Tragic - isnt it?

This week's PC Charts 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft 8 (8)The SimsEA 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame Doug

I would imagine a fair amount of those sold go straight back to the shop the very next day so the results could be misleading.. -- __________ Steve Levett "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]... > This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > Doug > >

That's the way the system works man... Mike http://mikebeauchamp.com "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (23 lines)

> This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > Doug > >

That's the way the system works man... Mike [link lost in import]

Douglas Ellison wrote:

Quoted text (12 lines)

> This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA

Hmmm... cool. I've got 7 of the Top 10. :-) -- Fester

"Steve Levett" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ageksb$kevnt$[email hidden]... > I would imagine a fair amount of those sold go straight back to the shopthe > very next day so the results could be misleading.. I doubt it. Don't take the average concensus of opinion in a diehard newsgroup as a measure. MS

> >Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and >just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > >Doug >No Doug, it's good news it's bringing more people to our hobby and stopping us going the way of flightsims in recent years ie companies not even wanting to release them. Gp4 does some things bloody well ie tracks, weather etc and gives people a very immersive experience. Regards Mike

It proves at least one thing: how small this niche is which you belong to. I'd say: watch out or you go extinct!!! <G> On Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:32:38 +0100, "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (22 lines)

>This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > >Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > >Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and >just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > >Doug >

How long has the sims been in the top ten now? Must be years. BTW I have only two - GTA3 and the Sims. On a similar topic, has anybody else ever managed to get a sim as a Grand Prix driver? Chris "Uncle Fester" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (23 lines)

> Douglas Ellison wrote: > > This week's PC Charts > > > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > > 8 (8)The SimsEA > > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > Hmmm... cool. I've got 7 of the Top 10. :-) > > -- > > Fester > > >

Quoted text (7 lines)

>>Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune >> >>Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and >>just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame >> >>Doug >>

Well at least the US isn't contributing to this :)

I have GP4 and I like it. I will probably get flamed but I think many of the criticisms of it I've seen on this group don't take into account that what with traction control and launch control it's a lot easier to drive F1 cars than it used to be. Shame about the silly black flags tho... But more important, is WSC out, and can someone point me to the site for it. I saw shots of it months ago and it looked sexy then.... "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (23 lines)

> This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > Doug > >

> But more important, is WSC out, and can someone point me to the site forit. > I saw shots of it months ago and it looked sexy then.... www.west-racing.com Theyre counting down to goodwood for a public info release DOug

"Douglas Ellison" wrote... > > <snip> > www.west-racing.com > > > Theyre counting down to goodwood for a public > info release Just checking: this info will be available on the web as well, I presume? -I.e. we won't have to go to Goodwood to find out? Jan. =---

"Jan Verschueren" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:YoFW8.163$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (11 lines)

> "Douglas Ellison" wrote... > > > <snip> > > www.west-racing.com > > > > > > Theyre counting down to goodwood for a public > > info release > > Just checking: this info will be available on the web as well, I > presume? -I.e. we won't have to go to Goodwood to find out? >

Yup -same count down Doug

In article <agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

Quoted text (19 lines)

> This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies and > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > Doug

Hmmm..... wheres F1 2002? Suprised medal of honour is still up there, because that games dump. a few good missions (the beach landing), but too easy and a rubbish ending.

That is a myth that r.a.s. loves to repeat because we have a lot of old timers here who can't let go of the past. Nicki Lauda had a hell of a time trying to drive a new F1 car about six months ago. He was full of confidence beforehand, but wasn't even close to the times of Irvine and De La Rosa. David G Fisher "Jon Silk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agf6q0$8ih$[email hidden]... > I have GP4 and I like it. I will probably get flamed but I think many of > the criticisms of it I've seen on this group don't take into account that > what with traction control and launch control it's a lot easier to driveF1 > cars than it used to be. > > Shame about the silly black flags tho... > > But more important, is WSC out, and can someone point me to the site forit.

Quoted text (22 lines)

> I saw shots of it months ago and it looked sexy then.... > > "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]... > > This week's PC Charts > > > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > > 8 (8)The SimsEA > > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > > > > > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies

and

Quoted text (7 lines)

> > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > > > Doug > > > > > >

Lauda has never driven a car with the amount of downforce of a modern F1 car. If he were 27 and had a chance to do significant testing in a modern F1 car I have a hard time believing he'd have a problem. As it stands, you've got an old former racer driving a car he's never driven before with no frame of reference for how far he can push it without going off. He probably also has significantly more fear of going off than most of the new guys do, since in his day going past the limit meant death (was re: his accident at the nurburgring). Now if you go off you slide over some dirt/gravel and into a tire barrier. Jason On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 19:13:08 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (53 lines)

>That is a myth that r.a.s. loves to repeat because we have a lot of old >timers here who can't let go of the past. > >Nicki Lauda had a hell of a time trying to drive a new F1 car about six >months ago. He was full of confidence beforehand, but wasn't even close to >the times of Irvine and De La Rosa. > >David G Fisher > >"Jon Silk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:agf6q0$8ih$[email hidden]... >> I have GP4 and I like it. I will probably get flamed but I think many of >> the criticisms of it I've seen on this group don't take into account that >> what with traction control and launch control it's a lot easier to drive >F1 >> cars than it used to be. >> >> Shame about the silly black flags tho... >> >> But more important, is WSC out, and can someone point me to the site for >it. >> I saw shots of it months ago and it looked sexy then.... >> >> "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >> news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]... >> > This week's PC Charts >> > >> > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames >> > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 >> > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision >> > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA >> > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA >> > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton >> > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft >> > 8 (8)The SimsEA >> > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos >> > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA >> > >> > >> > >> > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune >> > >> > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies >and >> > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame >> > >> > Doug >> > >> > >> >> > >

>"Mike Blackmore" <[email hidden]> wrote > No Doug, it's good news it's bringing more people to our hobby and > stopping us going the way of flightsims in recent years ie companies > not even wanting to release them. Unfortunately I think we *are* at that level already. -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- http://www.ymenard.8m.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

Tricky manoeuvre, saying that you enjoy GP4 and then trying the diversion tactic of WSC. :) With this new wheel I have configuring it for GP4 only took half the time. I still think the way the menus are set up in GP4 and the utter convoluted way that you have to go about doing things, is a nuisance. GP4 is also a complete system's hog. Driving does seem easy-- though the 112.xxx times at the EA site for Silverstone F1 2002 hot lapping don't appear greatly realistic, either. Have you found the times at Silverstone more realistic with GP4-- in the 118.xxx-121.xxx range? I still enjoy and think that F1 2002 is a much better game and simulator than GP4. Add to that the fact that at least there's some online racing with F1 2002, while with GP4 there is none. Alanb "Jon Silk" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agf6q0$8ih$[email hidden]... > I have GP4 and I like it. I will probably get flamed but I think many of > the criticisms of it I've seen on this group don't take into account that > what with traction control and launch control it's a lot easier to driveF1 > cars than it used to be. > > Shame about the silly black flags tho... > > But more important, is WSC out, and can someone point me to the site forit.

Quoted text (22 lines)

> I saw shots of it months ago and it looked sexy then.... > > "Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]... > > This week's PC Charts > > > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > > 8 (8)The SimsEA > > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > > > > > > > Crammond gets away with another lump of shit - and makes a fortune > > > > Meanwhile, a quality product like WSC will probably sell 10,000 copies

and

Quoted text (7 lines)

> > just about recoop their costs. I think it's a crying shame > > > > Doug > > > > > >

"Alan Bernardo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:DwIW8.450663$352.70446@sccrnsc02... > Tricky manoeuvre, saying that you enjoy GP4 and then trying the diversion > tactic of WSC. :) You can't blame me for trying > GP4 is also a complete system's hog. True...... >Have you found the times at Silverstone more realistic with GP4-- in the118.xxx-121.xxx range? I'm not fast enough to tell yet :(

You can't blame me for trying True...... 118.xxx-121.xxx range? I'm not fast enough to tell yet :(

The Fourth Man <[email hidden]> wrote on 09 Jul 2002: <snip> > There is no way a football stext im (soccer) woul be in > the top ten here. [in Canada] I was quite surprised to see CM 01/02 still in the UK charts, actually - it's been out for months now, and spent ages at number one, so you'd think anyone who wanted it already had it. Maybe people buy extra copies like with GPL ;-) -- Cricket: England 2 Sri Lanka 0 Athletics: Gt Britain & NI European Cup winners Keep those flags up! The GPL Scrapyard: http://www.btinternet.com/~gplscrapyard

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (16 lines)

>Douglas Ellison wrote: >> This week's PC Charts >> >> 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames >> 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 >> 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision >> 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA >> 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA >> 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton >> 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft >> 8 (8)The SimsEA >> 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos >> 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > > >Hmmm... cool. I've got 7 of the Top 10. :-)

Hmm...I only have 2 of them. And they both are The Sims...<g> Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett My .sig file is in the shop for repairs... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

"Douglas Ellison" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:agehkm$l0rnp$[email hidden]...

Quoted text (14 lines)

> This week's PC Charts > > 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames > 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 > 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision > 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA > 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA > 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton > 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft > 8 (8)The SimsEA > 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos > 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA > >

The real tragedy isn't the vaulting of GP4 to the #1 posisiton, don't worry it most likely will fall back quickly, but the huge influence the 'SIMS' are having on sales...the 'sims' and it's offshoots are the Myst of the mid '90s. They are crowding out shelf space, taking sales displays...Wal Mart is a prime example. They have one box of N2k2 and none of F1 2002 nor any Rallye or what could be considered a serious racing sim. Yet they have multiple displays and shelves crammed with the 'Sims.' That is the tragedy that American PC gamers are so narrowly focused. They need to broaden their experience like we have with an open wheel historical RACING title, a couple of open wheel F1 RACING titles and a Nascar RACING title or two(lol) dave henrie

EldredP wrote:

Quoted text (26 lines)

> In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> > writes: > > >>Douglas Ellison wrote: >> >>>This week's PC Charts >>> >>> 1 (N)Grand Prix 4Infogrames >>> 2 (2)Grand Theft Auto 3Take 2 >>> 3 (1)Soldier Of Fortune 2Activision >>> 4 (3)Medal Of Honour: Allied AssaultEA >>> 5 (4)The Sims: On HolidayEA >>> 6 (6)Antivirus 2002Norton >>> 7 (5)Elder Scrolls III: MorrowindUbiSoft >>> 8 (8)The SimsEA >>> 9 (10)Championship Manager 01/02Eidos >>> 10 (9)The Sims: Hot DateEA >> >> >>Hmmm... cool. I've got 7 of the Top 10. :-) > > > Hmm...I only have 2 of them. And they both are The Sims...<g> > > Eldred

Yep, I have all 3 of these Sims titles. I'm sure their "On Holiday" is our "Vacation". My girls really love The Sims. -- Fester

On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 20:32:25 GMT, [email hidden] (jason moyer) wrote: >Lauda has never driven a car with the amount of downforce of a modern >F1 car. That's complete BS and another myth. The early-mid eighties flatbottomed and ground-effect cars(which Lauda also drove) had tons more downforce than today's cars. Today's cars comparatively speaking are much less reliant on downforce than in the eighties. They were pulling 4g's laterally in 1982 already(w/ground effect). In 1984-85 5g's. And that was with much less sticky tyres. Lauda actually said in his interview after his Jaguar test drive that he thought the grip was comparatively much more progressive than the last cars he drove. In his own words(2nd quote earlier interview): "Q: You have talked about what is easier nowadays, can you tell us if anything is harder? NL: The difficult part was getting the balance of the car right - going into the corner I had understeer, and at the corner I had a twitchy car (oversteer). In my time I used slick tyres so the car was glued to the floor, and steady round the corner because of the grip, but now we have grooved tyres and less aero (help) the car changes characteristics quickly until it get to its grippy phase. It is more progressive in terms of speed through corners than it used to be. " -"To be honest, there was no such thing as cornering technique in the ground effect era. �Cornering� was a euphemism for rape practised on the driver. . . When you came into a corner you had to hit the accelerator as hard as you possibly could, build up speed as quickly as possible and, when things became unstuck, bite the bullet and give it even more. In a ground effect car, reaching the limit was synonymous with spinning out."

Quoted text (9 lines)

>If he were 27 and had a chance to do significant testing in a modern >F1 car I have a hard time believing he'd have a problem. As it >stands, you've got an old former racer driving a car he's never driven >before with no frame of reference for how far he can push it without >going off. He probably also has significantly more fear of going off >than most of the new guys do, since in his day going past the limit >meant death (was re: his accident at the nurburgring). Now if you go >off you slide over some dirt/gravel and into a tire barrier. >

He apparently wasn't that scared when he brought home the '84 WDC.

On Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:40:43 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (9 lines)

>> Hmm...I only have 2 of them. And they both are The Sims...<g> >> >> Eldred > > >Yep, I have all 3 of these Sims titles. I'm sure their "On Holiday" is >our "Vacation". My girls really love The Sims. > >Fester

Yup, the Sims is a nice game for young girls. I wonder what the hell Eldred is doing with the Sims though :) Andre

Andre Warringa wrote:

Quoted text (17 lines)

> On Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:40:43 GMT, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >>>Hmm...I only have 2 of them. And they both are The Sims...<g> >>> >>>Eldred >> >> >>Yep, I have all 3 of these Sims titles. I'm sure their "On Holiday" is >>our "Vacation". My girls really love The Sims. >> >>Fester > > > Yup, the Sims is a nice game for young girls. > I wonder what the hell Eldred is doing with the Sims though :)

Trying to pick up young girls? :-P -- Fester

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes: >> Yup, the Sims is a nice game for young girls. >> I wonder what the hell Eldred is doing with the Sims though :) > > >Trying to pick up young girls? :-P Hmm...how old is your daughter now...? KIDDING, Chuck - kidding! :-) Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett My .sig file is in the shop for repairs... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] (Andre Warringa) writes:

Quoted text (8 lines)

>>Yep, I have all 3 of these Sims titles. I'm sure their "On Holiday" is >>our "Vacation". My girls really love The Sims. >> >>Fester > >Yup, the Sims is a nice game for young girls. >I wonder what the hell Eldred is doing with the Sims though :) >

Curiosity, I guess. Creating and micro-managing a family isn't much different from creating and micro-managing a civilization... Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett My .sig file is in the shop for repairs... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

On 12 Jul 2002 23:09:06 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) wrote: >Curiosity, I guess. Creating and micro-managing a family isn't much different >from creating and micro-managing a civilization... > >Eldred True, but the real life version of the Sims has way more features and is much more interesting.. why the hell simulate it on a computer?? Andre

EldredP wrote:

Quoted text (16 lines)

> In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> > writes: > > >>>Yup, the Sims is a nice game for young girls. >>>I wonder what the hell Eldred is doing with the Sims though :) >> >> >>Trying to pick up young girls? :-P > > > Hmm...how old is your daughter now...? > > KIDDING, Chuck - kidding! :-) > > Eldred

Hey honey... did you see where I left the goat's nut snips at? ;-) -- Fester

Jason never answered. :-) David G Fisher "na_biker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

Quoted text (53 lines)

> On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 20:32:25 GMT, [email hidden] (jason moyer) > wrote: > > >Lauda has never driven a car with the amount of downforce of a modern > >F1 car. > > That's complete BS and another myth. > > The early-mid eighties flatbottomed and ground-effect cars(which Lauda > also drove) had tons more downforce than today's cars. Today's cars > comparatively speaking are much less reliant on downforce than in the > eighties. They were pulling 4g's laterally in 1982 already(w/ground > effect). In 1984-85 5g's. And that was with much less sticky tyres. > > Lauda actually said in his interview after his Jaguar test drive that > he thought the grip was comparatively much more progressive than the > last cars he drove. > > In his own words(2nd quote earlier interview): > > "Q: You have talked about what is easier nowadays, can you tell us if > anything is harder? > NL: The difficult part was getting the balance of the car right - > going into the corner I had understeer, and at the corner I had a > twitchy car (oversteer). In my time I used slick tyres so the car was > glued to the floor, and steady round the corner because of the grip, > but now we have grooved tyres and less aero (help) the car changes > characteristics quickly until it get to its grippy phase. It is more > progressive in terms of speed through corners than it used to be. " > > -"To be honest, there was no such thing as cornering technique in the > ground effect era. "Cornering" was a euphemism for rape practised on > the driver. . . When you came into a corner you had to hit the > accelerator as hard as you possibly could, build up speed as quickly > as possible and, when things became unstuck, bite the bullet and give > it even more. In a ground effect car, reaching the limit was > synonymous with spinning out." > > >If he were 27 and had a chance to do significant testing in a modern > >F1 car I have a hard time believing he'd have a problem. As it > >stands, you've got an old former racer driving a car he's never driven > >before with no frame of reference for how far he can push it without > >going off. He probably also has significantly more fear of going off > >than most of the new guys do, since in his day going past the limit > >meant death (was re: his accident at the nurburgring). Now if you go > >off you slide over some dirt/gravel and into a tire barrier. > > > > He apparently wasn't that scared when he brought home the '84 WDC. > > > >

Aye, what shall I respond with, good sir? Jason On Sat, 13 Jul 2002 04:23:21 GMT, "David G Fisher" <[email hidden]> wrote:

Quoted text (61 lines)

>Jason never answered. :-) > >David G Fisher > >"na_biker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:[email hidden]... >> On Tue, 09 Jul 2002 20:32:25 GMT, [email hidden] (jason moyer) >> wrote: >> >> >Lauda has never driven a car with the amount of downforce of a modern >> >F1 car. >> >> That's complete BS and another myth. >> >> The early-mid eighties flatbottomed and ground-effect cars(which Lauda >> also drove) had tons more downforce than today's cars. Today's cars >> comparatively speaking are much less reliant on downforce than in the >> eighties. They were pulling 4g's laterally in 1982 already(w/ground >> effect). In 1984-85 5g's. And that was with much less sticky tyres. >> >> Lauda actually said in his interview after his Jaguar test drive that >> he thought the grip was comparatively much more progressive than the >> last cars he drove. >> >> In his own words(2nd quote earlier interview): >> >> "Q: You have talked about what is easier nowadays, can you tell us if >> anything is harder? >> NL: The difficult part was getting the balance of the car right - >> going into the corner I had understeer, and at the corner I had a >> twitchy car (oversteer). In my time I used slick tyres so the car was >> glued to the floor, and steady round the corner because of the grip, >> but now we have grooved tyres and less aero (help) the car changes >> characteristics quickly until it get to its grippy phase. It is more >> progressive in terms of speed through corners than it used to be. " >> >> -"To be honest, there was no such thing as cornering technique in the >> ground effect era. "Cornering" was a euphemism for rape practised on >> the driver. . . When you came into a corner you had to hit the >> accelerator as hard as you possibly could, build up speed as quickly >> as possible and, when things became unstuck, bite the bullet and give >> it even more. In a ground effect car, reaching the limit was >> synonymous with spinning out." >> >> >If he were 27 and had a chance to do significant testing in a modern >> >F1 car I have a hard time believing he'd have a problem. As it >> >stands, you've got an old former racer driving a car he's never driven >> >before with no frame of reference for how far he can push it without >> >going off. He probably also has significantly more fear of going off >> >than most of the new guys do, since in his day going past the limit >> >meant death (was re: his accident at the nurburgring). Now if you go >> >off you slide over some dirt/gravel and into a tire barrier. >> > >> >> He apparently wasn't that scared when he brought home the '84 WDC. >> >> >> >> > >

In article <[email hidden]>, Uncle Fester <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (8 lines)

>> Hmm...how old is your daughter now...? >> >> KIDDING, Chuck - kidding! :-) >> >> Eldred > > >Hey honey... did you see where I left the goat's nut snips at? ;-)

Whoops...! Wow - look at the time - gotta go! <G> Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett My .sig file is in the shop for repairs... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

In article <[email hidden]>, Andre Warringa <[email hidden]> writes:

Quoted text (10 lines)

>On 12 Jul 2002 23:09:06 GMT, [email hidden] (EldredP) wrote: > >>Curiosity, I guess. Creating and micro-managing a family isn't much >different >>from creating and micro-managing a civilization... >> >>Eldred > >True, but the real life version of the Sims has way more features and >is much more interesting.. why the hell simulate it on a computer??

Because I'm better at IT than real life...? :-( Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett My .sig file is in the shop for repairs... Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.