> > > "Blake" <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > > When did Microsoft become an authority in how many changes I can make

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> > > MY system?? WTF is that lame crap! > > > > When you agreed to the 'end user license agreement'. If you don't like > it, > > then don't run the software. It's perfectly simple. > > > > > > -- > > Richard. > > > > "And he never shows his feelings, But the fool on the hill." > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:34 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139107

The problem is...you really are not sure of what the customer wants, unless you take a survey, or at worst look at a genereal study of computer users, not just those that say they are having a problem. One problem with an open environment like this is that people do not understand that if one person is having a problem, 900 people may not be having a problem. I've been running a version of XP since mid-June (RC-1) and haven't had any problems. Chris stated that the activiation problem SHOULD not have happened, backing it up with the best thing Microsoft ever did, the knowledge base website. Therefore, it was a bug that caused this whole discussion...Just FYI, this isn't all directed at you, I'd just rather get it out as one semi-big message then a lot of tiny messages. -Stuart Becktell "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Ck258.387$[email hidden]...

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> > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:_eW48.60111$%[email hidden]... > > Just do what has been suggested: Don't buy Windows XP. Don't install > > Windows XP. I haven't seen anyone among my friends twist anyone's arms > and > > force them into buying XP. > > Yea, yea, I should have stopped supporting the software monkeys at MS and > just stuck with Dos right? What ever happened to giving the customer what > they want? The fact is if I want to continue being a gamer and buying

future > games I will be railroaded into having to use XP and XP compatiblehardware > so don't tell me I have a choice, because I don't. Look, I like lots of > things about XP but this activation crap really sucks so telling me not to > use it if I don't like it is just an arrogant stance coming from a bunchof > Micorsoft brown noser's. And don't even get me started on the spyware, > Passport and forced loading of messenger on XP. > > > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:39 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139110

What is packet writing? That just sounds wierd, not stating that you are wrong (...already know you can't be too cautious in RAS, lol) it just seems wierd to use a completely different model designed for networks to write information to a non-network component on a computer. -Stuart Becktell "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SPC58.21877$[email hidden]...

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> It wasn't clear _how_ he wrote the CD's. I was just discussing Packet > Writing in general as it seemed to fit the symptoms. > > Another example of software that does Packet Writing that most don't know > about. DriveImage creates CD's in packet written format. > > -Larry > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:Fpy58.516$[email hidden]... > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:E4q58.18402$[email hidden]... > > > Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his

Win98 > > > doesn't have the UDF driver installed. > > > > > > Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where somesoftware

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> > > burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normal > > format > > > and need help. > > > > > > -Larry > > > > You serious? XP uses packet writing even on a CDR? I don't think it is > > packet writing because when doing this drag and drop method it writes a > lead > > in/lead out just like when you burn cdr with other software. Packet > writing > > doesn't do that. > > > > > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:41 UTC↳ reply to Dave Henrie #139111

You get what you pay for, I'll never use the included CD writing tool in XP, just like I won't use the included defragmenter (the full version of diskeeper is SO MUCH better.) -Stuart Becktell "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6yy58.3593$9U4.7415@rwcrnsc54... > > "Aguirre" > . The problem only happens when using XP's built in software. > > > I would suspect they included a pared-down cd burner to get after thefact > sales. Probably part of an agreement with whomever coded the XP cdburner. > dave henrie > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:44 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139112

Just for a general FYI, I got a full version of XP home with my Dell notebook. -Stuart Becktell "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:AFC58.21647$[email hidden]... > No, Chris. > > Since, I believe January of 2000, Microsoft has pressured OEM's to NOT > provide full Windows CD's with their computers. > > From what I understand, the OEM's absolutely HATE the idea, but you knowhow

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> that goes. Can't risk pissing off the Mothership. Might start getting > late/short deliveries and what... > > It's definetely a MS thing, not an OEM thing. > > -Larry > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:YZq58.178999$[email hidden]... > > Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the > > consumer into using just their product and their support? A user can > order > > a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying > > hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, build

your

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> > own if you have the knowledge to do so. > > -- > > Chris H. > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:49q58.18410$[email hidden]... > > > What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed out

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> > > their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's. > > > > > > Another fine Microsoft idea :( > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:tzi58.81776$[email hidden]... > > > > I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using > Safe > > > Mode > > > > without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believe > it'll > > > let > > > > you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive. > > > > > > > > - Chris H. > > > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > > > > > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before > > services > > > > even > > > > > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet

because > > the > > > > NIC > > > > > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > > > > > > > > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, andpermit

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> > you > > > to > > > > > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't > held > > > > > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > > > > > > > > > Oh, well :) > > > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:46 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139113

Thats fairly common in large corporations. Where I work continualy sells Oki printers to Xerox. A huge rule at Xerox is that they have ONLY Xerox printers on site. They also have to buy Xerox printers from us, because it is to hard for them to get them for free. -Stuart Becktell "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:tuh58.17290$[email hidden]... > It's frightening that Microsoft doesn't even know what they, themselves,are

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> doing with the data they collect! > > Man, I can't wait to see the bloopers that crop up with .NET. It will be > epic, truly epic. > > -Larry > > "Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:a33pfr$15bhqu$[email hidden]... > > http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,18423,00.html Is this the

real > > reason MS want all our info. I'm think it is and the passport systemjust

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> > proves it to me. Maybe they are collecting info for a rent system in the > > future. > > > > -- > > > > Steve Levett > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:9u458.14468$[email hidden]... > > > Chris, > > > > > > I'm afraid that doesn't jive with what happened to me. > > > > > > I didn't even remove the card. I didn't evem MOVE the card. I simply > > > removed it's entry from the device manager so that Windows would > reinstall > > > the driver at the next restart. > > > > > > That suggests that alterations in SOFTWARE can also trigger WPA, and > that > > > sucks. > > > > > > Though I appreciate your input, there is NO excuse for Microsoft's > digital > > > leash known as WPA. > > > > > > What if I had been working on a time-sensitive deliverable? Would > > Microsoft > > > have refunded me the money lost due to this defect in their product?

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> > > course, the answer is no... > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > > > Eldred: As long as you're shifting the same items around, you

really > > > should > > > > have no problem. Adding new things, perceived by Windows XP as > > "changes," > > > > to the mix results in a different "hash" being created. Once the > > > threshold > > > > as described at http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm is exceeded, thiswould

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> > > force > > > > a free telephone call. > > > > > > > > There's a pretty good 10-item list on that site which describes what > is > > > > tracked and the method used. There are also a few suggestions for > those > > > who > > > > do change hardware quite often. People have even changed out the > > > > motherboard, for instance, without triggering a new activation. > > > > > > > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff

you're > > > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions, > yet > > I > > > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you isan

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> > > > unwarranted attack. > > > > > > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what > > > version > > > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not only > inaccurate, > > > but > > > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available

off > > the > > > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which I > received > > > for > > > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean onthis

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> > > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs > > > afterward. > > > > -- > > > > Chris H. > > > > Microsoft MVP - Windows XP > > > > Associate Expert > > > > Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:48 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139114

I just wanted you (and everyone else) to know how extremely HELPFUL you have been throughtout this. I came in a couple days late, but all the links and all that you put in are just amazing. -Stuart Becktell "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Lji58.81499$[email hidden]... > Would you like to see the receipt, Jens? It was $194.99 at the local > Staples, plus 5% tax here, for $204.74 total. Activated after I installed > it and fed the ICS wizard information on my DSL connection. > > BTW, I'm not pushing sales of any product. In fact, I've only said to NOT > purchase anything if someone is happy with their system. I've never saidto > go buy anything - that's all your own idea. Do we run out and buy all the > new cars the automobile manufacturers advertise every year? Not whenwe're > happy with what we've got, which in my case happens to be two '95vehicles,

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> one which we bought used. > > I've got two machines here which will never see XP installed, because > they're running other operating systems just fine and upgrading isn't > necessary for their purpose. Just like other people, money counts. > > Now if GPL 2 came out at the local store, I would have to convince my Wife > that I just couldn't live without it. 8-) > > - Chris H. > > "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:FYg58.2187$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > news:AG158.153796$[email hidden]... > > > Jens: I do care, otherwise I wouldn't be putting up with stuff you're > > > stating. I haven't seen you jump in here with helpful suggestions,

yet > I > > > voluntarily try to assist people and all that is coming from you is an > > > unwarranted attack. > > > > > I believe I have done much more to help people her in r.a.s than youhave. > > Unwarranted attack? You are lying through your teeth using outrageousspin > to > > sell the product. So the attack is warranted. > > > > > Since you don't know me, your accusations and telling the world what > version > > > I own or anything else about what I think or do is not onlyinaccurate, > but > > > untruthful. I own Windows XP Pro, retail final version, available off > the > > > shelf at your local computer store. I also have a copy which Ireceived

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> for > > > beta testing the product for nearly a year. I installed clean on this > > > desktop using XP to format to NTFS, and added my normal programs > afterward. > > > -- > > > > Funny, you never said that you bought it. Thus you received it from MS. > And as > > you are a self-appointed expert et al, they presumably gave it to you > without > > activation required. I noticed you didn't mention activating your XP. > You're > > spinning so fast, you could be a DVD player. > > > > I think it is time I invoked Eldred's rule. > > > > > > > >

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:51 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139116

and those damn notebooks...so easy to find components to make your own... "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> > writes: > > > > >EldredP wrote: > >> > >> So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS,

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> >that > >> an implicit approval of said OS installed therein? > > > > > >Sure. M$ got their money for another copy of XP didn't they? Cmon > >Eldred, I know you possess the abilities to build one on your own. Make > >it YOUR way! <g> > > > > I *did* build my own, and I've very happy with it. I was talking about a > system for my dad...<g> He wants all the bells and whistles of a couple

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> packages he saw on TV...<sigh> I can't match those prices with a homemade > system. > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Stuart Becktell 30 Jan 2002 02:53 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139117

Question, why do you have two servers at your house? File and print? -Stuart Becktell "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:xqh58.17286$[email hidden]... > Well, I don't know about Bye-Bye Microsoft. That's a bit too tough > especially since I make a decent living supporting PC's and MS products,but > that doesn't mean some stuff can't be 'offloaded' from Windows. > > I have one of the new LCD iMac's on order. The one with the DVD burnerand > other goodies. I intend on offloading as much personal stuff as I can to > this machine and the really superb MacOS X. > > I have 4 PC's (including two servers) running at home that will continueto

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> do so for work purposes and sim racing. > > All of my 'Digital Media' stuff and home computing will move to the iMac. > > This is actually kind of funny, but guess what was the first software > package I bought? Yep. Microsoft Office v.X. LOL! Ya can't truly win, > can you :) > > -Larry > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:qH958.435$[email hidden]... > > > > "jon " <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:a32fp4$t4j$[email hidden]... > > > This is what I wonder about. I have done reinstalls of 98 and 2000 on > two > > > computers, one of them a dual boot system. Now what happens to the > product > > > activation if I buy xp, and 3 years from now MS decides they no longer > > offer > > > support for it. Will they release something to bypass activation on it > so > > > users familiar with it can reinstall it, or will you have to buy the > > newest > > > version of windows because you cant get the older copy "activated"? > > > > Chris said to me in another post that if this comes to be then they will > > offer a download that will disable the activation process. He also said

he > > has heard rumours that MS plan to make their OS rentware but isnt'privvy > to > > that info himself, and so have I. Bye-bye Microsoft. > > > > > >

reverend rob 30 Jan 2002 03:39 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139119

concurr the helpfulness, promote. cya, rob "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:T9J58.37018$[email hidden]... > I just wanted you (and everyone else) to know how extremely HELPFUL youhave > been throughtout this. I came in a couple days late, but all the links and > all that you put in are just amazing. > -Stuart Becktell concurr the helpfulness, promote cya, rob

rb.. 30 Jan 2002 03:39 UTC#528876

concurr the helpfulness, promote. cya, rob concurr the helpfulness, promote cya, rob

reverend rob 30 Jan 2002 03:42 UTC↳ reply to reverend rob #139120

but.... the wpa still sux. "rb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:fWJ58.6473$[email hidden]...

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> concurr the helpfulness, > > promote. > > cya, > rob > > > > "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:T9J58.37018$[email hidden]... > > I just wanted you (and everyone else) to know how extremely HELPFUL you > have > > been throughtout this. I came in a couple days late, but all the links

and

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> > all that you put in are just amazing. > > -Stuart Becktell > > concurr the helpfulness, > > promote > > cya, > rob > > >

Don Burnette 30 Jan 2002 03:50 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #139123

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> In article <lvy58.517$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> > writes: > > >If your Dad is a computer neophyte he is much better off with XP IMO. > > > > I considered that too, but I haven't made up my mind yet... > > Eldred > --

XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. Don Burnette

Don Burnette 30 Jan 2002 03:53 UTC↳ reply to Aguirre #139124

"Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:jEy58.520$[email hidden]...

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Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting this clean install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive to another , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly activated copy of XP. Don Burnette

Don Burnette 30 Jan 2002 03:55 UTC↳ reply to jlohman #139125

"jlohman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:%8D58.35075$[email hidden]... > > While in theory your method would work, it does not work when dealingwith > a > > Monopoly. > > > > Which is the worst part about a Monopoly. Voting with one's wallet isnot > a > > concern to them. > > And complaining in a newsgroup that Microsoft probably doesn't even know > about, much less cares about is going to make a difference? > It is the only choice we have. There is no reason to go to XP, why givethem > money and support them? Espically if there is no reason to have it. > A couple of years ago Intel had the identification built in the the P3. It > upset many people, many people did not buy a P3 because of that. When they > introduced the P4, they made sure everyone knew it did not have the > identification code in it. Although Intel is not a Monopoly, they areclose > to a monopoly. It seemed to make a difference to Intel. > Let me ask you this, if everyone stopped buying XP, and stuck with 98, ME, > or 2000, which will still run almost everything you want to run, whatwould > happen to Microsofts profits? Espically with the Xbox (which is costing > Microsoft an arm and a leg). I think not buying it, can, and will make a > difference. It already has made a difference, there profits where down.They > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in > recent time. > Hmm, that's just opposite of what I have been hearing, I thought XP's sales were way above and beyond what they had anticipated. Don Burnette

Asbjørn Bjørnstad 30 Jan 2002 04:02 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139129

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. -- -asbjxrn

Don Burnette 30 Jan 2002 04:09 UTC↳ reply to Asbjørn Bjørnstad #139131

"Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. > > How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. > -- > -asbjxrn

Ok, let me clarify my above statement - it is an opinion, an opinion I formed after doing much reading on XP, then installing it on my system on 12/24. My experience with XP to date has been very, very good. It's an incredible OS, with a lot more depth than previous win9x series. It's a pretty substantial step up from the win9x os. Again, my opinion based on my experience, everyone's mileage may vary. I think it's a no brainer with a "new" system. Folks looking to upgrade need to read up some, check their compatiblity, and if they want the best out of it be willing to reformat and do a fresh install. Don Burnette

Dave Henrie 30 Jan 2002 04:15 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139134

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:zlK58.19267$[email hidden]...

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> > "Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. > > > > How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. > > -- > > -asbjxrn > > Ok, let me clarify my above statement - it is an opinion, an opinion I > formed after doing much reading on XP, then installing it on my system on > 12/24. > My experience with XP to date has been very, very good. It's an

incredible > OS, with a lot more depth than previous win9x series. It's a pretty > substantial step up from the win9x os. > Again, my opinion based on my experience, everyone's mileage may vary. I > think it's a no brainer with a "new" system. Folks looking to upgrade need > to read up some, check their compatiblity, and if they want the best outof > it be willing to reformat and do a fresh install. > > Don Burnette > I LOVE being a broken record. Just for my info...did your sims NOT run before you got xp???? dave henrie

Don Burnette 30 Jan 2002 04:31 UTC↳ reply to Dave Henrie #139136

"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lrK58.2576$iY1.11473@rwcrnsc53...

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> > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:zlK58.19267$[email hidden]... > > > > "Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:[email hidden]... > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > > XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. > > > > > > How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. > > > -- > > > -asbjxrn > > > > Ok, let me clarify my above statement - it is an opinion, an opinion I > > formed after doing much reading on XP, then installing it on my system

on > > 12/24. > > My experience with XP to date has been very, very good. It's an > incredible > > OS, with a lot more depth than previous win9x series. It's a pretty > > substantial step up from the win9x os. > > Again, my opinion based on my experience, everyone's mileage may vary.I > > think it's a no brainer with a "new" system. Folks looking to upgradeneed

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> > to read up some, check their compatiblity, and if they want the best out > of > > it be willing to reformat and do a fresh install. > > > > Don Burnette > > > I LOVE being a broken record. Just for my info...did your sims NOT run > before you got xp???? > dave henrie

Nope, they ran. Had some occasional lockups. Didn't mean to sound like a broken record, was just trying to clarify where I was coming from. Don Burnette

mark jeangerard 30 Jan 2002 05:09 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139039

Chris, you can have my signature line. Just copy&paste it into your newsreader. Remember though, only use it in one newsgroup and check in with me every other week. :-) Naturally I posted my message at the top of the thread *before* I read down and found that you had already posted the link you refer to. It answered all my questions. Thanks. -- "Racing! - Science for the action minded." mark "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Hrm58.86479$[email hidden]... > Mark, wish I had your signature line. As for the serious question, when one > installs on a system which isn't connected to the Internet, the toll free > number (regional, around the world) is shown. > > I don't work for anyone. I'm disabled and on permanent Social Security > Disability. I've also run everything from DOS 1.0 until today. I posted > a link to a very good explanation of what goes into the activation count > earlier: http://www.aumha.org/a/wpa.htm > > - Chris H.

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 05:21 UTC↳ reply to reverend rob #139040

Thanks for the kudos, folks. I believe in some circumstances WPA does stink, too. But for the "normal" home user, the route to Windows XP is probably through a new computer they won't even touch again for a couple years. That's my gut feeling. And those who do get a version of XP to upgrade their system are generally pretty savvy users who do a lot of their own hardware upgrading themselves. All of us who have come from the Win9x side, without prior NT or Win2K experience are learning every day. Believe me, I do a lot more research and reading than typing responses to questions. But I get the benefit of learning. -- Chris H. "rb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:lYJ58.6479$[email hidden]... > but.... the wpa still sux. > > > "rb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:fWJ58.6473$[email hidden]... > > concurr the helpfulness, > > > > promote. > > > > cya, > > rob > > > > > > > > "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:T9J58.37018$[email hidden]... > > > I just wanted you (and everyone else) to know how extremely HELPFUL you > > have > > > been throughtout this. I came in a couple days late, but all the links > and > > > all that you put in are just amazing. > > > -Stuart Becktell > > > > concurr the helpfulness, > > > > promote > > > > cya, > > rob > > > > > > > > >

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 05:50 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139041

Packet writing is a term used also in the method by which files are written to CD-R/RW media. A brief explanation is here: http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm . There are many full explanations of "packet writing" available by doing a search for the term at www.google.com. -- Chris H. "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:32J58.36956$[email hidden]... > What is packet writing? That just sounds wierd, not stating that you are > wrong (...already know you can't be too cautious in RAS, lol) it just seems > wierd to use a completely different model designed for networks to write > information to a non-network component on a computer. > -Stuart Becktell

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 06:04 UTC↳ reply to mark jeangerard #139042

Glad you got your questions answered, Mark, and thanks for the offer on the signature. However, I don't like filling out the interstate transportation paperwork, signing all those forms for royalty fees, and dealing with the tax people. I used to use "A life? Where can I download one of those?" but ceased on September 11 because I felt it was made very insignificant. -- Chris H. "Mark Jeangerard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a37v5d$te9$[email hidden]... > Chris, you can have my signature line. Just copy&paste it into your > newsreader. Remember though, only use it in one newsgroup and check in with > me every other week. :-) > > Naturally I posted my message at the top of the thread *before* I read down > and found that you had already posted the link you refer to. It answered all > my questions. Thanks. > > -- > > "Racing! - Science for the action minded." > > mark

Asbjørn Bjørnstad 30 Jan 2002 06:32 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139043

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes:

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> "Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome. > > > > How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. > > Ok, let me clarify my above statement - it is an opinion, an opinion I > formed after doing much reading on XP, then installing it on my system on > 12/24.

I was merely thinking about "awesome stability". When I hear that phrase, I think of Hitatchi Data Systems 9900 series. You put it in the datacentre and power it on. Then it runs and you never power it off again until you throw it out. _Always_ running and available, even through "OS" upgrades etc. It comes with a 100% (Not 99.99%) data availability guarantee. That's awesome. -- -asbjxrn

Uwe Schuerkamp 30 Jan 2002 08:46 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139054

On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 23:17:23 GMT, Milhouse <[email hidden]> wrote: > You really want something to tinker with? > > Go download Linux. ;) > > "It's only free if you work for nothing..." > Is that a new MS slogan we have yet to see in print? I wonder when/if folks will ever grasp the difference between free as in "free beer" and free as in "free speech". ;-) BTW, if you want to make a difference to MS, then yes, go and use Linux. cheers, uwe -- Uwe Schuerkamp //////////////////////////// http://www.schuerkamp.de/ Herford, Germany \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ (52.0N/8.5E) Ever wondered what's wrong with the world? http://bnetwork.com/ PGP Fingerprint: 2E 13 20 22 9A 3F 63 7F 67 6F E9 B1 A8 36 A4 61

Olly Greenfield 30 Jan 2002 10:27 UTC#139057

I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas. It came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old 466 mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an extra half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse correctly, so you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to your first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processor speed feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I would hate to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind that no matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble under windows 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. As far as videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying the great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer compatible with the best pc racing sims. In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the more powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we will likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years to come if ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend to see is that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall are not much better graphically. Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, and likely in the PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of console gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy a Windows pc for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, a Macintosh will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how often I can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM Subject: Re: > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > news:[email hidden]... > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry$The > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of mydata > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to$400 or > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or loseall

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> your > > data. > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > /Jens > > >

Olly Greenfield 30 Jan 2002 10:39 UTC↳ reply to Jens H. Kruuse #139060

> It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). Looks like we are stuck with a PRO Monopoly, PRO Big Business, Pro oil company, Pro Defense weapons industry, consumer unfriendly President. I think bill gates has a friend in the white house. Backed up by a Pro Big Business Congress and Republican majority on the Supreme court, the U.S. consumer ,and the rest of the world for that matter, are pretty much screwed for the next 8 years. "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:LNY48.1768$[email hidden]... > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > news:[email hidden]... > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry$The > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of mydata > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to$400 or > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or loseall

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> your > > data. > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > /Jens > > >

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:22 UTC↳ reply to Steve Levett #139068

"Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:a34fck$15v6ps$[email hidden]... >I wonder if MS will do the same with this activation? If we make enough noise they *might*. But if we all just sit back and take it up the ass then nothing will happen and next time they may try something even worse. Like rentware.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:40 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139069

"Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:aZI58.36916$[email hidden]... > The problem is...you really are not sure of what the customer wants,unless > you take a survey, or at worst look at a genereal study of computer users, > not just those that say they are having a problem. No one wants spyware or their privacy and security compromised. Or are you going to tell me it's ok by you? > One problem with an open environment like this is that people do not > understand that if one person is having a problem, 900 people may not be > having a problem. I've been running a version of XP since mid-June (RC-1) > and haven't had any problems. I wasn't talking about tech problems, I'm talking about *features* that are just an annoyance to everyone. > Chris stated that the activiation problem SHOULD not have happened, > backing it up with the best thing Microsoft ever did, the knowledge base > website. Therefore, it was a bug that caused this whole discussion...Just > FYI, this isn't all directed at you, I'd just rather get it out as one > semi-big message then a lot of tiny messages. Of course it wasn't intentional, but the fact is WPA doesn't always work as advertised so it should have been left out and would have gone a long way to improving customer relations.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:41 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139071

"Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SPC58.21877$[email hidden]...

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OK, but I read that url and XP doesn't do packet writing. You need 3rd party software for that.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:44 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139072

"Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:32J58.36956$[email hidden]... > What is packet writing? That just sounds wierd, not stating that you are > wrong (...already know you can't be too cautious in RAS, lol) it justseems > wierd to use a completely different model designed for networks to write > information to a non-network component on a computer. > -Stuart Becktell Packet writing formats the cdrw and treats it like a slow HD. You can erase and replace files just like on a floppy or HD. You can't do that with CDR. You need cdrw media to do packet writing too. XP doens't do packet writing natively. Packet wiriting is unreliable too so I never use it anymore anyway.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:47 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139074

"Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q3J58.36970$[email hidden]... > You get what you pay for, I'll never use the included CD writing tool inXP, > just like I won't use the included defragmenter (the full version of > diskeeper is SO MUCH better.) What's better about it? If using NTFS in XP you don't need to defragment nearly as much as when using FAT32 so I expect XP's defragmenter is adequate if using NTFS.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:48 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139073

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:6Yy58.184809$[email hidden]... > The burning software in XP is by Roxio. 8-( Guess what they want you to > do? Oh geeze, so it's really Roxio Lite then. :-)

Marc 30 Jan 2002 12:52 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139075

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:P0G58.15018$[email hidden]... > I never have liked XP's integraded CD-writing...it's kinda nifty but I'll > take Nero 5.5 ANY day. I thought it was cool until I ran into this Win98 problem. I use CloneCD for burning duplicate cd's though so no problem there. Used to use Nero but the version I have is drive specific. I could load my Prassi software to overcome the problem so long as it is XP compatible.

Uncle Fester 30 Jan 2002 12:53 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139076

Milhouse wrote:

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> > You really want something to tinker with? > > Go download Linux. ;) > > "It's only free if you work for nothing..." > > Milhouse

At least with Open Source software, if a vendor *were* arrogant enough to add a WPA-like feature, you'd have the power to remove it yourself. Nothing wrong with The People possessing more power! -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:04 UTC↳ reply to Asbjørn Bjørnstad #139077

"Asbjï¿½rn Bjï¿½rnstad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > How do you know? It hasn't been out that long yet. True. I got a corrupted boot sector on XP just a few days ago and couldn't boot into XP or use system restore from the boot menu. Had to run XP cdrom and use the recovery console, after a bit of fishing around found a little prog called "fixboot", ran that and found my boot sector had somehow become corrupted and it wrote a new one. No problems since doing that but I have never had that happen on any OS in the past.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:06 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139078

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UGK58.107102$%[email hidden]... > Nope, they ran. Had some occasional lockups. Didn't mean to sound like a > broken record, was just trying to clarify where I was coming from. > > Don Burnette No, he's the broken record. Anti XP, anti Nvidia.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:08 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #139079

"Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:9fJ58.37061$[email hidden]... > > This is actually kind of funny, but guess what was the first software > > package I bought? Yep. Microsoft Office v.X. LOL! Ya can't trulywin, > > can you :) You can download Sun Systems "Star Office" for free.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:11 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139080

"Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:JYC58.22102$[email hidden]... > Isn't it funny that Ghost used to be a Shareware package :) > > -Larry Yea, I think Ghost is severely overpriced considering it only does one thing.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:12 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139081

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:47K58.101832$[email hidden]... > Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. > I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting thisclean > install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive toanother > , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly > activated copy of XP. > > Don Burnette I should have stuck with FAT32 then I could still be using my *free* copy of Ghost. Oh well, stuck with XP's system restore isn't too bad I guess.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:14 UTC↳ reply to Milhouse #139082

"Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:74G58.15021$[email hidden]... > You really want something to tinker with? > > Go download Linux. ;) I have a copy of Corel Linux on cdrom here but have never installed it because I can't play my games on it too.

Marc 30 Jan 2002 13:17 UTC↳ reply to Uwe Schuerkamp #139083

"Uwe Schuerkamp" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > BTW, if you want to make a difference to MS, then yes, go and > use Linux. I really would like to, but then I won't be able to use my expensive copies of Adobe Photoshop and Pagemaker, not to mention all the games I own too. Also there are no Linux drivers for my ATI R8500.

Dave Henrie 30 Jan 2002 13:47 UTC↳ reply to Marc #139086

"Marc" > > Don Burnette > > No, he's the broken record. Anti XP, anti Nvidia. > Pretty close Marc.... But I like to think I'm more the don't replace(i.e. spend $$) something that was already working. :) --don't replace(i.e. spend $$) something that was already working. :) --don't replace(i.e.spend $$) something that was.... (<bzzrtscrit>) dave henrie

Uncle Fester 30 Jan 2002 14:01 UTC↳ reply to Marc #139088

Marc wrote:

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> > "Milhouse" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:74G58.15021$[email hidden]... > > You really want something to tinker with? > > > > Go download Linux. ;) > > I have a copy of Corel Linux on cdrom here but have never installed it > because I can't play my games on it too.

http://www.mandrakesoft.com/products/81/gaming-edition -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 17:34 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138970

Exactly. 8-) And in some future edition of the OS it'll probably be removed because the licensing has expired, and people will be crying that they're forced to buy a full product. LOL! -- Chris H. "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PTR58.650$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:6Yy58.184809$[email hidden]... > > The burning software in XP is by Roxio. 8-( Guess what they want you to > > do? > > Oh geeze, so it's really Roxio Lite then. :-) > > > >

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 17:40 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138973

System Restore should not equate to "back up" however. It only deals with the condition of the system, allowing the user to retreat to a "better" position. The back up software included in both Home and Pro is more suited to full restoration, even though a third-party program is better at giving the user a full image of the partition. BTW - The back up software is installed by default in Pro, but the user needs to manually install it in Home by going to the Utilities folder on the CD. -- Chris H. "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:FeS58.656$[email hidden]... > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:47K58.101832$[email hidden]... > > Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. > > I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting this > clean > > install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive to > another > > , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly > > activated copy of XP. > > > > Don Burnette > > I should have stuck with FAT32 then I could still be using my *free* copy of > Ghost. Oh well, stuck with XP's system restore isn't too bad I guess. > > >

Chris H. 30 Jan 2002 17:59 UTC↳ reply to Olly Greenfield #138980

Only in an effort to help, Olly, but how much memory does that machine have and is it sharing the memory with the video? To really run nice, a machine should have 256 MB of RAM. Here's a really dandy, step-by-step article on how to optimize XP: http://www.extremetech.com/article/0,3396,s%253D1027%2526a%253D19543,00.asp (URL MAY WRAP!) Some minor little things like disabling fast user switching (if not necessary) and cutting down on some of the visual effects will do a great deal for performance. Remember, too, the OEM has probably installed a whole lot of unnecessary "monitoring" software which runs in the background just in case their techs need to access the machine. -- Chris H. "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas. It > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old 466 > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an extra > half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse correctly, so > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to your > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processor speed > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I would hate > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind that no > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble under windows > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. As far as > videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying the > great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually > migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer > compatible with the best pc racing sims. > In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the more > powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we will > likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years to come if > ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend to see is > that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall are not > much better graphically. > Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, and likely in the > PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of console > gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy a Windows pc > for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video > applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, a Macintosh > will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. > But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how often I > can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM > Subject: Re: > > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > news:[email hidden]... > > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry > $The > > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my > data > > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to > $400 or > > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or lose > all > > your > > > data. > > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > > > /Jens > > > > > > > >

EldredP 30 Jan 2002 19:17 UTC↳ reply to mark jeangerard #138894

In article <a37v5d$te9$[email hidden]>, "Mark Jeangerard" <[email hidden]> writes: >Chris, you can have my signature line. Just copy&paste it into your >newsreader. Remember though, only use it in one newsgroup and check in with >me every other week. :-) LOL! Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 30 Jan 2002 19:17 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #138897

In article <r4K58.106737$%[email hidden]>, "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> writes:

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>"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> In article <lvy58.517$[email hidden]>, "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> >> writes: >> >> >If your Dad is a computer neophyte he is much better off with XP IMO. >> > >> >> I considered that too, but I haven't made up my mind yet... >> >> Eldred >> -- > >XP all the way man, the stability alone is awesome.

You know what? I *just* realized I won't be able to do that. He still uses(writes) Dos BASIC programs. Those won't work in XP, right? Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 30 Jan 2002 19:17 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#138896

In article <jTC58.21956$[email hidden]>, "Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: >Yeah, but I heard the Dad (I forget his name), was a genuine, prime, grade-A >Asshole in real life, and no one on the show could stand to be near the guy >between takes :) Robert Reed. (useless trivia info...<g>) Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Tim Miser 30 Jan 2002 19:24 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #138898

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <jTC58.21956$[email hidden]>, "Larry$The > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > >Yeah, but I heard the Dad (I forget his name), was a genuine, prime,grade-A > >Asshole in real life, and no one on the show could stand to be near theguy > >between takes :) > > Robert Reed. (useless trivia info...<g>) > > Eldred > -- Died of Aids. (more useless trivia!)

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 19:59 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #138904

That's good news. You know, Dell just might be the one PC maker that doesn't have to worry about pissing off Microsoft :) Or, it might be because that copy is forever locked to your computer and can't even be MOVED to a different machine (OEM copies are not transferrable to a different machine). There's a reason for it. It sure ain't out of goodness :) -Larry "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:D6J58.36992$[email hidden]...

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> Just for a general FYI, I got a full version of XP home with my Dell > notebook. > -Stuart Becktell > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:AFC58.21647$[email hidden]... > > No, Chris. > > > > Since, I believe January of 2000, Microsoft has pressured OEM's to NOT > > provide full Windows CD's with their computers. > > > > From what I understand, the OEM's absolutely HATE the idea, but you know > how > > that goes. Can't risk pissing off the Mothership. Might start getting > > late/short deliveries and what... > > > > It's definetely a MS thing, not an OEM thing. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:YZq58.178999$[email hidden]... > > > Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the > > > consumer into using just their product and their support? A user can > > order > > > a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying > > > hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, build > your > > > own if you have the knowledge to do so. > > > -- > > > Chris H. > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:49q58.18410$[email hidden]... > > > > What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed

out

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> of > > > > their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's. > > > > > > > > Another fine Microsoft idea :( > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > news:tzi58.81776$[email hidden]... > > > > > I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using > > Safe > > > > Mode > > > > > without Internet enabled. I haven't had to do that, but I believe > > it'll > > > > let > > > > > you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard

drive.

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> > > > > > > > > > - Chris H. > > > > > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > > > news:zeh58.17267$[email hidden]... > > > > > > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before > > > services > > > > > even > > > > > > launch. That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet > because > > > the > > > > > NIC > > > > > > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and > permit > > > you > > > > to > > > > > > COPY files to another medium. At least that way your data isn't > > held > > > > > > hostage. That really pissed me off more than anything else. > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh, well :) > > > > > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:04 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#138906

LOL! At this rate, the new iMac might actually out-sell Windows XP :) -Larry "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:AuE58.188509$[email hidden]... > Not to argue the point, but figures can all be in the point of view.ZDNet > reported shortly about disappointing sales after the launch, decrying that > "only about 300,000" copies sold in the first few days. Other sources, > including MSNBC, noted a second-month sales decrease of about 150,000copies > in November compared to second-month Win98 or Win98SE sales. Oh, the poor > babies. Only 650-750,000 copies sold from October 25 through December 1. > > So much is based on "knowledgeable industry sources' expectations"perceive

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> should happen. When it doesn't, whatever the item is turns out to be a > flop. It isn't their projection that's wrong. I wouldn't mind > three-quarters of a million of something selling. 8-) > -- > Chris H. > > "Mitch Alatorre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:7eE58.40020$[email hidden]... > > "You need to research your false claims *prior* to spewing forth :) > > > > > > > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > > > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system

in > > > recent time. > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:07 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #138910

Don, It depends on where the numbers come from. If the factory drops a copy on the floor and it falls down in a crack in the concrete, Microsoft counts it as a moved license :) Then, there's re-shelving. While it might be possible to figure out how many copies a store sells, it's impossible to know how many to subtract because of the one's that were shelved after an initial trial period. One thing is for certain. It's fairly easy to say the actual number of in-use copies is FAR less than what Microsoft reports as sales. -Larry "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:89K58.19116$[email hidden]...

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> > "jlohman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:%8D58.35075$[email hidden]... > > > While in theory your method would work, it does not work when dealing > with > > a > > > Monopoly. > > > > > > Which is the worst part about a Monopoly. Voting with one's wallet is > not > > a > > > concern to them. > > > > And complaining in a newsgroup that Microsoft probably doesn't even know > > about, much less cares about is going to make a difference? > > It is the only choice we have. There is no reason to go to XP, why give > them > > money and support them? Espically if there is no reason to have it. > > A couple of years ago Intel had the identification built in the the P3.

It > > upset many people, many people did not buy a P3 because of that. Whenthey > > introduced the P4, they made sure everyone knew it did not have the > > identification code in it. Although Intel is not a Monopoly, they are > close > > to a monopoly. It seemed to make a difference to Intel. > > Let me ask you this, if everyone stopped buying XP, and stuck with 98,ME,

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> > or 2000, which will still run almost everything you want to run, what > would > > happen to Microsofts profits? Espically with the Xbox (which is costing > > Microsoft an arm and a leg). I think not buying it, can, and will make a > > difference. It already has made a difference, there profits where down. > They > > did not sell XP the way they had hoped it would sale (even with the > > commericals). In fact it is their worst launch of a operating system in > > recent time. > > > > Hmm, that's just opposite of what I have been hearing, I thought XP's

sales > were way above and beyond what they had anticipated. > > Don Burnette > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:08 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#138911

see www.activewin.com. There is a news item today that covers an XP update, and this is one of the symptoms it is reported to fix. The last time I checked, the link was dead. It's an XP Pre-SP1 patch, and the Q article says a fix is 'in the works'. -Larry "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:SPC58.21877$[email hidden]...

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Win98 > > > doesn't have the UDF driver installed. > > > > > > Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where somesoftware

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Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:09 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #138912

Internet, Google, Search, One Each. Packet Writing. You'll enjoy the hits :) -Larry "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:32J58.36956$[email hidden]... > What is packet writing? That just sounds wierd, not stating that you are > wrong (...already know you can't be too cautious in RAS, lol) it justseems

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> wierd to use a completely different model designed for networks to write > information to a non-network component on a computer. > -Stuart Becktell > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:SPC58.21877$[email hidden]... > > It wasn't clear _how_ he wrote the CD's. I was just discussing Packet > > Writing in general as it seemed to fit the symptoms. > > > > Another example of software that does Packet Writing that most don't

know

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> > about. DriveImage creates CD's in packet written format. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:Fpy58.516$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:E4q58.18402$[email hidden]... > > > > Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his > Win98 > > > > doesn't have the UDF driver installed. > > > > > > > > Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where some > software > > > > burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normal > > > format > > > > and need help. > > > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > You serious? XP uses packet writing even on a CDR? I don't think it is > > > packet writing because when doing this drag and drop method it writes

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> > lead > > > in/lead out just like when you burn cdr with other software. Packet > > writing > > > doesn't do that. > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:10 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138913

As I said in my original response, it was never indicated HOW the CD's were burned, and I was just trying to cover all the bases. -Larry "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:nNR58.647$[email hidden]...

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> > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:SPC58.21877$[email hidden]... > > It wasn't clear _how_ he wrote the CD's. I was just discussing Packet > > Writing in general as it seemed to fit the symptoms. > > > > Another example of software that does Packet Writing that most don't

know > > about. DriveImage creates CD's in packet written format. > > > > -Larry > > OK, but I read that url and XP doesn't do packet writing. You need 3rdparty > software for that. > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:11 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #138914

Yeah, that's him :) -Larry "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <jTC58.21956$[email hidden]>, "Larry$The > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > >Yeah, but I heard the Dad (I forget his name), was a genuine, prime,grade-A > >Asshole in real life, and no one on the show could stand to be near theguy

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> >between takes :) > > Robert Reed. (useless trivia info...<g>) > > Eldred > -- > Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank - under construction... > > Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats

you > with experience... > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:11 UTC↳ reply to Tim Miser #138915

No shit? I didn't know that... -Larry "Tim Miser" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > In article <jTC58.21956$[email hidden]>, "Larry > $The > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > >Yeah, but I heard the Dad (I forget his name), was a genuine, prime, > grade-A > > >Asshole in real life, and no one on the show could stand to be near the > guy > > >between takes :) > > > > Robert Reed. (useless trivia info...<g>) > > > > Eldred > > -- > > Died of Aids. (more useless trivia!) > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:14 UTC↳ reply to Goy Larsen #138917

This was reported on in the major news bins and on TechTV when it first occured a year or two ago. It IS because MS does not want OEM's to ship full Windows CD's with their systems. I am not privy to the agreements, or what the penalties are, or if it's just a nudge-nudge, your shipment got lost type of thing but it was started by Microsoft. I don't think smaller shops figure into this. It's a beheamoth thing :) -Larry "Goy Larsen" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > "Chris H." wrote: > > > > Isn't that the preference of the OEM? Don't the OEMs want to lock the > > consumer into using just their product and their support? A user canorder > > a machine without an OS and purchase an "OEM" version (with qualifying > > hardware) at a lot of places. Or, like a lot of us have done, buildyour

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> > own if you have the knowledge to do so. > > Depends, as an OEM manufacturer you *can* choose to supply the OS on a > CD instead of doing the recovery CD thing, but the cost is a fair bit > higher, and with the low profit margin amongst OEM manufacturers, that > is really not an option in most cases > > We offer it as an extra cost option if the customer asks for it > > > Beers and cheers > (uncle) Goy > > http://www.theuspits.com > http://www.teammirage.com > > "A woman is an occasional pleasure but a cigar is always a smoke" > --Groucho Marx--

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:18 UTC↳ reply to Stuart Becktell #138918

1. File Server. 2. Internet Gateway/Firewall/Terminal Server/DHCP I'ts a geek thing :) -Larry "Stuart Becktell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:9fJ58.37061$[email hidden]...

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> Question, why do you have two servers at your house? File and print? > -Stuart Becktell > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:xqh58.17286$[email hidden]... > > Well, I don't know about Bye-Bye Microsoft. That's a bit too tough > > especially since I make a decent living supporting PC's and MS products, > but > > that doesn't mean some stuff can't be 'offloaded' from Windows. > > > > I have one of the new LCD iMac's on order. The one with the DVD burner > and > > other goodies. I intend on offloading as much personal stuff as I can

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> > this machine and the really superb MacOS X. > > > > I have 4 PC's (including two servers) running at home that will continue > to > > do so for work purposes and sim racing. > > > > All of my 'Digital Media' stuff and home computing will move to the

iMac. > > > > This is actually kind of funny, but guess what was the first software > > package I bought? Yep. Microsoft Office v.X. LOL! Ya can't trulywin,

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> > can you :) > > > > -Larry > > > > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:qH958.435$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "jon " <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:a32fp4$t4j$[email hidden]... > > > > This is what I wonder about. I have done reinstalls of 98 and 2000

on > > two > > > > computers, one of them a dual boot system. Now what happens to the > > product > > > > activation if I buy xp, and 3 years from now MS decides they nolonger > > > offer > > > > support for it. Will they release something to bypass activation onit > > so > > > > users familiar with it can reinstall it, or will you have to buy the > > > newest > > > > version of windows because you cant get the older copy "activated"? > > > > > > Chris said to me in another post that if this comes to be then theywill > > > offer a download that will disable the activation process. He alsosaid

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> he > > > has heard rumours that MS plan to make their OS rentware but isnt' > privvy > > to > > > that info himself, and so have I. Bye-bye Microsoft. > > > > > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 20:48 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #138924

I create a series of 3 images when I set up a new system. First, I install the OS on a freshly formatted hard drive. I then update any necessary hardware drivers until I have a green board. Then I burn an image called 'base'. Next, I add all standard utilities, apply any updates from Windows Update, and basically everything except for applications. Image is burned, called a 'system restore image'. Next, I install all apps, games, etc... Tweak everything just the way I like it. Burn the final set, called the "I gotta be up and running in 30 minutes or I'm screwed" image. This one is usually 7 or 8 CD's. The reason I do it like this is if I make some changes, I don't have to start from scratch. I just go back to whatever the appropriate level is to accomodate the changes, then re-do any images after that point after the changes are incorporated. I also keep file-based copies on a secondary drive, which is actually what I work from when restoring. It's just one of many possible methods :) -Larry "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:47K58.101832$[email hidden]...

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> > "Aguirre" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:jEy58.520$[email hidden]... > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:eZo58.172603$[email hidden]... > > > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01 > > > > > Drive Image isn't cheap either. Cheaper than Norton Ghost though. > > > > > > Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. > I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting this

clean > install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive toanother

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> , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly > activated copy of XP. > > Don Burnette > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 21:01 UTC↳ reply to Olly Greenfield #138923

Olly, You can speed up XP considerably by turning off most of the Eye Candy. If you want to get further into that, let me know and I'll provide some info or you can search out the many articles on the web. -Larry "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas. It > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old466 > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an extra > half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse correctly,so > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to your > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processorspeed > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I wouldhate > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind that no > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble underwindows > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. As faras

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> videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying the > great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually > migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer > compatible with the best pc racing sims. > In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the more > powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we will > likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years to come if > ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend to see is > that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall are

not > much better graphically. > Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, and likely inthe > PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of console > gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy a Windows pc > for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video > applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, aMacintosh

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> will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. > But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how often I > can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM > Subject: Re: > > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > news:[email hidden]... > > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry > $The > > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my > data > > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation to > $400 or > > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or lose > all > > your > > > data. > > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > > > /Jens > > > > > > > >

Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 21:03 UTC↳ reply to Olly Greenfield #138925

Oh, btw... You'd love doing Graphics on the Mac. It's simply a natural fit. Hard to quantify, but certainly a major difference. When it comes to graphics and drawing, I can't get crap done on a PC. It simply doesn't feel right, or right for the job :) For similar reasons, I don't like doing Database Work on a Mac. In fact, I don't like it in Windows, either. All that clicking and scrolling nonsense is NOT effective for heavy data entry. No, IMHO DOS is the best environment for heavy Database Entry work. It's just you, the fields, the tab key and the data you are entering. Simple, clean, efficient. -Larry "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas. It > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old466 > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an extra > half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse correctly,so > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to your > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processorspeed > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I wouldhate > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind that no > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble underwindows > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. As faras

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Larry (The Other Larry) 30 Jan 2002 21:05 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138926

It's not good enough to be rated 'Lite'. -Larry "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:PTR58.650$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:6Yy58.184809$[email hidden]... > > The burning software in XP is by Roxio. 8-( Guess what they want youto > > do? > > Oh geeze, so it's really Roxio Lite then. :-) > > >

Don Burnette 31 Jan 2002 01:01 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139004

Only thing I don't understand is why they included cd burning capability, but not the capability to back up to a cd burner. With today's technology as it is, and so many folks having burners, I would have thought that would have been a no brainer. Don Burnette "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eeW58.31098$[email hidden]... > System Restore should not equate to "back up" however. It only deals with > the condition of the system, allowing the user to retreat to a "better" > position. The back up software included in both Home and Pro is moresuited

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> to full restoration, even though a third-party program is better at giving > the user a full image of the partition. BTW - The back up software is > installed by default in Pro, but the user needs to manually install it in > Home by going to the Utilities folder on the CD. > -- > Chris H. > > "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:FeS58.656$[email hidden]... > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:47K58.101832$[email hidden]... > > > Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. > > > I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting this > > clean > > > install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive to > > another > > > , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly > > > activated copy of XP. > > > > > > Don Burnette > > > > I should have stuck with FAT32 then I could still be using my *free*

copy

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> of > > Ghost. Oh well, stuck with XP's system restore isn't too bad I guess. > > > > > > > > >

Don Burnette 31 Jan 2002 01:06 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139005

I've seen folks talk about that on the Microsoft groups, it's funny though I have all the eye candy on, system restore on, and indexing on, and my system is going as fast as I could want. Does system restore or indexing service have any effect on gaming? I believe they only operate in idle states correct? Don Burnette "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:gaZ58.60474$[email hidden]... > Olly, > > You can speed up XP considerably by turning off most of the Eye Candy. If > you want to get further into that, let me know and I'll provide some infoor

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> you can search out the many articles on the web. > > -Larry > > "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas.

It > > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old > 466 > > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just > > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes anextra > > half second, making you think that you did not click the mousecorrectly, > so > > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond toyour > > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processor > speed > > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I would > hate > > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind thatno > > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble under > windows > > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either > > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about > > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco > > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. Asfar

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> as > > videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying the > > great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually > > migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer > > compatible with the best pc racing sims. > > In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the more > > powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we

will > > likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years to comeif > > ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend to seeis

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> > that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall are > not > > much better graphically. > > Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, and likely in > the > > PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of console > > gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy a Windows

pc > > for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video > > applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, a > Macintosh > > will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. > > But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how oftenI

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> > can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> > > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry > > $The > > > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my > > data > > > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation

to > > $400 or > > > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, orlose

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> > all > > > your > > > > data. > > > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > > > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > > > > > /Jens > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Chris H. 31 Jan 2002 01:23 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139010

Because they're damned if they do, and damned if they don't. Wouldn't full-fledged CD burning software bring accusations of trying to freeze others out of the market? Oh my gosh, look what they're doing now! They're including free CD burning software. Yet people would complain because it wasn't included, too. (Where's my QuickView?!^&#&) LOL! -- Chris H. "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:%H068.214508$[email hidden]... > Only thing I don't understand is why they included cd burning capability, > but not the capability to back up to a cd burner. > With today's technology as it is, and so many folks having burners, I would > have thought that would have been a no brainer. > > Don Burnette > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eeW58.31098$[email hidden]... > > System Restore should not equate to "back up" however. It only deals with > > the condition of the system, allowing the user to retreat to a "better" > > position. The back up software included in both Home and Pro is more > suited > > to full restoration, even though a third-party program is better at giving > > the user a full image of the partition. BTW - The back up software is > > installed by default in Pro, but the user needs to manually install it in > > Home by going to the Utilities folder on the CD. > > -- > > Chris H. > > > > "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:FeS58.656$[email hidden]... > > > > > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:47K58.101832$[email hidden]... > > > > Yup, bout 60-65 bucks depending where you get it I guess. > > > > I never thought I would need imaging software, but after getting this > > > clean > > > > install of XP and it be so rock solid, I wanted to image my drive to > > > another > > > > , so should something happen I can revert back to my previous freshly > > > > activated copy of XP. > > > > > > > > Don Burnette > > > > > > I should have stuck with FAT32 then I could still be using my *free* > copy > > of > > > Ghost. Oh well, stuck with XP's system restore isn't too bad I guess. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Chris H. 31 Jan 2002 01:28 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #139013

Correct about System Restore, but Indexing is always around when you're changing/moving files. Indexing is one of the things I recommend turning off, because it can only speed up access to files by fractions of a second on relatively fast computers. But, it is always there, waiting for action while it is on. SR, on the other hand, does actually respect waiting for an idle state. My Outlook Express is set to check e-mails every five minutes, and on 24-7, so SR never activates unless I call it into action by installing a program or manually create a Restore Point. -- Chris H. "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:%L068.119590$%[email hidden]... > I've seen folks talk about that on the Microsoft groups, it's funny though I > have all the eye candy on, system restore on, and indexing on, and my system > is going as fast as I could want. > Does system restore or indexing service have any effect on gaming? I believe > they only operate in idle states correct? > > Don Burnette > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:gaZ58.60474$[email hidden]... > > Olly, > > > > You can speed up XP considerably by turning off most of the Eye Candy. If > > you want to get further into that, let me know and I'll provide some info > or > > you can search out the many articles on the web. > > > > -Larry > > > > "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > > > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for christmas. > It > > > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their old > > 466 > > > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at just > > > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an > extra > > > half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse > correctly, > > so > > > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to > your > > > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in processor > > speed > > > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. I would > > hate > > > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mind that > no > > > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble under > > windows > > > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under either > > > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow about > > > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation fiasco > > > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least. As > far > > as > > > videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying the > > > great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually > > > migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer > > > compatible with the best pc racing sims. > > > In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the more > > > powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we > will > > > likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years to come > if > > > ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend to see > is > > > that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall are > > not > > > much better graphically. > > > Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, and likely in > > the > > > PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of console > > > gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy a Windows > pc > > > for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video > > > applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, a > > Macintosh > > > will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. > > > But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how often > I > > > can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> > > > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > > > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM > > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, "Larry > > > $The > > > > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all of my > > > data > > > > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise the activation > to > > > $400 or > > > > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money, or > lose > > > all > > > > your > > > > > data. > > > > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > > > > > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > > > > > > > /Jens > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Don Burnette 31 Jan 2002 01:35 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#139014

Hmm, thanks Chris, I'll turn indexing off and see if I notice any difference. Don Burnette "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:55168.114416$[email hidden]... > Correct about System Restore, but Indexing is always around when you're > changing/moving files. Indexing is one of the things I recommend turning > off, because it can only speed up access to files by fractions of a second > on relatively fast computers. But, it is always there, waiting for action > while it is on. SR, on the other hand, does actually respect waiting foran > idle state. My Outlook Express is set to check e-mails every fiveminutes,

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> and on 24-7, so SR never activates unless I call it into action by > installing a program or manually create a Restore Point. > -- > Chris H. > > "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:%L068.119590$%[email hidden]... > > I've seen folks talk about that on the Microsoft groups, it's funny

though

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> I > > have all the eye candy on, system restore on, and indexing on, and my > system > > is going as fast as I could want. > > Does system restore or indexing service have any effect on gaming? I > believe > > they only operate in idle states correct? > > > > Don Burnette > > > > > > > > > > "Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > news:gaZ58.60474$[email hidden]... > > > Olly, > > > > > > You can speed up XP considerably by turning off most of the Eye Candy. > If > > > you want to get further into that, let me know and I'll provide some > info > > or > > > you can search out the many articles on the web. > > > > > > -Larry > > > > > > "Olly Greenfield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > > > news:_TP58.6864$[email hidden]... > > > > I just bought a new 1 ghz celeron pc for my sisters kids for > christmas. > > It > > > > came with XP, and as nice as XP looks, it is incredibly slow. Their > old > > > 466 > > > > mhz celeron is far faster at all of the basic applications ,or at

just

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> > > > getting windows XP to recognize your mouse clicks sometimes takes an > > extra > > > > half second, making you think that you did not click the mouse > > correctly, > > > so > > > > you start clicking again just about the time it starts to respond to > > your > > > > first mouse clicks. Thus a machine that is twice as fast in

processor > > > speed > > > > feels less like a 1GHZ machine and more like a 300MHZ machine. Iwould > > > hate > > > > to bog my new athlon down with XP, knowing in the back of my mindthat

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> > no > > > > matter how well it ran under XP it would be a bit more nimble under > > > windows > > > > 98 SE. While some applications seem to run about the same under > either > > > > version of windows, windows itself seems really ponderous and slow > about > > > > responding to your commands. This on top of the whole activation > fiasco > > > > makes me unlikely to buy XP for the next couple of years at least.

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> > far > > > as > > > > videogames are concerned I am leaning more and more towards enjoying > the > > > > great pc games that are currently win 98 compatible , and eventually > > > > migrating almost entirely to console games when win 98 is no longer > > > > compatible with the best pc racing sims. > > > > In the console world Sony's PS2 still kicks butt against even the

more > > > > powerful XBOX by microsoft in terms of sales, and that means that we > > will > > > > likely not have a monopoly in the console world for many years tocome > > if > > > > ever.I own both xbox and ps2, and the biggest difference I tend tosee > > is > > > > that the xbox games have greatly superior antialiasing, but overall > are > > > not > > > > much better graphically. > > > > Also, with HDTV compatibility already present in the xbox, andlikely > in > > > the > > > > PS3, PC like resolutions will be available in the near future of > console > > > > gaming. So for me, there will be less and less reason to buy aWindows

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> > pc > > > > for gaming purposes, and as far as graphics applications and video > > > > applications, which is my next most favorite use of a computer, a > > > Macintosh > > > > will do just fine I suspect, even though I have never used a MAC. > > > > But to keep big brother Microsoft from telling me how much or how > often > > I > > > > can change my computer I will buy a MAC and learn to use it. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Jens H. Kruuse" <[email hidden]> > > > > Newsgroups: rec.autos.simulators > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2002 11:47 AM > > > > Subject: Re: > > > > > > > > > > > > > "EldredP" <[email hidden]> skrev i en meddelelse > > > > > news:[email hidden]... > > > > > > In article <O6M48.6388$[email hidden]>, > "Larry > > > > $The > > > > > > Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > > > > > > > > > > > > >Keep in mind that during this whole process MICROSOFT had all

of > my > > > > data > > > > > > >locked up and held hostage by this stupid activation system. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus setting up a scenario where MS decide to raise theactivation > > to > > > > $400 or > > > > > > something, just out of the blue. You'd have to pay the money,or

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> > lose > > > > all > > > > > your > > > > > > data. > > > > > > Sounds like extortion to me... :( > > > > > > > > > > > It isn't. Just ask GWB's "Department of Justice XP"(TM). > > > > > > > > > > /Jens > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Asbjørn Bjørnstad 31 Jan 2002 05:41 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#139038

"Larry $The Other Larry$" <[email hidden]> writes: > For similar reasons, I don't like doing Database Work on a Mac. In fact, I > don't like it in Windows, either. I must agree with you there, here is one of our databases, I'd hate to run it on a Mac... Memory: 6912M real, 107M free, 5165M swap in use, 6705M swap free PID USERNAME THR PRI NICE SIZE RES STATE TIME CPU COMMAND 623 sybase 2 0 0 2006M 1999M cpu/1 505.8H 16.45% dataserver 822 sybase 2 0 0 2006M 1999M cpu/0 300.8H 14.95% dataserver 825 sybase 2 10 0 2006M 1999M cpu/8 311.2H 14.71% dataserver 824 sybase 2 31 0 2006M 1999M cpu/4 311.7H 11.80% dataserver 823 sybase 2 0 0 2006M 1999M cpu/9 306.4H 11.74% dataserver (For those who think 5*1.9 GB is more than 6.5 GB the answer is shared memory.) -- -asbjxrn

Marc 31 Jan 2002 10:46 UTC↳ reply to Larry (The Other Larry)#138850

"Larry (The Other Larry)" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:opY58.60030$[email hidden]... > see www.activewin.com. > > There is a news item today that covers an XP update, and this is one ofthe

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> symptoms it is reported to fix. > > The last time I checked, the link was dead. > > It's an XP Pre-SP1 patch, and the Q article says a fix is 'in the works'. > > -Larry

Ok, thx. The url is working for me.

Marc 31 Jan 2002 10:51 UTC↳ reply to Dave Henrie #138852

"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:iQS58.6335$[email hidden]... > Pretty close Marc.... But I like to think I'm more the don'treplace(i.e. > spend $$) something that was already working. :) > --don't replace(i.e. spend $$) something that was already working. :) > --don't replace(i.e.spend $$) something that was.... (<bzzrtscrit>) > dave henrie Guess I should have stuck with Dos6.2 and my 486 DX2-66 then. :-)

Marc 31 Jan 2002 10:55 UTC↳ reply to EldredP #138853

"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > You know what? I *just* realized I won't be able to do that. He still > uses(writes) Dos BASIC programs. Those won't work in XP, right? >They might. XP has some Dos compatibility. There is a utility in the system32 folder called "forcedos.exe".

Marc 31 Jan 2002 10:58 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#138861

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:eeW58.31098$[email hidden]... > System Restore should not equate to "back up" however. It only deals with > the condition of the system, allowing the user to retreat to a "better" > position. The back up software included in both Home and Pro is moresuited > to full restoration, even though a third-party program is better at giving > the user a full image of the partition. BTW - The back up software is > installed by default in Pro, but the user needs to manually install it in > Home by going to the Utilities folder on the CD. > -- > Chris H. OK thx, but can I backup to cdrom with it? I don't want it taking up more HD space than XP already is with it's bloatware. With Ghost I always burned the image file to cdrom and deleted it from the HD.

Marc 31 Jan 2002 10:59 UTC↳ reply to Don Burnette #138854

"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:%H068.214508$[email hidden]... > Only thing I don't understand is why they included cd burning capability, > but not the capability to back up to a cd burner. > With today's technology as it is, and so many folks having burners, Iwould > have thought that would have been a no brainer. Well, that answers my last questionn to Chris. Guess I won't be using that utility then. Back to Win98 soon and then I can use Ghost again.

Marc 31 Jan 2002 11:04 UTC↳ reply to Uncle Fester #138860

"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Marc wrote: > http://www.mandrakesoft.com/products/81/gaming-edition > Thx, looks interesting. But can I run Photoshop and Pagemaker on it too?

Uncle Fester 31 Jan 2002 14:06 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138869

Marc wrote:

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> > "Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:[email hidden]... > > Marc wrote: > > http://www.mandrakesoft.com/products/81/gaming-edition > > > > Thx, looks interesting. But can I run Photoshop and Pagemaker on it too?

Info on Pagemaker: http://appdb.codeweavers.com/appview.php?appId=329&versionId=483 Info on Photoshop: http://appdb.codeweavers.com/appview.php?appId=17&versionId=86 However, I'll also mention that Photoshop has nothing on The GIMP. http://www.gimp.org And that there are numerous HTML editors available as well. Among the better ones are Bluefish: http://bluefish.openoffice.nl/index.php and Quanta: http://quanta.sourceforge.net/ A good place to look up *Nix apps is FreshMeat: http://freshmeat.net/ Have fun! ;-) -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

Uncle Fester 31 Jan 2002 14:06 UTC#528881

> > [link lost in import: /***-edition] > Thx, looks interesting. But can I run Photoshop and Pagemaker on it too? Info on Pagemaker: http://appdb.codeweavers.com/appview.php?appId=329&versionId=483 Info on Photoshop: http://appdb.codeweavers.com/appview.php?appId=17&versionId=86 However, I'll also mention that Photoshop has nothing on The GIMP. http://www.gimp.org And that there are numerous HTML editors available as well. Among the better ones are Bluefish: http://bluefish.openoffice.nl/index.php http://quanta.sourceforge.net/ good place to look up *Nix apps is FreshMeat: http://freshmeat.net/ Have fun! ;-) -- Fester "Is it that we need a nobrainer Linux desktop OS for people with no brains or should people do a little more reading and smarten up?" from alt.linux.mandrake NG

Dave Henrie 31 Jan 2002 14:27 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138873

> > Guess I should have stuck with Dos6.2 and my 486 DX2-66 then. :-) > If that setup would run the titles you own, then I'd agree. My beeelabored point was/is....pretty much EVERYTHING ran and MOST compatibility issues have been sorted out of the preXP os's. There is no single feature in XP that improves my gaming experience. So spending a pretty big chunk of cash to CHANGE a box that was already working just seems wrong to me...If XP had some whizbang feature or a must have APP that only XP could handle, then I'd probably be already there. But dangit...I boot win98se, I choose a program, it runs. What MORE is there to an os? as for Nvidia....I grew up expecting new drivers about every DX upgrade, the previous drivers worked on everything.. So this musical chairs thing with some driver versions working with titles in group A and some drivers only working with titles in group B etc was very disconcerting. Until the Feds jumped into my bank account I was this "" close to buying a GeForce. I think the 3's and from what I've heard the 4's are amazing pieces of hardware. But this convoluted driver system just has me boggled. dave(stuck in the 90's) henrie

Marc 31 Jan 2002 15:15 UTC↳ reply to Dave Henrie #138876

"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Nvc68.12588$[email hidden]... > If that setup would run the titles you own, then I'd agree. My > beeelabored point was/is....pretty much EVERYTHING ran and MOST > compatibility issues have been sorted out of the preXP os's. There is no > single feature in XP that improves my gaming experience. So spending a > pretty big chunk of cash to CHANGE a box that was already working justseems > wrong to me...If XP had some whizbang feature or a must have APP that only > XP could handle, then I'd probably be already there. But dangit...I boot > win98se, I choose a program, it runs. What MORE is there to an os? The big issue is that it is a protected OS and has much better memory management and is not as prone to crashing as Win98 and yet still runs all your games and apps. OK , a few games have issues on it but not many. But, I hate XP because of it's alck of security out of the box and the activation thingy so I may revert to Win98 soon myself. It is a better OS than Win98 though. Them's the facts. > as for Nvidia....I grew up expecting new drivers about every DX upgrade, > the previous drivers worked on everything.. So this musical chairs thing > with some driver versions working with titles in group A and some drivers > only working with titles in group B etc was very disconcerting. Until the > Feds jumped into my bank account I was this "" close to buying a GeForce.I > think the 3's and from what I've heard the 4's are amazing pieces of > hardware. But this convoluted driver system just has me boggled. > dave(stuck in the 90's) henrie Well, it's much better than a company that doesn't release drivers often enough. ATI, for example. I'm using an R8500 right now and it it wasn't for hacked drivers I would be seriously pissed at my poor purchase decision.

Marc 31 Jan 2002 15:19 UTC↳ reply to Uncle Fester #138877

"Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Have fun! ;-) Thx for the links. I've saved it to disk for future reference. One major issue I have come across with Linux though is that I have an ATI R8500 and the only drivers availalble for that card has no 3D support under Linux, only 2D, and then it's not even accelerated 2D. Kind of a waste of an expensive card to run it on that OS.

Chris H. 31 Jan 2002 16:34 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138887

Some of the information here may be helpful, Marc: http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm You may also find useful information in Help and Support by doing a search for "backup." This can be initiated either by using the Windows interface or from the command line. Personally, I choose the files to be backed up, zip them and then write to CD. But there are many ways of accomplishing the backup, depending on the user preference. -- Chris H. "Marc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Km968.762$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:eeW58.31098$[email hidden]... > > System Restore should not equate to "back up" however. It only deals with > > the condition of the system, allowing the user to retreat to a "better" > > position. The back up software included in both Home and Pro is more > suited > > to full restoration, even though a third-party program is better at giving > > the user a full image of the partition. BTW - The back up software is > > installed by default in Pro, but the user needs to manually install it in > > Home by going to the Utilities folder on the CD. > > -- > > Chris H. > > OK thx, but can I backup to cdrom with it? I don't want it taking up more HD > space than XP already is with it's bloatware. With Ghost I always burned the > image file to cdrom and deleted it from the HD. > > >

EldredP 31 Jan 2002 20:28 UTC↳ reply to Tim Miser #138824

In article <[email hidden]>, "Tim Miser" <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (7 lines)

>> Robert Reed. (useless trivia info...<g>) >> >> Eldred >> -- > >Died of Aids. (more useless trivia!) >

Yeah, I knew that too, but didn't mention it... Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

EldredP 31 Jan 2002 20:28 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138825

In article <kk968.761$[email hidden]>, "Marc" <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (7 lines)

>"EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> You know what? I *just* realized I won't be able to do that. He still >> uses(writes) Dos BASIC programs. Those won't work in XP, right? >> >They might. XP has some Dos compatibility. There is a utility in the >system32 folder called "forcedos.exe".

Great - even MORE shit I have to explain to him... :( Eldred -- Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001 Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank - under construction... Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Marc 01 Feb 2002 10:21 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#138675

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:2me68.214280$[email hidden]... > Some of the information here may be helpful, Marc: > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm > You may also find useful information in Help and Support by doing a search > for "backup." This can be initiated either by using the Windows interface > or from the command line. Personally, I choose the files to be backed up, > zip them and then write to CD. But there are many ways of accomplishingthe > backup, depending on the user preference. > -- > Chris H. Thanks Chris.

Chris H. 01 Feb 2002 15:16 UTC↳ reply to Marc #138754

Hope it helps you. -- Chris H. "Zardoz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:aWt68.1107$[email hidden]... > > "Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:2me68.214280$[email hidden]... > > Some of the information here may be helpful, Marc: > > http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm > > You may also find useful information in Help and Support by doing a search > > for "backup." This can be initiated either by using the Windows interface > > or from the command line. Personally, I choose the files to be backed up, > > zip them and then write to CD. But there are many ways of accomplishing > the > > backup, depending on the user preference. > > -- > > Chris H. > > Thanks Chris. > > >

Marc 01 Feb 2002 17:59 UTC↳ reply to Chris H.#138786

"Chris H." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:sjy68.136787$[email hidden]... > Hope it helps you. > -- > Chris H. Yea, it was informative. Zardoz=Marc :-)

Rec.Autos.Simulators Archive

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

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