GP4 Vs F1 2002

Hi Folks, Here's my views on these two sims. My system is an Athlon XP2100 with a 64Mb Geforce3 and a SBLive sound card. The system has 1Gb of memory and uses both a Sidewinder FF steering wheel and sidewinder FF joystick. OS is win XP Professional. 1. Graphics. GP4's graphics have a 'cartoony' look about them when compared to F1 2002's which look much more realistic. That said, GP4 doesn't seem to suffer from the shimmering effect that F1 2002 does and enables the farther distances to be seen more easily. I think GP4 has the higher/smoother frame rates, although I didn't actually measure this and it was a close call. Speed wise F1 2002 really gives a good impression of speed, whereas GP4 sometimes feels pedestrian in comparison. Both games were ran at 1024x768. GP4 does boast more track detail as well, although the tracks are based on the 2001 tracks and some such as hockenhiem are now significantly different from what they were. GP4's in car cockpit is of the generic variety and I think looks quite gross, although the mirrors are very good (Better than F1 2002). F1 2002 has different cockpits for each manufacturer. Both have dynamic weather, with GP4 winning out on having more realistic looking weather effects. Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 1 2. Handling: I don't know if it's the set-ups or what, but GP4's cars drive on rails. It takes some serious abuse (usually in 1st gear) to get these cars to misbehave. I'm sure this isn't right. I found it far too easy to drive and I wonder if the physics has been dumbed down. I found GP3 to be much more twitchy and generally harder to control. F1's handling can be quite twitchy, but it actually feels right and you get a good impression of being able to 'read' the road with it. GP4 just feels dead by comparison. I don't know if this is to do with the track bumps that F1 2002 creates so well. (GP4's tracks are billiard ball smooth.) Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 2 3. Controller Use: GP4 has some seriously unintuitive controller setup routines. To top this off I can't get it to load my controller preferences by default. There is probably a way to do this but the menu system is truly maze like in complexity. GP4's force feedback is a joke. I get severe judder on engine start and every now and then severe judder whilst driving. This seems to mostly occur under braking and is so bad it actually 'force-feeded' me off the road on several occasions. Strangely, the very thing you expect to produce judders - the curbs - don't! Because of this I've disabled it's FF effects. GP4 also has one other problem (on my system at least), if I have both controllers plugged in (they are USB devices) the game will get as far as loading the track data then crash to desktop with no warning(!) I've tried swapping the 'default' controller in the windows controller panel but this doesn't seem to make any difference. The upshot to this, is that I've got to fiddle around at the back of my PC to pull the joystick and plug in the wheel. F1 2002's controller setup is easy to get going and remembers your previous settings. Force feedback is also well implemented and adds tremendously to the feel of the road. Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 3 4. Sound. I found GP4's sound to be rather weak when compared to F1 2002. It even appears weak compared to it's predecessor GP3. I don't know if it's more realistic, but it doesn't give the impression you've got a big screaming engine behind you. Tire screeches also seem to be absent(!) I don't know whether my settings need looking at, but with F1 2002 it sounds great 'as is' straight out of the box. Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 4 5. Season data. Unfortunately for GP4 it's using 2001 data instead of 2002 like F1 2002. Car data I can live with, but not having the latest track layouts is a real bummer (there have been quite a few circuit revisions), especially as I like to do races on various tracks just before they get televised on Sunday. Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 5 In conclusion I think F1 2002 is by far the better product, I'm not saying Mr. Crammonds software is shit, I'm just saying that it isn't as good and has lost the industry leading edge it once commanded. I'm glad I have both and is interesting to compare them. Hopefully, there will be a fix for the controller problems I'm having in GP4 and hopefully with some car tweaking I might be able to get them to feel a little more livelier. But for the moment F1 2002 reigns supreme. -- Robert Pollard

GP4 felt "on rails" until i went into control setup, turned off the steering assist etc and disable steering help in the game. Also note the default setups are a lot better than the older version so its not as twitchy to drive. Not tried F12002 but i tried 2001 and didnt like it. It felt "arcadey" and seemed more concentrating on an action game than a simulation. They should rename GP4 to GP3 Service Pack 1 though.

> Not tried F12002 but i tried 2001 and didnt like it. It felt "arcadey"and > seemed more concentrating on an action game than a simulation. I must admit, F1 2001 felt a bit that way when I first tried it, but after some perseverence, I soon saw what all of the sim fans were raving about. Once it get's you by the short and curlies, you look back and laugh at the time when you thought Crammond sims were realistic...

hey good call completely agree with you on GP4 I had spend some time just to make sure ALL THE DRIVING AIDS ARE OFF,,,,, GP4 is such a bloody bad layout that you want to pull your hair out just to get IN TO THE OPTIONS Yes, it drives like it is on rails at ACE settings most realistic possible, ( shit there is no custom setting ) COntroller setup is again "hair pulling affair" I cant believe it is soooo difficult to program a simple thing like this !!! Sound card MUST BE EAX off for Creative LIVE cards ( good god , crammond ! it is such a simple thing ) Graphics Framerate is better than F2 2002 ( don't ask why ) but FERRARI is now in orange !!! there is a shine over the cars which you can't turn off it is interferring with the colours 16bit is ALL YOU GET !! "Robert Pollard" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > Hi Folks, > Here's my views on these two sims. My systemis an Athlon XP2100 > with a 64Mb Geforce3 and a SBLive sound card. Thesystem has 1Gb of > memory and uses both a Sidewinder FF steering wheeland sidewinder FF > joystick. OS is win XP Professional. > > 1. Graphics. GP4's graphics have a 'cartoony'look about them > when compared to F1 2002's which look much morerealistic. That said, > GP4 doesn't seem to suffer from the shimmering effectthat F1 2002 does > and enables the farther distances to be seen moreeasily. I think GP4 > has the higher/smoother frame rates, although Ididn't actually measure > this and it was a close call. Speed wise F1 2002really gives a good > impression of speed, whereas GP4 sometimes feelspedestrian in > comparison. Both games were ran at 1024x768. GP4 doesboast more track > detail as well, although the tracks are based on the2001 tracks and > some such as hockenhiem are now significantlydifferent from what they > were. > GP4's in car cockpit is of the genericvariety and I think looks > quite gross, although the mirrors are very good(Better than F1 2002). > F1 2002 has different cockpits for each manufacturer.Both have dynamic > weather, with GP4 winning out on having morerealistic looking weather > effects. > Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 1 > > 2. Handling: I don't know if it's the set-upsor what, but GP4's > cars drive on rails. It takes some serious abuse(usually in 1st gear) > to get these cars to misbehave. I'm sure this isn'tright. I found it > far too easy to drive and I wonder if the physics hasbeen dumbed down. > I found GP3 to be much more twitchy and generallyharder to control. > F1's handling can be quite twitchy, but itactually feels right > and you get a good impression of being able to 'read'the road with it. > GP4 just feels dead by comparison. I don't know ifthis is to do with > the track bumps that F1 2002 creates so well. (GP4'stracks are billiard > ball smooth.) > Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 2 > > 3. Controller Use: GP4 has some seriouslyunintuitive > controller setup routines. To top this off I can'tget it to load my > controller preferences by default. There is probablya way to do this > but the menu system is truly maze like in complexity. > GP4's force feedback is a joke. I get severejudder on engine > start and every now and then severe judder whilstdriving. This seems to > mostly occur under braking and is so bad it actually'force-feeded' me > off the road on several occasions. Strangely, thevery thing you expect > to produce judders - the curbs - don't! Because ofthis I've disabled > it's FF effects. > GP4 also has one other problem (on my systemat least), if I > have both controllers plugged in (they are USBdevices) the game will > get as far as loading the track data then crash todesktop with no > warning(!) I've tried swapping the 'default'controller in the windows > controller panel but this doesn't seem to make anydifference. The > upshot to this, is that I've got to fiddle around atthe back of my PC > to pull the joystick and plug in the wheel. > F1 2002's controller setup is easy to getgoing and remembers > your previous settings. Force feedback is also wellimplemented and adds > tremendously to the feel of the road. > Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 3 > > 4. Sound. I found GP4's sound to be ratherweak when compared to > F1 2002. It even appears weak compared to it'spredecessor GP3. I don't > know if it's more realistic, but it doesn't give theimpression you've > got a big screaming engine behind you. Tire screechesalso seem to be > absent(!) I don't know whether my settings needlooking at, but with F1 > 2002 it sounds great 'as is' straight out of the box. > Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 4 > > 5. Season data. Unfortunately for GP4 it'susing 2001 data > instead of 2002 like F1 2002. Car data I can livewith, but not having > the latest track layouts is a real bummer (there havebeen quite a few > circuit revisions), especially as I like to do raceson various tracks > just before they get televised on Sunday. > Score: GP4: 1 F1 2002: 5 > > In conclusion I think F1 2002 is by far thebetter product, I'm > not saying Mr. Crammonds software is shit, I'm justsaying that it isn't > as good and has lost the industry leading edge itonce commanded. I'm > glad I have both and is interesting to compare them.Hopefully, there > will be a fix for the controller problems I'm havingin GP4 and > hopefully with some car tweaking I might be able toget them to feel a > little more livelier. But for the moment F1 2002reigns supreme. > > -- > Robert Pollard

YEAH ? i disable every damn thing possible only the sensitive zone is enabled it still very DIFFICULT TO SPIN ON TARMAC EXCEPT ON 1ST GEAR. "Richard Whitcombe" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:af5vnk$sds$[email hidden]... > GP4 felt "on rails" until i went into control setup,turned off the steering > assist etc and disable steering help in the game.Also note the default > setups are a lot better than the older version so itsnot as twitchy to > drive. > Not tried F12002 but i tried 2001 and didnt like it.It felt "arcadey" and > seemed more concentrating on an action game than asimulation. > > They should rename GP4 to GP3 Service Pack 1 though. > >

in GP3 I could save during races, an important feature for me! Is this possible in GP4 and/or F12002? Jochen

In article <af6o8t$gc8$[email hidden]>, Jochen Heistermann <[email hidden]> writes >in GP3 I could save during races, an important feature >for me! Is this possible in GP4 and/or F12002? >You can in GP4. -- Sean Black

> They should rename GP4 to GP3 Service Pack 1 though. > I think they should rename GP4 to GP1 Service Pack 3 !

> Huh? F12001 arcadey? Bollocks mate. Even F12001 has the best FFB ever > done in a racing sim and I expect F12002 only improves uipon it. The > physics engine in F12001 is light years ahead of GP3 too. > Each to their own. It felt a lot more like playing an arcade game than driving something. FFB isnt massively essential to the game. Most of the EA games are going more and more arcade based. There is definately up with the F12001 physics engine from when i tried it. Certain things it does arent even possible.

> Sound card MUST BE EAX off for Creative LIVE cards > ( good god , crammond ! it is such a simple thing ) Am I missing something here? I have a Soundblaster Live 5.1 and currently EAX is on.... Will performance improve if I turn it off? (asks hopefully...)

"Jon Silk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:af7k8k$elq$[email hidden]...

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> > Sound card MUST BE EAX off for Creative LIVE cards > > ( good god , crammond ! it is such a simple thing ) > > Am I missing something here? I have a Soundblaster Live 5.1 and currently > EAX is on.... Will performance improve if I turn it off? (asks > hopefully...) > >

Seems like owners of Soundblaster Live gets better performance by turning off hardware accelaration in GP4. My framerates almost doubled after upgrading the soundcard drivers on my Soundblaster 64 PCI. Why these differences I don't know, but it can make a huge difference if you configure this right.

only for those who need 20 tries to finish a race for the championship :) lamer function best forgotten...pause is fine :) Sebastion Melmoth <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Mon, 24 Jun 2002 14:41:17 +0100, Sean Black > <[email hidden]> bleeted: > > > >You can in GP4. > > Yea, but not in F12002. An important feature for me too and one that > no other racing sim besides GP4 has anymore. I may just have to buy > GP4 and put up with it's problems just because it has this feature. I > would like to run full races in N2002 but there is no way I want to > race the complete race in one sitting. A sad omission indeed. > > -- > Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes.

In article <[email hidden]>, "David Powell" <[email hidden]> writes: >only for those who need 20 tries to finish a race for the championship :) >lamer function best forgotten...pause is fine :) Yet *another* argument that has been done to death, and we'll never agree on... :-( Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

I agree. I hope Papy/ISI never ever ever ever add a save function. Being able to save a long race is nothing more than cheating. Jason On Tue, 25 Jun 2002 01:43:05 +0100, "David Powell" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>only for those who need 20 tries to finish a race for the championship :) >lamer function best forgotten...pause is fine :) > >Sebastion Melmoth <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Mon, 24 Jun 2002 14:41:17 +0100, Sean Black >> <[email hidden]> bleeted: >> >> >> >You can in GP4. >> >> Yea, but not in F12002. An important feature for me too and one that >> no other racing sim besides GP4 has anymore. I may just have to buy >> GP4 and put up with it's problems just because it has this feature. I >> would like to run full races in N2002 but there is no way I want to >> race the complete race in one sitting. A sad omission indeed. >> >> -- >> Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes. > >

> Yea, but not in F12002. An important feature for me too and one that > no other racing sim besides GP4 has anymore. I may just have to buy > GP4 and put up with it's problems just because it has this feature. I > would like to run full races in N2002 but there is no way I want to > race the complete race in one sitting. A sad omission indeed. In race save is pretty vital for me. Rarely do i get 2 uninterrupted hours to do an entire race. Pause is one thing but it stops the quick 30 minute race before doing some work/leaving the house/letting someone else use the PC and so on. If i have time i do the races in full in one sitting but the real world interferes too much for me to do that often.

In message <afg5an$btg$[email hidden]>, Richard Whitcombe <[email hidden]> writes

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> > >> Yea, but not in F12002. An important feature for me too and one that >> no other racing sim besides GP4 has anymore. I may just have to buy >> GP4 and put up with it's problems just because it has this feature. I >> would like to run full races in N2002 but there is no way I want to >> race the complete race in one sitting. A sad omission indeed. > >In race save is pretty vital for me. Rarely do i get 2 uninterrupted hours >to do an entire race. Pause is one thing but it stops the quick 30 minute >race before doing some work/leaving the house/letting someone else use the >PC and so on. >If i have time i do the races in full in one sitting but the real world >interferes too much for me to do that often. > >

Pretty vital for me too. It should be an option, if you don't like it then don't use it. -- Sean Black

On Thu, 27 Jun 2002 17:25:57 GMT, [email hidden] (jason moyer) wrote: >I agree. > >I hope Papy/ISI never ever ever ever add a save function. Being able >to save a long race is nothing more than cheating. > >Jason Jason... How is it cheating any more than using the "Pause" feature? In either case, you get to stop racing for a period of time to take care of your "real world" activities, and then go back to racing. Jim Tester

You can save the game then go practice and make adjustments to your setup and make sure they work on your car. Go back to saved game, pit, and make adjustments. Maybe that is what he is talking about. Kerry "Jim Tester" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Thu, 27 Jun 2002 17:25:57 GMT, [email hidden] (jason moyer) > wrote: > > >I agree. > > > >I hope Papy/ISI never ever ever ever add a save function. Being able > >to save a long race is nothing more than cheating. > > > >Jason > > Jason... > > How is it cheating any more than using the "Pause" feature? > > In either case, you get to stop racing for a period of time to take > care of your "real world" activities, and then go back to racing. > > Jim Tester

that would be the end of the world wouldnt it "Kerry Grant" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > You can save the game then go practice and make adjustments to your setup > and make sure they work on your car. Go back to saved game, pit, and make > adjustments. Maybe that is what he is talking about. > > Kerry

"drink" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:CI5T8.577$[email hidden]... > that would be the end of the world wouldnt it > It certainly would be if he was saving and tweeking while driving from OUTSIDE the cockpit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! dave henrie

Dave Henrie <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:g17T8.351571$cQ3.21845@sccrnsc01...

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> > "drink" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:CI5T8.577$[email hidden]... > > that would be the end of the world wouldnt it > > > It certainly would be if he was saving and tweeking while driving from > OUTSIDE the cockpit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > dave henrie >

;o)

In article <[email hidden]>, "Kerry Grant" <[email hidden]> writes: >You can save the game then go practice and make adjustments to your setup >and make sure they work on your car. Go back to saved game, pit, and make >adjustments. Maybe that is what he is talking about. Then why wouldn't you have tested setup changes beforehand? If you have setup skill, you'd ALREADY have your car setup properly... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (jason moyer) writes: >I agree. > >I hope Papy/ISI never ever ever ever add a save function. Being able >to save a long race is nothing more than cheating. I disagree. If the person has a mindset to cheat, then they'll do it. For others who need their computers for other things, there's nothing wrong with a savegame feature. Besides, even if someone DOES cheat, how does it affect US? The savegame feature would only work offline, so who CARES? Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you with experience... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.