CART on the PC?

Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters will be releasing an IRL game, due 2003.

Sweet!! Don Burnette "elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters willbe > releasing an IRL game, due 2003. > >

>"Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote > Sweet!! I guess if you like racing open-wheel boats with full throttle on most of the ovals, it's for you Don ;) -- -- Fran�ois M�nard <ymenard> -- http://www.ymenard.8m.com/ -- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez Corporation - helping America into the New World...

In article <ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says... > >Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters will be >releasing an IRL game, due 2003. I think I'll get in first and say "its no GPL".

Why don't they do a sim of a "professional" racing series? <G> -- Scott B. Husted PA-Scott ICQ# 4395450 http://www.Husted.cc "Don Burnette" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:J5E69.150779$[email hidden]... > Sweet!! > > Don Burnette > > "elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > > Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters will > be > > releasing an IRL game, due 2003. > > > > > >

Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race (Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being siphoned off to NASCAR. "elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters willbe > releasing an IRL game, due 2003. > >

Cart may out-draw IRL, but I find the IRL a hell of a lot more exciting than Cart. -Larry "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:EYO69.144470$[email hidden]... > Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road > courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airportrace > (Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS > road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to createan

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> oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too > well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the > Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is > starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being > siphoned off to NASCAR. > > "elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > > Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters

will > be > > releasing an IRL game, due 2003. > > > > > >

Did you see Mid-O? I find ovals--single-seaters or tin tops--abt. as interesting as watching rush-hour traffic on the 405. "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_RR69.53132$[email hidden]... > Cart may out-draw IRL, but I find the IRL a hell of a lot more excitingthan > Cart. > > -Larry

On Thu, 15 Aug 2002 14:33:08 GMT, "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road >courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race >(Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS >road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an >oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too >well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the >Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is >starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being >siphoned off to NASCAR.

Do they show IRL on Speed? I don't think I've ever seen an IRL race. I can't name one IRL driver. -- karkrazy AT softhome DOT net

Can you substaniate those claims? I'd be interested in seeing those. Would you like to make a bet CART won't be a series in say, 2 years? PS Name anyone from CART/IRL besides Fittipaldi who is being siphoned off to NASCAR... -- Tim Doyle TDRacin� Online VRW Team Owner www.VirtualRacingWorld.com "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:EYO69.144470$[email hidden]... > Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road > courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race > (Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS > road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an > oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too > well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the > Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is > starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being > siphoned off to NASCAR. > > "elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > > Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters will > be > > releasing an IRL game, due 2003. > > > > > >

lol yeah, most have never heard of Gil DeFerran, Helio Castroneves, Eddie Cheever, hell, Roger Penske for that matter. What do those guys have to do with racing, you know?? pfffft -- Tim Doyle TDRacin� Online VRW Team Owner www.VirtualRacingWorld.com <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Thu, 15 Aug 2002 14:33:08 GMT, "Steve Smith" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road > >courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race > >(Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS > >road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an > >oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too > >well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the > >Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is > >starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being > >siphoned off to NASCAR. > > Do they show IRL on Speed? I don't think I've ever seen an IRL race. > I can't name one IRL driver. > > -- > karkrazy AT softhome DOT net

"Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:YuS69.39833$[email hidden]... > Did you see Mid-O? I find ovals--single-seaters or tin tops--abt. as > interesting as watching rush-hour traffic on the 405. The only exciting oval races I've ever watched are Michigan 500's in Cart. Never seen another oval race that I didnt switch off - and I'm a HUGE motorsport fan. Doug

Although I'm not a huge fan of the series, you ever hear of a little known obscure driver named Al Unser Jr.? -- Biz "Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and the....." - Ash <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Thu, 15 Aug 2002 14:33:08 GMT, "Steve Smith" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road > >courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race > >(Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS > >road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an > >oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too > >well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the > >Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is > >starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being > >siphoned off to NASCAR. > > Do they show IRL on Speed? I don't think I've ever seen an IRL race. > I can't name one IRL driver. > > -- > karkrazy AT softhome DOT net

> Although I'm not a huge fan of the series, you ever hear of a little knownobscure driver named Al > Unser Jr.? Heard a little too much about him lately...

obscure driver named Al Heard a little too much about him lately...

On Thu, 15 Aug 2002 21:00:00 GMT, "Biz" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Although I'm not a huge fan of the series, you ever hear of a little known obscure driver named Al >Unser Jr.? >-- >Biz Yeah, I've heard of him. I didn't know he was in IRL though. He must be pretty big since he has a few video games named after him :) -- karkrazy AT softhome DOT net

In article <cjT69.9055$[email hidden]>, "Kxlsyd1" <[email hidden]> writes: >PS Name anyone from CART/IRL besides Fittipaldi who is being siphoned off >to NASCAR... Besides Tony Stewart, John Andretti, Robby Gordon? Ok, that's 'past tense'... :-) Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:+8.09 N2002 Rank:+22.329 Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Hornish is on the move too, if you believe the buzz. SB "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <cjT69.9055$[email hidden]>, "Kxlsyd1" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >PS Name anyone from CART/IRL besides Fittipaldi who is being siphonedoff

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> >to NASCAR... > > Besides Tony Stewart, John Andretti, Robby Gordon? > Ok, that's 'past tense'... :-) > > Eldred > -- > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank:+8.09 > N2002 Rank:+22.329 > > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Or Gil De Ferran, Helio Castroneves, how about Eddie Cheever, didn't he run some series called F1? Oh, and that one guy, what's his name...Roger Penske? pfffft PS Wanna bet CART won 't be around after 2 years?? -- Tim Doyle TDRacin� Online VRW Team Owner www.VirtualRacingWorld.com "Biz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:kDU69.12984$[email hidden]... > Although I'm not a huge fan of the series, you ever hear of a little known obscure driver named Al > Unser Jr.? > -- > Biz > > "Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand > alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and > the....." - Ash > > > <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > On Thu, 15 Aug 2002 14:33:08 GMT, "Steve Smith" > > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > > > >Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road > > >courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race > > >(Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS > > >road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an > > >oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too > > >well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the > > >Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is > > >starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being > > >siphoned off to NASCAR. > > > > Do they show IRL on Speed? I don't think I've ever seen an IRL race. > > I can't name one IRL driver. > > > > -- > > karkrazy AT softhome DOT net > >

You must have loved it when you were a kid, when your Dad swung you round and round in circles holding you by the arms, then put you down on the ground and laughed as he watched you fall over 6 times. I used to kick him in the shin. Maybe that's why I can't get into IRC or the Nascar ovals. :-) Darf "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:_RR69.53132$[email hidden]... > Cart may out-draw IRL, but I find the IRL a hell of a lot more excitingthan > Cart. > > -Larry

On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 01:15:31 GMT, "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> wrote: >PS Wanna bet CART won 't be around after 2 years?? If CART is pulling in more fans and money than the IRL, I don't unerstand why they would be gone in 2 years? I've been a Penske fan my whole life. I have Rick Mears posters from around 82 or 83 all over the walls of my bedroom at my dad's house. I lived about 10 minutes from the corporate HQ and had family who worked for him. Now he leaves CART to race some shitty oval series? Bye Roger, don't get dizzy. On the plus side I can root for Paul Tracy again. Jason

But, IRL has Sarah Fisher; and I'd rather watch her than any Brazilian male! Jim Steve Smith wrote:

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>Hell-OOO! CART is not the IRL. IRL = ovals only. CART = Nat. terr. road >courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race >(Cleveland). IRL's junior division (Infinity Pro) *may* race on the IMS >road course in 2003 or 2004, but founder Tony George's aim was to create an >oval series for homegrown drivers. So far, it isn't working out too >well--CART outdraws IRL (TV, asses in seats) everywhere but the >Brickyard...and the usual off-shore talent (the Boys from Brazil) is >starting to displace the locals who, if they're any good at all, are being >siphoned off to NASCAR. > >"elysium" <[email hidden]> wrote in message >news:ajf1l9$e1u$[email hidden]... > >>Further to recent posts about single-seater racing sims, Codemasters will >> >be > >>releasing an IRL game, due 2003. >> >> > >

Robby Gordon? Hehehe That guy Has been 'siphoned' back and forth so many times !! He must come pre -greased :-)) jv "EldredP" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > In article <cjT69.9055$[email hidden]>, "Kxlsyd1" > <[email hidden]> writes: > > >PS Name anyone from CART/IRL besides Fittipaldi who is being siphonedoff

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> >to NASCAR... > > Besides Tony Stewart, John Andretti, Robby Gordon? > Ok, that's 'past tense'... :-) > > Eldred > -- > Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett > GPLRank:+8.09 > N2002 Rank:+22.329 > > Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

It looks like some of you guys here like to speak of that which you know nothing about. Nice try. -- Tim Doyle TDRacin� Online VRW Team Owner www.VirtualRacingWorld.com "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 01:15:31 GMT, "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >PS Wanna bet CART won 't be around after 2 years?? > > If CART is pulling in more fans and money than the IRL, I don't > unerstand why they would be gone in 2 years? > > I've been a Penske fan my whole life. I have Rick Mears posters from > around 82 or 83 all over the walls of my bedroom at my dad's house. > I lived about 10 minutes from the corporate HQ and had family who > worked for him. > > Now he leaves CART to race some shitty oval series? Bye Roger, don't > get dizzy. > > On the plus side I can root for Paul Tracy again. > > Jason

LOL! "Darf" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3d5c5999$0$31150$[email hidden]... > You must have loved it when you were a kid, when your Dad swung you round > and round in circles holding you by the arms, then put you down on > the ground and laughed as he watched you fall over 6 times. > I used to kick him in the shin. Maybe that's why I can't get into IRC orthe

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> Nascar ovals. :-) > > Darf > > "Larry" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:_RR69.53132$[email hidden]... > > Cart may out-draw IRL, but I find the IRL a hell of a lot more exciting > than > > Cart. > > > > -Larry > > >

Big Paul & Li'l Al aren't the same these days. Tracy has fully matured since his crash n' burn days, and Li'l Al has fallen on hard times since his daughter Cody fell ill (lost his ride, lost his wife, seems to have lost his self-respect, and has come perilously close to losing his freedom). The Captain, as always, is only in it for the money - Roger the Dodger is a lifelong roadracer who switched to a junior league oval series because his sponsors told him to. Tobacco money really smokes, huh? "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]...

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> On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 01:15:31 GMT, "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >PS Wanna bet CART won 't be around after 2 years?? > > If CART is pulling in more fans and money than the IRL, I don't > unerstand why they would be gone in 2 years? > > I've been a Penske fan my whole life. I have Rick Mears posters from > around 82 or 83 all over the walls of my bedroom at my dad's house. > I lived about 10 minutes from the corporate HQ and had family who > worked for him. > > Now he leaves CART to race some shitty oval series? Bye Roger, don't > get dizzy. > > On the plus side I can root for Paul Tracy again. > > Jason

TDRacin <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:TmY69.9189$[email hidden]... > Or Gil De Ferran, Helio Castroneves, how about Eddie Cheever, didn't herun > some series called F1? Oh, and that one guy, what's his name...Roger > Penske? pfffft > Gil is a good driver and Helio is also. They will win in any series they go to. Eddie was not fast in F1, not fast in CART. He ran decently in Sports Cars, but you have a co driver there so who knows how much help or hinderence he was there. As for Penske I am waiting to see how Tony likes MK Chassis new shops in Poole England. Tony squarely screwed up on that one. > PS Wanna bet CART won 't be around after 2 years?? >I will take the bet. They have butts in the seats, and they are pretty fluid cash wise. They need to work out something to take the company private again, but they will be around in two years. I believe Pook is getting the foundation set to make CART viable for a long time. I also think it will be healthier in the long run to have Honda and Toyota in the IRL since both manufactures were trying to have the scantioning body write rules their way. I would rather watch a road race where the winner flat runs away from everyone else and shows his mastery of the circuit, then an oval race where you have drivers running foot to the firewall all day long and making draft passes. Oval racing is highly overrated. Seemingly the ADHD of racing now a days. Dave

On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 10:05:20 GMT, "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> wrote: >It looks like some of you guys here like to speak of that which you know >nothing about. Nice try. Uh. I know that CART draws more people to its events in addition to having a strong international fanbase that worries FIA. On the other hand, the IRL races in front of half empty grandstands and has a fanbase that is a tiny subset of NASCAR's. The only IRL race anyone cares about is Indy, and interest has swung up sharply since George started letting CART participate again. Of course, if the IRL were a bigger draw than CART, he wouldn't have done that... Jason

On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 11:28:47 GMT, "Steve Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>Big Paul & Li'l Al aren't the same these days. Tracy has fully matured >since his crash n' burn days, and Li'l Al has fallen on hard times since his >daughter Cody fell ill (lost his ride, lost his wife, seems to have lost his >self-respect, and has come perilously close to losing his freedom). The >Captain, as always, is only in it for the money - Roger the Dodger is a >lifelong roadracer who switched to a junior league oval series because his >sponsors told him to. Tobacco money really smokes, huh?

I wonder how he's going to feel when the tobacco ban kicks in and he's stuck in a second-rate go-kart oval series without a sponsor? =) Jason

jason moyer <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > The only IRL race anyone cares about is Indy, and interest has swung > up sharply since George started letting CART participate again. Of > course, if the IRL were a bigger draw than CART, he wouldn't have done > that... > > Jason Its TV numbers are down far enough to where the Coca Cola 600 is a bigger show TV wise now. Really is a shame when you used to have such a storied race, and now its second best on the weekend, TV ratings wise. As for the series well Texas and IMS are their draw tracks. Those two shows are the only ones they can really hang their hats on since many others are tied up to season ticket sales thus if NASCAR is a sellout then the whole season will be a sellout. Dave

jason moyer <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I wonder how he's going to feel when the tobacco ban kicks in and he's > stuck in a second-rate go-kart oval series without a sponsor? =) > > Jason HEY, please do not degrade Karting like that. Dave

Never fear; the old silver fox will always come out on top. He probably already has sponsors like Cap'n Crunch lined up (don't forget; the cancer-stick makers bought heavily into food producers as a hedge against just such an eventuality). "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 11:28:47 GMT, "Steve Smith" > <[email hidden]> wrote: > > >Big Paul & Li'l Al aren't the same these days. Tracy has fully matured > >since his crash n' burn days, and Li'l Al has fallen on hard times sincehis > >daughter Cody fell ill (lost his ride, lost his wife, seems to have losthis > >self-respect, and has come perilously close to losing his freedom). The > >Captain, as always, is only in it for the money - Roger the Dodger is a > >lifelong roadracer who switched to a junior league oval series becausehis > >sponsors told him to. Tobacco money really smokes, huh? > > I wonder how he's going to feel when the tobacco ban kicks in and he's > stuck in a second-rate go-kart oval series without a sponsor? =) > > Jason

In article <[email hidden]>, "Juan Vizoso" <[email hidden]> writes: >Robby Gordon? Hehehe That guy Has been 'siphoned' back and forth so >many times !! He must come pre -greased :-)) jv Hey, I just gave names. I didn't comment on relative 'talent'...<g> Eldred -- Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett GPLRank:+8.09 N2002 Rank:+22.329 Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Prove it. Bet you can't. Have you ever watched a CART race? Show me the packed stands, or even 5/8th packed full granstands. CART was allowed to particpate the whole time, and they chose not to. But look where CART teams and drivers are headed now... -- Tim Doyle TDRacin� Online VRW Team Owner www.VirtualRacingWorld.com "jason moyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 10:05:20 GMT, "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> > wrote: > > >It looks like some of you guys here like to speak of that which you know > >nothing about. Nice try. > > Uh. I know that CART draws more people to its events in addition to > having a strong international fanbase that worries FIA. > > On the other hand, the IRL races in front of half empty grandstands > and has a fanbase that is a tiny subset of NASCAR's. > > The only IRL race anyone cares about is Indy, and interest has swung > up sharply since George started letting CART participate again. Of > course, if the IRL were a bigger draw than CART, he wouldn't have done > that... > > Jason

TDRacin <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:XId79.9488$[email hidden]... > Prove it. Bet you can't. >The IRL never had to worry about a not being able to race in Europe on a road course. CART had to stay way from European road courses. > Have you ever watched a CART race? Show me the packed stands, or even5/8th > packed full granstands. >Yes I have watched several and you can see more people watching the race on one corner at Long Beach then went to Fontana. Heck attendence numbers just at Long Beach beat the IRLs numbers for homestead, PIR and Fontana combined. Monterry Mexico was a great crowd, as were the Canadian races. With the exception of Chicago the rest of the CART races have been well attended. Milwaukee was a bit low, but it would be great numbers compared to the IRL standards of attendees to races. The IRL does not put butts in the seats. One reason they only race at one SMI track. The IRL has decent attendance at two races Texas and IMS. Don't bring up new start tracks like Chicago or Kansas since everyone knows the season ticket policy at these tracks. Nascar sells out their weekends and to get NASCAR seats you must buy season tickets. Most view buying IRL tickets as the cost to make sure they get NASCAR WC tickets. > CART was allowed to particpate the whole time, and they chose not to. But > look where CART teams and drivers are headed now... > Indy is the only race anyone does care about in the IRL. Witness the empty stands at Homestead, Pir, Fontana, etc. Indy's TV ratings are a shadow of what they once were too. The Coca Cola 600 has better rating then the Indy 500 and they run the race on the same day. Also when Indy went to the IRL in 96 they had the great 25/8 rule. Effectively putting CART teams on the outside looking in unless they ran a full season of the IRL. CART teams doing a on off at Indy is not a big deal. I do wonder how bad the TV ratings would have slipped for the Indy 500 is CART teams had not started going a on off. Dave

"TDRacin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:XId79.9488$[email hidden]... > Prove it. Bet you can't. (snip and move up) > CART was allowed to particpate the whole time, and they chose not to. But > look where CART teams and drivers are headed now... yes Cart teams and drivers are headed to INDY, it just happens due to American tobacco laws they must race the whole series to display thier rolling billboards. This is something I predicted(yes me: search google waaaay back when Cart and the LEague of the Devil first split) But as far as being allowed to particpate the 'whole time.' Well. Do I need to quote the 28/8 rule? Do I need to remind you who denied Lola and Reynard permission to build IRL spec tubs? Do I need to remind you who wouldn't license Ilmour-Mercedes to build IRL engines? Do I need to remind you that the IRL has continually backed away from any concialltion attempts. Why did Cart go back to Turbos? Because XX(of whom I won't even dare print his initials) wouldn't let Cart engine suppliers build IRL spec engines.(see he already has Toyota and Honda so why bother with Ford & Ilmour?) {and yes I am quite aware CART has itself to blame for loosing Honda} Why did Cart freeze the chassis rules and abandon plans to build a new IRL-similar chassis? Because the Devil's spawn would not allow those companies to build tubs for both series. Sure...sure...they have ALWAYS been welcome..... > (snipped and lowered) > Have you ever watched a CART race? Show me the packed stands, or even5/8th > packed full granstands. > > > -- > > Tim Doyle Tim I don't know what you are smoking but... as stated elsewhere in this thread, the IRL races are poorly attended EXCEPT Indy and any of the Nascar tracks that require IRL tickets be bought in tandem with Nascar tickets. now some proof. from a Molson webpage Sixteen years of CART racing in Canada will continue in 2002 with Molson Indy events in Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver. Attracting more spectators and television viewers than any other three-day event in the country, the Molson Indys in Toronto and Vancouver are two of Canada's largest and most popular sporting events. Combined attendance for the two races in 2001 reached an all-time record of 330,000 making a large economic impact in both cities. ________ Name any two IRL events EXCLUDING Indy that come close to 330K. From American Race Fan site: CART opens its 2002 FedEx Championship Series season March 10 in Monterrey, Mexico, with the Tecate Telmex Grand Prix Presented by Herdez on the temporary street circuit at Fundidora Park. The 2001 race was the first in the northern Mexican city and drew a CART weekend-attendance-record 318,000 spectators, including a race-day crowd of more than 115,000. ________ again, name any single IRL event excluding Indy that pulled in 115K on raceday and 318K for a weekend. There have been events in the CART schedule that have been poorly attended. The Chicago oval race is one in paticular. But on any given raceweekend, more butts are in CART seats than IRL. but...as we should all be aware....even tho CART draws large weekend crowds, their overall numbers and the IRL's as well, pales next to Nascar and F1. here's a few more numbers: from cartrock.com Attendance Figures April 17 - CART is reporting that the total attendance figures over the three-day race weekend for Long Beach topped 250,000, half of that from race day alone. These are slightly up from the Monterey season-opener figures, which were 236,000 _________ 5/8ths full grandstands with 125,000 people on raceday? ___________ getting IRL attendance figures is tougher but here is some from the recent Richmond race...one that is doing well by IRL standards. From the Bridgestonetire.com site about the IRL at Richmond. They would have been satisfied with 30,000, filling the front-stretch grandstand. On a night with the temperature in the 90s, the people kept comi ng in until the seats from Turn Four to Turn Two were nearly full. Walk-up ticket sales forced Richmond ushers to open several roped-off areas. The Associated Press estimated the crowd at 40,000 and the Richmond Times-Dispatch said it was "about 50,000." Depending upon whose estimate you accept, the attendance was either good or very good. ____________ lets go with 50K shall we? about 3/8ths of some of the numbers quoted above. I guess CART is getting 5/8ths of the ticket sales...dang...you were right. :) dave henrie

On Sat, 17 Aug 2002 04:58:47 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote:

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>CART opens its 2002 FedEx Championship Series season March 10 in Monterrey, >Mexico, with the Tecate Telmex Grand Prix Presented by Herdez on the >temporary street circuit at Fundidora Park. The 2001 race was the first in >the northern Mexican city and drew a CART weekend-attendance-record 318,000 >spectators, including a race-day crowd of more than 115,000. >________ >again, name any single IRL event excluding Indy that pulled in 115K on >raceday and 318K for a weekend.

Jesus. Thanks for posting some hard stats, Dave, that is ridiculous. That has to be close to rivalling the draw for the Malaysian F1 races. I'd like to note that CART has been incredibly smart about choosing venues for a long time. They stole Long Beach from F1, which was one of F1's biggest draws at the time, and then they essentially forced F1 out of Detroit by putting on a better show. The numbers for Mexico are great, and I'd bet that the void left by F1 leaving Mexico City has had a positive impact. It's a shame that Pook hasn't taken the series to the Nordschleife, could you imagine the attendance for that? =) >Attendance Figures >April 17 - CART is reporting that the total attendance figures over the >three-day race weekend for Long Beach topped 250,000, half of that from race >day alone. These are slightly up from the Monterey season-opener figures, >which were 236,000 CART will never die as long as Long Beach is on its calendar. That is easily the crown jewel of American street racing. Taking Long Beach off the calendar is one of the few things Bernie Ecclestone has done in his career that was truly daft. Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

CART is becoming the AAA series of F1, the IRL wishes it were Nascar. "American" open wheel racing is dead. "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bKk79.62680$me6.8203@sccrnsc01...

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> > "TDRacin" <[email hidden]> wrote in message > news:XId79.9488$[email hidden]... > > Prove it. Bet you can't. > > (snip and move up) > > CART was allowed to particpate the whole time, and they chose not to.

But > > look where CART teams and drivers are headed now... > > > yes Cart teams and drivers are headed to INDY, it just happens dueto > American tobacco laws they must race the whole series to display thier > rolling billboards. This is something I predicted(yes me: search google > waaaay back when Cart and the LEague of the Devil first split) But as faras > being allowed to particpate the 'whole time.' Well. Do I need to quotethe > 28/8 rule? Do I need to remind you who denied Lola and Reynard permission > to build IRL spec tubs? Do I need to remind you who wouldn't license > Ilmour-Mercedes to build IRL engines? Do I need to remind you that theIRL

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> has continually backed away from any concialltion attempts. > > Why did Cart go back to Turbos? Because XX(of whom I won't even dare > print his initials) wouldn't let Cart engine suppliers build IRL spec > engines.(see he already has Toyota and Honda so why bother with Ford & > Ilmour?) {and yes I am quite aware CART has itself to blame for loosing > Honda} > Why did Cart freeze the chassis rules and abandon plans to build a new > IRL-similar chassis? > Because the Devil's spawn would not allow those companies to build tubs

for

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> both series. > Sure...sure...they have ALWAYS been welcome..... > > > > (snipped and lowered) > > Have you ever watched a CART race? Show me the packed stands, or even > 5/8th > > packed full granstands. > > > > > > -- > > > > Tim Doyle > > Tim I don't know what you are smoking but... > as stated elsewhere in this thread, the IRL races are poorly attended

EXCEPT

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> Indy and any of the Nascar tracks that require IRL tickets be bought in > tandem with Nascar tickets. > now some proof. > > from a Molson webpage > Sixteen years of CART racing in Canada will continue in 2002 with Molson > Indy events in Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver. Attracting more spectators > and television viewers than any other three-day event in the country, the > Molson Indys in Toronto and Vancouver are two of Canada's largest and most > popular sporting events. Combined attendance for the two races in 2001 > reached an all-time record of 330,000 making a large economic impact in

both

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> cities. > ________ > Name any two IRL events EXCLUDING Indy that come close to 330K. > > From American Race Fan site: > > CART opens its 2002 FedEx Championship Series season March 10 in

Monterrey, > Mexico, with the Tecate Telmex Grand Prix Presented by Herdez on the > temporary street circuit at Fundidora Park. The 2001 race was the first in > the northern Mexican city and drew a CART weekend-attendance-record318,000

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> spectators, including a race-day crowd of more than 115,000. > ________ > again, name any single IRL event excluding Indy that pulled in 115K on > raceday and 318K for a weekend. > > > There have been events in the CART schedule that have been poorly > attended. The Chicago oval race is one in paticular. But on any given > raceweekend, more butts are in CART seats than IRL. but...as we should

all > be aware....even tho CART draws large weekend crowds, their overallnumbers

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> and the IRL's as well, pales next to Nascar and F1. > > here's a few more numbers: > > from cartrock.com > > > Attendance Figures > April 17 - CART is reporting that the total attendance figures over the > three-day race weekend for Long Beach topped 250,000, half of that from

race

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> day alone. These are slightly up from the Monterey season-opener figures, > which were 236,000 > _________ > > 5/8ths full grandstands with 125,000 people on raceday? > ___________ > > > getting IRL attendance figures is tougher but here is some from the > recent Richmond race...one that is doing well by IRL standards. > > From the Bridgestonetire.com site about the IRL at Richmond. > > > They would have been satisfied with 30,000, filling the front-stretch > grandstand. On a night with the temperature in the 90s, the people kept

comi > ng in until the seats from Turn Four to Turn Two were nearly full. Walk-up > ticket sales forced Richmond ushers to open several roped-off areas. The > Associated Press estimated the crowd at 40,000 and the Richmond > Times-Dispatch said it was "about 50,000." Depending upon whose estimateyou > accept, the attendance was either good or very good. > ____________ > lets go with 50K shall we? about 3/8ths of some of the numbers quoted > above. I guess CART is getting 5/8ths of the ticket sales...dang...youwere > right. :) > dave henrie > > > >

"JHAWLEY" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:4qu79.8777$[email hidden]... > CART is becoming the AAA series of F1, the IRL wishes it were Nascar. > "American" open wheel racing is dead. I almost agree with that....not dead but certainly not what it used to be. dave henrie

> CART = Nat. terr. road > courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airport race > (Cleveland). I remember playing CART Precision Racing a few years back; Cleveland was my favourite racetrack. Wish they'd include it in an upcoming title. What can we expect for the pit crews in this upcoming title, I wonder?

You can drive a fairly accurate (not enuf bumps) Cleveland in GPL. Dave Noonan's converter will allow you to use Papy's IndyCar/CART Racing track...if you have the original. "adamchehata" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > > CART = Nat. terr. road > > courses (ex: Elkhart), street races (Long Bch), ovals, even an airportrace

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> > (Cleveland). > > I remember playing CART Precision Racing a few years back; Cleveland > was my favourite racetrack. Wish they'd include it in an upcoming > title. > > What can we expect for the pit crews in this upcoming title, I wonder?