When will driving / racing games get real, meaty engine sounds?

I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I've ever played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing some crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? -----------== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----= Over 100,000 Newsgroups - Unlimited Fast Downloads - 19 Servers =-----

"Ultrasparc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just > occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had > engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I'veever

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> played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the > best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You > never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same > damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. > > When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why > don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing

some > crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? > Have you heard the soundpak version 4 at the uspits for N2k2? How about the sounds for F1 2k2 or the FIA & ALMS mods for F1 2k1? They may not be what you mean, but these titles have take big strides forward in sound. dave henrie

Well Gran Turismo and Sega GT... use actual sounds for all the STOCK cars. "Ultrasparc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just > occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had > engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I'veever

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> played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the > best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You > never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same > damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. > > When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why > don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing

some

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> crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? > > > > > > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Uncensored Usenet News

==---------- > http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----= Over 100,000 Newsgroups - Unlimited Fast Downloads - 19 Servers=-----

"Ultrasparc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just > occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had > engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I'veever

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> played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the > best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You > never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same > damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. > > When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why > don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing

some > crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? > The technology is certainly there to do this...Project Gotham Racing, although a good game, lacks on the sound...I definitely agree with this post...Developers listen up!! -Joe

On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 06:15:34 GMT, "Joe" <[email hidden]> wrote: >Project Gotham Racing, >although a good game, lacks on the sound... Umm... that Ferrari sounds pretty good to me .. :) I use headphones with my consoles, BTW.

On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 05:56:04 GMT, "Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote: > version 4 at the uspits for N2k2? How about >the sounds for F1 2k2 or the FIA & ALMS mods for F1 2k1? The Panoz Roadster in the Le Mans 2k1 patch for 2002 has possibly the throatest engine I've heard in a sim this side of the 3 liter Ferrari in GPL. It's a framerate killer and needs to be downsampled, but it sounds fantastic. Jason ----- GPLRank 24.50 N2002Rank -12.995

"Ultrasparc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just > occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had > engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I'veever

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> played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the > best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You > never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same > damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. > > When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why > don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing

some > crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? > >I thought porsche unleashed for the PC had fairly good sound, especially the "whale tail" car (cannot remember the damn model). Overall, I agree that sound lags far behind graphics. -- Joe Marques

935 Moby Dick? > I thought porsche unleashed for the PC had fairly good sound, especiallythe

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> "whale tail" car (cannot remember the damn model). Overall, I agree that > sound lags far behind graphics. > > -- > Joe Marques > > > >

YES! Thanks. -- Joe Marques "Carl Ribbegaardh" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:ajrmpo$1dj2bb$[email hidden]... > 935 Moby Dick? > > > I thought porsche unleashed for the PC had fairly good sound, especially > the > > "whale tail" car (cannot remember the damn model). Overall, I agree that > > sound lags far behind graphics. > > > > -- > > Joe Marques > > > > > > > > > >

"Dave Henrie" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:UL%79.75641$983.88733@rwcrnsc53... > Have you heard the soundpak version 4 at the uspits for N2k2? How about > the sounds for F1 2k2 or the FIA & ALMS mods for F1 2k1? > They may not be what you mean, but these titles have take big strides > forward in sound. > dave henrie No, I have not played these. I'll give them a try, thanks. -----------== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----= Over 100,000 Newsgroups - Unlimited Fast Downloads - 19 Servers =-----

(Warning: long rambling post ahead) Most games _do_ use real recorded samples, but they have to pitch-shift them to simulate different rpms (although you can sample at different rpms and cross-fade between them). So if you're at constant RPMs near the point where the sample was taken, it'll sound the same as the recording. Sometimes you can get lucky and get a really good sample that sounds good at different pitches, but that's a real art. Even if you sample a lot of rev ranges, it's hard to mix between them without hearing weird interference artifacts, or else a discontinuity if you don't mix. Also trying to get "loopable" samples is a little tricky. If there was some sort of custom chassis dyno built for recording samples at fixed RPMs and load, that would help, especially if it had a motor to get "engine braking" sounds. Because of all these tradeoffs, there is a lot of disagreement about which "sim sounds" sound good. Also, pitch shifting engine samples really isn't right, especially at low rpms, because at some level you should be hearing something like: boom... boom, boom boom, boom boom boom, boom-boom-boom, b-b-b-b- ... as the engine accelerates, all at the same pitch. The synthesis approach actually does get those behaviors, and is better at making a more "dynamic" engine sound that reacts to more parameters, but so far they tend to sound somewhat artificial, especially at fixed rpms. So basically they all suck right now in some way or another, but some can sound really good in some conditions (such as the GPL ferrari at high RPMs, WOT) IMVHO, the only way to get a really good engine sound will be from a complete accoustic simulation of an engine + exhaust system. You should try downloading the SoundMAX/Staccatto demo to see the current "state of the art" in synthesis. It's not "there" yet, but it is promising. So yes, engine sounds suck right now, but it's not for lack of trying. -Dave P. "Ultrasparc" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:[email hidden]... > I was watching a video of a Ferrari 355 w/ Tubi Style exhaust, and it just > occurred to me how much more enjoyable driving games would be if they had > engine sounds with as much balls as the real thing. I don't think I'veever

Quoted text (7 lines)

> played a driving game with realistic engine sounds. I know it's not the > best example, but the Ferrari's in Project Gotham Racing sound weak. You > never hear the engine "opening up" as you hit the higher rpm bands. Same > damn exhaust note throughout the entire RPM range. > > When will they stop using these wimpy engine/exhaust sounds in games? Why > don't they sit down and record the actual cars instead of synthesizing

some

Quoted text (8 lines)

> crap that sounds somewhat like the car? Is that so much to ask? > > > > > > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Uncensored Usenet News

==---------- > http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----= Over 100,000 Newsgroups - Unlimited Fast Downloads - 19 Servers=-----

"Dave Pollatsek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:3d61c38f$0$79561$[email hidden]... > different pitches, but that's a real art. Even if you sample a lot of rev > ranges, it's hard to mix between them without hearing weird interference > artifacts, or else a discontinuity if you don't mix. Also trying to get > "loopable" samples is a little tricky. If there was some sort of custom > chassis dyno built for recording samples at fixed RPMs and load, thatwould > help, especially if it had a motor to get "engine braking" sounds. Yes it's tough... I guess it's just not economically viable for development teams to spend so much development time on the engine sounds. > IMVHO, the only way to get a really good engine sound will be from a > complete accoustic simulation of an engine + exhaust system. You shouldtry > downloading the SoundMAX/Staccatto demo to see the current "state of the > art" in synthesis. It's not "there" yet, but it is promising. Yeah, engine sound simulation will definitely be the next evolutionary step. Well, maybe after a few more steps in between. Hell, guitar amp manufacturers have been doing digital guitar amp modelling for years now, and they still can't duplicate the complex tones & distortions of tube amps (although they are getting extremely close). -----------== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----= Over 100,000 Newsgroups - Unlimited Fast Downloads - 19 Servers =-----

I think this site has got the sounds just about perfect: http://people.cornell.edu/pages/slp29/insane.html

"Dave Pollatsek" <[email hidden]> writes: > > (Warning: long rambling post ahead) > Most games _do_ use real recorded samples, but they have to pitch-shift them > to simulate different rpms (although you can sample at different rpms and > cross-fade between them). So if you're at constant RPMs near the point > where the sample was taken, it'll sound the same as the recording. well, no. because the engine sound depends on several things other than rpm. throttle position, turbo pressure, engine acceleration... bunch of variables. > IMVHO, the only way to get a really good engine sound will be from a > complete accoustic simulation of an engine + exhaust system. You should try > downloading the SoundMAX/Staccatto demo to see the current "state of the > art" in synthesis. It's not "there" yet, but it is promising. cool. didn't know about that one. thanks. -- Gunnar #31 SUCKS#015 Tupperware MC#002 DoD#0x1B DoDRT#003 DoD:CT#4,8 Kibo�: 2 DE RECTIS NON TOLERANDUM EST